EPTKeSPA asks blizzard to stop ~ - Page 13
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GeLaar
2421 Posts
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Lonyo
United Kingdom3884 Posts
On December 03 2013 09:38 hoby2000 wrote: Here's what I got from this: Kespa is still being a whiny bitch about one of their star players who made a critical mistake in his gaming career because he wants to play in a tournament that's not Kespa sanctioned, and now they're complaining to Papa Bear so he will make sure that their childish actions go through? I understand Kespa is mad at Savior for what he did, but what they're doing right now is out right fucking stupid. You guys created the system that created him, then are mad at him for continuing to play tournaments and showmatch events in a game you trained him to play? He doesn't have other skills, and it's something he was amazing at. If he can't play in Kespa sanctioned tournaments, fine, but don't be childish fucking pricks and attempt to stop him from doing it outside of Korea. I fucking hate Kespa, and I honestly hope they fail. Look, I know they're making Esports in Korea great, but they're oppressors, and are going to be worse for this scene in the long run. Get these fuck tards out of this business please. So you don't think that eSports should have the same sort of sanctioning system as other world sports, where if one body sanctions someone, it impacts their ability to play/etc elsewhere? Because in most sports, it would be pretty standard for someone punished by one country to be unable to participate elsewhere as well. http://www.thestar.com.my/Sport/Football/2013/11/13/FIFA-bans-26-players-worldwide-over-Italian-matchfixing.aspx The Italian body banned the players, the worldwide governing body made those bans worldwide. Kespa is the Italian body, Blizzard is the worldwide body. Kespa banned him for life, and then asked Blizzard to extend the ban to worldwide. He was criminally charged. THIS SORT OF THING IS STANDARD IN REAL SPORTS. | ||
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GhoSt[shield]
Canada2131 Posts
On December 02 2013 18:31 Hyeon wrote: please, stop suking Savior and other matchfix guys. He ruined your fav MBC and Ongamenet broodwar league and damaged his progamer friends. If he's a real person and has a "brain", he shouldn't show up on afreeca and beg money with broodwar. pretty much this. I feel just about the same way after Savior destroyed the pro-BW scene in Korea. I have no issue with Savior personally and I don't feel that we can or should stop him from participating in events/afreeca if that is his choice or the sponsors choice. Everyone should just remember that Savior is pretty much the #1 reason sponsors stopped sponsoring BW (it was seen as "pure, untainted") in Korea and led to OGN and MBC dropping BW and gaming altogether in the case of NBC. Savior and Justin were the worst (iirc Justin was the ringleader of the matchfixing among progamers, Savior was just the most famous). Fuck you Ma Jae Yoon. | ||
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ZenMeng
United States31 Posts
User was warned for this post | ||
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MVega
763 Posts
It really sucks that SaviOr was involved in match fixing. It really really sucks. A ban is appropriate, but if he gets to play somewhere it's really not the end of the world. Especially now that he's a bit older, he's probably learned SOMETHING from his mistakes, he most certainly has regrets because it really has to suck to be as unpopular as him. So let him play again, eventually, and see what happens. Worst case scenario he hasn't learned anything and then you ban him for longer. Best case scenario? He actually helps the scene. There was a BW maphacker that moved on to WarCraft 3, apologized, played legit, lived through the controversy of "OMG THIS GUY CHEATED!" and actually contributed to the scene in a meaningful way and displayed top level play that entertained fans. Giving someone another chance isn't going to hurt the scene. Two companies that don't even care about the game anymore trying to interfere however might, and the scene is fragile enough as it is. | ||
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kickinhead
Switzerland2069 Posts
- Is Savior suspected for still doing this stuff and if yes, is there any proof? - What does KeSpa have to do with it? Do they just hate Savior this much that they just mess with stuff the have no business in messing with? - Not really sure if Savior hasn't been punished enough - if he doesn't do shady stuff again, why not let him play? But I guess that's up to discussion and I really can't remember how bad it was with Savior. | ||
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ShaLLoW[baY]
Canada12499 Posts
