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MeSaber
Sweden1235 Posts
Always when i join late i would like to know what stats the guys before me have. A command like !list , or whatever to show it would be nice. To not spam the public chat it could be a whisper. Another good command would be a vote system to kick laggers. This could probably be abused but still, no one likes a lag game and those koreans know how to lag in EU. | ||
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elKa-ThE-FeArEd
Sweden176 Posts
It counted as a loss, do i have to report that or will it count as win automatically later on? | ||
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Jealous
10170 Posts
On September 17 2020 23:55 elKa-ThE-FeArEd wrote: they killed one of our mates early on but we managed to win 2v3. It counted as a loss, do i have to report that or will it count as win automatically later on? It counts as a loss if you leave the game before the last opponent. I don't think they are fixing these things but I don't want to say with certainty ;; | ||
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elKa-ThE-FeArEd
Sweden176 Posts
On September 18 2020 03:02 Jealous wrote: It counts as a loss if you leave the game before the last opponent. I don't think they are fixing these things but I don't want to say with certainty ;; I left the game with the end screen tho | ||
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D3AD-R3TARD
Poland305 Posts
On September 16 2020 06:23 MeSaber wrote: I would ask for some commands. Always when i join late i would like to know what stats the guys before me have. A command like !list , or whatever to show it would be nice. To not spam the public chat it could be a whisper. Another good command would be a vote system to kick laggers. This could probably be abused but still, no one likes a lag game and those koreans know how to lag in EU. It's a good idea. Right now I'm kinda oveloaded with work but I'll try to add this when I have time. On September 17 2020 23:55 elKa-ThE-FeArEd wrote: they killed one of our mates early on but we managed to win 2v3. It counted as a loss, do i have to report that or will it count as win automatically later on? Yeah, it's the thing with replays. They only list players actions. So there is info on players leaving the game but not on player elimination. For this reason when you leave before opponent who was eliminated and before hosting bot, only player left according to replay is your opponent. I'll try to fix this but it is slightly more complicated as it requires processing results table. For now what can be done is not leaving before hosting bot and asking eliminated players to leave. | ||
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MeSaber
Sweden1235 Posts
With early information people can choose to change position to Bottom group to gain advantage. When balancing it usually just change one player and not mixing the teams properly. I.E 2 friends in same group could be playing with each other most of the time. | ||
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elKa-ThE-FeArEd
Sweden176 Posts
On September 18 2020 18:00 D3AD-R3TARD wrote: It's a good idea. Right now I'm kinda oveloaded with work but I'll try to add this when I have time. Yeah, it's the thing with replays. They only list players actions. So there is info on players leaving the game but not on player elimination. For this reason when you leave before opponent who was eliminated and before hosting bot, only player left according to replay is your opponent. I'll try to fix this but it is slightly more complicated as it requires processing results table. For now what can be done is not leaving before hosting bot and asking eliminated players to leave. Ah alright! thx for the explanation | ||
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D3AD-R3TARD
Poland305 Posts
On September 18 2020 20:14 MeSaber wrote: An easy fix could maybe be display all stats when the last player has joined.. That way everyone gets the same information at the same time and no-one can move around to get a "better ally" so to speak. With early information people can choose to change position to Bottom group to gain advantage. When balancing it usually just change one player and not mixing the teams properly. I.E 2 friends in same group could be playing with each other most of the time. Ok, I've added feature that whispers to new players stats of players already in the lobby. Kinda like standard custom stats are displayed. One swap is always enough to get needed teams. Balancer only starts when teams are exactly as needed so changing places doesn't affect anything. | ||
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Grouhh
56 Posts
On September 18 2020 18:00 D3AD-R3TARD wrote: For now what can be done is not leaving before hosting bot and asking eliminated players to leave. Hi man, thanks for this awesome bot ! What happened to me once is that the loser refused to leave, so I waited until the bot leaves. But the loser waited too, and he managed to steal the win anyway. I guess the bot has no way to tell who is the actual winner in that case. And I strongly suspect some players are trying to exploit that limitation by leaving as late as possible... which was already BM enough in the first place. Also, a suggestion: I think it has already been discussed here, but since there are 2-3 bots running, maybe one of them could be "1000+ MMR" or something like that ? From my experience, the games are for the most part very balanced and enjoyable, but there are two things that can really ruin a game: unknown players, and players with such low skill that no teamplay is possible (like, at all). 1000+ MMR games could be a great way to solve both issues. And I guess the bot dedicated to these games could still turn back to regular mode in case it struggles to find enough players. | ||
