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I was about to post this in the daily proleague thread as usual but then decided that this one may deserve its own thread, with ASL16 around the corner:
* denotes players who have their results inflated a little bit by playing in K-League more than the others.
Earnings are estimated approximately, and not restricted to just Major Proleague (K-League and J-League are also counted in).
(K-League ranking for anyone curious: https://tl.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=28082406)
Before we get into the rankings, let's appreciate  Mini,  Soma and  Rush for their hard work. They are the 3 players with the most Proleague games in the first half of 2023. Although the number of games a player gets to play in Proleague is also influenced by luck, you still have to compete regularly to be in the top. Case in point: Bisu and Soulkey - the two with the least games. Bisu had many streaming breaks, while Soulkey was busy doing other stuff (mostly playing LOL). It should also be noted that Shuttle had the 4th most games in Proleague - quite contrary to the false notion that he doesn't practice anymore and is leaning towards variety streaming.
Now, the top 3 players of MPL based on win rate reads: Snow, Light and Mini. If you watch Proleague regularly, this is as obviously as it gets. And these 3 players were also first-picked in that exact order in the recent MPL World Cup. Apparently, progamers know their shit.
Snow's PvT, at 77%, has reached an absurd level where he's just now bullying every Terran on earth. The 3 Ultimate Battle series between him and the top 3 Terrans (vs Rush, vs Royal, vs Light) ended with a combined score of 22-5. But what may surprise a few is that his PvZ is now the best by a distance among the Protosses. Mini, Bisu and Best all have their PvZ win rate around 50%, but Snow stands far above them at 59%. His no.1 position in PvZ was probably vindicated earlier this year in the KCM S1 finals, in which the Protoss team, with both Bisu and Mini there, elected to revive Snow for their last chance, and he completed a reverse all-kill to win the season for Team Protoss.
Talking about absurd level in a matchup, Light's TvZ is no less impressive (also at 77%). And that plays a big part in placing him in 2nd place. He also has no weak matchups, maybe apart from TvP against Snow. His win rate in every match-up is just so far ahead compared to the next Terrans in line, that no one should ever mention again that Royal or Rush has surpassed him. There were many times when his MPL teammates could just comfortably watch the games and picked up the prize as Light did all the heavy lifting. Although you can pick many of his performances or all-kills over the past 6 months as highlights, what is most impressive to me is this insane 120-minute TvP marathon he pulled off in May.
Mini's form has seen some ups and downs over the past 6 months. Judging by overall win rate, he's only 3rd in MPL, but when it comes to who the scariest player is, there is no doubt that it's him. Look at his number of all-kills: 10, which is equal to the all-kills of the next 3 players combined. When Mini is on his day, he's just unplayable. But when he's not, well... just see the last ASL. Nevertheless, have fun rewatching any of his record 10 all-kills in the first half of this year: 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th 10th.
Soma in 4th position is considered by many the only hope for Zerg moving forwards. It's a bit sad that the overall win rate of the current best Zerg is 8-11% off his Terran and Protoss counterparts. The reason are probably (1) Zergs just beat each other in their mirror matchup and (2) all Zergs are having a hard time in ZvT. Well, at least Soma is still dominant in ZvP though. And he also has the second most all-kills (like this one) in MPL. Younger players are so scary these days.
Soulkey in 5th position is a curious case. He doesn't play as much as the others, but is still very good, which really begs the question that if he puts in the effort (like Soma for example) how much better can he be? Although Soulkey did have his gaming moments throughout the year, he's probably best remembered by foreign fans this year by complaining that Zerg can't queue up units in this Zerg support group video. Or even better, THIS ONE.
I can't really separate Royal and Rush, even though their standings in the table read 6th and 9th (the difference is minimal anyway). They are both very strong in TvZ and decent in TvP. Maybe Royal is better in the mirror matchup than Rush. Another common thing: they play BW like maniacs. From January to June, Royal and Rush played 1157 and 1126 games (all kinds, competitive), respectively - the most among progamers. And that doesn't even take into account their ladder games. Finally Artosis is right at something: Terran players are the most hard working.