On December 03 2013 10:31 kickinhead wrote: I don't really get it: - Is Savior suspected for still doing this stuff and if yes, is there any proof? - What does KeSpa have to do with it? Do they just hate Savior this much that they just mess with stuff the have no business in messing with? - Not really sure if Savior hasn't been punished enough - if he doesn't do shady stuff again, why not let him play? But I guess that's up to discussion and I really can't remember how bad it was with Savior. -no -kespa are fucking morons. i can understand them not being his biggest fan, but even back in the bw heydays they were morons. -h8rs gonna hate | ||
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ZeroChrome
Canada1001 Posts
However it is Savior's right to continue playing BW and streaming on afreeca, and nobody in China or Blizzard gives a fuck if he plays in other tournaments so this whole discussion is pointless. Sonic isn't going to let any of them play in his leagues and that's what matters. | ||
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aka_star
United Kingdom1546 Posts
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BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
On December 03 2013 07:59 L_Master wrote: No. Savior was the mind behind it. Afaik he never fixed one of his own matches, but he was the go to guy that recruited the other progamers into the matchfixing. It is though because as I recall reading, Justin had a bigger hand or something. I don't know if he fixed one of his own matches or not and yes, he recruited others but you guys make it sound like he gave them no choice or something lol. I mean maybe he did but they also made the choice to get involved in it so I think they should get just as much blame (although some have already sincerely apologized to the fans and moved on so I respect that). On December 03 2013 08:05 Stratos wrote: This will be pretty damn accurate if you make it the other way around, good job. Chinese like Savior because their own celebrities can keep up with him, so what they want him for is his past fame and glory. Maybe? who knows the reason they like him? I was generalizing based on his partner's experience. I don't know if you read the translation or not but his partner was pretty respectful against someone who's seen as scum and should be banned from the BW community in general. He talked about how amazing he was, nice, talkative, relaxed under pressure(for most of the time) etc... On December 03 2013 08:40 lemmata wrote: Making statements like this deprives you of all credibility. Like to make up stories much? If anything, the corporate interests had a huge incentive to cover up everything to protect CJ, which owns OGN and also has a ton of political influence in Korea. We don't speculate about that because that is all conjecture and zero substance. 1) Savior's partner's experience doesn't say much about commercial viability of the tournament if he was replaced by a Korean ex-pro with superior skill, especially when the "flower" of BW is 1v1 and 2v2 was historically more of a sideshow even when it was a part of ProLeague. 2) I wouldn't deny that Savior is quite knowledgeable about the game, but knowledge does not equal skill when you get old. If the organizers cared more about skill, there are plenty of ex-pros on Afreeca who can whip Savior's ass right now. 3) If the sponsor was indeed acting in its own best interests, then it revealed that it's best interests are tied to quick short-term gains rather than long-term sustainability of BW by insisting on having Savior present. I wouldn't deny that there are short-term advantages to the notoriety of Savior, but if you are trying to set up something credible for the long haul, then there are clearly superior alternatives out there. + Show Spoiler + no, it doesn't. There wasn't anything specific in my sentence that caused me to lose credibility. People are focused so much on Saviour that they don't seem to realize or are forgetting that there are other match fixers as well. They also had a choice to make and decided to match fix. That's not made up lol. I'm not talking levels of match fixing or who's more involved. There were no stories being made up here. Saviour was the most popular from the match fixers by far. Heck, even with my limited BW knowledge, I'm aware of that fact. There's a reason there was TL articles about him, he's considered a bonjwa and the maestro etc... I never was aiming for commercial viability, just an objective account from someone who's not his friend per se. It's much better than all the subjective accounts we get. I haven't watched his stream and missed the tourney so I dunno what his level was like. I was mostly talking about the amount of respect he got from his partner considering his past. Can't say much on #3, the sponsor had their own reasons for inviting him and who knows what they are. | ||
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Clefairy
1570 Posts
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L_Master
United States8017 Posts
On December 03 2013 10:40 aka_star wrote: BW still being played ?!? holly shitttt I thought it died out after blizzard gave birth and forced kespa to pay child support. Lets get these chinese streams up!!.... I'd tune in any day, beats this deathball dance AOE bull crap we keep getting in a young SC2. There are still Korean leagues as well, with many of the notable BW pros. Not to mention we have a foreign teamleague and the TLS grandfinals will be starting soon. | ||
