Poll: Who are you rooting for? (Vote): The Dong! (Vote): Crazy-Hydra, worlds greatest ladyboy. (Vote): July! (Vote): Stats
Poll: Who are you rooting against? (Vote): Jaedong, that guy needs to lose something for once. (Vote): Crazy-Hydra, worlds creepiest ladyboy. (Vote): July, out with the old, in with the new. (Vote): Stats
Poll: Who advances? (Vote): The Dong and July (Vote): The Dong and Crazy-Hydra (Vote): The Dong and Stats (Vote): Stats and Crazy-Hydra (Vote): Stats and July (Vote): July and Crazy-Hydra
ZvZ is kind of a risky matchup so upsets are not out of the picture but one thing I am certain about is that it'll take a miracle for Stats to get through.
Poll: Who's going to shine tonight? (Vote): Nobody going to cut the heads off of this Crazy-Hydra (Vote): The greatest month of the year!! (Vote): Ding Dong, got some nubcake topped off with failsauce for yall (Vote): Statistics point in favour of the toss tonight
Sloppy, Jaedong lets a muta that was chilling get sniped. +1 armor for Jadong making a pretty big difference. Jaedong snipes 2 overlords and now a third, seems to have a pretty big lead in air power now
On December 03 2009 17:30 ArvickHero wrote: damn, if crazy-hydra had armor upgrades he would've won some of those battles
JD traded a muta or two for that upgrade which is why CH seemed ahead after that first major battle and was able to apply pressure. Eventually though, micro and the +1 won it
Storms massacre July's attempt at a Templar snipe. lurkers are dying, hydras raped by storm. Stats lures Zuly off high ground then retreats when templar are out of mana.
On December 03 2009 17:56 meeple wrote: If he cold have sniped those templar instead of his wasting his muta, he could've stood a really good chance, even after a 12 nex.
Hard to properly get those snipes off after losing you spire and only getting out 7 mutas.. not to say he couldn't do it, but after getting the spire sniped his chances went way down
i dont even know what kt did to its players but its sketching me out in a good way its like EVERY single one of kt players is showing at least average results.....except for barracks but he pulled off a game against jangbi so i guess i'll take that
His chin is so manly. I bet when he was born, Reach rubbed his chin and said "You will be a manly protoss with the most manly of chins" and he has finally come to manly fruition.
On December 03 2009 18:03 Vasoline73 wrote: STATS FIGHTING. Advancing 2-0 here against JD of all people would be so freaking clutch when everybody considered him the easy 0-2 guy of this group
why were so many people skeptical of stats? he only had to practice against one race, that's already a huge advantage. he's just been over shadowed by Violet in proleague I guess
On December 03 2009 18:05 StorrZerg wrote: stats beating both july and jaedong in one night... the chances are soo low, it it does happen i will cry map imbalance to my death
On December 03 2009 18:25 Ota Solgryn wrote: Why did stats take the expo closest to JD? Pretty stupid decision if you ask me. It made it a lot easier for JD to herass and eventually take it down.
if you take that expo dealing with drops is a much easier.
On December 03 2009 18:25 Ota Solgryn wrote: Why did stats take the expo closest to JD? Pretty stupid decision if you ask me. It made it a lot easier for JD to herass and eventually take it down.
Because stats could defend from 1 end (the small ramp closest to JD) instead of two (had he taken 12 a clock) and if he had opted for the 11 natural expansion, it would've been alot harder to defend since it's simply too far away. Atleast that's how I reason.
JD shut it down with great muta/scourge control though.
On December 03 2009 18:25 Ota Solgryn wrote: Why did stats take the expo closest to JD? Pretty stupid decision if you ask me. It made it a lot easier for JD to herass and eventually take it down.
On December 03 2009 18:24 cokencheese wrote: Jaedong showing that he can play CJ-style Zerg when he wants to.
Exactly what i was thinking with his mass lings. Looked also like type -b game vs stork except jd used his guardians whereas type-b neglected them after using them for like 20 seconds.
Okay, genuine question here. When J took that 4th, Stats hadn't scouted it, and he had yet to heavily sunk up his 3rd, how can that not be called a hidden expo?
