EPTWhat can we as a community do to improve StarCraft - Page 17
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ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28561 Posts
Amount of people still playing bw = very low. SC2 = just made free to play. Them destroying bw = makes people dislike the company. This = profit? | ||
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ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
yeah companies do that, they basically dilute their products into many variations that are all low quality and rather expensive so that you think you need to buy all of them instead of sticking to the original efficient cheap solution, for example the fuck has actiblizz been doing all this time and is just still going on and they cashed on it | ||
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Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
On November 26 2017 00:21 Liquid`Drone wrote: I would like to say that even acknowledging that blizzard has made some pretty grievous mistakes with this whole SC:R project, people who seriously think they did it because they deliberately wanted to destroy the bw scene to make the last remains of the player pool go to other, more profitable blizzard games, need to get their heads checked. That theory is flat out idiotic. yup. those are the kind of theories found in blizzard forums and youtube comments. not on a community like TL. plus, it ain't gonna fix the lag. | ||
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ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
On November 26 2017 00:04 SCC-Faust wrote: Something that interests me though is the numbers letmelose provided - with BW becoming less and less populous, yet Grant has said since the release the numbers have only been growing. Does that mean that there was less than 2.8% of people playing BW on August 2017 and then somehow magically climbed up to 2.8% in this current month? http://www.gametrics.com/news/news02_view.aspx?seqid=31604 3.27% is the number taken from July 2017, when Starcraft Remastered was unavailable. There indeed was an increase of sorts right after Starcraft Remastered was released, but I don't think any sane person would look at the numbers right now and conclude that the numbers have only been growing. This is the result of artificial hype and false promises without any actual substance: an initial increase in interest followed by months of frustration and the inevitable fallout that comes with it. It truly does not matter what Blizzard's intentions are, if the end result is not beneficial for Brood War. It's literally the only thing that matters unless your priorities have Brood War further down the ladder. All companies steal ideas, endorse inhuman working conditions, do shady lobbying, evade taxes, and those at the top don't get to be there without being involved in some shady business. I really couldn't give a flying fuck about Blizzard and what their intentions are. Starcraft Remastered has been an abject failure and I wish Blizzard was never there to take notice of the short revival that Brood War had in terms of popularity and force us to endure months of their suckage. If Blizzard was half as competent at aiding the Brood War scene as they are with everything else, all these posts of frustration that involves posting personal anecdotes of being forced to deal with technical issues that were not there before Blizzard's involvement, or blaming Blizzard of having nefarious intentions would not exist. That should be the focal issue from which everything stems from. Blizzard could have the best of intentions at heart, but they sure have a funny way of showing it. | ||
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Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
On November 26 2017 00:51 ProMeTheus112 wrote: ban me, I don't care, I take it for heyjoray -__- hahaha, heck no. we need you in the strat forums. | ||
Peeano
Netherlands4683 Posts
I do have faith in SC:R development crew skills and determination, but at this rate it's likely to take at least a year to get to something as good as the community based 1.16.1 was. But we need to go beyond that, because why else would you want to play SC:R? I think we can all agree fixing lag their top priority to increase the user experience asap. Fixing ladder matching and creating a proper friend list are close seconds. Most users here want to be able to continue watching casted tournaments, for that alone we'd need a proper working game and interface so we can even get highly competitive driven players like Ret interested enough to play this. I'm not saying our current top players aren't competitive. But it's not very inviting to play the most competitive game of all time, with all the current issues. Neither was it with the community based 1.16.1. Port forwarding and ip conflicts and lag always have been hell... I really fear for Starcraft to become what Warcraft 2 is now. It's like ICCup but at an even smaller scale. Right now my question is how can we keep users interested long enough for Blizzard to make SC:R a proper working product? I think it's super vital for our community to stay strong. Can we realistically count on SC:R dev's team to deliver? I really want to believe so. | ||
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CobaltBlu
United States919 Posts
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OrangeGarage
Korea (South)319 Posts
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Incomplete..ReV
Norway613 Posts