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D3AD-R3TARD
Poland305 Posts
On September 19 2020 07:00 Grouhh wrote: Hi man, thanks for this awesome bot ! What happened to me once is that the loser refused to leave, so I waited until the bot leaves. But the loser waited too, and he managed to steal the win anyway. I guess the bot has no way to tell who is the actual winner in that case. And I strongly suspect some players are trying to exploit that limitation by leaving as late as possible... which was already BM enough in the first place. Also, a suggestion: I think it has already been discussed here, but since there are 2-3 bots running, maybe one of them could be "1000+ MMR" or something like that ? From my experience, the games are for the most part very balanced and enjoyable, but there are two things that can really ruin a game: unknown players, and players with such low skill that no teamplay is possible (like, at all). 1000+ MMR games could be a great way to solve both issues. And I guess the bot dedicated to these games could still turn back to regular mode in case it struggles to find enough players. As for wrong results, I am currently testing solution that will base the winner on a results page, not on replay only. If this works, not leaving after losing all buildings will not affect anything. As for 1000+ MMR games, I am still experiencing problems with running 3 bots at the same time. However, once I get it to work fine, the third bot could be limited to only ranked players or D+, C+ or something like this. There is not so many 1000+ MMR players so I don't know how often those matches would happen... | ||
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Grouhh
56 Posts
On September 21 2020 03:34 D3AD-R3TARD wrote: That's great news, thanks !As for wrong results, I am currently testing solution that will base the winner on a results page, not on replay only. If this works, not leaving after losing all buildings will not affect anything. On September 21 2020 03:34 D3AD-R3TARD wrote: Well, maybe not 1000+ then, but you get the idea :-)As for 1000+ MMR games, I am still experiencing problems with running 3 bots at the same time. However, once I get it to work fine, the third bot could be limited to only ranked players or D+, C+ or something like this. There is not so many 1000+ MMR players so I don't know how often those matches would happen... I also know there are some good players that are repelled by the BOT because as you rise through the ranks, you get less and less active teammates. From experience, at 2500 MMR, which is not even that high, the odds of getting at least one teammate that will do absolutely nothing during the whole game are substantial. So I would not be surprised to see the pool of "good players" increase if the 3rd bot gets dedicated to them. | ||
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kurrrak
Poland134 Posts
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Grouhh
56 Posts
On September 23 2020 05:16 kurrrak wrote: I'm reporting major backstabber whose nickname is 1+2-3+4-5+6-7+8. For me it happened 3-4 times with him, playing mmr or casual games. Also very bm the whole game. I didn't report earlier thinking that everyone can have a bad day, but it seems this case is incurable. Confirmation can be seen on replay from match played on 2020-09-22 22:03 (and probably many more). Haha, yeah, that guy is also a very notorious BM team killer. Up to the point I always suspected he was Bossman himself under a different ID. And he just can't stop talking trash during the game. Very annoying. | ||
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D3AD-R3TARD
Poland305 Posts
On September 23 2020 05:16 kurrrak wrote: I'm reporting major backstabber whose nickname is 1+2-3+4-5+6-7+8. For me it happened 3-4 times with him, playing mmr or casual games. Also very bm the whole game. I didn't report earlier thinking that everyone can have a bad day, but it seems this case is incurable. Confirmation can be seen on replay from match played on 2020-09-22 22:03 (and probably many more). Confirmed and banned. | ||
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kurrrak
Poland134 Posts
Thank You. | ||
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Veps
1 Post
I had a look into my stats and I wonder how do you calculate the MMR? I've noticed on some games a "random" player on the winning team just gains almost half 1k of MMR without noticeable reason while the rest just wins 75 points of MMR. While this guy, relatively to it's team mates, isn't the one with an extraordinary high initial MMR nor very low on MMR. Also noticed similar effect on the negative side: While every team member has about 1k initial MMR and two of them lose about -75 points, one guy just loses -9 points. (Can send you the game dates via pm if needed.) Is there some logic behind I didn't grasp or is it just a bug? | ||
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Jealous
10170 Posts
