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Physician
United States4146 Posts
Cal's All Star Montage
This is another VOD, or montage, by Calvino, from the StarCraft Dream community. Don't expect awesome progamer micro or wonder moves since it is a movie designed to highlight one of their "most succesful fastest map tournaments" so the movie maker is limited to the tournament material, something which I believe he has done very well. You will notice too, that they are not progamers, the featured players are skilled gamers and the movie reflects fastest map strategies exclusively. The movie is well made and by far better than a lot of crap that has come from our own community that despite this I have seen at times receive only words of praise.
MucchoBalls a SCD forum member had this to say about the movie, "I really liked this 1 a lot more than the one before. More game play, better music and nice editing. And of course great players," as he compared it to Calvino's previous movie, a view I share.
SCD is the largest fastest community outside of Korea and it also harbors many old school vanilla players that like to lurk in their forums. For those of you who were unaware it also happens to be the home of the creator of the PenguinPlug, superpenguin, who has been inactive for quite sometime. His zealot approach against evil hack users in general still permeates this community, who contrary to recent claims, is a community that aspires for clean gaming as much as we do.
This community has run a succesful fastest ladder for quite sometime, both 1v1 and 2v2, and has its own league. In shear number this site and community is not small by any means. A very recent thread when they announced upcoming changes in their site & ladder upgrade, SCD10, received over 5000 views and more than 500 replies to a single thread.
Respect ~
yours truly Physician
Source
http://www.starcraftdream.com/showthread.php?t=16942
Download
http://clanlare.com/entity/All-Star Montage.zip
Previous Montage & post
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=46708
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nice;) Thanks for being such a great gateway to the bgh and fastest communities^_^
dling now~
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Coolies. Gonna check it out.
Thanks Physician.
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
On January 16 2007 08:53 OverTheUnder wrote:
nice ; ) Thanks for being such a great gateway to the bgh and fastest communities^_^ dling now~
I had already started specificially on these two communities in the last days of PGTour until of course PGTour's demise hit us all hard, since it really did act as a super nexus for all our communities, and even more so than my attempts at making GG.net the ultimate nexus. Anyway today the melee community is pretty much merged into one, and I though I often like to take a good deal of credit for facilitating this, few will agree or realize this.
I been bringing communities to us for a long time, thus I am running out of communities lately, particularly in view of the fact that we are shrinking in size world wide. I have always thought people were not ready, i.e. mature enough to see such communities in their own light but after 8 years most of us see other StarCraft fans, as that, and not the game type or specific interest they represent in our community at large. I like to think I have helped this view over the years.
I still remember a long time ago when I made a post about the UMS community at gg.net and the mass flaming some felt free to dispense; nevertheless I am stubborn as a mule with my 1com dream. I know too that a result of world wide dwindling numbers will be a relentless force pushing for communities into a trend of consolidation rather than division, so ultimately there will be 1com whether the haters and dividers like it or not. I also know that the future melee players, will come mainly from both communities you mentioned; so I might as well start enticing them now, to join the golden path!
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physician, whether or not the "normal" players are willing to admit it, we already are one community.
within every community there are different views, different preferrences, but we all share the broodat.mpq file on our harddrive. (or at least stardat.mpq <3 vanilla guys)
thanks for sharing, gonna dl it.
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
# Cpt Obvious I could not agree with you more, i.e. I agree, StarCraft4Ever <3!
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This tourny was vanilla right?
Nice video---fastest and bgh are really fun to watch when good players are playing^^
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
i kept wondering why terran never made medics hahaha
that last game was pretty cool, but i didn't get that part where it says:
SEMIFINALS
ONLY EIGHT REMAIN
it's semifinals => 4 remain... o.O
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that video was mind blowing!
i would really like to see the replays though.
looked like vanilla sc, that would explain the lack of a) temp tech (no high temps because no DT's) b) medics and c) lurkers.
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does the video music skip like the worst thing ever for anyone else?
Cool video tho ^_^...Epic scarab killing a million drones was pretty much awesome -____-;;;;
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#Physician: Mission Accomplished 
thanks for the replays, very appreciated!
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If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__-
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On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__-
One thing that people misjudge is by just looking at bwchart. In fastest, there is less micro required, at the same time more macro required. In general there is less apm required for fastest than non money.
Also, in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money. So in general watching a replay of a money player, you might look at it and say "wow this kid sucks, he has no micro", but in fact he is massing at that time and making more units instead of microing to save units since you have unlimited minerals.
