EPToriginal video is 3 years old, but its very relevant today.
Why Pros Refused Blizzards Balance Patch Offer
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jinjin5000
United States1498 Posts
original video is 3 years old, but its very relevant today. | ||
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[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium6868 Posts
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oxKnu
1258 Posts
His main point about refusing any patches like that because of risk of an unplayable game is very pragmatic, and let's be honest, given Blizzard's history in the past 10 years probably the best decision. | ||
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jinjin5000
United States1498 Posts
https://strawpoll.com/6kb6z4yqj | ||
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ne4aJIb
Russian Federation3209 Posts
On February 01 2021 06:03 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote: Interesting Bisu stoped the dragoon fix bug that blizzard was promoting everywhere as a coming fix. Oo Man, where is the stream? | ||
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jkhggjhfghgf
1 Post
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gfrewasdsda
1 Post
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Kaolla
China2999 Posts
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TaShadan
Germany1980 Posts
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EmptyHands
14 Posts
Thanks for the video btw, love your content. | ||
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
(I assume Bisu feels that dragoons becoming better by itself could break the game) Thanks again for giving us a peek into the eye of the storm jinjin.  | ||
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Cele
Germany4016 Posts
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JieXian
Malaysia4677 Posts
I wonder why bisu refused the dragoon fix. Was it because it will be too good? or maybe because he didn't trust blizzard on that either (maybe the new dragoon movement will be wonky)? Thanks for the subs! | ||
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iFU.pauline
France1710 Posts
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BlueStar
Bulgaria1171 Posts
On February 01 2021 17:32 iFU.pauline wrote: No more balance patch, the last one was terrible, it switched pool 150 to 200 which gave a 50% winrate to any rush bunker attempt for the past 20 years and require Jesus level drone management just because a couple of 3v3 hunters noob weren't happy. lol :D :D | ||
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QuadroX
386 Posts
On February 01 2021 17:32 iFU.pauline wrote: No more balance patch, the last one was terrible, it switched pool 150 to 200 which gave a 50% winrate to any rush bunker attempt for the past 20 years and requires Jesus level drone management just because a couple of 3v3 hunters noobs weren't happy. 100% on that! | ||
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fesfsfsfeqqw
1 Post
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RKC
2848 Posts
On February 01 2021 16:43 JieXian wrote: Wow, I'm glad they made the right call, especially given the recent news I wonder why bisu refused the dragoon fix. Was it because it will be too good? or maybe because he didn't trust blizzard on that either (maybe the new dragoon movement will be wonky)? Thanks for the subs! Maybe dragoons getting too good could break PvP or make the matchup stale? Or maybe there's a selfish reason - Bisu knows the secret art of dragoon micro and fixing it would dilute his edge  | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8852 Posts
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2Pacalypse-
Croatia9535 Posts
I wouldn't be surprised if Bisu misinterpreted Blizzard where he thought they wanted to make dragoons less "stupid" in general, like when walking them down the ramps or through other tight spaces. That would indeed change the game significantly as it involves altering the pathing algorithm, something that probably shouldn't be tinkered with. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8852 Posts
i think youre underestimating how often dragoons can glitch out of an attack and how much attention has to be given to dragoons specifically because of this. if dragoons attacked as smoothly as hydras or tanks for example their overall dps would improve quite a bit. would make busts a lot easier or early game micro vs marines much easier for example. the added benefit of you being able to allocate a bit more apm to something else is always good (eg microing zealots in engages rather than microing the dragoons). also have to keep in mind dragoons without range upgrade suffers from this issue more and this would be a big buff to pre upgrade dragoons | ||
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TaShadan
Germany1980 Posts
On February 02 2021 21:58 2Pacalypse- wrote: I'm pretty sure Bisu just didn't fully understand what Blizzard was talking about. I have no idea why he would be so adamantly against fixing a bug where dragoons (and other units) occasionally get stuck and you need to press stop or hold position to get them moving again. This is something that pretty much never happens to pro players anyway, since they're much more diligent in controlling their units. Even non-pros have gotten pretty used to this bug and will have no big issues in working around it, but that doesn't make it any less annoying. So in the end, fixing this bug would most likely just have a positive impact on brand new players who haven't encountered it before, while having no negative impacts on higher skilled players. I wouldn't be surprised if Bisu misinterpreted Blizzard where he thought they wanted to make dragoons less "stupid" in general, like when walking them down the ramps or through other tight spaces. That would indeed change the game significantly as it involves altering the pathing algorithm, something that probably shouldn't be tinkered with. I agree. Just remove the annoying stop/hold bug. Not the general behaviour. But of course it would need proper testing before being added. | ||
