EPTBroodwar becomes legend.
And people ages from now
will speak of it
as the best game ever.
And I was there when it happened.
It's not over yet
so i'm not saying goodbye,
just goodnight.
'Til we meet again...
Goodnight, BroodWar
| Forum Index > BW General |
|
yOngKIN
Korea (North)656 Posts
Broodwar becomes legend. And people ages from now will speak of it as the best game ever. And I was there when it happened. It's not over yet so i'm not saying goodbye, just goodnight. 'Til we meet again... | ||
|
atrox_
United Kingdom1710 Posts
| ||
|
CFRD119
United States97 Posts
| ||
|
nttea
Sweden4353 Posts
 but they are tears mixed with both sadness and happiness, bw will never be the same... but remembering all the awesome times from the circa 10 years I've played and watched this game. | ||
|
pRo9aMeR
595 Posts
| ||
|
yepenaxa
Belarus2280 Posts
BW <3 | ||
|
Le French
France782 Posts
| ||
|
solidONE
United States160 Posts
| ||
|
AroundTweed
New Zealand27 Posts
| ||
|
Left4Cookies
Denmark803 Posts
| ||
|
killerdog
Denmark6522 Posts
On August 04 2012 21:17 atrox_ wrote: it's not the end though people, there are still plenty of foreigners to watch! Also, the Chinese scene! For me at least, i would rather have an epic moment like this be the "end" of my following of broodwar, personally i think an epic sendoff like this as my last memory of really following broodwar is actually nicer then a few years of watching chinese leagues/the few foreigners left while knowing that it will almost definitely never reach the level it was tonight ever again  Goodbye broodwar | ||
|
Talic_Zealot
688 Posts
| ||
|
TelecoM
United States10673 Posts
| ||
|
Daudr
Sweden275 Posts
gg. | ||
|
sc4k
United Kingdom5454 Posts
. | ||
|
lubu42
United States314 Posts
| ||
|
razorsuKe
Canada2000 Posts
Then seeing all those familiar faces on the stream, even ElkY, aaaahhhhh can't stand it T_T | ||
|
danbel1005
United States1319 Posts
I will never forget you. GG | ||
|
Marl
United States692 Posts
| ||
|
lifeisgood99
Canada915 Posts
| ||
|
Wintex
Norway16838 Posts
| ||
|
Potling
Norway298 Posts
| ||
|
Existential
Australia2107 Posts
| ||
|
Guamshin
Netherlands295 Posts
| ||
|
Flameling
United States413 Posts
| ||
|
elmerpogs
Philippines441 Posts
| ||
|
zefreak
United States2731 Posts
| ||
|
ShinsoEU
Bulgaria92 Posts
| ||
|
PUPATREE
340 Posts
| ||
|
rabidch
United States20289 Posts
| ||
|
Lazzi
Switzerland1923 Posts
| ||
|
justiceknight
Singapore5741 Posts
| ||
|
Jedclark
United Kingdom903 Posts
| ||
|
stambe
Bulgaria492 Posts
On August 04 2012 22:11 Lazzi wrote: I've seen a very little of BW , I came to late, I tried to watch all the epic matches I've missed but 12 years are too much to see in so little time... But somehow I'm sad. Why? Because you saw something special, and you are now sad because you didnt get to see it all, adn because you/we may never see something as beautiful and full of emotion as BW. | ||
|
Ettick
United States2434 Posts
A sad time, even for a d/d- player like me who rarely even plays BW lol Farewell, it was a good year or so that I had following the BW pro scene, I really wish that I could have caught on to it earlier | ||
|
heynes
Germany201 Posts
| ||
|
saroir
Germany244 Posts
| ||
|
Jojo131
Brazil1631 Posts
forever D ranked  | ||
|
Ciryandor
United States3735 Posts
PLEASE??? | ||
|
makkk
Germany23 Posts
If you asked me yesterday what I was feeling about Brood War coming to an end, I'd have said: Well, everyone said the games were lacking in quality lately anyways. Changing to SC2 can just be an improvement. If you asked me right now, I couldnt help but run off crying, disbelieving how stupid I could be... | ||
|
Lazzi
Switzerland1923 Posts
On August 04 2012 22:13 stambe wrote: Because you saw something special, and you are now sad because you didnt get to see it all, adn because you/we may never see something as beautiful and full of emotion as BW. Mignt be that. Maybe SC2 has a chance to become super awesome too... but BW is better. I'm a sc2 player only , and played only a few games of BW but I recognize that BW is better. SC2 is far from BW but maybe one day it'll be as good, maybe. | ||
|
TelecoM
United States10673 Posts
Auction all kill OSL...... "THIS IS NOT THE END" BW Will not die. | ||
|
writer22816
United States5775 Posts
| ||
|
Ultimo Hombre
Australia1436 Posts
| ||
|
kollin
United Kingdom8380 Posts
| ||
|
figq
12519 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/5JbPN.png) The brood is scattered, the overmind is in a coma, but there's still some creep left. | ||
|
Glioburd
France1911 Posts
Zizi yO. | ||
|
droken
Sweden126 Posts
| ||
|
Stebus
Australia18 Posts
| ||
|
tanngard
Norway1325 Posts
On August 04 2012 21:56 razorsuKe wrote: It's hitting me so hard right now, feels like I should have thought about the impact of this a little more and flew to Korea to be there and see a match live, just once. Then seeing all those familiar faces on the stream, even ElkY, aaaahhhhh can't stand it T_T I was seriously sceaming like a little girl when i saw ElkY and Grrrr. I dont know why. I dont know why i started crying either. It was just too many memories swelling up today. Why did we not travel? Being at the finals would have been the greatest moment of my life. Instead i sit alone in my apartment crying, screaming and talking to myself like i have done for the last 4 years time and time again watching brood war. Today was the last time i will be this emotional invested in watching a game. End of an era. | ||
|
Meta
United States6225 Posts
| ||
|
andynewin
United States105 Posts
On August 04 2012 23:04 tanngard wrote: I was seriously sceaming like a little girl when i saw ElkY and Grrrr. I dont know why. I dont know why i started crying either. It was just too many memories swelling up today. Why did we not travel? Being at the finals would have been the greatest moment of my life. Instead i sit alone in my apartment crying, screaming and talking to myself like i have done for the last 4 years time and time again watching brood war. Today was the last time i will be this emotional invested in watching a game. End of an era. I cried a lot especially watching all the plares get on stage I knew like %90 of them I started watching in 08 and have been a fan ever since. I think I have failed a class just because I was trying catch up on vods. The vods are still there and I hope I can find the time to watch the stuff I have missed. I have never been so emotional in my life I feel like my best friend will never be the same, but my friend will always still be there. Broodwar isn't over for me I think I am going to start playing again and actually get good or atleast somewhat good at the game. Theres the chinese scene its not a proscene per say but a really hardcore casual scene that really loves the game and plays for fun and from what I have seen it looks really good. If there are some good casters I will start watching that. The Korean pro scene is parhaps dead, but who knows after the turn out of tonight they filled out a huge stadium with fans. There will probably be legends style matches with broodwar every once in a while in proleague and osl. I'm definitely gonna miss watching my favorite broodwar pros playing bw. No game will compete with the legacy of bw it started in a very special way and will stay in all our our hearts forever. Broodwar Hwaiting!!!! Sincerely Andy I love you tl | ||