Most of these fastest players don't spam at all to get crazy apm's like non-money players do. Where they tell one unit to move and click 5 times for that, or hold hotkeys.
Its not easy for a non money player to beat a money player. Just by looking at bwchart, it doesn't show how good a player really is.
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On January 16 2007 20:28 VV wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- One thing that people misjudge is by just looking at bwchart. In fastest, there is less micro required, at the same time more macro required. In general there is less apm required for fastest than non money. Also, in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money. So in general watching a replay of a money player, you might look at it and say "wow this kid sucks, he has no micro", but in fact he is massing at that time and making more units instead of microing to save units since you have unlimited minerals. Most of these fastest players don't spam at all to get crazy apm's like non-money players do. Where they tell one unit to move and click 5 times for that, or hold hotkeys. Its not easy for a non money player to beat a money player. Just by looking at bwchart, it doesn't show how good a player really is.
#1 - Where did he say anything about BWChart, maybe he watched the game and saw a low skill level.
#2 - The whole idea of being faster (APM) is that you are quick enough to micro WHILE macro'ing.
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
didn't one of them have 240 apm?
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Intersting movie..
P.S. Man they really love cheese builds. lol
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On January 16 2007 20:28 VV wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- One thing that people misjudge is by just looking at bwchart. In fastest, there is less micro required, at the same time more macro required. In general there is less apm required for fastest than non money. Also, in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money. So in general watching a replay of a money player, you might look at it and say "wow this kid sucks, he has no micro", but in fact he is massing at that time and making more units instead of microing to save units since you have unlimited minerals. Most of these fastest players don't spam at all to get crazy apm's like non-money players do. Where they tell one unit to move and click 5 times for that, or hold hotkeys. Its not easy for a non money player to beat a money player. Just by looking at bwchart, it doesn't show how good a player really is.
I did not simply look at bwchart to judge these players. I could tell pretty well how good they were just by watching their build orders and unit choice in the movie.
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Hi~ I'm L]o[sT_Stalife from the montage..
reason why in the montage, semifinal says 8 players left is because of the tournament format.
He made the normal final a "championship" and a normal semifinal a "final"...
and another mistake was a typo, where cal put L]o[sT_Stalife vs La.Progamer (ZVP) but it really should be ZVT~
I hope you guys enjoyed it. and thanks physician for all this !
SCD is on its way to 10th season of tournament! If you are looking for fun, then join us.
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Wow these players are absolutely atrocious, and although I can't say that the players in the TL vs BGH lineup are our top tier members, I hope that for our own pride that we can win at that. I would participate but I simply don't have the time, otherwise I honestly would want to just completely dominate a fastest / BGH season just to settle the issue once and for all..
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Cool video, those gosu money map players make it look extremely micro intensive! I browsed their website looking for a channel/server they play on but can't find it, and I still can't figure out why they play only vanilla. Talk about whacky!
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On January 16 2007 20:28 VV wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- One thing that people misjudge is by just looking at bwchart. In fastest, there is less micro required, at the same time more macro required. In general there is less apm required for fastest than non money. Also, in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money. So in general watching a replay of a money player, you might look at it and say "wow this kid sucks, he has no micro", but in fact he is massing at that time and making more units instead of microing to save units since you have unlimited minerals. Most of these fastest players don't spam at all to get crazy apm's like non-money players do. Where they tell one unit to move and click 5 times for that, or hold hotkeys. Its not easy for a non money player to beat a money player. Just by looking at bwchart, it doesn't show how good a player really is.
translation: in FMP you just need macro and low money map players have high apm cuz its all useless shit that we FMP people dont do cuz it takes precious attention away from our macro. we dont have high apm cuz low apm is cool and we're even cooler cuz we only macro cuz its harder than micro and macro at the same time
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stalife had close to 400 apm, but that wasn't the only point that I wanted to come across. Most people, the first thing that they do is open the replay with bwchart and judge, don't tell me they don't.
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main channel is cristal @ USEAST,. most ppl play nilla, if you want to play bw, then ask, some might not have bw or choose not to play bw. if you want fastest, you might want to check op parts USEAST, or clan alp or clan alp- im not sure which... gl
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On January 17 2007 07:51 VV wrote:
stalife had close to 400 apm, but that wasn't the only point that I wanted to come across. Most people, the first thing that they do is open the replay with bwchart and judge, don't tell me they don't.
I haven't heard of anyone who does that, I'm serious about this. Most people just open the replay and watch the games for themselves. BWChart can barely tell you anything, and the apm can be gotten from PP anyway.
Nice video btw, enjoyed it quite alot.
