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On November 27 2017 16:50 jinjin5000 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2017 16:46 Lazare1969 wrote:
Yeah, same thoughts as Flash. In 2002 Blizzard released this game called Warcraft 3 and it had 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, FFA matchmaking right out of the box, no lag. It had a much better custom game system than Starcraft Broodwar (up until 2009 when host bots ruined everything and Blizzard neglected to do anything). Fast forward to 2017 and their updated Starcraft game has only 1v1 matchmaking and it has lag issues. IMO they should've released 2v2 and 3v3 matchmaking even if it was only turn rate 4. Unlike Starcraft 2, Broodwar is actually a fun casual team game. would disagree on unlike SC2 part. Blizzard did tremendous job on promoting coop and other modes. But SCR doesnt even have stable way to get multiple people in custom game without lagging to hell.
Even just playing a 3v3 hunters game with having no lag is a 1 in 10 occurence.
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On November 27 2017 16:50 jinjin5000 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2017 16:46 Lazare1969 wrote:
Yeah, same thoughts as Flash. In 2002 Blizzard released this game called Warcraft 3 and it had 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, FFA matchmaking right out of the box, no lag. It had a much better custom game system than Starcraft Broodwar (up until 2009 when host bots ruined everything and Blizzard neglected to do anything). Fast forward to 2017 and their updated Starcraft game has only 1v1 matchmaking and it has lag issues. IMO they should've released 2v2 and 3v3 matchmaking even if it was only turn rate 4. Unlike Starcraft 2, Broodwar is actually a fun casual team game. would disagree on unlike SC2 part. Blizzard did tremendous job on promoting coop and other modes. But SCR doesnt even have stable way to get multiple people in custom game without lagging to hell.
SC2 Launch had hardly any good games to easily get into. Even months after the only 2 good UMS maps were StarBattles and Nexus Wars (Desert Strike too iirc came a little later).
3v3 BGH style maps existed, but again the biggest problem with the OG Client until they came up with CoOp mode was 0 easy way to just relax between matches.
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Does anyone know when blizzard is gonna release 2v2, 3v3 or 4v4 ladder?
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On November 28 2017 04:44 LaStScan wrote:
Does anyone know when blizzard is gonna release 2v2, 3v3 or 4v4 ladder?
Honestly Scan I doubt even Blizzard knows the answer to that question. Hopefully within the next 6 months. Hopefully...
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On November 28 2017 04:31 SchAmToo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2017 16:50 jinjin5000 wrote:On November 27 2017 16:46 Lazare1969 wrote:
Yeah, same thoughts as Flash. In 2002 Blizzard released this game called Warcraft 3 and it had 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, FFA matchmaking right out of the box, no lag. It had a much better custom game system than Starcraft Broodwar (up until 2009 when host bots ruined everything and Blizzard neglected to do anything). Fast forward to 2017 and their updated Starcraft game has only 1v1 matchmaking and it has lag issues. IMO they should've released 2v2 and 3v3 matchmaking even if it was only turn rate 4. Unlike Starcraft 2, Broodwar is actually a fun casual team game. would disagree on unlike SC2 part. Blizzard did tremendous job on promoting coop and other modes. But SCR doesnt even have stable way to get multiple people in custom game without lagging to hell. SC2 Launch had hardly any good games to easily get into. Even months after the only 2 good UMS maps were StarBattles and Nexus Wars (Desert Strike too iirc came a little later). 3v3 BGH style maps existed, but again the biggest problem with the OG Client until they came up with CoOp mode was 0 easy way to just relax between matches.
wow i had so much fun playing Star Battle back in like 2012
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the issue is that the game is old as hell. everyone around and active are guys who played together back in the day,and is in their mid/late 20's and 30's. and the kids who try to play this game dont get helped nor do they stay motivated when theyre losing so much because its so difficult. i cant see how it can grow if no one can find the fun aspect of the game tbh. Old SC has a lot of depth.