On December 03 2009 18:38 cascades wrote: Okay, genuine question here. When J took that 4th, Stats hadn't scouted it, and he had yet to heavily sunk up his 3rd, how can that not be called a hidden expo?
Zerg takes the nat, sunks it up so they can take the main as a protected base. Its assumed that when you take that nat you will eventually take the main.
On December 03 2009 18:38 cascades wrote: Okay, genuine question here. When J took that 4th, Stats hadn't scouted it, and he had yet to heavily sunk up his 3rd, how can that not be called a hidden expo?
It's pretty normal for someone to expand to the main of the nat of their third. (kekeke love my wording)
hidden implies you wouldn't think of looking for it there. Stats' timing sense might have been off (although he was trying to take his third, just getting denied), but it wasn't an early 4th really.
On December 03 2009 18:38 cascades wrote: Okay, genuine question here. When J took that 4th, Stats hadn't scouted it, and he had yet to heavily sunk up his 3rd, how can that not be called a hidden expo?
because taking the main after taking the nat is like, the most obvious choice ever?
taking 11 main would be considered hidden expo though
On December 03 2009 18:38 cascades wrote: Okay, genuine question here. When J took that 4th, Stats hadn't scouted it, and he had yet to heavily sunk up his 3rd, how can that not be called a hidden expo?
A hidden expo is usually one that the opponent doesn't expect or is in an odd place. This expo followed the normal sequence of expo's and the opponent, if he didn't know about it, that's the first place he would check
Ah bummer for Crazy Hydra. Keep playing well man and you'll be back next season :D.
And pretty sick ling control from July. I have a bad feeling for Stats here. If he loses, it sucks because he had to go through July/JD/July to advance.. pretty much every Protoss's nightmare... and if he wins everybody on teamliquid will bitch about map balance/how Stats sucks in someway.
I feel bad for CH but July has been my favorite player since like 2004, and I've been rooting for and following Jaedong since his career started so there's only one way I can root for this group to go.
I am so confused why July never got any zerglings. So many of those battles would have swung in his favor if he just had some zerglings in the mix to absorb some of the dragoon shots. I really am 100% confused as to why he went 100% with hydra, am I missing something?
Sad to see July knocked out but Stats showed fairly strong play and is always more room for a protoss or few.
On December 03 2009 19:16 oatboy wrote: dude hydras are awesome in midgame, but they do jack shit against a lategame protoss ball. Why the fuck didnt july expand and tech like a normal zerg?
On December 03 2009 19:16 HuskyTheHusky wrote: I am so confused why July never got any zerglings. So many of those battles would have swung in his favor if he just had some zerglings in the mid to absorb some of the dragoon shots. I really am 100% confused as to why he went 100% with hydra, am I missing something?
Sad to see July knocked out but Stats showed fairly strong play and is always more room for a protoss or few.
Either way, GG!
Was he ever at crackling tech? Speed lings are well and good but when the protoss ball starts getting mega huge, non cracklings just kind of disappear to archons.
The moment that really exemplified that game was when July flanked that last battle from the south, moving a control group of hydras forward to dodge the storm and maybe snipe the reavers. Instead, a scarab exploded immediately taking the entire group out.
On December 03 2009 19:17 WyffGoaL wrote: July is really old already, you can tell from his micro and his "strategy" ( mass hydra at late game, WTF? ) His generation is totally gone T_T
Hmmmm you are probably right, he just sucks now a days...
* Detailed ELO, sort by vZ *
Oh wait he's currently the best ZvPer in the world.
Stats really impressive, he has a chance to stand up to all the zergs, although I wouldn't put too much hype on him, July's zvp is really out of date and he didn't play that well.
Stats says out of the four people he might meet next round, he'd like to fight Ruby the most. (The group his opponent will come from isn't decided yet.)
Other than that he said nothing special. He's happy to qualify, will do his best in the next round as well, doesn't have any specific goal for this MSL yet, etc...
On December 03 2009 19:16 HuskyTheHusky wrote: I am so confused why July never got any zerglings. So many of those battles would have swung in his favor if he just had some zerglings in the mix to absorb some of the dragoon shots. I really am 100% confused as to why he went 100% with hydra, am I missing something?