If I was to answer the questions in the headline of the thread, I'd say that what we as a community can do to improve Starcraft is a balance between two things. Supporting the people working on fixing our problems, and to keep informing them about what's problematic. I honestly feel the Blizzard staff seems to genuinely care about fixing the problems. There also seems to be a lot of problems with connecting/implimenting BW into the Launcher thingy. A problem I don't think f.ex. iCCup has, as they can make a launcher specific to BW, rather than juggle old codes with new ones. However, this is an impression, rather than something factual I can find links to. But that's beside the point. The point is, I truly believe that even though earning money is at the core of making games and Remastering and such, they really want to do well. I decide to trust their intentions. Not just because I truly do, but also because if I don't, then I don't trust we'll get help. If I don't trust that, then why am I even playing Remastered and wasting my time and energy on whining online about something that will never get fixed? I'd just stick to iCCup then. I also think it's nice to give some encouragement, although I've failed at this point as I'm mostly a silent gamer on these matters. I tend to think that the problems will be adressed and fixed in time and then I keep on with my daily life. They won't know that I trust them and appreciate their work. Nor will they know about the problems I have. Both are faults of mine that I myself need to address. That leads to the next point. Even though I find it foolish to be overly hateful and demanding, it is important to inform the staff of the problems we're experiencing. And to keep informing them that we're still experiencing it. Keep up some pressure. I myself haven't helped here, and that is something I think I should start doing. Although there's very little I don't like about it. I love that I can just click a button and get games, that I don't need to forward my ports, that the game has been revitalized in the foreign scene - there's so many things I think is great! And it doesn't bother me at all that the games don't get updated until it's gone a while. Nor does it bother me that I have to wait - what - FIVE seconds to see my profile? Holy shit, ain't nobody got time for that! This ain't Reddit. But I do find my enjoyment is somewhat decreased when I can't play. For instance when the ladder searches for a game, finds one, the screen gets up but only my nick shows. And then it goes back to 0 seconds in searching for a new game. And after that's happened 3-4 times I figure "ok, might as well do something else". I'd probably get a game if I waited more, and when I really want to play I'll wait. But it's still a fault that could do with some fixing. So shame on me for not writing in, rather than being a lazy, happy gamer. So the bottom line is that even though I agree that it's bad that such a faulty game was released and that it should've been far more worked out before relase - I don't think it serves anyone to turn to such anger and impatience. The situation is what it is. There's no changing that now. If someone hits you with a car and you get chained to a wheelchair, you will only hurt yourself in the end if you become bitter and always angry at the car driver. It won't help anyone. It'll just make everyone have sucky lives. Likewise, it doesn't help anyone that people keep regurgitating the same hatred and frustration over Blizzard. It's okay to be angry, but move the fuck on. Keep sending in feedback that the game doesn't work as it should, but phrase it in a constructive manner. "I can't get a game because the search function goes in a loop", "I can't play due to unbearable lag", "I waste too much time when I want to look at other peoples' profiles". Keep it up! I agree that it's bad, but if you want something improved, you need to do your part to. Even if it's unfair. Don't be an ass, even if the situation stinks. My 2 humble cents. | ||
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Starlightsun
United States1405 Posts
If you don't like SC:R, play the free version. The old version of bw is still supported. But guys don't make up conspiracy theories that blizzard tries to kill sc/bw to promote sc2. It makes no sense financially, from a marketing point of view and logically. What would they gain? Nothing! No the old version has basically been killed, along with the servers to play it on. I don't believe this was an attempt to push SC2, but it is obvious that Blizzard saw something to gain by forcing all the Korean PC bangs to switch to SC:R, as well as charging huge licensing fees for tournaments like ASL. They saw that BW was having a revival with old pros switching back, and ASL 1-3, so they wanted their piece of the pie as the IP owners of BW. But the release of SC:R has been strikingly like that of SC2; huge hype followed by huge disappointment, and then players/sponsors leaving the scene. Sick of people defending Blizzard for this shameless money grab at the expense of Korean professional BW. | ||
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SchAmToo
United States1141 Posts
On November 26 2017 04:00 Starlightsun wrote: No the old version has basically been killed, along with the servers to play it on. I don't believe this was an attempt to push SC2, but it is obvious that Blizzard saw something to gain by forcing all the Korean PC bangs to switch to SC:R, as well as charging huge licensing fees for tournaments like ASL. They saw that BW was having a revival with old pros switching back, and ASL 1-3, so they wanted their piece of the pie as the IP owners of BW. But the release of SC:R has been strikingly like that of SC2; huge hype followed by huge disappointment, and then players/sponsors leaving the scene. Sick of people defending Blizzard for this shameless money grab at the expense of Korean professional BW. I'm pretty sure this project has been in the works longer than ASL1-3 seasons. I've heard rumors of it for a while. I also think you're all just unaware of how much Mike Morhaime just loves StarCraft. I would not doubt at all that 90% of the reason this game happened is because Mike just wanted to see more Brood War. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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blunderfulguy