|
JieXian
Malaysia4677 Posts
On August 04 2012 21:45 Daudr wrote: Fuck... Who is cutting onions at this time... gg. ![[image loading]](http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/729/oniong.png) GG GL HF BW | ||
|
Tennet
United States1458 Posts
I will miss you BW even if I didn't give you all the love you deserve, may you have a worthy successor (my hope for SC2 to be as amazing as BW in the coming decade) to carry on the starcraft legacy for many more years. Your legend will never die! | ||
|
fNacks
United States39 Posts
gg yo | ||
|
Bagration
United States18282 Posts
| ||
|
TRAP[yoo]
Hungary6026 Posts
| ||
|
SoFool
Malaysia96 Posts
Although I didn't watch the first half of the decade, but I was there when flash and jd rise. It was an honor :') | ||
|
picture2x
Philippines36 Posts
| ||
|
Alakaslam
United States17336 Posts
But all due respect to the Korean pro scene... Obviously that will be missed, and hopefully revived as were cars of the 60's in the USA. In 20 years a broodwar disc may be quite valuable as could be a pc with it installed- you never know. Broodwar is not dead. Entering a dark time, perhaps. But not dead. This thread is perfectly titled. | ||
|
iNvArey
United States20 Posts
| ||
|
Release
United States4397 Posts
You've been a loyal friend Always better than stah2 At last i say adieu | ||
|
Sawamura
Malaysia7602 Posts
| ||
|
leperphilliac
United States399 Posts
Well at least I can still continue playing it =P. | ||
|
MageKirby
United States535 Posts
With this, I take my leave from TL. It was good run. This site was amazing, if anything. I will miss this community. But without BW, I will most likely devote myself to fighting games. But. Never forget. August 4th 2012. edit: thanks for noticing typo. fixed :o | ||
|
Essbee
Canada2371 Posts
On August 05 2012 12:14 MageKirby wrote: This is it. Goodbye BW. For more than half my life, I had BW. And for the rest of my life, I will remember. With this, I take my leave from TL. It was good run. This site was amazing, if anything. I will miss this community. But without BW, I will most likely devote myself to fighting games. But. Never forget. August 8th 2012. *August 4th | ||
|
Juliette
United States6003 Posts
I'm glad it ended with a (jang)bang | ||
|
EtherealDeath
United States8366 Posts
| ||
|
Lightwip
United States5497 Posts
This is merely a formality. | ||
|
Amridell
188 Posts
| ||
|
lynx.oblige
Sierra Leone2268 Posts
| ||
|
Phoobie
Canada120 Posts
GG WP | ||
|
Zamkis
Canada114 Posts
| ||
|
OoFuzer
Chile436 Posts
| ||
|
Archers_bane
United States1338 Posts
| ||
|
Daft Commander
United States79 Posts
| ||
|
TheAmazombie
United States3714 Posts
And flights of angels sing thee to thy rest. | ||
|
Impervious
Canada4200 Posts
| ||
|
Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
| ||
|
Brandish
United States339 Posts
On August 05 2012 14:18 Archers_bane wrote: So many of these threads keep popping up, and I keep feeling empty i can't help but feel the same way, this is truly the end of an era | ||
|
MusicalPulse
United States162 Posts
| ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7889 Posts
On August 04 2012 21:44 GGzerG wrote: this is the saddest day of my life. I'm sure you will live sadder. I hope for you at least. Such a great game, that's a shame. Can't really do anything about it, I don't enjoy SC2 all that much. | ||
|
Gairbear
United States80 Posts
![[image loading]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/67688134/good%20night%20sweet%20prince.jpg) ![[image loading]](https://dl.dropbox.com/u/67688134/pancakes.jpg) This is the pancake Astronaut signing off.... + Show Spoiler + | ||
|
Tom Cruise
Denmark482 Posts
| ||
|
StarMoon
Canada682 Posts
Farewell to the tank/mine lines. To mutalisk micro. To DTs you don't even notice as they kill your whole base. GG to this game that was so hard that it was rarely that your opponent beats you as much as you fail at the game. | ||
c3rberUs
Japan11286 Posts
| ||
|
Gene(S)is
Sweden419 Posts
| ||
|
bailando
Germany332 Posts
When i think of korea, bw always comes up to my mind. Sad to see it go. For me it could have been another 10 years more and i wouldnt get bored. | ||
|
wifebeater
178 Posts
I first picked up this game back in 1998, loved it ever since. Got into the korean/forgein scene around 2004, took some long breaks now and then but kept coming back no matter what. SC:BW-4-EVER yO~~. I'm really hoping that Blizzard is able to forge together another godsent game like SC:BW for us, godspeed to them~~. But at the moment, I think it's rather premature moving on to SC2 as for now. The game is not simply ready yet ^^, but I do understand that the South Korean community must join forces to this one commitment that is SC2 in order to get things to work out. It's just such a huge waste seeing active legends like FlaSh playing SC2. But now that it's over I'm thinking of quitting watching VOD:s/playing games. But just maybe I'll stick around, after all some of my favorite players are still around~~. I'm not bitter at all, SC:BW was well rooted in e-Sport so it stuck around for a real long time and I couldn't be more grateful because of it. I'm gonna revisit some tournaments + see some classsic games, somebody should make an 'SC:BW matches worth revisiting thread' or something. Spoiler free and all, SC2 people would maybe even enjoy this. But could someone please make something like this? I'm really glad that I got the opportunity to be a part of the true beginng of e-Sports, Godspeed South Korea on this new beginning of yours! And thanks to y'all for even making this possible! SC:BW~~ Love You Forever! gg NO re :'( | ||
|
ZombiEzerg
United States13 Posts
gg | ||
|
firehand101
Australia3152 Posts
| ||
|
SuperaddE
Sweden132 Posts
Best game ever. | ||
|
Bobbias
Canada1373 Posts
What we need now is a dedicated server for archiving every vod, every reply available, and preserving as much information and history as we can so that when someone remembers this game, they can go back, find that amazing match, and watch it, or read up on the players involved. | ||
|
DwmC_Foefen
Belgium2186 Posts
| ||
|
Biff The Understudy
France7889 Posts
On August 05 2012 20:16 firehand101 wrote: gl hf, you had a good run....the longest of any competitive game infact.... I think chess might have been around for a little longer. I guess you meant video game ;-) | ||
|
EnergizerBunny
29 Posts
| ||
|
Tom Cruise
Denmark482 Posts
On August 05 2012 23:03 EnergizerBunny wrote: Goodnight BW, goodnight e-sports. ..esports is gonna be around without broodwar, lol. | ||