July burned a million Scourge and never had enough Hatcheries. Money was never his biggest problem in this game - even losing all those Drones didn't cost him money as much as larvae.
Lings are great but when you gotta choose between 24 lings and 12 hydra you gotta go with the hydra. July really threw away too many units (mainly Scourge) that game to go with some nice moves by Stats to get more Drones.
On December 03 2009 19:17 WyffGoaL wrote: July is really old already, you can tell from his micro and his "strategy" ( mass hydra at late game, WTF? ) His generation is totally gone T_T
Hmmmm you are probably right, he just sucks now a days...
* Detailed ELO, sort by vZ *
Oh wait he's currently the best ZvPer in the world.
July hasn't played much ZvP lately and his lack of play in PL even over zergs like Modesty should be ominous even to the biggest July fanboy...
On December 03 2009 19:17 WyffGoaL wrote: July is really old already, you can tell from his micro and his "strategy" ( mass hydra at late game, WTF? ) His generation is totally gone T_T
Hmmmm you are probably right, he just sucks now a days...
* Detailed ELO, sort by vZ *
Oh wait he's currently the best ZvPer in the world.
Not sure what this "July's PvZ is awesome" bandwagoning is coming from. The only time he really caught my attention was when he had to face Bisu, and Bisu generally won. And the last game today wasn't exactly impressive. Some minutes before the end even the commentators were like "What's he doing? This isn't a fight he can win with Hydras..."
On December 03 2009 19:17 WyffGoaL wrote: July is really old already, you can tell from his micro and his "strategy" ( mass hydra at late game, WTF? ) His generation is totally gone T_T
Hmmmm you are probably right, he just sucks now a days...
* Detailed ELO, sort by vZ *
Oh wait he's currently the best ZvPer in the world.
Not sure what this "July's PvZ is awesome" bandwagoning is coming from. The only time he really caught my attention was when he had to face Bisu, and Bisu generally won. And the last game today wasn't exactly impressive. Some minutes before the end even the commentators were like "What's he doing? This isn't a fight he can win with Hydras..."
Historically, July's ZvP has been the creme de la creme... so its fair for people to say his ZvP was good... but I think this shows its fallen off slightly
On December 03 2009 19:17 WyffGoaL wrote: July is really old already, you can tell from his micro and his "strategy" ( mass hydra at late game, WTF? ) His generation is totally gone T_T
Hmmmm you are probably right, he just sucks now a days...
* Detailed ELO, sort by vZ *
Oh wait he's currently the best ZvPer in the world.
After losing to Stats, he is no long the best ZvPer in the world. Elo is all about relevancy!
I thought stats played well, but I feel like rather than stats winning with brililant play July lost because of missed opportunities, missing the shuttle with scourge, messing up micro, and decisions, massing hydra instead of going for more bases and a stronger late game. Did you see how out of control stats looked versus Jaedong? I'm not saying he's bad but he beat July because july didnt play well, so I'm not ready to say he has good pvz.
On December 03 2009 19:31 meeple wrote: Set 5 wasn't that great imo... July just failed to play well enough to even put up a fight
Well his 2 front hydra push was big and scary. And Stat's push through the bridge was damn close (with a sick scarab killing several hydras). Also cool HT snipes. Great game fo sho.
On December 03 2009 19:17 WyffGoaL wrote: July is really old already, you can tell from his micro and his "strategy" ( mass hydra at late game, WTF? ) His generation is totally gone T_T
Hmmmm you are probably right, he just sucks now a days...
* Detailed ELO, sort by vZ *
Oh wait he's currently the best ZvPer in the world.
Not sure what this "July's PvZ is awesome" bandwagoning is coming from. The only time he really caught my attention was when he had to face Bisu, and Bisu generally won. And the last game today wasn't exactly impressive. Some minutes before the end even the commentators were like "What's he doing? This isn't a fight he can win with Hydras..."
You need to do a little bit more of research. Watch the minimap of his game against The Rock on RoV.
stats has become REALLY good, just look at his recent record. his few losses came from top players (calm, movie, zero). He is not S class (yet) except for his PvT, so I think he'll be eliminated by the likes of JD, Calm, Zero, Effort, but imo he can beat anyone else left in this tournament.