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On January 16 2007 20:55 siro) wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 20:28 VV wrote:On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- One thing that people misjudge is by just looking at bwchart. In fastest, there is less micro required, at the same time more macro required. In general there is less apm required for fastest than non money. Also, in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money. So in general watching a replay of a money player, you might look at it and say "wow this kid sucks, he has no micro", but in fact he is massing at that time and making more units instead of microing to save units since you have unlimited minerals. Most of these fastest players don't spam at all to get crazy apm's like non-money players do. Where they tell one unit to move and click 5 times for that, or hold hotkeys. Its not easy for a non money player to beat a money player. Just by looking at bwchart, it doesn't show how good a player really is. #1 - Where did he say anything about BWChart, maybe he watched the game and saw a low skill level. #2 - The whole idea of being faster (APM) is that you are quick enough to micro WHILE macro'ing.
We do both, Micro and Macro are a huge part of the game. If any of you can play in SCD and remain in the top 10 bracket Ill paypal you 50$. Thats how confident I am that you guys highly underrate us and couldn't touch the good players on this map without practice.
On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__-
Yeah and I really doubt you could take any of them. Especially if your judging it just from the montage.
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On January 17 2007 14:47 eNtitY~ wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 20:55 siro) wrote:On January 16 2007 20:28 VV wrote:On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- One thing that people misjudge is by just looking at bwchart. In fastest, there is less micro required, at the same time more macro required. In general there is less apm required for fastest than non money. Also, in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money. So in general watching a replay of a money player, you might look at it and say "wow this kid sucks, he has no micro", but in fact he is massing at that time and making more units instead of microing to save units since you have unlimited minerals. Most of these fastest players don't spam at all to get crazy apm's like non-money players do. Where they tell one unit to move and click 5 times for that, or hold hotkeys. Its not easy for a non money player to beat a money player. Just by looking at bwchart, it doesn't show how good a player really is. #1 - Where did he say anything about BWChart, maybe he watched the game and saw a low skill level. #2 - The whole idea of being faster (APM) is that you are quick enough to micro WHILE macro'ing. We do both, Micro and Macro are a huge part of the game. If any of you can play in SCD and remain in the top 10 bracket Ill paypal you 50$. Thats how confident I am that you guys highly underrate us and couldn't touch the good players on this map without practice. Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- Yeah and I really doubt you could take any of them. Especially if your judging it just from the montage.
i second that. FMP, though i don't play it, is not just "a low map with infinte money so you don't need to expand". there is a LOT more to it and a lot cheese strats that you would NEVER expect on low maps work incredibly well on fastest. and thats not nearly all thats to that map. you guys highly underestimate those fastest players!
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On January 17 2007 14:47 eNtitY~ wrote:We do both, Micro and Macro are a huge part of the game. If any of you can play in SCD and remain in the top 10 bracket Ill paypal you 50$. Thats how confident I am that you guys highly underrate us and couldn't touch the good players on this map without practice.
I think some people here might actually be seriously considering that bet of 50 dollars hehe. Its obvious we would need practise as we don't know the builds/strats etc, but I'm sure many of the players here would be able to beat the top players after practise.
Also when you said "Micro and Macro are a huge part of the game" it is a contradiction to what VV said:
in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money.
The point is that on fastest you can achieve the same amount of macro and micro that is in low money, as long as you have the apm to do it.
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
skyglow1 I agree with you, that both elements, decent macro & micro, are needed. I think he probably meant that in FMP your macro is more critical than your micro (meaning if you have poor macro your screwed) at least in the vast majority of FMP players; of course when 2 opponents start getting to boxer level everything starts becoming critical.
_____________________________________________________________________________________
Anyway here goes my feedback & personal experience, which is small, with FMP.
FMP unlike BGH is quite different. If your not used to it it can seriously screw your timing and builds can be achieved much faster. The management of the "flow", i.e. you macro flow can be severely offset if your not used to it. FMP is actually pretty different than BGH and melee for these reasons.
I avoid FMP like the plague because of that, in fact the times I have played fastest, after coercion from friends, I have found after how impatient I get when I play "low money" melee games immediately after; that initially seem tedious compared to FMP. For the same reason if your a rush or cheese freak you can have a wonderful time at FMP.
FMP, though people also abuse tend to play the same maps, has at least more variation in map (i.e. where a different map will make a difference in game play) as opposed to BGH where they play the same map, over and over.