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lemmata
468 Posts
On December 03 2013 10:43 BigFan wrote: no, it doesn't. There wasn't anything specific in my sentence that caused me to lose credibility. People are focused so much on Saviour that they don't seem to realize or are forgetting that there are other match fixers as well. They also had a choice to make and decided to match fix. That's not made up lol. I'm not talking levels of match fixing or who's more involved. There were no stories being made up here. Saviour was the most popular from the match fixers by far. Heck, even with my limited BW knowledge, I'm aware of that fact. There's a reason there was TL articles about him, he's considered a bonjwa and the maestro etc... You said that he was made a scapegoat that is what makes you lose credibility. Selective listing of true statements does not make the conclusion that follows true. He was the freaking ring-leader for fuck's sake. The low-level criminal who sells drugs to children on the street is bad, but the guy who directs the operation as the leader of the gang is even worse, especially if he was already well off and didn't need the extra cash. He abused his position as a respected player and older brother figure to do this. To say that the extra blame and anger directed at Savior is because he was scapegoated for his fame is to ignore all these facts that make him deserving of more blame and anger. Also, you keep saying that people forget that there are other match-fixers. Repeating that statement will not make it true. No, people haven't forgotten about those other match-fixers. Those other match-fixers have just kept themselves out of the public eye (as they should), whereas Savior is constantly doing things that make the public take notice. This is kind of obvious. | ||
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lemmata
468 Posts
On December 03 2013 10:39 ZeroChrome wrote: Letting match fixers return to the pro (or semi-pro atm) scene would be the joke of the century. No other sport allows match fixers and druggies back into their game. IMO allowing cheaters to return would undermine the integrity of the sport just as much as the cheating itself. THIS + Show Spoiler + statement separates the children from adults | ||
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Korelle
143 Posts
On December 03 2013 09:38 hoby2000 wrote: THIS SORT OF THING IS STANDARD IN REAL SPORTS. Esports is not real sports, it never has been, it never will be and the sooner people stop pretending otherwise the better it will be for Esports as a whole. | ||
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Strela
Netherlands1896 Posts
On December 02 2013 18:10 arb wrote: ya blizzard needs to get the fuck on and stay away. they ruined BW in the first place promoting the shitty sequel. they need to stay out of BW unless they plan on reviving it. Yea fuck Blizzard, they just created the game that totally love and cant live without. | ||
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vOdToasT
Sweden2870 Posts
On December 03 2013 11:07 Strela wrote: Yea fuck Blizzard, they just created the game that totally love and cant live without. When he says "fuck blizzard" he obviously only means the modern Blizzard. First of all, people change. It is possible to like someone at one point in time, but not ten years later. Secondly, many of the people who made StarCraft are no longer at Blizzard. They moved on to ArenaNet. You fail. | ||
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ShaLLoW[baY]
Canada12499 Posts
On December 03 2013 11:04 Korelle wrote: Esports is not real sports, it never has been, it never will be and the sooner people stop pretending otherwise the better it will be for Esports as a whole. I agree. I feel like differentiating professional gaming from sports by calling them eSports is a bit self-defeating. It's a concept that I really don't think will ever work out. | ||
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Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
the fact that he's even streaming the game that he's hurt so deeply bothers me enough, but to have other people willingly let him sit in their booth or table or even anywhere near a stage is just so wrong. get your shit together people and keep away from that fucker then we won't have any need for blizzard to shut down anything. | ||
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Larvator
Ukraine87 Posts
On December 02 2013 19:08 BoxvsYellow wrote: KesPa has not only taken away Ma's eligibility as a professional plyer, but the organization also has banned Ma from any E-sports related events. Kind of makes no sense. They, both KESPA and Blizard, "banned" Brood War from E-sports and know KESPA says what Chinese organization should do? What exactly they want from scntv? | ||
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