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On November 28 2017 10:23 TheShuttleGuy wrote:
the issue is that the game is old as hell. everyone around and active are guys who played together back in the day,and is in their mid/late 20's and 30's. and the kids who try to play this game dont get helped nor do they stay motivated when theyre losing so much because its so difficult. i cant see how it can grow if no one can find the fun aspect of the game tbh. Old SC has a lot of depth.
3v3 and UMS and stuff man. it's hella fun for everyone
how many people got into the game that way? for the first few months I played online probably more than 70% of my games were 3vs3. Even now I still love playing 3vs3. I mean not right now you know what I mean lal
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On November 27 2017 22:58 Silentenigma wrote:Show nested quote +On November 27 2017 16:46 Lazare1969 wrote:
Yeah, same thoughts as Flash. In 2002 Blizzard released this game called Warcraft 3 and it had 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, FFA matchmaking right out of the box, no lag. It had a much better custom game system than Starcraft Broodwar (up until 2009 when host bots ruined everything and Blizzard neglected to do anything). Fast forward to 2017 and their updated Starcraft game has only 1v1 matchmaking and it has lag issues. IMO they should've released 2v2 and 3v3 matchmaking even if it was only turn rate 4. Unlike Starcraft 2, Broodwar is actually a fun casual team game. Warcraft 3 HAD lag.You would get default 200 ping no matter who you are playing against.
yeah this is difference between peer to peer and server system i think,
server advantage is I guess it can almost halve the ping between two distant locations if it's right in the middle (?), but it will increase ping for players who are in close locations but far from the server
so in warcraft 3, you would never have as low a ping as your low ping games of bw. However very laggy situations were maybe a bit more rare (?) it did still happen
anyway basically with peer to peer you can improve the advantage of peer to peer by looking for close players and block the disadvantage by avoiding to play vs far players. Although in some cases you could still have good enough ping against far players ofc, just not quite guaranteed.
Basically then you want to be able to cancel a laggy game after it started without win/loss, and have even that not happen too often (say less than 10% or 5% is cool right?). So for example players who do a lot of 3v3 games need the quality fast interfaces/chat stuff and quality connection and lobby, so that it's easy making a game/joining it fast, starting or restarting fast, and not need to restart often, then lot of fun gogo ggggg
when this works well most of the time 4vs4 is also a thing and fun to do^^
imo 2vs2 is a game where you depend so much more on your ally, and your decisions depend so much on your ally, that's where it's harder to play good games without a ladder,
but for 3vs3 for me I would not see a point of playing ladder rather than custom, I tried it in other games like WC3 and SC2, well they also don't have quite the quality of bw for 3vs3, but I just love custom game 3v3/4v4 everyone just messing around and you can play some of the same people again remaking, rejoining, switching teammates around whatever its good ♥♦♣♠
ps: btw easy way to be able to cancel a ladder game is add a "ask for draw" button, if opponent accept game draws gg. accept by typing /draw or smtg you can't missclick lol
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On November 28 2017 10:23 TheShuttleGuy wrote:
the issue is that the game is old as hell. everyone around and active are guys who played together back in the day,and is in their mid/late 20's and 30's. and the kids who try to play this game dont get helped nor do they stay motivated when theyre losing so much because its so difficult. i cant see how it can grow if no one can find the fun aspect of the game tbh. Old SC has a lot of depth.
It's 100x easier to learn now than 5-10 years ago with all the streams and guides. Newer players get a lot of help.
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On November 28 2017 21:39 Sero wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2017 10:23 TheShuttleGuy wrote:
the issue is that the game is old as hell. everyone around and active are guys who played together back in the day,and is in their mid/late 20's and 30's. and the kids who try to play this game dont get helped nor do they stay motivated when theyre losing so much because its so difficult. i cant see how it can grow if no one can find the fun aspect of the game tbh. Old SC has a lot of depth. It's 100x easier to learn now than 5-10 years ago with all the streams and guides. Newer players get a lot of help.
That doesn't mean anything.. there are newer and easier games. We can rub our old backs and go "well back in our day..." but unfortunately bw is still one of the most challenging games to be half decent at. So challenging, in fact, that there are people who have been playing for over 10 years without ever playing anything other than UMS.
