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On May 14 2009 12:11 p4NDemik wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2009 12:00 omG.[RaYnE] wrote:
imo they just need a new batch of much more intelligent people making the rules and such It doesn't matter who is making the rules on KeSPA's side, in the end, they need players' input to make rules that actually do what they are intended to do, and not bullshit like what has been happening.
Unless a union is formed KeSPA is going to keep doing what they want. Unions are hard to form and require lots of paperwork and legal footwork and you have to remember that even the coaches of the teams are still young guys (for the most part). This is a lot to place on the shoulders of 20 something year olds who already have issues to deal with outside of progaming and a strict intense schedule.
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On May 14 2009 12:11 p4NDemik wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2009 12:00 omG.[RaYnE] wrote:
imo they just need a new batch of much more intelligent people making the rules and such It doesn't matter who is making the rules on KeSPA's side, in the end, they need players' input to make rules that actually do what they are intended to do, and not bullshit like what has been happening. Show nested quote +On May 14 2009 12:11 Pioneer wrote:On May 14 2009 03:27 p4NDemik wrote:
ace does play in Gom.
What basis would KeSPA/IEG have to sue MBC/OGN if they let their players play in GOM? I don't see the connection you're trying to make. Those teams don't play purely because OGN/MBC don't want the added competition. KeSPA doesn't have the power to dictate what events teams can not participate in - they can only tell them which events the teams absolutely have to participate in. (and that's pretty much limited to PL)
Basically what I'm asking is what clause in the broadcasting rights makes MBC and OGN's progaming teams KeSPA's bitch? MBC would pull their sponsorship of Hero if the coaches ignored them. Legal battle with KeSPA/IEG > losing a small portion of their income. If MBC pulled their sponsorship of Hero, Hero would essentially die and the players would go to other teams. They can't even keep their stars from leaving with the money MBC sends to them. (July, Bisu, TheZerg and they almost lost Pusan) So in a sense they can tell Hero what to do (OGN isn't even a part of this anymore since Hite owns Sparkyz now) and unless the coaches want to lose their jobs and see their hardwork disappear they listen. and KeSPA and IEG are butt buddies, IEG owns the rights to PL and MBC is sure as hell not pulling out of PL over 1 league that is in competition with them. Yes, I know MBC would never go along with the team going rogue, that's not what I'm talking about, because that will never happen. What I want to know is how KeSPA would have any legal basis to go after MBC/OGN if they (for whatever reason) changed their minds and let their teams participate in GOM events.
Doesn't matter if their is legal basis. It all comes back to the fact that IEG owns the 3 major leagues in Korea, KeSPA is essentially IEG's pawn, IEG doesn't want GOM to succeed so they make sure KeSPA doesn't sanction them, a combination of some teams not wanting their players to play in a non sanctioned league and being essentially owned by IEG makes it so these teams won't go play in them.
IEG doesn't need a legal basis when there is no players union and their money is enough to make people do what they want.
sorry for the double post.
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The biggest problem that Starcraft has is that it's too small. Yes, it's big compared to other competitive games but it's minute compared to other professional sports.
In such a situation, it is natural for there only to be one governing body and for it to be made up of retards. I don't think the industry is quite big enough to have 2 serious competitors, and I don't think it ever will. Starcraft's growth potential is very limited.
You can see how small the inudstry is with GOM. They're organising their own league. If it gets big enough, the KESPA leagues will die and GOM will have a chance to take over KESPA's position. But right now, 4 teams aren't involved. That's 1/3rd of the Korean Starcraft industry!
A player's union would help, as some people have pointed out. But no matter what, I think Starcraft is stuck in a situation where nobody really likes what's happening but everyone goes along with it anyway because that's the only way it'll work out. Especially during hard economis times like these, nobody would want to rock the boat. If teams form a union that threatens to boycott matches, sponsors will drop them because they aren't giving their brands airtime.
Maybe when the economy rebounds there'll be more sponsorship money floating around and a better chance at an organisation overtaking KESPA. If it rebounds just as SC2 is taking off, another organisation may be able to steal first mover advantage from KESPA and establish itself as a viable alternative.