Bisu is another curious case, kind of. After spending 100 years playing the Maple Story customized map, he returned to MPL with mixed results. His PvZ is now no longer the best, his PvP has never been the best in the modern era, and his PvT has always been questionable, but all of them are still good enough for him to beat the best 15 players in the world more than half of the times, despite not playing regularly. He had more than a one-month break for vacation, only to come back and complete an all-kill in the recent KCM matchday.
Jaedong actually started the year playing mostly in the K-League because he hadn't had good results in MPL (he was still in bad form after the disappointment of ASL14). And he played A LOT of BW (1008 games - 4th most among pros) and ladder games. It's really impressive given his injury problem. Then around the time of ASL15, he got his form back and started killing almost everyone (well, maybe except Terrans). Although that peak didn't last long, he's still good enough to stand toe to toe with anyone in the MPL, and hasn't dropped to K-League level since. Oh, and let's visit back to this monstrous performance by Jaedong back in March.
Mind and JYJ are actually not MPL's regulars. They played in K-League most of the times, but I put them here to complete the 5-5-5 balance for each race. Although the pair didn't often have good results in MPL (except for this JYJ's all-kill), to be fair, them not being MPL's regulars is mostly because of their less popularity (and the ability to attract funding). Needless to say, their best moment this year was the ASL finals. JYJ should thank Mind for eliminating Best for him, otherwise I seriously doubt that he could have beaten Best in a BO7 series, given that his TvP is so weak. On the other hand, when it comes to TvZ in the current meta and map pool, I can't even say that Royal and Rush are significantly better than them. However, given the overall level, both of them are unlikely to repeat the miracle of ASL15 again.
Two-time ASL champion Queen has a negative win rate in MPL this year. Yep. But to be honest, he hasn't looked the same player he was back then, for quite a long time. The guy has been struggling big time with ZvT, and although he still had his moments sometimes, like this all-kill, it's such a rarity these days. On the other hand, he was dubbed the unintentional "sponsor" of the recent TaekJong Cup, after losing like 6 in a row and placing bottom of the tournament (and having to add money to the prize pool each time you lost).
Best is probably still suffering PTSD from that (in)famous quarterfinals vs Mini two years ago, that his PvP win rate is beyond pathetic at 29% (lowest win rate of any matchups in the table). His PvT is not as strong as it's used to be but it's still decent, and his PvZ is surprisingly stronger than we would expect, although his various stints in the K-League might help inflate those numbers a bit. It's safe to say that age has finally caught up with the oldest players in this list. However, our old man still had his moments once in a while: Do Wick Chap. 1 & Do Wick Chap. 2.
Hero's RO4 finish in ASL15 probably masked his form in 2023 a little bit, but those who have followed him closely know that his level has dropped noticeably this year, to the point that he had to have several "rehab" periods to regain form. So him being 2nd from the bottom is not that big of a surprise. Added to that was the recent accident that required surgery on his index finger, which sidelined him for almost 2 months. The road to find form is even harder for our macro Zerg.
What is definitely not a surprise is Shuttle at the absolute bottom of the table with a win rate of 42% - a number already inflated by him playing in K-League sometimes. There were several periods when he won like 1 out of 10 games in MPL, and the only reason that he has still been playing in MPL regularly is his popularity. That said, players like Shuttle are actually such a treasure in this current era. Someone who still grinds the game regularly, doesn't take himself too seriously, and holds the BW scene together (he organized the most MPLs, and has been a very active participant in the university scene - the thing that has been helping pour endless money to progamers' pocket these days). Also, he does this.
To end this write-up, it's worth it to say our top progamers are enjoying a good period money wise. On average each of these 15 players made ~7k USD/month just from Proleague alone (other incomes not included). And that's from participating in just about 15 Proleague matchdays per month. May the BW scene be healthy and wealthy in the months and years to come 
+ Show Spoiler [Quick assessment on K-League] + (no all-kill data obviously because K-League doesn't use all-kill format) What is hard for K-League is making assessments about individuals as players jump in and out too frequently, Keep in mind that while MPL is most definitely the top 1-15 players, KL is not necessarily the next 16-30. Some players are strong enough to play here but don't have the popularity to join or just aren't active much themselves. What is certain is that sSak, Effort, Sharp, Action, Shine and Stork - the top KL players are definitely good enough to play in MPL. It's not like there is a promotion/relagation system between the two. But these players play in KL mostly due to their own choice/habit, available slots or ability to attract funding - not because of skills. Rain is a special case as he doesn't play much and when he does, he just casually slips between MPL, KL and J-League. Can't really put him anywhere but one thing for sure, he's MPL level as well.