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Poland523 Posts
BW is hard to get good at. It is not hard to enjoy. Who likes the game will keep playing UMS, team games, or 1v1 against players of similar skill level or against friends. There is plenty of ways to enjoy BW even if you play badly. If someone only wants to quickly get very good at something without any serious effort, then he/she will have more fun playing easier or casual games. Some people, like me, like challenges and are highly competetive, so I enjoy playing BW and I am grateful that it still exists.
And objectively speaking it is easier to learn the game now then it was before.
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Not sure if it is mentioned yet but the communities attitude towards other players and other games needs to improve. Would greatly improve the community.
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this is what the team ladder map pool should be:
2v2
Fighting Spirit
Circuit Breakers
Gladiator
Neo Requiem
The Hunters
3v3
The Hunters
4v4
The Hunters
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On November 29 2017 06:14 Lazare1969 wrote:
this is what the team ladder map pool should be:
2v2
Fighting Spirit
Circuit Breakers
Gladiator
Neo Requiem
The Hunters
3v3
The Hunters
4v4
The Hunters
God yes, a 3v3 hunters ladder would be incredible. Assuming you can get games with no lag.
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the thing is if it has random team you can rank everyone individually yeah thats good i guess lol
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On November 29 2017 06:14 Lazare1969 wrote:
this is what the team ladder map pool should be:
2v2
Fighting Spirit
Circuit Breakers
Gladiator
Neo Requiem
The Hunters
3v3
The Hunters
4v4
The Hunters
after the hunters python is the most popular 2v2 map
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On November 29 2017 07:54 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2017 06:14 Lazare1969 wrote:
this is what the team ladder map pool should be:
2v2
Fighting Spirit
Circuit Breakers
Gladiator
Neo Requiem
The Hunters
3v3
The Hunters
4v4
The Hunters after the hunters python is the most popular 2v2 map
isn't it the most vetoed map in current ladder?
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On November 29 2017 08:22 Lazare1969 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2017 07:54 TT1 wrote:On November 29 2017 06:14 Lazare1969 wrote:
this is what the team ladder map pool should be:
2v2
Fighting Spirit
Circuit Breakers
Gladiator
Neo Requiem
The Hunters
3v3
The Hunters
4v4
The Hunters after the hunters python is the most popular 2v2 map isn't it the most vetoed map in current ladder?
Sure, but not for 2v2.
Also, I think The Huntress wouldn't be bad to add to the 3v3 mappool. Hell, I'd add BGH and FPM as well, but give the option to 100% veto those maps. There are a ton of players for those two maps, as well as a ton of players who refuse to play them. Make separate ladders if needed--I personally wouldn't give a shit if they included money map MMR on the same ranking as low money MMR, but I know there are alot of whiney purists out there who would complain about it. I just want a system that matches me and my teammates up vs other teams on whatever map we want to play at a given time.
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On November 29 2017 09:04 Ganfei2 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2017 08:22 Lazare1969 wrote:On November 29 2017 07:54 TT1 wrote:On November 29 2017 06:14 Lazare1969 wrote:
this is what the team ladder map pool should be:
2v2
Fighting Spirit
Circuit Breakers
Gladiator
Neo Requiem
The Hunters
3v3
The Hunters
4v4
The Hunters after the hunters python is the most popular 2v2 map isn't it the most vetoed map in current ladder? Sure, but not for 2v2. Also, I think The Huntress wouldn't be bad to add to the 3v3 mappool. Hell, I'd add BGH and FPM as well, but give the option to 100% veto those maps. There are a ton of players for those two maps, as well as a ton of players who refuse to play them. Make separate ladders if needed--I personally wouldn't give a shit if they included money map MMR on the same ranking as low money MMR, but I know there are alot of whiney purists out there who would complain about it. I just want a system that matches me and my teammates up vs other teams on whatever map we want to play at a given time.
i don't think money maps belong in ladder. there's plenty of it in custom games anyway.
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EPT