|
sGs.FroZen
United States38 Posts
| ||
|
jediken21
United States1 Post
| ||
|
3FFA
United States3931 Posts
....e...ex...excuse...m....m...me...for a....m...moment  | ||
|
TBone-
United States2309 Posts
On August 06 2012 00:17 jediken21 wrote: Really, all you guys sound like you are burning the disc and the rest of the internet is burning the servers and no-pros will play it ever again. Call be in denial, but I'm fairly sure you can still buy the game from Blizzard, and people can still play it at a professional level, sure the money wont be there (as if there ever was, really) but people still play Doom professionally. I mean c'mon guys you all sound like every disc or install is just gone now lolwut? Are you even aware of what just happened? | ||
|
Cele
Germany4016 Posts
On August 06 2012 00:17 jediken21 wrote: Really, all you guys sound like you are burning the disc and the rest of the internet is burning the servers and no-pros will play it ever again. Call be in denial, but I'm fairly sure you can still buy the game from Blizzard, and people can still play it at a professional level, sure the money wont be there (as if there ever was, really) but people still play Doom professionally. I mean c'mon guys you all sound like every disc or install is just gone now lolwut? It´s just that an Era of professional BW in Korea has ended and thus the foreign scene will most likely collapse as well. Of course people can still play the game. but there is a major difference between some people playing a game and a healthy international scene with top level gaming in the pro section. Goodbye Broodwar, i still like you more (; | ||
|
endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On August 06 2012 00:17 jediken21 wrote: Really, all you guys sound like you are burning the disc and the rest of the internet is burning the servers and no-pros will play it ever again. Call be in denial, but I'm fairly sure you can still buy the game from Blizzard, and people can still play it at a professional level, sure the money wont be there (as if there ever was, really) but people still play Doom professionally. I mean c'mon guys you all sound like every disc or install is just gone now lolwut? How can you be a professional if there is no money. Your sentence doesn't make sense. Also, public B.net servers are trash spammed by bots, there are usually no players, and when there are, a majority are hackers. Only decent alternative is Fish. | ||
|
Proseat
Germany5113 Posts
| ||
|
a7choi
United States1664 Posts
| ||
|
eXigent.
Canada2419 Posts
| ||
|
Crisium
United States1618 Posts
| ||
|
TheAngelofDeath
United States2033 Posts
| ||
|
Itachii
Poland12466 Posts
Too many memoires to mention them all,good games everyone throughout all these years and see you around. BROODWAR FOR LIFE | ||
|
Starburst
United States108 Posts
| ||
|
psiops
Canada21 Posts
| ||
|
jax1492
United States1632 Posts
| ||
|
Raigeki
Hong Kong207 Posts
| ||
|
Ricjames
Czech Republic1047 Posts
| ||
|
altered
Switzerland646 Posts
| ||
|
TwilightStar
United States649 Posts
| ||
|
G5
United States2898 Posts
| ||
|
Dumbledore
Sweden725 Posts
| ||
|
Release
United States4397 Posts
| ||
|
Stuk
France63 Posts
I started playing Brood War 12 years ago in the attic of a friend (the only one having several computer with LAN at the time) and I have tons of memories related to Starcraft 1. Even if I started following the pro-scene way later, Brood War was a huge part of my teenage years. Brood War and the Korean scene have made eSport what it is today, and we shall never forget the best game ever. Good bye Brood War :'( | ||
|
dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
| ||
|
nanaoei
3358 Posts
(oyasumi nasai） | ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
|
StorkHwaiting
United States3465 Posts
| ||
|
Taekwon
United States8155 Posts
Re? | ||
|
Dispersion
Korea (South)504 Posts
Brood War is the superior game. </3 RIP. | ||
|
SausageLinks
United States93 Posts
| ||
|
chaosTheory_14cc
Canada1270 Posts
The greatest competitive game in history. | ||
|
khy
United States475 Posts
| ||
|
tehredbanditt
103 Posts
Remember when iloveoov had the sickest TvZ in the world and it seemed like no zerg would ever beat him? Then how about when July zerg beat him using extremely aggressive tactics? None of it compared to the dominance of Savior though. The way he man handled all of the competition of the time, something a zerg had never done before. My years of rooting for zerg was finally paying off. I could keep going on about this great game; more importantly about those who played it, but there is so much content that it's overwhelming. Sadly, in 5,10, or 20 years from now no one will REALLY know (except for us diehards) what BW was. My favorite BW memories were watching Savior beat Nada in the finals and teaching friend how to play competitive 1v1. He has passed but I often think about him. | ||
|
Slow Motion
United States6960 Posts
| ||
|
stambe
Bulgaria492 Posts
I hope more people think this way instead of the grim "BW is gone for me now". | ||
|
elKaDor
Sweden376 Posts
| ||
|
GinNtoniC
Sweden2945 Posts
Farewell! | ||
|
Esp1noza
Russian Federation481 Posts
I hope a morning comes one day. | ||
TheEmulator
28089 Posts
Farewell | ||
|
theslayer922
Canada304 Posts
| ||
|
TaShadan
Germany1971 Posts
On August 12 2012 17:12 elKaDor wrote: now we can just hope that Blizzard will do an "Remake" of Broodwar, cuz sc2 aint even worth playing I doubt that will ever happen and i doubt that a remake from Blizzard would be as good as the original. | ||
|
Garmer
1286 Posts
| ||
|
MVega
763 Posts
On August 12 2012 17:12 elKaDor wrote: now we can just hope that Blizzard will do an "Remake" of Broodwar, cuz sc2 aint even worth playing To be fair, the pro broodwar players for the most part seem to disagree with that assessment. I'm pretty excited about watching them in a new game and seeing what kind of interesting stuff they can come up with. | ||
|
grobo
Japan6199 Posts
Goodbye, sweet prince! | ||
|
Sephy90
United States1785 Posts
On August 06 2012 10:08 Release wrote: Klazart never made a final stand You know this whole... situation would've been better had Klazart been with us. I don't think I can accept what has happened let alone say good-bye.. it's too painful. | ||
|
warblob004
United States198 Posts
| ||
|
Sumahi
Guam5609 Posts
| ||
|
NewbieOne
Poland560 Posts
I remember WCG in Warsaw, must have been 2007. There were two telebims where I was, pretty much right next to each other. Can't have been more than a couple metre distance. We were looking at the TFT screen, the other guys (i.e. the BroodWar guys) were right there, though in a separate group. There was a bit of competition between the two groups. Some witticisms flew both ways. Some people took time to look at the other screen, others just cast a furtive glance from to time. It was near the time I had the peak of my ability in TFT and it was also what motivated me. | ||