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MeSaber
Sweden1235 Posts
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SchAmToo
United States1141 Posts
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ne4aJIb
Russian Federation3209 Posts
On February 03 2021 04:10 SchAmToo wrote: We're listening to Flash retell a conversation from 5 years ago. We have no idea what Bisu's stance was other than he was against whatever was being proposed. Let's not sit here and assume we know exactly the conversation or what changes, and that Flash is remembering correctly. On February 01 2021 05:55 jinjin5000 wrote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPgsJ-MHrCk original video is 3 years old, but its very relevant today. | ||
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SchAmToo
United States1141 Posts
hmmm i misread patching as pathing. still, 3 years old is still 2 years out. I'd say it's possibly unreliable narrator. | ||
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jinjin5000
United States1498 Posts
On February 03 2021 04:29 SchAmToo wrote: hmmm i misread patching as pathing. still, 3 years old is still 2 years out. I'd say it's possibly unreliable narrator. Blizzard specifically said dragoon/marine gum bug which is exactly what people here are talking about (stuck and stop attacking bug thing) I wasnt sure how to put it in English term. Bisu disagreed saying any fix to dragoon pathing will break the unit to be way too good, including that | ||
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ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
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oxKnu
1258 Posts
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TT1
Canada10035 Posts
On February 02 2021 21:58 2Pacalypse- wrote: I'm pretty sure Bisu just didn't fully understand what Blizzard was talking about. I have no idea why he would be so adamantly against fixing a bug where dragoons (and other units) occasionally get stuck and you need to press stop or hold position to get them moving again. This is something that pretty much never happens to pro players anyway, since they're much more diligent in controlling their units. Even non-pros have gotten pretty used to this bug and will have no big issues in working around it, but that doesn't make it any less annoying. So in the end, fixing this bug would most likely just have a positive impact on brand new players who haven't encountered it before, while having no negative impacts on higher skilled players. I wouldn't be surprised if Bisu misinterpreted Blizzard where he thought they wanted to make dragoons less "stupid" in general, like when walking them down the ramps or through other tight spaces. That would indeed change the game significantly as it involves altering the pathing algorithm, something that probably shouldn't be tinkered with. The dragoon freeze bug plays a big role when trying to goon micro (decision making wise), he probably thought fixing it would be too big of a buff. It's the same thing with scarab duds, targeting workers with reavs is an art. It's all about the angling and whether or not you wanna go for the juicy center connection or the safer connection on the edges/closer to the reav. A "small" change for an extremely versatile unit like the dragoon could end up throwing everything out of whack. That said, I'm all for changes that improve our QoL if it doesn't have an impact on gameplay, such as adding an SC2-esque fog of war etc. | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
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2 Posts
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8852 Posts
On February 03 2021 06:10 oxKnu wrote: All of this is non-sense. If the game was in the hands of a capable company they would have a test realm where they could let pro-players test these changes before rolling them in the official game. "capable company" | ||
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baiesradu
Romania150 Posts
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JoinTheRain
Bulgaria409 Posts
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M3t4PhYzX
Poland4253 Posts
yeah, this is crucial over here.. lol | ||
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ggfdgfdfgd
1 Post
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9-BiT
United States1089 Posts
On February 02 2021 21:58 2Pacalypse- wrote: I'm pretty sure Bisu just didn't fully understand what Blizzard was talking about. I have no idea why he would be so adamantly against fixing a bug where dragoons (and other units) occasionally get stuck and you need to press stop or hold position to get them moving again. This is something that pretty much never happens to pro players anyway, since they're much more diligent in controlling their units. Even non-pros have gotten pretty used to this bug and will have no big issues in working around it, but that doesn't make it any less annoying. So in the end, fixing this bug would most likely just have a positive impact on brand new players who haven't encountered it before, while having no negative impacts on higher skilled players. I wouldn't be surprised if Bisu misinterpreted Blizzard where he thought they wanted to make dragoons less "stupid" in general, like when walking them down the ramps or through other tight spaces. That would indeed change the game significantly as it involves altering the pathing algorithm, something that probably shouldn't be tinkered with. It makes sense, Bisu has no incentive to make protoss easier because that only removes the leg up he has on other protoss players. The more the playing field is leveled the less he stands out. It's in his best interest to keep the skill floor as high as possible. | ||
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MinixTheNerd
200 Posts
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Jealous
10314 Posts
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