+ Show Spoiler [Player vs Player specific win rates (a…] + More insights into players' performance for the first half of 2023. This table contains win rates for all games between these players, not just Proleague (ASL, KCM, Ultimate Battle, Spongames... all included). Data is omitted in cases less than 10 games were played between the 2 players. PLAYER vs PLAYER WIN RATE, JAN-JUN 2023 (ALL GAMES)Table is to be read [row vs column], for example Mini vs Snow is 57.1% for Mini. So it mostly agrees with the Proleague table. But there are a few things to point out: - Bisu's PvZ is still the best, or at least tie-best with P:Snow. Interesting that Bisu's doing better against Soma and Queen, while Snow is doing better against Jaedong and Hero. Maybe a style clash? - Best has better PvZ than Mini. Like, vs virtually every opponent. This must be a shock. - Hero can't play ZvP anymore? When every other Zerg is beating Shuttle at a rate of 70%, Hero is the only one losing to him. - The saddest win rate belongs to Jaedong with 8% against Light. - So Light's TvZ is actually more at 65% vs other Zergs, but him farming Jaedong at a rate of 92% boosted up his rate massively. - JYJ's TvZ may actually be better than Rush and Royal, and only second to Light. Makes a lot of sense now when he TvZ'd his way to the ASL finals. - TvP is tough for Terrans. The top 4 Terrans can barely get a positve win rate against the top 4 Protosses. - But ZvT is even worse for Zergs. Only Soma can somewhat hold his head high. The others are being beaten brutally - ZvZ has no order. While in PvP and TvT you can clearly tell who's the best and second and so on. In ZvZ they're just beating each other randomly all over the place.
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nice writeup TMNT. Interesting to see that minis PvT is far stronger than his PvZ this year, and snow is somehow the best PvZer now lol
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Excellent writeup !!! 
Snow is playing great these days!
And mini has 10 all-kills...unbelivable !
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What an insightful read, thanks TMNT.
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age has finally caught up with a lot of these guys.
its no surprise that the big names that have fallen to the lower rankings are all the oldest guys.
queen, best, bisu and jd are all the same age and they have all declined. bisu and jd still have moments but thats all it is, just glimpses of their class. otherwise they cant maintain the consistency as you would expect from people that dont have the drive or concentration to keep up with younger minds. light is the only exception from this age group.
the strongest guys now are unsurprisingly the guys who are 3-5 years younger (snow, soma, mini, royal, jyj). larva would have been in this group if he still played too
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Past Kespa era, best, bisu and jd were never good to begin with.
Just wanted to clarify, because u made it sound like it's just about the recent times.
What's the reason? Lack of coaches, army service, age; one can only speculate.
Edit: of course they are still good, the best, so personaly i don't have anything against their record. I'd take being top10 of the world any day.
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What players participate in the k-League?
Is there a leaderboard for them?
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On July 17 2023 15:09 masoka82 wrote:
What players participate in the k-League?
Is there a leaderboard for them?
Yes , K-League stats would be nice to have... but i'm afraid we ask for too much 
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I don't follow K-League enough to have a write up but here it is. It's really easy to pull data off eloboard.com to have a ranking though.
(no all-kill data obviously because K-League doesn't use all-kill format)
What is hard for K-League is making assessments about individuals as players jump in and out too frequently, Keep in mind that while MPL is most definitely the top 1-15 players, KL is not necessarily the next 16-30. Some players are strong enough to play here but don't have the popularity to join or just aren't active much themselves.
What is certain is that sSak, Effort, Sharp, Action, Shine and Stork - the top KL players are definitely good enough to play in MPL. It's not like there is a promotion/relagation system between the two. But these players play in KL mostly due to their own choice/habit, available slots or ability to attract funding - not because of skills.
Rain is a special case as he doesn't play much and when he does, he just casually slips between MPL, KL and J-League. Can't really put him anywhere but one thing for sure, he's MPL level as well.
