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On July 01 2017 05:59 l3rand0n wrote:
Dragoon/photon cannon attack animations do not seem to accelerate the same way they used to in BW.
What does that even mean? That dragoons have faster or slower projectiles? They literally only slapped on new paint on the old projectile. Srsly the BW community just is looking for reasons not to play the remaster and I suspect alot of you like Endymion actually hope it fails.
On July 01 2017 18:34 Qikz wrote:
The gameplay is staying exactly the same, the graphics are being updated and you don't even need to use them, where exactly is the big deal here?
Yep they just want the game to fail or find a reason to be dissatisfied.
On July 01 2017 18:34 Qikz wrote:
I've been a member of this commmunity for 8 years and the weird sense of elitism that's appeared since SC2 come out and has been getting worse since remastered was announced is ridiculous.
It was always there. Sc2 just kicked the self-superiority complex into overdrive. Also according to some BW people I spoke to in this forum: if you weren't here for the full 19 years your opinion on the game doesn't count.
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There is no reason to assume that the people that work right now on SC BW knew any more than the people that made SC2 knew about SC BW.
Several times they rewrote the input engine so it would obviously not be able to handle more than 300 actions per minute. They actually came out and admitted that they capped the refresh rate at 300 while the way inputs were read was linked to this.
This just literally means that the person who had to come up with the number 300 doesn't know there are Koreans playing SC BW.
And then when they tested their new version before releasing it as a patch, no one noticed as well. And you don't need to be a top Korean to notice it was missifng inputs.
Blizzard doesn't understand why people still play SC BW after 20 years. They do not understand why SC BW was able to become an esports. They gave SC2 an engine that made it fundamentally unenjoyable to micro the units. When in SC2 beta, they finally decided to listen to that guy who had been telling them "Hey we need to listen to the community, let's make units kitable/more microable' they threw up their hands and told themselves 'We have no clue anymore, let's just try that' and they told a dev to rewrite the way how the Phoenix was controlled. We then got some build of the game where the Phoenix would literally fly backwards and shoot backwards at the same time (meaning it shot forward again, just in a very very odd way). It was so 'funny' because that completely exemplified how they were usually unwilling to listen, and completely clueless about community feedback, and the fundamentals of the game, the moment they got so desperate they even tried 'doing what TL told them' a try.
Look, this SC:R has all kinds of problems. The most obvious one is that it will split the community. Yes, 15 dollars is almost no money. Yet there are a lot of jobless kids in our community. Apparently, they cannot afford it. I would be willing to pay 15 euro every weekend I play SC BW, if it was actually better than what we have now.
But what if we don't want a re-implementation of the game engine? Being forced to relearn hotkeys, or else play at a disadvantage? You can see in the videos they made so far that dragoons can be inside their current collision boxes, and not freak out. Also, did you see any dragoons walking backwards? They changed collisions detection and pathing. Maybe not a lot. But they did. And even if it is better, I want the game to be the same. They are free to make SC3 inside their new SC:R engine and I will actually play it and not mind that it feels different. I just don't want 'my game' to feel iffy. I'd be mad about that even if Blizzard gave me 1500 euro, rather than me them 15 dollar.
They aren't just reskinning the game. They are changing attach animations. Dragoon shots are suddenly fuzzy balls rather than perfect circles.
This is an overall problem they run into anyway. Some people here seem to think you can actually draw new 4k versions of the old skins, and that it will look good. Even if the individual sprites look good, the game just seems odd in 4k. It seems like things float above the background, pop out even. It doesn't seem real or convincing.
Second, the old sprites were so low resolution, you couldn't actually see what was going on. If they make 4k versions of that, it suddenly becomes obvious what silliness they decided back then to put into the sprites, but were hidden by pixels. For example, I can't wait to see the 4k version of the missile turret. They are really going to have a dude as big as a supply depot rotating in that chair? I mean, I and about everyone else that played SC BW only learned after 10 years of playing that it was actually a dude in a chair, because someone pointed it out online.
So we have people who want to play old hotkeys vs old hotkeys, old pathing, old AI, old attack animations, old graphics. But they do want matchmaking and players that are online.