United States1415 Posts
I get that people will always "love to hate" but I don't see how Blizzard, the team working on SCR, or the players who support SCR are the villains to be hated. And there's enough horseshit in the world as it is, why let others get away with stoking those flames here? As for rumors of when the project started, I heard rumors about it starting before ASL. I hardly know jack, yet I also heard those rumors, I'm pretty sure it isn't "insider information". Heck, a friend of mine who hadn't played StarCraft since Heart of the Swarm came out heard the same murmuring from a different place. If you didn't hear the rumors or can't believe people at Blizzard have either wanted to do this for years or understood that their players have wanted this to happen for years, then fine, just don't keep reinforcing fabricated narratives with more conjecture. | ||
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SCC-Faust
United States3736 Posts
Also I have this conspiracy that you guys are shitting up this thread with conspiracy talk to get this topic locked. | ||
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jinjin5000
United States1385 Posts
http://www.inven.co.kr/webzine/news/?news=189878&site=sc + Show Spoiler + Q. 스타크래프트가 리마스터 버전이 나오면서 뜰 것 같은 기대가 컸어요. 그런데 오히려 인기가 줄어들었다는 말이 많이 나오고 있습니다. Q: There was a lot of excitement about remastered and its implication on growing the scene. But instead, theres a lot of talk on the popularity decreasing instead. + Show Spoiler + 솔직히, 저는 리마스터 이전으로 돌아가고 싶어요. 그때는 아프리카tv BJ들이 모두 흥했거든요. 함께 팀 배틀을 활발하게 진행할 수 있었죠. 제 방송은 이전이나 지금이나 똑같아요. 그런데, 리마스터가 나오면서 서버가 불안해지기 시작했어요. 팀 배틀 진행을 못하면서 힘들어진 BJ들이 많더라고요. 그 분들한테는 팀 배틀에서 몇 번의 승리가 굉장히 중요하거든요. 한 2-3달 동안 팀 배틀을 서버 때문에 못하게 되니까 방송을 제대로 못하게 되는 경우가 생겼습니다. Flash: To be completely honest, I want to go back to time before remaster release. Then, all the Afreeca BJs were lively. It was possible to do team battles lively then. My stream on other hand, has been the same as then and now. However, the servers began to be unstable as remaster came out. There was also lot of BJs who were in difficult situation due to not being able to continue on with the team battles. To those people, wins in team battles were very important. Since they were not able to do team battle for around 2-3 months due to server instability, there were lot of cases where they were not able to broadcast due to it. + Show Spoiler + 현재 서버 문제는 해결됐어요. 그런데 당시 여파가 지금까지 이어지는 분들이 있더라고요. 예전에는 다 같이 잘 됐다면, 지금은 특정 방으로 시청자들이 몰리는 현상이 나타났죠. 물론, 블리자드의 사정도 있겠지만, 너무 늦게 해결된 게 아닌가... 스타크래프트를 좋아하는 팬으로서 리마스터에 정말 큰 기대를 했는데 아쉬움이 컸습니다. 그래도 요새 다시 팀 배틀이 활성화되면서 다시 살아나는 분위기가 형성됐어요. Flash: As for now, server problems are solved. But the aftermath from then could be felt until now. Before, everyone did well, but now, the viewers tend to congregate into a specific stream instead. Well, Blizzard has their own reasons, but I feel like that it was solved too late… As a fan of StarCraft, I looked forward to remaster a lot, but there was a big disappointment. But even then, the team battles revived a bit nowadays, and there is an atmosphere of revival. Interview had other points such as big talk about the issue of Tesagi and how it boomed into bw scene when sea won vs bisu 3:0. Will touch it later if nobody touches it but i have finals week. team battles are sort of like clan wars, with multiple people obsing in 1 room full of clan members. Included teams such as Moo, Neox, ect. The lagging of the room with multiple people is rather bigger issue than people give credit for, as well as breaking clan system and clan rooms. (Rather minor, but still takes away part of customization) | ||
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Lazare1969
United States318 Posts
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jinjin5000
United States1385 Posts
On November 27 2017 16:46 Lazare1969 wrote: Yeah, same thoughts as Flash. In 2002 Blizzard released this game called Warcraft 3 and it had 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, FFA matchmaking right out of the box, no lag. It had a much better custom game system than Starcraft Broodwar (up until 2009 when host bots ruined everything and Blizzard neglected to do anything). Fast forward to 2017 and their updated Starcraft game has only 1v1 matchmaking and it has lag issues. IMO they should've released 2v2 and 3v3 matchmaking even if it was only turn rate 4. Unlike Starcraft 2, Broodwar is actually a fun casual team game. would disagree on unlike SC2 part. Blizzard did tremendous job on promoting coop and other modes. But SCR doesnt even have stable way to get multiple people in custom game without lagging to hell. | ||
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Silentenigma
Turkey2037 Posts
On November 27 2017 16:46 Lazare1969 wrote: Yeah, same thoughts as Flash. In 2002 Blizzard released this game called Warcraft 3 and it had 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, FFA matchmaking right out of the box, no lag. It had a much better custom game system than Starcraft Broodwar (up until 2009 when host bots ruined everything and Blizzard neglected to do anything). Fast forward to 2017 and their updated Starcraft game has only 1v1 matchmaking and it has lag issues. IMO they should've released 2v2 and 3v3 matchmaking even if it was only turn rate 4. Unlike Starcraft 2, Broodwar is actually a fun casual team game. Warcraft 3 HAD lag.You would get default 200 ping no matter who you are playing against. | ||
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