|
TsGBruzze
Sweden1190 Posts
| ||
|
henzi
United States200 Posts
| ||
|
Deleted User 183001
2939 Posts
RIP BW.You provided me with great entertainment (and fucking yellow fever, which fortunately I got over). You will be missed. | ||
|
SKDN
Sweden243 Posts
On August 13 2012 02:17 JudicatorHammurabi wrote: Crazy that in the span of a few months BW just died. One of a country's biggest professional sports with millions of fans just dies, and even worse, there was no protest from those diehard Korean fans. And people bitch about American complacency? haha. There'd be riots if the NBA was shut down tomorrow. RIP BW.You provided me with great entertainment (and fucking yellow fever, which fortunately I got over). You will be missed. yellow fever indeed... | ||
|
Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
On August 13 2012 02:17 JudicatorHammurabi wrote: Crazy that in the span of a few months BW just died. One of a country's biggest professional sports with millions of fans just dies, and even worse, there was no protest from those diehard Korean fans. And people bitch about American complacency? haha. There'd be riots if the NBA was shut down tomorrow. RIP BW.You provided me with great entertainment (and fucking yellow fever, which fortunately I got over). You will be missed. you overestimate how big the scene is/was and the timespan of it's decline. | ||
|
iky43210
United States2099 Posts
| ||
|
Manimal_pro
Romania991 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
|
Gamegene
United States8308 Posts
| ||
|
Flamingo777
United States1190 Posts
| ||
|
Vanimar
220 Posts
| ||
|
See.Blue
United States2673 Posts
| ||
|
AzureHath
Bulgaria154 Posts
gg | ||
|
Troxle
United States486 Posts
| ||
|
Piste
6177 Posts
bw has been with me since my childhood. | ||
|
Pandain
United States12989 Posts
Can't believe the entity that brought me into professional gaming, and Teamliquid, and sc2, is gone. Part of my childhood is gone with it too, I guess. | ||
|
imperfect
Canada1652 Posts
it's been fun. | ||
|
Chronopolis
Canada1484 Posts
The brood is calling. | ||
|
Postaljester
United States128 Posts
| ||
|
DyEnasTy
United States3714 Posts
| ||
|
noobcakes
United States526 Posts
| ||
|
FlaShFTW
United States10158 Posts
| ||
|
Ghostcom
Denmark4782 Posts
| ||
|
mopy
Australia19 Posts
User was warned for this post | ||
|
hitthat
Poland2267 Posts
Remove yourself from terran teritory. | ||
|
Le French
France782 Posts
On August 13 2012 14:43 mopy wrote: Finally no more BW elitists. User was warned for this post This deserves more than a little slap in the hand. Please ban this f*cker! | ||
Falling
Canada11350 Posts
On August 13 2012 15:50 Le French wrote: This deserves more than a little slap in the hand. Please ban this f*cker! I had to fight against my own flash of anger, so there it is. | ||
|
Le French
France782 Posts
On August 13 2012 16:09 Falling wrote: I had to fight against my own flash of anger, so there it is. I really don't want to belabor on this issue, and I am not the vengeful angry type. But let me just say this for the record, to give a bit of context. This very site is founded on our love for broodwar. And it is not some faddish love that would be easily replaced once a shiny new toy is out. I am speaking this in objective terms. The hate for SC2 among bw people started out emotionally, of people not wanting their prized game to die. But truth be told, at this point in time between sc2 and bw, bw is just a far more superior game compared to sc2, and I believe that justifies the dislike. Let me add that SC2 has a long way to go though, and improvements seem to be underway. Going back. So on day we celebrate an end of the era, here comes people (not just him but others who post in similar fasion as well) who chime in only to insult and make fun of it. This is just inappropriate, to say the least. Also, he posted this in another thread and was able to get away with it also: You should of quit when you where on top. Plus people tend to only remember you for your GSL semi final performances and forget, all you BM once you started losing. Also who can forget that time when you where acting on HuK's behalf in that group selection thing. You where acting like you where hot shit and you owned the place even though you were fairly knocked out to code B. I mean do you have to act like a total ass to gom tv just because you haven't been getting the results. | ||
|
Stratos
Czech Republic6104 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + game anyone? | ||
|
TaShadan
Germany1971 Posts
| ||
|
Trufflez
Australia174 Posts
But... graphics. | ||
|
letian
Germany4221 Posts
Best post in the thread, damn it | ||
|
AllSalesFinal
United States211 Posts
. SCBW paved the road for my love of computer/competition/rts gaming.But my best memory? Doing 2v2s on Blood Bath. 7rax9depot to survive the 4pools. Worked every time. | ||
|
DyEnasTy
United States3714 Posts
On August 13 2012 20:34 AllSalesFinal wrote: I didn't even know about tl.net before sc2 came out, but I do remember back in 01/02? I was absolutely obsessed with boxer games on halls of valhalla. No idea why that map appealed to me so much, but i was only 12 at the time, so it is excused. It is sad to see it go, all the nights staying up late in the basement "sleeping" watching replays, and then sadly I fell out of it around the time of WC3 . SCBW paved the road for my love of computer/competition/rts gaming.But my best memory? Doing 2v2s on Blood Bath. 7rax9depot to survive the 4pools. Worked every time. Pfffft FFA on Three Kingdoms was tooootaly cooler | ||
|
Scrutinizer
170 Posts
| ||
|
pedduck
Thailand468 Posts
| ||
|
malady
United States600 Posts
On August 13 2012 15:50 Le French wrote: This deserves more than a little slap in the hand. Please ban this f*cker! he won't be banned because this is sc2 world now | ||
|
dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
EDIT: Or is this the 3 month countdown? | ||
|
fabiano
Brazil4644 Posts
On August 14 2012 03:37 dUTtrOACh wrote: Does this mean the elephant has left the room? EDIT: Or is this the 3 month countdown? This means the start of a make-believe "esports" scene. | ||
|
FlaShFTW
United States10158 Posts
On August 13 2012 14:43 mopy wrote: Finally no more BW elitists. User was warned for this post 17 posts. amazing use of one of them. guys this aint the end. china is still here. we have D rank tourneys and C rank tourneys still here. We can rebuild. THIS DOES NOT MEAN WE DIE HERE | ||
|
]343[
United States10328 Posts
On August 14 2012 04:38 FlaShFTW wrote: 17 posts. amazing use of one of them. guys this aint the end. china is still here. we have D rank tourneys and C rank tourneys still here. We can rebuild. THIS DOES NOT MEAN WE DIE HERE "I'm not dead yet!" | ||
|
-Switch-
Canada506 Posts
| ||
|
pigmanbear
Angola2010 Posts