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TMNT, have you noticed any significant differences in stats/performance after Proleague switched to the ASL16 pool?
Eloboard matchup stats still has a really low number of games per new map, but maybe there's some specifics you've noticed so far? One thing I've noticed, is that Invader seems really comfortable for PvZ.
Thanks for the post btw. Nice to have a source of data which actually focuses on the day-to-day tryhard pro games, in English.
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On July 17 2023 15:09 Bonyth wrote:
Past Kespa era, best, bisu and jd were never good to begin with.
Just wanted to clarify, because u made it sound like it's just about the recent times.
What's the reason? Lack of coaches, army service, age; one can only speculate.
Edit: of course they are still good, the best, so personaly i don't have anything against their record. I'd take being top10 of the world any day.
were never good relative to the scene or compared to their peak?
because bisu and jd were definitely good relative to the scene for a long time post kespa too. they didnt dominate like flash did but they did their tbls status justice for a long time before they each dropped off.
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On July 17 2023 17:53 iRkSupperman wrote:
TMNT, have you noticed any significant differences in stats/performance after Proleague switched to the ASL16 pool?
Eloboard matchup stats still has a really low number of games per new map, but maybe there's some specifics you've noticed so far? One thing I've noticed, is that Invader seems really comfortable for PvZ.
Thanks for the post btw. Nice to have a source of data which actually focuses on the day-to-day tryhard pro games, in English.
Can't say anything based on data at this point because the number of games is still too low (the K-League players haven't even used the new maps yet) and some OP players (Snow, Light) are skewing the data.
Only thing I rememer is Sea said when reviewing the maps that Apocalypse is a balanced map, Invader is a Protoss map, Campanella is Terran map and Tempest Zerg map. Well, 2p map where the 3rd gas is right next to natural definitely seems easier for P.
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By the way, ASL qualifiers are right around next week. Main tournament starts mid August.
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Thanks for the work TMNT.
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Amazing work TMNT !!
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Damn SK is the only zerg with a positive winrate vs terran right now :O
Zergs really need a meta shift, things aren't going well in that match-up.
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On July 17 2023 22:29 Ideas wrote:
Damn SK is the only zerg with a positive winrate vs terran right now :O
Zergs really need a meta shift, things aren't going well in that match-up.
Tbf Light is also the only Terran with a positive win rate vs Protoss, and it's barely over 50%.
The reason for those poor win rates is because Snow and Light are skewing the data too much with their 77% win rate in PvT and TvZ.
But yeah, ZvT is in a dire state right now. You'll see a clearer picture when you look at the specific win rates of player vs player
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What is the reason Rain is only playing in K-league? Just not able to dedicate enough time for Proleague? Seems like he should be playing with the big boys.
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It's their choice really. Sharp, Ssak, Effort, Stork and Rain are at least on par if not better than Shuttle, who is a MPL regulars but also a punching bag for the big boys. I can only guess that they don't want to be embarassed week in week out in the MPL so they fixed their spots in the KL.
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On July 17 2023 18:19 TMNT wrote:
By the way, ASL qualifiers are right around next week. Main tournament starts mid August.
thx for info! Is there any news about Flash,will he play? Will there be some announcement by him or people just expect he will sign up for qualifiers?
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Awesome work man, thank you!
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Netherlands5091 Posts
Very nice work! Love it, but won't dare to use it to predict upcoming ASL results too much. We know what happened last time 
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are map stats avail?
Curious about the outcome of the play on Champion.
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Champion in its short lifespan sees 54.8% PvZ (31 games), 54.8% ZvT (31games), 44.2%TvP (43 games). Can't say anything from that small data though.
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hi TMNT, what is the major proleague? apart from KCM, are there any league in Korean?
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On July 22 2023 04:44 shakigami wrote:
hi TMNT, what is the major proleague? apart from KCM, are there any league in Korean?
There's a pinned thread in the front page of this forum about it:
https://tl.net/forum/bw-tournaments/605325-megathread-daily-proleagues
Weird that the Proleague has been running for years but a lot of foreigners weren't even aware of it. Should have started the thread much sooner.