Then we have people playing the widescreen version of the game, meaning they can see a larger part of the map. They have matchmaking. And I have to vote that I approve of what Blizzard did so I can still get games online. And I will have to go back to the old graphics, because if we wanted nice graphics in our games, then why are we playing SC BW in 2017 anyway? And then all the small details about how the game controls are off.
I'd rather play Valve or Riot 1500 euro, and Blizzard leaves us alone. The game did fine for 19 minus 3 years without you guys. It will do fine for the next 10. And if you really worried, just release the fucking source code. At least the community doesn't have a track record of releasing game-breaking patches every 2 to 3 years.
If only they just did a literal reskin. Why do we actually need widescreen? Just fix some compatibility issues, fix the CPU baking, write the old engine, then write new sprites on top of literally the old engine. Then add matchmaking, with an actual trueskill-Glicko like system. Not the nonsense iccup has. And not the fakeness SC2 has. I don't fucking want to play a game where the matchmaking tries to convince me and everyone else that we are just below Flash in skill.
I won't be convinced of SC:R until I can take a SC:R replay and run it somewhat decently in 1.16, and vice versa.
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On July 01 2017 19:35 Kadungon wrote:
There is no reason to assume that the people that work right now on SC BW knew any more than the people that made SC2 knew about SC BW.
Several times they rewrote the input engine so it would obviously not be able to handle more than 300 actions per minute. They actually came out and admitted that they capped the refresh rate at 300 while the way inputs were read was linked to this.
This just literally means that the person who had to come up with the number 300 doesn't know there are Koreans playing SC BW.
And then when they tested their new version before releasing it as a patch, no one noticed as well. And you don't need to be a top Korean to notice it was missing inputs.
Blizzard doesn't understand why people still play SC BW after 20 years. They do not understand why SC BW was able to become an esports. They gave SC2 an engine that made it fundamentally unenjoyable to micro the units. When in SC2 beta, they finally decided to listen to that guy who had been telling them "Hey we need to listen to the community, let's make units kitable/more microable' they threw up their hands and told themselves 'We have no clue anymore, let's just try that' and they told a dev to rewrite the way how the Phoenix was controlled. We then got some build of the game where the Phoenix would literally fly backwards and shoot backwards at the same time. It was so 'funny' because that completely exemplified how they were usually unwilling to listen, and completely clueless about community feedback, and the fundamentals of the game, the moment they got so desperate they even tried 'doing what TL told them' a try.
Look, this SC:R has all kinds of problems. The most obvious one is that it will split the community. Yes, 15 dollars is almost no money. Yet there are a lot of jobless kids in our community. Apparently, they cannot afford it. I would be willing to pay 15 euro every weekend I play SC BW, if it was actually better than what we have now.
But what if we don't want a re-implementation of the game engine? Being forced to relearn hotkeys, or else play at a disadvantage? You can see in the videos they made so far that dragoons can be inside their current collision boxes, and not freak out. Also, did you see any dragoons walking backwards? They changed collisions detection and pathing. Maybe not a lot. But they did. And even if it is better, I want the game to be the same. They are free to make SC3 inside their new SC:R engine and I will actually play it and not mind that it feels different. I just don't want 'my game' to feel iffy. I'd be mad about that even if Blizzard gave me 1500 euro, rather than me them 15 dollar.
They aren't just reskinning the game. They are changing attach animations. Dragoon shots are suddenly fuzzy balls rather than perfect circles.
This is an overall problem they run into anyway. Some people here seem to think you can actually draw new 4k versions of the old skins, and that it will look good. Even if the individual sprites look good, the game just seems odd in 4k. It seems like things float above the background, pop out even. It doesn't seem real or convincing.
Second, the old sprites were so low resolution, you couldn't actually see what was going on. If they make 4k versions of that, it suddenly becomes obvious what silliness they decided back then to put into the sprites, but were hidden by pixels. For example, I can't wait to see the 4k version of the missile turret. They are really going to have a dude as big as a supply depot rotating in that chair? I mean, I and about everyone else that played SC BW only learned after 10 years of playing that it was actually a dude in a chair, because someone pointed it out online.