On October 05 2020 11:38 Veps wrote: Thanks for the bot. I had a look into my stats and I wonder how do you calculate the MMR? I've noticed on some games a "random" player on the winning team just gains almost half 1k of MMR without noticeable reason while the rest just wins 75 points of MMR. While this guy, relatively to it's team mates, isn't the one with an extraordinary high initial MMR nor very low on MMR. Also noticed similar effect on the negative side: While every team member has about 1k initial MMR and two of them lose about -75 points, one guy just loses -9 points. (Can send you the game dates via pm if needed.) Is there some logic behind I didn't grasp or is it just a bug? Not the creator but I imagine it is due to "confidence interval" or a similar mechanic which gets narrower as you play more games. The easiest way I can think of to explain this is by walking through an example. Let's say it is your first ranked game. You start at 1000 MMR, let's say. How good are you? Probably somewhere between 0 and 2000 MMR, but it's kinda hard to tell since we have no data. In order to most quickly arrive at your "true" rank, your early games get more points skew until you arrive at your "true" rank. So, if you win or lose the first game, you may gain or lose 100 points to bring you closer to your true rank. If you win or lose the second game, you can gain or lose 75 points, so on and so forth. That way, someone who has lost their first 5 games is likely closer to their "true" rank of being a 200 MMR scrub, and a pro who wins their first 5 games is closer to being 1700 MMR, or whatever. A person who wins 50% of their games will gain 100, lose 75, lose 50, gain 25, gain 12.5, and will end up at around the initial starting point, for example. Please note: all numbers are just to make a point, not how any actual system works; the numbers would depend on other players in the game, so it'd be closer to like win 99.2, lose 82.3, etc.. If each win/loss was a set amount of points, or just a weighted average of all players, then a player who is "actually" a 1700 MMR player would likely have to play a hundred games before getting even close to their "real" rank - and same can be said for the noob, who will ruin countless games by being overrated and placed on teams where they don't belong, so on and so forth. Modern ranking systems use approaches such as these in very interesting ways. You may find this Wikipedia link interesting. | ||
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D3AD-R3TARD
Poland305 Posts
On October 05 2020 11:38 Veps wrote: Thanks for the bot. I had a look into my stats and I wonder how do you calculate the MMR? I've noticed on some games a "random" player on the winning team just gains almost half 1k of MMR without noticeable reason while the rest just wins 75 points of MMR. While this guy, relatively to it's team mates, isn't the one with an extraordinary high initial MMR nor very low on MMR. Also noticed similar effect on the negative side: While every team member has about 1k initial MMR and two of them lose about -75 points, one guy just loses -9 points. (Can send you the game dates via pm if needed.) Is there some logic behind I didn't grasp or is it just a bug? It's not a bug. What you see are most likely two groups of players. Players with very big and very small (like 9 points) changes are players in first 4 placement matches. Other players are already ranked. In first 4 matches MMR has to be quickly set to an appropriate level. For this APM is used along with initial custom game stats and match results. In case of a player with big gain he probably had poor custom game stats, but won the game and had good APM so system pushes his MMR up rapidly. In case of player with small change MMR gain from good APM was neutralized by APM drop caused by loss. After 4 matches APM is no longer used and also MMR changes are less significant. As Jealous pointed out this method is used in most modern rating systems. Basically the more certainty there is about player's skill the less change is made after each game/result. Overall, I think that ranking system is working pretty well, although I still think about ways to improve it. | ||
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plaetschernderbach
Switzerland2 Posts
Formula example: /s username A (after the game has ended) - /s username A (before the game has started) You should end up with 1-0-0, or 0-1-0 or 0-0-1 Do you know what I mean? Abuse Blizzard's WIN - LOSS Statistik. Its build in and free  | ||
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SirGlinG
Sweden933 Posts
On October 09 2020 05:33 plaetschernderbach wrote: Can't you not just use /stats of each user to decide which team has won. Formula example: /s username A (after the game has ended) - /s username A (before the game has started) You should end up with 1-0-0, or 0-1-0 or 0-0-1 Do you know what I mean? Abuse Blizzard's WIN - LOSS Statistik. Its build in and free Could be a good solution. To handle those who stay at loss screen it'd require looking at the last player to leave, if he won or lost. If the bot /stats searches the players before/during the game and then looks at stats of the last player to leave. Not sure how quickly b.net stats updates but if it's within 2 minutes then no loser who stayed in the game can create a game and 4pool a quick win right after the game. | ||
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