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On July 22 2023 00:50 Jumperer wrote:
this chart once again proved that protoss is the most overpowered/easiest race and that terran is the weakest race. With the exception of shuttle hero best queen, terran players are the worse performers. Terrans all have low % winrate vs protoss and have by far the least amount of all-kills. Light have much higher APM than snow yet have a lower winrate. Terran only have higher winrate in TvZ because all zerg players are currently bad, it has nothing to do with the matchup. If you drop prime yellow/savior/ggaemo in today's meta they would all have over 60% winrate in zvt.
When will protoss be banned from competitive starcraft like SF2 akuma, metaknight brawl, ice climbers wobble melee, and link in soul caliber?
Genuinely impossible to tell whether this is parody or just the average terran player.
Anyway, great writeup and information. Mini getting so many all-kills but sometimes just bombing is hilarious, totally fits him as a player.
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On July 22 2023 05:45 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2023 04:44 shakigami wrote:
hi TMNT, what is the major proleague? apart from KCM, are there any league in Korean? There's a pinned thread in the front page of this forum about it: https://tl.net/forum/bw-tournaments/605325-megathread-daily-proleaguesWeird that the Proleague has been running for years but a lot of foreigners weren't even aware of it. Should have started the thread much sooner. Oh crap, I had no idea this was even a thing. This is great!
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On July 22 2023 05:45 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2023 04:44 shakigami wrote:
hi TMNT, what is the major proleague? apart from KCM, are there any league in Korean? There's a pinned thread in the front page of this forum about it: https://tl.net/forum/bw-tournaments/605325-megathread-daily-proleaguesWeird that the Proleague has been running for years but a lot of foreigners weren't even aware of it. Should have started the thread much sooner.
Pretty sure that people who watched Korean pros streams and Youtube channels were aware of it. Just going by conversations I've had in various Discord servers/streams with players/watchers of Starcraft in the last years. But yes, good to have a centralised thread for it on TL as well. Thanks for managing it
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On July 22 2023 00:50 Jumperer wrote:
this chart once again proved that protoss is the most overpowered/easiest race and that terran is the weakest race. With the exception of shuttle hero best queen, terran players are the worse performers. Terrans all have low % winrate vs protoss and have by far the least amount of all-kills. Light have much higher APM than snow yet have a lower winrate. Terran only have higher winrate in TvZ because all zerg players are currently bad, it has nothing to do with the matchup. If you drop prime yellow/savior/ggaemo in today's meta they would all have over 60% winrate in zvt.
When will protoss be banned from competitive starcraft like SF2 akuma, metaknight brawl, ice climbers wobble melee, and link in soul caliber?
not funny. Stop trying.
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I think Snow's numbers will slowly dwindle once Flash comes back. Fair to say that Mind/Royal/Rush are not what we would have hoped for them to be after their ASL success.
The most impressive statline BY FAR is that of Mini's. Don't know what's happening in his PvZ but I assume those are numbers that will gradually increase over time, hard to believe the new ASL maps are as anti-protoss as the past couple of seasons so not too worried there.
Light's TvZ: there will be no better zergs coming out any time soon so these numbers are pretty insane. We all knew it should be around 65% but this is just crazy.
Hero ZvT: what the hell is going on there.
Best PvP: kind of expected though, PvP at the highest level is micro + mental strength and decision-making which we can all agree he is the poorest out of anyone having reached skill levels similar to his.
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More insights into players' performance for the first half of 2023.
This table contains win rates for all games between these players, not just Proleague (ASL, KCM, Ultimate Battle, Spongames... all included). Data is omitted in cases less than 10 games were played between the 2 players.
PLAYER vs PLAYER WIN RATE, JAN-JUN 2023 (ALL GAMES)Table is to be read [row vs column], for example Mini vs Snow is 57.1% for Mini.
So it mostly agrees with the Proleague table. But there are a few things to point out:
- Bisu's PvZ is still the best, or at least tie-best with Snow. Interesting that Bisu's doing better against Soma and Queen, while Snow is doing better against Jaedong and Hero. Maybe a style clash?
- Best has better PvZ than Mini. Like, vs virtually every opponent. This must be a shock.
- Hero can't play ZvP anymore? When every other Zerg is beating Shuttle at a rate of 70%, Hero is the only one losing to him.