So we have people who want to play old hotkeys vs old hotkeys, old pathing, old AI, old attack animations, old graphics. But they do want matchmaking and players that are online.
Then we have people playing the widescreen version of the game, meaning they can see a larger part of the map. They have matchmaking. And I have to vote that I approve of what Blizzard did so I can still get games online. And I will have to go back to the old graphics, because if we wanted nice graphics in our games, then why are we playing SC BW in 2017 anyway? And then all the small details about how the game controls are off.
I'd rather play Valve or Riot 1500 euro, and Blizzard leaves us alone. The game did fine for 19 minus 3 years without you guys. It will do fine for the next 10. And if you really worried, just release the fucking source code. At least the community doesn't have a track record of releasing game-breaking patches every 2 to 3 years.
If only they just did a literal reskin. Why do we actually need widescreen? Just fix some compatibility issues, fix the CPU baking, write the old engine, then write new sprites on top of literally the old engine. Then add matchmaking, with an actual trueskill-Glicko like system. Not the nonsense iccup has. And not the fakeness SC2 has. I don't fucking want to play a game where the matchmaking tries to convince me and everyone else that we are just below Flash in skill.
I won't be convinced of SC:R until I can take a SC:R replay and run it somewhat decently in 1.16, and vice versa.
It's like you haven't even played 1.18 yet. widescreen issues are fixed already. none of the issues I've seen in this thread are legit; just whiney sc2 players trying to bring down SC:R.
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On July 01 2017 19:44 bstuLLs wrote:
It's like you haven't even played 1.18 yet. widescreen issues are fixed already. none of the issues I've seen in this thread are legit; just whiney sc2 players trying to bring down SC:R.
You didn't even read. I didn't say anything about widescreen issues. Just about people having widescreen view vs people that don't.
Whining SC players? Are you the same guy that said before that this is exactly the same as SC2 people whining to Blizzard about not changing the game. If you really feel this new SC:R engine is so good, go re-engine and reskin SC2. That game is broken and needs fixing. Not SC BW.
And you really needed to make a new account to tell me how stupid I was? I guess you spend more time making that account than you did on not reading one of the best posts made on TL in 3 weeks. Well done!
All I am saying, Blizzard, leave us alone. The game has been fine without you. It will continue to be fine without you. I'd even pay you 1500 euro not to release SC:R.
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Yeah 1500 euro will totally counteract the hundreds of thousands of copies they expect to sell in South Korea.
🤔🤔🤔🤔
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Like that is what I said. Like I have hundreds of thousands to spend on a hobby you have been casually doing for free for over a decade. I just got a post-doc position. All I was saying is that I'd pay 1/3rd of my monthly salary for blizzard to leave us the fuck alone. I am a honest academic. Yes, if I had infinite money, I'd buy Blizzard just to disband it out of spite. But I am a honest academic. In the past, I was the one convincing people here how much SC BW actually sold in SK. People didn't believe me. Are you buying up all the SC2 copies Blizzard didn't sell in SK? If not, why even go down this line?
trololo I guess. That's the quality posters TL has post-SC2 in the Hearthstone-Overwatch era
Why didn't have TL a WoW section back in 2007? Because back then we were fucking elitist.
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France1920 Posts
On July 01 2017 10:27 eviltomahawk wrote:
The blinking dark swarm is likely a bug. The Zergling spawn animation is definitely unpolished, but hopefully they'll give iterate it some more before release along with the other animations.
I doubt it's a bug, Blizzard gave this video to journalists specifically to show the mass how graphics looks with the gameplay. It would be really weird if they let a bug slip into it.
I remember hearing devs saying they recognized that the original dark swarm made it hard to distinguish units under it, so the blinking is probably their failed attempt at addressing this.
Another thing they should re-work is the addition of manholes on maps, making them very easy to mistake with burrowed lurkers.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/VxQxD2Q.jpg)
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On July 01 2017 19:35 Kadungon wrote:
But what if we don't want a re-implementation of the game engine? Being forced to relearn hotkeys, or else play at a disadvantage? You can see in the videos they made so far that dragoons can be inside their current collision boxes, and not freak out. Also, did you see any dragoons walking backwards? They changed collisions detection and pathing. Maybe not a lot. But they did. And even if it is better, I want the game to be the same.