On August 14 2012 01:47 malady wrote: he won't be banned because this is sc2 world now TL really needs to provide a Brood War portal. Once upon a time, BW supported this website, and I really would like to see TL do what it can to support BW now. People aren't going to get as excited for tournaments etc. if they only exist as forum posts or plaintext Events entries, and there's not enough activity in BW compared to SC2 for BW happenings to compete with SC2 on the homepage. The top nav should really be "Home | Starcraft 2 | Brood War | ...". Look at the homepage: Not a single thing in the main panel about Brood War that I can see, apart from entries in the tiny "Latest Results" panel. Pro League is about to end, and that's all the more reason to bid a proper farewell. I don't have numbers on this, but sometimes I swear that this site has more DOTA2/LoL featured streams combined than BW ones (I never understood why the site has non-BW/SC2 streams, period, but that's another discussion). | ||
|
lllMigueLlll
25 Posts
| ||
|
EnergizerBunny
29 Posts
| ||
|
Garmer
1286 Posts
| ||
|
Sinedd
Poland7052 Posts
| ||
|
Kaeru
Sweden552 Posts
| ||
|
M2
Bulgaria4116 Posts
| ||
|
NightOfTheDead
Lithuania1711 Posts
| ||
|
ShivaRee
China43 Posts
day and night thank you bw... but there are chinese sc events such as STL, C-osl, ... u always have a choice welcome to watch | ||
|
Gyro_SC2
Canada540 Posts
Sc2 will become the next Bw. With all the bw player starting playing sc2, im so happy. The spirit of the game is still there, and in 10 years you will see sc2 level better than bw. | ||
|
DieterEilts
Germany283 Posts
| ||
|
pigmanbear
Angola2010 Posts
| ||
|
BearStorm
United States795 Posts
| ||
|
KalWarkov
Germany4126 Posts
| ||
|
Oaky
United States95 Posts
| ||
|
elKaDor
Sweden376 Posts
On August 15 2012 05:22 Gyro_SC2 wrote: Broodwar was a good game but don't be sad. Sc2 will become the next Bw. With all the bw player starting playing sc2, im so happy. The spirit of the game is still there, and in 10 years you will see sc2 level better than bw. just that SC2 sucks, BW doesnt. Bw required skills, which they made auto in SC2 which makes the game useless | ||
|
empty.bottle
685 Posts
On August 22 2012 14:00 elKaDor wrote: just that SC2 sucks, BW doesnt. Bw required skills, which they made auto in SC2 which makes the game useless LOL he thinks sc2 will last 10 years. | ||
|
INTOtheVOID
United States225 Posts
| ||
|
Kleinmuuhg
Vanuatu4091 Posts
| ||
|
JFO
184 Posts
| ||
|
Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
On August 22 2012 19:26 INTOtheVOID wrote: Sad thread. Sucks, would be sweet if some billionaire decides to make a league because he didn't want the game to die. The point is that Kespa's contract with BW will soon run out after S2PL finishes, and Blizzard will certainly not renew it for the sake of StarTwo. And some CEO offered twice the amount of price money for OSL to continue as Brood War in which the OGN have denied. | ||
|
FlaShFTW
United States10158 Posts
On August 15 2012 05:22 Gyro_SC2 wrote: Broodwar was a good game but don't be sad. Sc2 will become the next Bw. With all the bw player starting playing sc2, im so happy. The spirit of the game is still there, and in 10 years you will see sc2 level better than bw. LOL >10 years. implying that sc3 won't come out by then and kill sc2. | ||
|
Garmer
1286 Posts
| ||
|
Sawamura
Malaysia7602 Posts
On August 22 2012 14:00 elKaDor wrote: just that SC2 sucks, BW doesnt. Bw required skills, which they made auto in SC2 which makes the game useless It's just that the game has already been out for two years and yet they are still pointing me to the "give it time" sign . Well I have a lot of time to give until than real life > my gaming life for good. | ||
|
brolaf
291 Posts
On August 22 2012 23:21 Xiphos wrote: The point is that Kespa's contract with BW will soon run out after S2PL finishes, and Blizzard will certainly not renew it for the sake of StarTwo. And some CEO offered twice the amount of price money for OSL to continue as Brood War in which the OGN have denied. I think if this transition and the larger scale implementation of SC2 in korea doesnt pay its dividends in the coming year or two, we may well see a return of BW, or some part of it. Would be interesting to see how the OGN ratings are now with the SC2 content compared to past leagues. | ||
|
v1p3r52
New Zealand182 Posts
| ||
|
LSB
United States5171 Posts
| ||
|
arb
Noobville17921 Posts
The game hadn't been out for like 6 months before I already knew it wasnt the game id fell in love with(broodwar) I believe I'll just lurk in the League forums until SC2 hopefully dies and BW makes a return | ||
|
Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
On August 23 2012 03:03 arb wrote:The game hadn't been out for like 6 months before I already knew it wasnt the game id fell in love with(broodwar) I believe I'll just lurk in the League forums until SC2 hopefully dies and BW makes a return last post best post | ||
|
thezanursic
5479 Posts
| ||
|
duke91
Germany1458 Posts
On February 20 2017 01:41 Terrorbladder wrote: bump-ing this thread because Brood War has come back! last post best post Truly wise words Also Gyro_sc2 last post in 2014 lol | ||
|
zeratul_jf
United States808 Posts
On February 20 2017 02:24 duke91 wrote: Truly wise words Also Gyro_sc2 last post in 2014 lol I got scared that I had missed some announcement of BW being not supported by blizz anymore or something and then I realized this was a necro.... | ||
|
ninazerg
United States7291 Posts
On February 20 2017 03:17 zeratul_jf wrote: I got scared that I had missed some announcement of BW being not supported by blizz anymore or something and then I realized this was a necro.... I thought it was going to be some over-dramatic "I'm quitting Brood War, guys" thread. | ||
|
Falling
Canada11350 Posts
(Day will come again!) -Hurin Thalion | ||
|
TAKK.borg
Croatia93 Posts
| ||
|
Jae Zedong
407 Posts
On February 20 2017 04:18 TAKK.borg wrote: Chills! Of the 'nerd' variety? | ||
|
MuNi
United States72 Posts
| ||
HaN-
France1920 Posts
| ||
BisuDagger
Bisutopia19239 Posts
| ||
|
739
Bearded Elder29903 Posts
| ||
|
letian
Germany4221 Posts
| ||
|
Broodwar4lyf
304 Posts
On August 15 2012 05:22 Gyro_SC2 wrote: Broodwar was a good game but don't be sad. Sc2 will become the next Bw. With all the bw player starting playing sc2, im so happy. The spirit of the game is still there, and in 10 years you will see sc2 level better than bw. lol BW outlived this poster | ||
|
Jae Zedong
407 Posts
| ||
|
[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On August 23 2012 02:38 v1p3r52 wrote: So sad to see BW ending :c But it never did. | ||
|
Ayaz2810
United States2763 Posts
Too bad they (iccup? fish? I don't even remember now) made it absurdly hard to download and play. I gave up after an hour of trying to make it work. | ||
|
arb
Noobville17921 Posts
On February 20 2017 12:50 Ayaz2810 wrote: Too bad they (iccup? fish? I don't even remember now) made it absurdly hard to download and play. I gave up after an hour of trying to make it work. its mind boggling it took you an hour on something that should take 5 minutes at the max, fish maybe a bit longer but there is step by step guides for that rofl | ||