- The saddest win rate belongs to Jaedong with 8% against Light.
- So Light's TvZ is actually more at 65% vs other Zergs, but him farming Jaedong at a rate of 92% boosted up his rate massively.
- JYJ's TvZ may actually be better than Rush and Royal, and only second to Light. Makes a lot of sense now when he TvZ'd his way to the ASL finals.
- TvP is tough for Terrans. The top 4 Terrans can barely get a positve win rate against the top 4 Protosses.
- But ZvT is even worse for Zergs. Only Soma can somewhat hold his head high. The others are being beaten brutally
- ZvZ has no order. While in PvP and TvT you can clearly tell who's the best and second and so on. In ZvZ they're just beating each other randomly all over the place.
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Hero always had trouble against Shuttle from what I remember, even back in 2015 when he was beating every other Protoss except maybe Bisu
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Holy shit 8% vs light, poor JD. I remember him always having trouble vs light in the kespa days but still being able to beat him out when it mattered in the OSL/MSL (his semifinals MSL match vs light in 2010 was so epic). But damn now he's just literally a scrub for light :O
But yea Soma seems to be the best ZvTer right now but his whole game plan is based on getting a huge advantage in the early game with his sublime muta control (or even just winning the game outright). Once he gets to hive tech he seems a bit weaker than a player like action or soulkey. Although I guess that sort of describes ZvT in general right now lol.
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Sorry if this has been answered before but how is the money divided up between players for proleague? Do only the winners receive the pot money, or participants receive some base-level cash as well? And do players get extra cash for winning their specific match?
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Bisutopia19256 Posts
Small note: Bisu’s PvP through Sonic era and early ASL era held an 80% win rate. If you call the modern era as the years during and after his military service, then yes his PvP isn’t as good.
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On July 23 2023 04:06 Ideas wrote:
Sorry if this has been answered before but how is the money divided up between players for proleague? Do only the winners receive the pot money, or participants receive some base-level cash as well? And do players get extra cash for winning their specific match?
The winners take it all. Losers get nothing. So it's more cruel when there is a super ace because only 1 game/1 player is responsible for the huge cash. Players sometimes get extra reward from a specific sponsor for doing an all kill.
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Snow deserves an ASL win man. He makes PvT looks absurdly imbalanced.
I think even prime Flash does not heat Snow PvT now. Those fking reavers man.....
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Jd with 8% vs Light makes me sad 
And yes, Snow is deserving an ASL !!
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On July 23 2023 14:58 weiliem wrote:
Snow deserves an ASL win man. He makes PvT looks absurdly imbalanced.
I think even prime Flash does not heat Snow PvT now. Those fking reavers man.....
It is highly likely he won't ever win an ASL nor any other big tittle. He looks great on the daily proleague stats but a single player league is just a whole different beast. Players from K league increase dramatically their performance compared to the top guys (Action/Shine/Rain/Stork...) and then you have also the specific preparation for each singular match. And to top it all the mental fortitude for going all the way through is something he has shown lots of cracks before. I think last ASL he had a great chance, considering the map pool and everyone else's level but he got screwed by Royal and himself in the group stage.
Let me recap:
ASL3 lost in group RO24 to effort/shine
ASL4 lost in group RO24 to shuttle/hero
ASL5 lost the finals to Rain 1/3 after beating flash 3/2 and Mini 3/1
ASL6 lost in group RO16 to effort/shuttle
ASL7 lost in group RO16 to calm/last
ASL8 lost the finals to flash 0/4 after beating last 3/0 and action 3/1
ASL9 lost in group RO16 to stork/larva
ASL10 lost in RO8 0/3 to Soma
ASL11 lost in RO8 1/3 to hero
ASL12 lost in group RO16 to Light/Queen
ASL13 lost in group RO24 to Royal/ggaemo
ASL14 lost in RO8 0/3 to hero
ASL15 lost in group RO16 to Light/Soulkey
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On July 22 2023 23:03 TMNT wrote:PLAYER vs PLAYER WIN RATE, JAN-JUN 2023 (ALL GAMES)
Can you make a version of this table with the number of games played between the players instead of winrate?
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EPT![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/75YPOGd.png)
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/DLVME9A.png)
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/eGkEHaq.png)