So I am sorry for the coming caps:
+ Show Spoiler +IT IS THE SAME ENGINE!!!!!!!! THEY DID NOT CHANGE PATHING THEY DID NOT CHANGE COLLISION DETECTION. In fact you can play scr versus scbw. SO NOTHING IS DIFFERENT!!!
On July 01 2017 19:35 Kadungon wrote:
Just fix some compatibility issues ___ write the old engine, then write new sprites on top of literally the old engine.
Thats what they did. Are you dyslexic?
It really shows that you have no idea what you are talking about. You are just looking for an excuse to complain about scr.
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On July 01 2017 20:13 404AlphaSquad wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2017 19:35 Kadungon wrote:
But what if we don't want a re-implementation of the game engine? Being forced to relearn hotkeys, or else play at a disadvantage? You can see in the videos they made so far that dragoons can be inside their current collision boxes, and not freak out. Also, did you see any dragoons walking backwards? They changed collisions detection and pathing. Maybe not a lot. But they did. And even if it is better, I want the game to be the same. So I am sorry for the coming caps: + Show Spoiler +IT IS THE SAME ENGINE!!!!!!!! THEY DID NOT CHANGE PATHING THEY DID NOT CHANGE COLLISION DETECTION. In fact you can play scr versus scbw. SO NOTHING IS DIFFERENT!!! It really shows that you have no idea what you are talking about. You are just looking for an excuse to complain about scr.
1) Blizzard never said that
2) If they did, it means nothing.
3) If you played some SC BW the last decade and watch the SC:R movies, you can see it is different. Specifically, watch the movie with the dragoons.
4) Don't trust Blizzard. They have a track record.
So I am sorry for the coming caps:
+ Show Spoiler +
SOMEONE SMASH YOU ACROSS THE HEAD WITH YOUR OWN STUPIDITY.
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On July 01 2017 20:16 Kadungon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2017 20:13 404AlphaSquad wrote:On July 01 2017 19:35 Kadungon wrote:
But what if we don't want a re-implementation of the game engine? Being forced to relearn hotkeys, or else play at a disadvantage? You can see in the videos they made so far that dragoons can be inside their current collision boxes, and not freak out. Also, did you see any dragoons walking backwards? They changed collisions detection and pathing. Maybe not a lot. But they did. And even if it is better, I want the game to be the same. So I am sorry for the coming caps: + Show Spoiler +IT IS THE SAME ENGINE!!!!!!!! THEY DID NOT CHANGE PATHING THEY DID NOT CHANGE COLLISION DETECTION. In fact you can play scr versus scbw. SO NOTHING IS DIFFERENT!!! It really shows that you have no idea what you are talking about. You are just looking for an excuse to complain about scr. 1) Blizzard never said that 2) If they did, it means nothing. 3) If you played some SC BW the last decade and watch the SC:R movies, you can see it is different. Specifically, watch the movie with the dragoons. 4) Don't trust Blizzard. They have a track record. So I am sorry for the coming caps: + Show Spoiler +
SOMEONE SMASH YOU ACROSS THE HEAD WITH YOUR OWN STUPIDITY.
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"The one aspect of StarCraft that's not being touched is the actual gameplay, which Blizzard said will be left exactly as it was. "Updated graphics, modern amenities, and other new features won’t matter if we ruin gameplay. Replays from 1.16 still work in SC Remastered. That’s how true we’ve been," Stilwell continued. "Whether players are continuing to play daily in an IGR, coming back after a long time away, or discovering the game that started the war for the Koprulu sector, this is the game the original developers intended you to play."
It sounds like Blizzard is doing everything right with StarCraft: Remastered, but that's not all its doing. At the end of March, it will also roll out a new patch for StarCraft: Brood War, updating it to version 1.18. Once that goes live, StarCraft and the Brood War expansion will both be made free for everyone—not free-to-play, as Blizzard emphasized, but straight-up free. StarCraft: Remastered will not be free, but it will be multiplayer-compatible with the original, so you can upgrade at any time without losing your progress in the campaign or having to give up any of your multiplayer buddies. "
Source: http://www.pcgamer.com/blizzard-reveals-starcraft-remastered-set-for-release-this-summer/
You are the one being retarded and you keep going. Whine more about dragoons not having the same pathing you mentally deficient person.