|
HerbMon
United States461 Posts
| ||
|
pheer
5390 Posts
- what happened on August 04 2012? - what just happened today to cause the bump? I love BW, but obviously not enough since I'm always out of the loop  | ||
|
wswordsmen
United States987 Posts
| ||
|
outscar
2832 Posts
On February 20 2017 12:50 Ayaz2810 wrote: Too bad they (iccup? fish? I don't even remember now) made it absurdly hard to download and play. I gave up after an hour of trying to make it work. I'm sorry but you don't have fighting spirit (I'm not talking about map) brother because real difficulties are ahead when you start laddering your ass to D+. You should immediately start today playing. PM me if you are serious about playing and have any troubles installing. | ||
|
Shana
Indonesia1814 Posts
Thankfully it's just a necro. | ||
|
FlaShFTW
United States10158 Posts
The night is darkest before the dawn. | ||
|
Me_ToKa
Bulgaria309 Posts
| ||
|
WhosQuany
Germany257 Posts
On February 20 2017 04:42 BisuDagger wrote: Good morning Brood War! | ||
|
nttea
Sweden4353 Posts
| ||
|
Dante08
Singapore4128 Posts
On February 20 2017 07:51 Jae Zedong wrote: The idea that SC2 could ever "become the next BW" is so absurd. They are completely different games. Why do people keep saying they are completely different games. I mean they are different but not "completely different". Warcraft and Starcraft would be "completely different" but not BW and SC2. Anyway awesome bump, long live BW! | ||
|
c3rberUs
Japan11286 Posts
| ||
|
ItsFunToLose
United States776 Posts
On February 20 2017 14:20 Shana wrote: I just got mini heart attack. My mind was racing, what happened, is it Afreeca pulling the plug, another match fixing, Blizzard nuking BW.... Thankfully it's just a necro. god this. can necros be auto-tagged as such somehow? after no posts for 6 months, the topic automatically gets braces put around the [title] or something to indicate that the thread link you're clicking is going to kick you in the nuts Why do people keep saying they are completely different games. I mean they are different but not "completely different". Warcraft and Starcraft would be "completely different" but not BW and SC2. I'd argue that warcraft 3 and broodwar have more in common in spirit, and especially from a personnel standpoint(polish, charm, talent, etc. That BW and SC2 both have drones/probes/scvs does not automatically make them similar games). When's the last sc2 game you watched where both armies clash, and 5 production cycles of reinforcements later, a winner is finally determined. fucking never. It's not uncommon for Broodwar or Warcraft 3 battles to last for several extended minutes where the winner of an engagement isn't clear until the dust settles. Blizzard today shares very few names and faces with the Blizzard that made broodwar. They're arguably completely separate companies. Sc2 has no soul, and it's painfully obvious to anyone over 30 that those responsible for our greatest childhood hits have moved on. | ||
|
Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
| ||
|
Jae Zedong
407 Posts
On February 20 2017 22:41 ItsFunToLose wrote:That BW and SC2 both have drones/probes/scvs does not automatically make them similar games). When's the last sc2 game you watched where both armies clash, and 5 production cycles of reinforcements later, a winner is finally determined. fucking never. It's not uncommon for Broodwar or Warcraft 3 battles to last for several extended minutes where the winner of an engagement isn't clear until the dust settles. Blizzard today shares very few names and faces with the Blizzard that made broodwar. They're arguably completely separate companies. Sc2 has no soul, and it's painfully obvious to anyone over 30 that those responsible for our greatest childhood hits have moved on. Exactly. Saying SC2 is comparable to BW is like taking Chess, a refined game of scholars, and add a bunch of random 3D pieces and say its still the same game, only bigger and betterer because you shoved a bunch of crap into it. If you add even 1 pawn to Chess it's a completely different game, not to mention what would happen if you altered all the existing pieces and let the game play out on a hockey rink with completely different mechanics. Starcraft 2 is Starcraft in name only. | ||
|
M2
Bulgaria4116 Posts
| ||
|
Elroi
Sweden5595 Posts
On February 20 2017 03:57 Falling wrote: "Aure entuluva!" (Day will come again!) -Hurin Thalion You nailed it. I remember reading that and crying so much. XD | ||
|
[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On February 20 2017 12:50 Ayaz2810 wrote: Too bad they (iccup? fish? I don't even remember now) made it absurdly hard to download and play. I gave up after an hour of trying to make it work. Still tryin' to figure out what that personal anecdote has to do with BW's resurgence, but, ehh, okay, whatev. | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
On February 21 2017 00:46 [[Starlight]] wrote: Still tryin' to figure out what that personal anecdote has to do with BW's resurgence, but, ehh, okay, whatev. his point I take it, was that they'll be even more of a resurgence if it was easier to get iccup etc... running from the get go instead of jumping through hoops to play the game. | ||
|
[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On February 21 2017 00:52 BigFan wrote: his point I take it, was that they'll be even more of a resurgence if it was easier to get iccup etc... running from the get go instead of jumping through hoops to play the game. I don't think he thought it through that far. "Hey, BW didn't die after all!" "Man, I am still horked off at ICCup and Fish, let me tell you why!!!!" Um... okay. | ||
|
Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
BW was the perfect metric of skill because of technical limitations in the 90s. Players had to accomplish more in any given amount of time to overcome these limitations, and the best ones were the people that could do the most efficiently. SC2 was created in the late 2000s, when the same limitations had been broken, there was just no point in intentionally bringing them back to the game. So, even though sc2 admittedly required less skill, you can't blame sc2 for being designed the way it was. | ||
|
ArmadA[NaS]
United States347 Posts
| ||
|
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
On February 21 2017 00:53 [[Starlight]] wrote: I don't think he thought it through that far. "Hey, BW didn't die after all!" "Man, I am still horked off at ICCup and Fish, let me tell you why!!!!" Um... okay. benefit of the doubt. | ||
|
Harem
United States11390 Posts
On February 20 2017 12:50 Ayaz2810 wrote: Too bad they (iccup? fish? I don't even remember now) made it absurdly hard to download and play. I gave up after an hour of trying to make it work. iccup.com | ||
|
Dazed.