Well Stats looks like a little Flash protoss version to me. Overall solid and safe play based on good mechanics. Of course he is not on his level, but his style is similar.
On December 04 2009 07:02 lone_hydra wrote: Weird recommendations. ZvZ was good but not crazy. It was pretty standard for 2 12 hatch openings, get mutas scourge, micro, more mutas=win.
The final match is the one that should be recommended. Sick ass PvZ from Stats.
how was not awesome? It was a even ZvZ for 18 minutes and everytime they engaged they ended up even, it was really awesome and tense to watch live, and I agree, game 5 was pretty darn awesome, but unfortunately the July fans disagree.
On December 04 2009 07:02 lone_hydra wrote: Weird recommendations. ZvZ was good but not crazy. It was pretty standard for 2 12 hatch openings, get mutas scourge, micro, more mutas=win.
The final match is the one that should be recommended. Sick ass PvZ from Stats.
If you think that was a "standard" zvz then you must not watch many games.
Most games are decided by the first, or at most second, muta battles. This one included at least a dozen battles raging over an 18min game. We're lucky if normal zvz reach the 8min mark nowindays.
Anyone who didn't watch last night should watch game 1 Jaedong v Hydra.
I finally got to watching Game 1 and I have to commend both players for an excellent match, especially from Sir Hydra. He performed way beyond expectations and I am eager to see more of his games if this level of play can be continued.
On December 04 2009 07:02 lone_hydra wrote: Weird recommendations. ZvZ was good but not crazy. It was pretty standard for 2 12 hatch openings, get mutas scourge, micro, more mutas=win.
The final match is the one that should be recommended. Sick ass PvZ from Stats.
If you think that was a "standard" zvz then you must not watch many games.
Most games are decided by the first, or at most second, muta battles. This one included at least a dozen battles raging over an 18min game. We're lucky if normal zvz reach the 8min mark nowindays.
Anyone who didn't watch last night should watch game 1 Jaedong v Hydra.
Thats because there is alot of ling action for the first few minutes usually due to at least 1 going for aggresive BOs. Game 1 was a really peaceful early game with both players consenting to sit back and macro/ tech up which allowed for high economy to support all the mutas. I still think its standard considering the macro zvz and BO both guys decided to play. Not saying it was not a good game, but it was definitely not crazy, just lucky that both players employed a standard economic zvz game plan.
On December 04 2009 07:02 lone_hydra wrote: Weird recommendations. ZvZ was good but not crazy. It was pretty standard for 2 12 hatch openings, get mutas scourge, micro, more mutas=win.
The final match is the one that should be recommended. Sick ass PvZ from Stats.
If you think that was a "standard" zvz then you must not watch many games.
Most games are decided by the first, or at most second, muta battles. This one included at least a dozen battles raging over an 18min game. We're lucky if normal zvz reach the 8min mark nowindays.
Anyone who didn't watch last night should watch game 1 Jaedong v Hydra.
Thats because there is alot of ling action for the first few minutes usually due to at least 1 going for aggresive BOs. Game 1 was a really peaceful early game with both players consenting to sit back and macro/ tech up which allowed for high economy to support all the mutas. I still think its standard considering the macro zvz and BO both guys decided to play. Not saying it was not a good game, but it was definitely not crazy, just lucky that both players employed a standard economic zvz game plan.
its not standard at all most zvzs end within 7-10 minutes due to one player getting extremely ahead in the battle + getting a harass advantage
In this game they kept engaging over and over again and breaking even for 18 minutes, it was amazing to watch, I would dare say it was the best zvz of the year, epic game
Usually the games you talk about with passive macro fests both players refuse to engage and muster up a huge army, however here they kept engaging over and over again with epic battles not knowing who is going to win and you end up surprised at each time they end up even, fantastic game in every account, or maybe watching it live inflates its value a lot idc, but games are meant to be watched without knowing the results beforehand for the full experience
EPT![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/alffla/NATESTORKbanner.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/DoctorHelvetica/misc_gfx/lineupimage.png)
Jaedong < Odd-Eye > 
Stats < Match Point > ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/DoctorHelvetica/misc_gfx/predictionsimage.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/DoctorHelvetica/misc_gfx/resultsimage.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/DoctorHelvetica/misc_gfx/recommendedimage.png)
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