EPT[Rumours] Air Force ProTeam - Page 2
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Wysp
Canada2299 Posts
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Sir.Kimmel
United States785 Posts
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IntoTheWow
is awesome32274 Posts
On November 14 2006 21:01 Myrmidon wrote: I mean this in seriousness: how would Starcraft progamers help design war simulations? Glitch/bug detecting. They can be like beta testers. | ||
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MyLostTemple
United States2921 Posts
On November 14 2006 21:01 Myrmidon wrote: I mean this in seriousness: how would Starcraft progamers help design war simulations? I mean this in seriousness back: your an idiot they're easily some of the best stratigic minds in the world WHAT DO U THINK? | ||
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
If anything I think the merit is in the fact that they are accustomed to absorbing such material, and it is not a foreign medium to them. I think a more serious thing is that this gaming festival participation is unfair to the other cadets who do not have such indulgences to occupy themselves with  | ||
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Wasabi
United States3085 Posts
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KissBlade
United States5718 Posts
On November 14 2006 21:17 thedeadhaji wrote: I dont know... I feel like their knowledge is very specific to starcraft, and the great deal of experience they have in any situation they are thrown at them in that particular game.( Not really, there is a great deal of skills progaming equips you with. Think about it, bluffing, guessing your opponent, reflexes, intuition,etc. Starcraft isn't just a game of who can click the mouse faster. | ||
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Hot77.iEy
Finland1486 Posts
On November 14 2006 20:37 Dexxus wrote: Wow that would be a sight to see... On an off note I've always wondered what it would be like if AMD/Intel/MS or other bigname companies decided all the sudden to sponsor pro SC teams... Team Exxon LOL  AMD had a team and Samsung has one right now. Coca Cola and Pringles have hosted Starleagues. I would say there are some big(ish) companies involved allready. edit: mmm.. cola+pringles ...mmm  | ||
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Amnesty
United States2054 Posts
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yubee
United States3826 Posts
On November 14 2006 21:38 Amnesty wrote: Today we talk about the germans blitzkrieg strategy, our Grand Kids will be talking about the Korean BBS. hahaha it'd be cool to see an airforce team compete, though it'd never win, though maybe against skt1 or ktf | ||
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Myrmidon
United States9452 Posts
On November 14 2006 21:05 IntoTheWow wrote: Glitch/bug detecting. They can be like beta testers. Yeah, but I think you have other people more experienced as beta testers. You know, professionals at beta testing, not at gaming. Being experienced and fast with a mouse has little to do with methodically testing all of the possibilities. On November 14 2006 21:11 MyLostTemple wrote: they're easily some of the best stratigic minds in the world Starcraft strategy is highly unlike military strategy in many ways, I'd think (could be very wrong though, as I have no military experience). And wouldn't commanding officers know warfare better than progamers? Starcraft skills may allow progamers to become better at the simulators faster, maybe, but that doesn't help the military design them in the first place. Progamers probably can't code AI or even think of what it should do (or anything related to graphics, etc. of development), discuss the probability for certain field actions to take place, devise scenarios, and the like. They might be able to grasp what interface is optimal for the simulator, but the goal is to be true to reality, right? | ||
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HAZE.tQ
United States251 Posts
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Pistasj
Norway272 Posts
Seriously I think this is more of a PR stunt from the airforce. If they are going to test an aviation simulater program who is best? Is it the real fighter pilots or the 2d starcraft warriors? But it's cool if they let progamers practice some while they do their duty so they dont rust as much when they come back. | ||
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KissBlade
United States5718 Posts
On November 14 2006 22:35 Pistasj wrote: Why dont we let the best people at starcraft in any country lead their countrys military since they are obviously the best strategic minds. I have replays as proof! Seriously I think this is more of a PR stunt from the airforce. If they are going to test an aviation simulater program who is best? Is it the real fighter pilots or the 2d starcraft warriors? But it's cool if they let progamers practice some while they do their duty so they dont rust as much when they come back. I agree that it is a PR stunt. But I also don't think that mutually excludes it as a good justification. Starcraft DOES involve a great deal of strategy, just as Sun Tzu's Art of War. The author never fought a battle in his life, he certainly never worked on Wall Street. Why do stockbrokers and generals all read his book then? The analogy is the same. | ||
Last Romantic
United States20661 Posts
On November 14 2006 22:49 KissBlade wrote: I agree that it is a PR stunt. But I also don't think that mutually excludes it as a good justification. Starcraft DOES involve a great deal of strategy, just as Sun Tzu's Art of War. The author never fought a battle in his life, he certainly never worked on Wall Street. Why do stockbrokers and generals all read his book then? The analogy is the same. Sun Tzu was a Wu general... Never fought battle in his life? oO? | ||