Canada3301 Posts
On February 21 2017 01:09 Terrorbladder wrote: I think sc2's ultimate failure came about when they were attempting to design it in such a way as to appeal to the "mainstream" gamer, when mainstream gamers arent attracted to RTS. That and its slow and shitty roll out of b.net 2.0/ums games etc, it hampered the casual scene as well. If sc2 hadnt gone full newbie, put in larger control groups but not unlimited, etc-- basically just not automating every damn little thing -- it would of worked. sc2 was a great RTS game in its own right but it was doomed by the expectation of being the MULTIPLAYER sequel to bw. BW was the perfect metric of skill because of technical limitations in the 90s. Players had to accomplish more in any given amount of time to overcome these limitations, and the best ones were the people that could do the most efficiently. SC2 was created in the late 2000s, when the same limitations had been broken, there was just no point in intentionally bringing them back to the game. So, even though sc2 admittedly required less skill, you can't blame sc2 for being designed the way it was. | ||
|
Jae Zedong
407 Posts
Let's not get ahead of ourselves here. They marketed SC2 as a mainstream game, they didn't design it like one. SC2 may be less mechanically demanding than BW, but it's easily the second most demanding game in the world after BW. It's not a casual game, and if you think SC2's failure is because it's too "newbie friendly" you're way off. We as a BW community may think it is, but the wider gaming world sure as hell doesn't. The game has 99 problems but casualness ain't one. | ||
|
Hildegard
Germany306 Posts
However I think BW balance is often looked at with rose-tinted glasses. In my opinion SC2 is better balanced than BW. | ||
|
palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
On February 21 2017 07:45 Hildegard wrote: I don't get the need to bash SC2 constantly. Both BW and SC2 have unreachable skill-caps. Considering that it doesn't really matter if one is more demanding than the other. I enjoy and watch both games since years. However I think BW balance is often looked at with rose-tinted glasses. In my opinion SC2 is better balanced than BW. You can have a perfect balance game and making it boring, examples of those incredible stupid things that Blizz added to SC2 are: forcefields, medivac boost speed, warp prism range, and go on and on. Every video game has an unreachable skill cap, so the way to compare them is how demanding in several aspects they are, anyway Good morning BW. | ||
|
toriak
Slovakia477 Posts
every race starts with 0 workers and 49 minerals | ||
|
Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
| ||
|
eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
On February 21 2017 16:19 Terrorbladder wrote: Sometimes I wonder how the meta would change if SC/SC2 gave each players starting money à la WC3... Don't players start with 50 minerals in either game? | ||
|
Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
On February 21 2017 18:20 eviltomahawk wrote: I mean, to the extent that WC3 gives, where you can immediately build basic buildings with starting money. Meanwhile SC/SC2 only gives enough money to make a worker.Don't players start with 50 minerals in either game? | ||
|
eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
On February 21 2017 18:46 Terrorbladder wrote: I mean, to the extent that WC3 gives, where you can immediately build basic buildings with starting money. Meanwhile SC/SC2 only gives enough money to make a worker. Oh I see. I feel like the games may end up needing early-game rebalancing to avoid rushes and proxies from becoming too strong. The factions in WC3 felt like they had more built-in racial defensive abilities. | ||
|
[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On February 21 2017 15:23 toriak wrote: a have a perfect balance for u every race starts with 0 workers and 49 minerals SC2 design team says, "Sounds like a winner!". | ||
|
bartus88
Netherlands491 Posts
On February 21 2017 07:45 Hildegard wrote: I don't get the need to bash SC2 constantly. Both BW and SC2 have unreachable skill-caps. Considering that it doesn't really matter if one is more demanding than the other. I enjoy and watch both games since years. However I think BW balance is often looked at with rose-tinted glasses. In my opinion SC2 is better balanced than BW. SC2 is undeniably better balanced, the BW community had to do the balancing by making maps that counter-acted the imbalances. But that is not something most people here would like to hear, they can only focus on the negatives of SC2. The few pages of this thread are pretty sad to read. Both are amazing games, but this community is way too blinded by bitterness to have a decent discussion. There's a good reason I went from reading this subforum daily to reading it once every 3 months, around the time this thread was made. | ||
|
darktreb
United States3016 Posts
On February 21 2017 19:26 bartus88 wrote: SC2 is undeniably better balanced, the BW community had to do the balancing by making maps that counter-acted the imbalances. But that is not something most people here would like to hear, they can only focus on the negatives of SC2. The few pages of this thread are pretty sad to read. Both are amazing games, but this community is way too blinded by bitterness to have a decent discussion. There's a good reason I went from reading this subforum daily to reading it once every 3 months, around the time this thread was made. Haha we've come full circle. SC2 has so little left to hang its hat on that people are resorting to defending it as a better balanced game. At this point SC2 supporters aren't even trying to pretend it's a more fun game to play, or more exciting to watch, or better in any way that actually matters. And then there's the annoying SC2 fan whine of "wahh BW fans so bitter, wahh why can't you just enjoy both games". This is such an obnoxious complaint. It's also hypocritical - how about you SC2 fans stop being so sensitive about this? It's the lamest complaint - it's basically saying "yes, you BW fans were completely right 5+ years ago even while the vast majority of people were mocking, doubting, and dismissing your views, but now you have the nerve to remind us you were right". SC2 was the reason for the unjust, un-meritocratic, premature killing of the BW pro scene. BW fans don't resent SC2 because it's another Starcraft game - that would have been fine. It's that Blizzard forced the BW teams + leagues to switch, via threat of lawsuit. This is the part that really burns every BW fan. If SC2 had taken over on merit, that would have been ok. All BW fans wanted was a fair chance, but that chance was never given. Notice how BW fans don't resent games like LoL? Sure, not every BW fan likes MoBa gameplay, but successful MoBa's earned the position they have today, rather than being born with a silver spoon up their ass and still managing to squander the opportunity. Even with the current revival of the scene, we'll never know what BW could have been. We'll never know how the legacies of various legends would have played out, what a world with someone like Bisu on ACE would have looked like, or how many up-and-comers might have infused the scene with fresh talent. Yes, I'm happy that BW is where it is today. But things like Afreeca and Twitch would have happened no matter what. What a world the pro BW scene might look like today, with all the technological and product developments of the past five years, had it never been stuffed into a coffin and buried alive. Are there bigger problems in the world than what happened to BW? Of course, far bigger. But we're in a BW forum FFS. What Blizz + SC2 did to BW is the game world equivalent a corrupt police officer wrongfully imprisoning our friend. Now our friend is free again, and we're celebrating their freedom. And guess what, we enjoy the fact that the shitty corrupt police officer who caused all that pain has now fallen on hard times, for the same reason people enjoy seeing a bad guy get his comeuppance at the end of a movie, even after the good guys have already won. That's "unnecessary bashing" too if you want to look at it that way. The rest of it will look at it the way it really is - sweet, sweet justice. | ||
|
hitthat
Poland2267 Posts
On February 21 2017 19:26 bartus88 wrote: SC2 is undeniably better balanced, the BW community had to do the balancing by making maps that counter-acted the imbalances. But that is not something most people here would like to hear, they can only focus on the negatives of SC2. The few pages of this thread are pretty sad to read. Both are amazing games, but this community is way too blinded by bitterness to have a decent discussion. There's a good reason I went from reading this subforum daily to reading it once every 3 months, around the time this thread was made. PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF *long histerical laugh* | ||
|
LightSpectra
United States1461 Posts
On February 21 2017 19:26 bartus88 wrote: SC2 is undeniably better balanced, the BW community had to do the balancing by making maps that counter-acted the imbalances. This makes no sense at all. No matchups happen in a vacuum, you always play on maps, and SC2 had an assload of imbalanced maps throughout its history. | ||
|
Dazed.