I don't "trust" blizzard. But I dont need to come up with crazy conspiracy theories or spread misinformation about them.
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On July 01 2017 20:13 404AlphaSquad wrote:
Thats what they did. Are you dyslexic?
It really shows that you have no idea what you are talking about. You are just looking for an excuse to complain about scr.
Yes, I am dyslexic. Anything wrong with people that have dyslexia? I did manage to complete a PhD in biophysics despite my dyslexia, getting into some decent journals some nice citations. If I am dyslexic, are you retarded then? Never heard about a person with clinically confirmed retardation getting even a masters
You have no idea what you are talking about because clearly you take everything marketing line Blizzard puts out at face value and as absolute truth. First you need to learn how to ignore this. Then you need to read between the lines.
Blizzard said they really tried hard to keep things the same. Why would they need to do that if all they do is write new sprites on top of the old ones? Because they have been changing things. The only reason you need to be careful about keeping things feel the same is because you are in fact changing it.
Anyway, we have a video of dragoons inside each others collision boxes. And when they start to move and become bigger, they don't float across each other. It is obvious if you ever got trashed by C- Protoss noobs the last decade. And I will be somewhat convinced if I see dragoons or goliaths or whatever bugging out like they did in SC BW in SC:R. I won't be fully convinced until I can load a SC:R replay in 1.16. There are already people claiming they feel that SC BW 1.18 is already different.
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On July 01 2017 20:26 Kadungon wrote:
You have no idea what you are talking about because clearly you take everything marketing line Blizzard puts out at face value and as absolute truth. First you need to learn how to ignore this. Then you need to read between the lines.
Yeah I dont got time for crazy conspiracy theories. You have no backup for your claim other than "I hate blizzard". I provided a source you chose to ignore claiming its propaganda. We are done here lunatic.
User was warned for this post
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Yeah, every big company has a big PR&marketing division where dozens of people with for sure double the education you have carefully planning and then carrying out their PR strategy. But when I hint to you about that, that is 'claiming propaganda'.
Why do you think corporations communicate with their customers? To fully inform them so they can make the most rational consumer decisions? Or to get their customers to feel safe and confident about giving you their money?
You are completely delusional about even the most basic aspects of customer-corporation interactions. No wonder every third line that comes out of you makes no sense.
User was warned for this post
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Look, this SC:R has all kinds of problems. The most obvious one is that it will split the community. Yes, 15 dollars is almost no money. Yet there are a lot of jobless kids in our community. Apparently, they cannot afford it. I would be willing to pay 15 euro every weekend I play SC BW, if it was actually better than what we have now.
Well before they brought out 1.18 the game was dead.
A few hundred idlers on iccup, bnet dead and buggy.
Now you log on theres a couple dozen games on W/E/Europe at peak.You can get games.
So i mean theres a few jobless people that can't afford $15.Probably far less than you think.But there is also gonna be at least 50 times the number of active players when remastered comes out so I don't see this as splitting the community but creating or recreating the community.
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Since when are people allowed to come here and say that SC BW is dead? Isn't that bannable offensive? No, this is not backseat moderating. Just me being very curious about how the rules here changed.
And this coming from a person who is infamous for being really bad a the game?
SC BW has been 'dead' (your words, not mine) ever since 2003. It kept certain people away from our community. We liked it that way.
I am not so concerned about the 3 months after the release of SC:R. Sure, it will bring new players, but they will be gone as fast as they will appear. They don't matter. If those people really liked to play SC BW, why haven't they already been here the last decade? Because of no WSAD? That's the only possible conceivable reason.
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What was your previous account on teamliquid Kadungon?