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On May 14 2009 12:15 Pioneer wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2009 12:11 p4NDemik wrote:On May 14 2009 12:00 omG.[RaYnE] wrote:
imo they just need a new batch of much more intelligent people making the rules and such It doesn't matter who is making the rules on KeSPA's side, in the end, they need players' input to make rules that actually do what they are intended to do, and not bullshit like what has been happening. Unless a union is formed KeSPA is going to keep doing what they want. Unions are hard to form and require lots of paperwork and legal footwork and you have to remember that even the coaches of the teams are still young guys (for the most part). This is a lot to place on the shoulders of 20 something year olds who already have issues to deal with outside of progaming and a strict intense schedule.
And sponsors do not like unions that boycott matches. If my team boycotted a match, I'd drop sponsorship because I can't count on them to give my brand airtime.
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konadora
Singapore66071 Posts
On May 14 2009 12:14 GTR wrote:
I don't understand why people think hite own Sparkyz now. They don't own anything except the right to have their brand plastered next to the team name.
OGN still run the team.
MBC wants to say 'no' to Hite, they've been using the name 'Sparkyz' and not 'Hite' all along. What's the point of selling the naming rights then >___>
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51323 Posts
free income for little effort except putting hite in their ingame names, logo and uniforms?
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United States13896 Posts
On May 14 2009 12:19 Pioneer wrote:Show nested quote +On May 14 2009 12:11 p4NDemik wrote:On May 14 2009 12:00 omG.[RaYnE] wrote:
imo they just need a new batch of much more intelligent people making the rules and such It doesn't matter who is making the rules on KeSPA's side, in the end, they need players' input to make rules that actually do what they are intended to do, and not bullshit like what has been happening. On May 14 2009 12:11 Pioneer wrote:On May 14 2009 03:27 p4NDemik wrote:
ace does play in Gom.
What basis would KeSPA/IEG have to sue MBC/OGN if they let their players play in GOM? I don't see the connection you're trying to make. Those teams don't play purely because OGN/MBC don't want the added competition. KeSPA doesn't have the power to dictate what events teams can not participate in - they can only tell them which events the teams absolutely have to participate in. (and that's pretty much limited to PL)
Basically what I'm asking is what clause in the broadcasting rights makes MBC and OGN's progaming teams KeSPA's bitch? MBC would pull their sponsorship of Hero if the coaches ignored them. Legal battle with KeSPA/IEG > losing a small portion of their income. If MBC pulled their sponsorship of Hero, Hero would essentially die and the players would go to other teams. They can't even keep their stars from leaving with the money MBC sends to them. (July, Bisu, TheZerg and they almost lost Pusan) So in a sense they can tell Hero what to do (OGN isn't even a part of this anymore since Hite owns Sparkyz now) and unless the coaches want to lose their jobs and see their hardwork disappear they listen. and KeSPA and IEG are butt buddies, IEG owns the rights to PL and MBC is sure as hell not pulling out of PL over 1 league that is in competition with them. Yes, I know MBC would never go along with the team going rogue, that's not what I'm talking about, because that will never happen. What I want to know is how KeSPA would have any legal basis to go after MBC/OGN if they (for whatever reason) changed their minds and let their teams participate in GOM events. Doesn't matter if their is legal basis. It all comes back to the fact that IEG owns the 3 major leagues in Korea, KeSPA is essentially IEG's pawn, IEG doesn't want GOM to succeed so they make sure KeSPA doesn't sanction them, a combination of some teams not wanting their players to play in a non sanctioned league and being essentially owned by IEG makes it so these teams won't go play in them. IEG doesn't need a legal basis when there is no players union and their money is enough to make people do what they want. sorry for the double post.
Nothing I didn't know already. IEG owns the broadcasting rights to MSL and ProLeague btw, not OSL I'm pretty sure.
The original question was directed at FS, who said that OGN/MBC would fear legal action if their teams participated in GOM. I'm still wondering what said legal action would be.
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EPT