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HonestTea
5007 Posts
The Korean army has special platoons for athletes, so they can maintain their training while completing their mandatory service. For example, a baseball player will eventually go to the Army's baseball team during his career. He still has to lose two year's worth of salary, and the training in the army is nothing like what they can do at pro teams, but it's still better than nothing. Recently, the Air Force has introduced a similar program for progamers. Apparantly the gamers help out with computer related stuff, and they also get to train for gaming. Chrh's name is on the MSL and OSL preliminary brackets, so he might be able to play in an individual league (as long as he makes it - which he won't). Boxer will also be assigned to the Air Force's progaming unit after completing basic training. So we may be able to see him in individual leagues (but as part of the Air Force's team, not SKT) In my opinion, the whole air force progaming team idea is 50% an extension of existing programs for pro athletes, and 50% a publicity stunt for the image of the army | ||
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gameguard
Korea (South)2131 Posts
Think about it. Special air force unit, impending doom (North Korea), five young lads with infinite potential, war simulator. + Show Spoiler + Ender's Game | ||
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The Storyteller
Singapore2486 Posts
With regards to army pro gaming teams: The Singapore Army has its own sports unit. The recruits in this unit were national champions or highly skilled athletes when they joined the army. After completing three months of mandatory Basic Military training (how to hold a rifle etc.) they spend the rest of their service playing the sports that they specialised in full time. The army fields these athletes in national and international competitions. The rationale is that they can keep in shape in the army, and upon leaving the army can go on to play sports for the country. If they had to do the usual army stuff, they would not be able to pick the sport up again, which would lead to a dearth of sportsmen. With regards to Starcraft and military simulations: I have FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE in this. The Singapore army, like most armies, uses computer simulations to train its officers. It's cheaper than sending men out into the field. The only thing is that AI is never advanced enough to put up a good fight. So they grab a bunch of privates and corporals and tell them to play the "enemy". Well, in every single wargame I have played, the corporals and privates DESTROY the officers in the war simulations. Why? because they play computer games. For instance, the officers would only use the recce units to scout. The privates would grab the cheapest unit they could find (supply truck) and have one of them just drive around enemy fortifications. Basic computer gaming strategy. Thus, they'd scout faster. not only that, but the officers would be completely stunned by the truck. They'd immediately order their artillery and other units to fire on it, thus giving away their positions. Nobody who was familiar with stop lurkers, or any burrowed units, would ever make a mistake like that. The privates' basic strategy was also much better than the officers'. Concepts such as seizing the middle ground, analysing terrain and knowing instantly where the important areas were all came naturally to us. To give an example, in the recent Savior vs Ra game, Savior seized the middle ground so that Ra's troops were forced to go the long way round. That's something we did too. Then there were the bugs. The officers would set up barbed wire along the coast and sit tight behind their fortifications. Unfortunately, all the privates, being savvy gamers, immediately zoomed in to the fortifications to take a closer look. And discovered that unless the barbed wire was set up at high magnification, there would be small but exploitable gaps in the barbed wire. Before they knew it, the officers were overun (again!) I could go on and on about the embarrassing defeats the officers suffered at our hands, but the point is that playing Starcraft does show a high level of strategic thinking, it's not just game specific; and that playing Starcraft does equip someone to help to debug military simulations. | ||
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Eagleheart
Sweden776 Posts
On November 14 2006 21:17 thedeadhaji wrote: I dont know... I feel like their knowledge is very specific to starcraft, and the great deal of experience they have in any situation they are thrown at them in that particular game. I really dont know how good their general aptitude for "computer related things" (as the article says) really is, considering Boxer himself said once that Garimto installed some stuff on his computer and he had no idea what in the world it was, etc. If anything I think the merit is in the fact that they are accustomed to absorbing such material, and it is not a foreign medium to them. I think a more serious thing is that this gaming festival participation is unfair to the other cadets who do not have such indulgences to occupy themselves with Agreed, they think too much of progamers...it's almost ridiculous. | ||
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Totoro
France479 Posts
On November 14 2006 21:22 KissBlade wrote: Not really, there is a great deal of skills progaming equips you with. Think about it, bluffing, guessing your opponent, reflexes, intuition,etc. Starcraft isn't just a game of who can click the mouse faster. Agreed. I remember a old gamer's interview who turned into poker. He said that good SC gamers do well in poker cause it need the same hability to react quickly, to make the good decisions etc... Starcraft is not only a E sport. It s a mind sport too. | ||
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