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On July 01 2017 19:59 Kadungon wrote:
Like that is what I said. Like I have hundreds of thousands to spend on a hobby you have been casually doing for free for over a decade. I just got a post-doc position. All I was saying is that I'd pay 1/3rd of my monthly salary for blizzard to leave us the fuck alone. I am a honest academic. Yes, if I had infinite money, I'd buy Blizzard just to disband it out of spite. But I am a honest academic. In the past, I was the one convincing people here how much SC BW actually sold in SK. People didn't believe me. Are you buying up all the SC2 copies Blizzard didn't sell in SK? If not, why even go down this line?
trololo I guess. That's the quality posters TL has post-SC2 in the Hearthstone-Overwatch era
Why didn't have TL a WoW section back in 2007? Because back then we were fucking elitist.
You seem very bitter and irrational, judging by all your posts in this thread. Perhaps /r/conspiracy or /r/HailCorporate would be a better forum for you, rather than TeamLiquid.
It's funny, you mention you just got a post-doc position. Realistically this means I am significantly older than you, and probably have been on TL for longer as well, mr last-month alt account. But keep condescending bro.
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On July 01 2017 20:32 Kadungon wrote:
Yeah, every big company has a big PR&marketing division where dozens of people with for sure double the education you have carefully planning and then carrying out their PR strategy. But when I hint to you about that, that is 'claiming propaganda'.
Why do you think corporations communicate with their customers? To fully inform them so they can make the most rational consumer decisions? Or to get their customers to feel safe and confident about giving you their money?
You are completely delusional about even the most basic aspects of customer-corporation interactions. No wonder every third line that comes out of you makes no sense.
There is a difference between marketing and conspiracy you pathetic bitter person.
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On July 01 2017 09:49 Endymion wrote:
what we really need to talk about is if the HD version has an aspect ratio advantage over traditional graphics..
Does anyone know, if there is a possibility to choose original graphics on the remastered version?
I would gladly use the advantage of having wider resolution combined with more clear animations and graphics (original).
On July 01 2017 20:13 404AlphaSquad wrote:IT IS THE SAME ENGINE!!!!!!!! THEY DID NOT CHANGE PATHING THEY DID NOT CHANGE COLLISION DETECTION. In fact you can play scr versus scbw. SO NOTHING IS DIFFERENT!!!
I thought they re-wrote the whole engine for 1.18, which would explain the different gameplay feel compared to before. Other than skipping key clicks and difference in latency I dont know if anything has changed though.
On July 01 2017 20:35 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:
Well before they brought out 1.18 the game was dead.
A few hundred idlers on iccup, bnet dead and buggy.
Now you log on theres a couple dozen games on W/E/Europe at peak.You can get games.
So i mean theres a few jobless people that can't afford $15.Probably far less than you think.But there is also gonna be at least 50 times the number of active players when remastered comes out so I don't see this as splitting the community but creating or recreating the community.
I dont see why would you say that the game was dead before 1.18, when there were significant rise on tournaments on competetive scene. iccup and battle.net is only a small portion of broodwar community. Sure after kespa was forced to switch to SC2 I thought it was a killing blow as well, but the competetive scene was reviving all the time. Most likely there would have never been remastered if the game would have been dead.
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On July 01 2017 20:54 Piste wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2017 09:49 Endymion wrote:
what we really need to talk about is if the HD version has an aspect ratio advantage over traditional graphics.. Does anyone know, if there is a possibility to choose original graphics on the remastered version? I would gladly use the advantage of having wider resolution combined with more clear animations and graphics (original). Show nested quote +On July 01 2017 20:13 404AlphaSquad wrote:IT IS THE SAME ENGINE!!!!!!!! THEY DID NOT CHANGE PATHING THEY DID NOT CHANGE COLLISION DETECTION. In fact you can play scr versus scbw. SO NOTHING IS DIFFERENT!!!
I thought they re-wrote the whole engine for 1.18, which would explain the different gameplay feel compared to before. Other than skipping key clicks and difference in latency I dont know if anything has changed though.
From what I've read, yes you can. I've read f5 is the key but I'm not sure about that.
"The screen ratio has been maintained. Your field of view is still that of Brood War. The client supports play in 4:3 or widescreen – and switching between them on the fly – without missing a beat. This switching between 4:3 standard def or widescreen HD can happen back and forth with just the press of a button."
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EPT