Having said all this I still think the golden path is regular, "low money", melee map playing; which how most of us start, and how ALL of us end up with. I been stubborn and avoided BGH, FMP and for that matter, USM, on principle only but I have paid a price for it, hours of wasted hours finding games. Sometimes I wonder if I did not miss out on everything StarCraft had to offer.
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On January 17 2007 05:20 exalted wrote:
Wow these players are absolutely atrocious, and although I can't say that the players in the TL vs BGH lineup are our top tier members, I hope that for our own pride that we can win at that. I would participate but I simply don't have the time, otherwise I honestly would want to just completely dominate a fastest / BGH season just to settle the issue once and for all..
exalted, you severely underestimate BGH players.
there are a lot of bgh players that are better than you (especially on bgh, and x2 for team games)
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On January 17 2007 14:47 eNtitY~ wrote:Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 20:55 siro) wrote:On January 16 2007 20:28 VV wrote:On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- One thing that people misjudge is by just looking at bwchart. In fastest, there is less micro required, at the same time more macro required. In general there is less apm required for fastest than non money. Also, in fastest since there is more macro, a player cannot micro their units as much as in low money. So in general watching a replay of a money player, you might look at it and say "wow this kid sucks, he has no micro", but in fact he is massing at that time and making more units instead of microing to save units since you have unlimited minerals. Most of these fastest players don't spam at all to get crazy apm's like non-money players do. Where they tell one unit to move and click 5 times for that, or hold hotkeys. Its not easy for a non money player to beat a money player. Just by looking at bwchart, it doesn't show how good a player really is. #1 - Where did he say anything about BWChart, maybe he watched the game and saw a low skill level. #2 - The whole idea of being faster (APM) is that you are quick enough to micro WHILE macro'ing. We do both, Micro and Macro are a huge part of the game. If any of you can play in SCD and remain in the top 10 bracket Ill paypal you 50$. Thats how confident I am that you guys highly underrate us and couldn't touch the good players on this map without practice. Show nested quote +On January 16 2007 19:49 davidgurt wrote:
If those are the top SCD players, I really should start playing fastest again. -__- Yeah and I really doubt you could take any of them. Especially if your judging it just from the montage.
I can, and I have, pal.  I used to play in vgtour before it got switched over to SCD. I've had enough experience with fastest communities and tournaments before to know how good some of these players are, especially since I've played with a handful of them.
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Netherlands19138 Posts
Thanks for the vid Physician, I'll go have a peek. Last one was terrible imho, hope this one is a bit better and entertaining  .
And indd we already are one big community, we're just a bit fractured at times :p.
All this merging and co-op tournaments and news sharing is just awsome. Seriously hope it's a trend that will continue in the future, along with the bonding with the korean site, which mani had such a great interview with its owner.
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On January 16 2007 12:39 azndsh wrote:
Stacked probes ftw
how did he do that?
he attacked and probes were even stacked
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On January 18 2007 04:26 XIII wrote:how did he do that? he attacked and probes were even stacked
the only possibility i can imagine was that he re-stacked them during cooldown, via rightclicking them onto a geyser or sth in the direction they were pointing, then letting them attack again.
or it was just a coincidence and they remained stacked for some other wacky reason.
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On January 17 2007 07:51 VV wrote:
stalife had close to 400 apm, but that wasn't the only point that I wanted to come across. Most people, the first thing that they do is open the replay with bwchart and judge, don't tell me they don't.
i dont even have bwchart
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On January 18 2007 04:30 Cpt Obvious wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2007 04:26 XIII wrote:On January 16 2007 12:39 azndsh wrote:
Stacked probes ftw how did he do that? he attacked and probes were even stacked the only possibility i can imagine was that he re-stacked them during cooldown, via rightclicking them onto a geyser or sth in the direction they were pointing, then letting them attack again. or it was just a coincidence and they remained stacked for some other wacky reason.
no... you can keep on stack attacking more than one target... all you have to do is hold shift and keep on targeting more units.
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On January 17 2007 05:20 exalted wrote:
Wow these players are absolutely atrocious, and although I can't say that the players in the TL vs BGH lineup are our top tier members, I hope that for our own pride that we can win at that. I would participate but I simply don't have the time, otherwise I honestly would want to just completely dominate a fastest / BGH season just to settle the issue once and for all..
As Coral said, you are REALLY underestimating BGH players. I can't speak for the fastest community anymore, since I haven't played fastest competitively in a couple of years, but BGHer players at top level are definitely good.
I also guarantee that all of these players, in the montage, would beat you in a bo3 on fastest.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/4413/allstarmontagepicbn5bg1.jpg)