Canada3301 Posts
On February 21 2017 07:03 Jae Zedong wrote: Alright, thats true actually, and was somewhat implied in what i said. RTS is never going to be mainstream unless its VERY dumbed down, so there attempts were sort of schizophrenic. Make things easier in the mistaken belief you can go mainstream 'here', but make it really hard to placate esports/hardcore fans 'there'. Oh well, heres to sc3.^ Let's not get ahead of ourselves here. They marketed SC2 as a mainstream game, they didn't design it like one. SC2 may be less mechanically demanding than BW, but it's easily the second most demanding game in the world after BW. It's not a casual game, and if you think SC2's failure is because it's too "newbie friendly" you're way off. We as a BW community may think it is, but the wider gaming world sure as hell doesn't. The game has 99 problems but casualness ain't one.  Edit: SC2 was a financial success but I would say it overall was a critical failure, as the overall impression by gamers has been negative (or at least enough below expectations of positive to be called a failure of sorts). It 'failed' to financially dominate the market, which I doubt was even blizzards goal, by not going mainstream enough. But it also failed in another sense, it didnt convince the hardcore gamers either. if it went hardcore at least it could be said it succeeded in bringing around blizzard fan boys, yada yada. In other words, there is more than one metric for success, and sc2 definitely could of been a success in a certain light if it had either been more competitive or less. But as it was it just pissed both camps off and will be remembered for its flawed game design. On February 21 2017 19:26 bartus88 wrote: sc2 was/is balanced with maps as well (any game with a rotating map pool and territorial features that impact gameplay necessarily is a game where maps influence balance. this is basic and unassailable logic), hell they disallowed certain forms of spawns just to help along balance...SC2 is undeniably better balanced, the BW community had to do the balancing by making maps that counter-acted the imbalances. But that is not something most people here would like to hear, they can only focus on the negatives of SC2. The few pages of this thread are pretty sad to read. Both are amazing games, but this community is way too blinded by bitterness to have a decent discussion. There's a good reason I went from reading this subforum daily to reading it once every 3 months, around the time this thread was made. -Gold bases were imbalanced -All small maps stopped being played because of terran rushes -Island maps were imbalanced and never played -Semi island maps were imbalanced and never played -Only cross spawns Then there are other features like ramp size and natural layout that impact sc2's balance, or how the map splits--- the actual selection of features that create a balanced sc2 game were fairly narrow. More narrow than broodwars in fact! | ||
|
Demurity
United States424 Posts
| ||
|
lestye
United States4163 Posts
Edit: SC2 was a financial success but I would say it overall was a critical failure, as the overall impression by gamers has been negative (or at least enough below expectations of positive to be called a failure of sorts). It 'failed' to financially dominate the market, which I doubt was even blizzards goal, by not going mainstream enough. But it also failed in another sense, it didnt convince the hardcore gamers either. if it went hardcore at least it could be said it succeeded in bringing around blizzard fan boys, yada yada. In other words, there is more than one metric for success, and sc2 definitely could of been a success in a certain light if it had either been more competitive or less. But as it was it just pissed both camps off and will be remembered for its flawed game design. How does this make any sense? It was critically praised. It wasn't exactly panned. And how did not dominate the market? Do you know of any other successful RTSes in the space? The most successful RTS outside of it are the Total War games which still only do a fraction of the sales. | ||
|
intotheheart
Canada33091 Posts
| ||
|
lestye
United States4163 Posts
On February 22 2017 03:07 intotheheart wrote: Let's not deny that SC2 made money, but I think the post you're referring to was talking about its success as an eSport and the size of the fanbase this far down the road more than anything else. "failed to financially dominate the market" "critical failure" were the keywords that made me think otherwise. I don't know, overall I disagree because I think it ignores the accomplishments SC2 did excel at, given the nature of an unpopular genre, ESPECIALLY in the West. I feel like people are comparing SC2 with the insanely successful MOBAs and Counterstrike and thinking its size is shit in comparison, when I don't think they're exactly comparable. If we consider the size and scope of RTS esports in the West since 2000, SC2 was a massive success in that respect. SC2 is still a massive success globally when you look at the interest of 1v1 esports, which aren't exactly the most popular thing on the planet nowadays. | ||
|
intotheheart
Canada33091 Posts
It's definitely one of the most popular eSports which is played 1v1, because in a 5v5 you can play with friends or blame others for your shortcomings. Which is why I mostly played LoL in high school more than SC2. 1v1 has... RTS Fighting Games what else? (seriously asking since I don't keep up with non-SC/non-DotA eSports. | ||
|
Dazed.
Canada3301 Posts
Many of these are 'good' problems to have, they are failures in light of what could have been, not abject failures in themselves. But clearly if sc2 was intended to be a highly competitive, balanced exciting esport, it swung high but largely missed its mark. And if the goal was to be mainstream it also failed to hit its mark. | ||
|
lestye
United States4163 Posts
On February 22 2017 03:50 Dazed_Spy wrote: Never said it didnt make money, I said it didnt dominate the PC gaming market. And who cares what a bunch of witless bribed critics say? I wasnt referring to them, but the population that actually played the game. It was panned. There were dozens and dozens and dozens of balance patches to the game and gradual additions to their inept battle.net. The game came out sloppy and it went down sloppy, even sc2 fans were continuously annoyed by the failures to balance, the failures in the design, and so on. SC2 was a failure in many lights; it didnt become a well respected sustainable esport down the line, it became niche and failed to even unite the blizzard RTS fan base, but at the same time it didnt broaden the appeal of RTS, it was 'merely' the most popular RTS. Many of these are 'good' problems to have, they are failures in light of what could have been, not abject failures in themselves. But clearly if sc2 was intended to be a highly competitive, balanced exciting esport, it swung high but largely missed its mark. And if the goal was to be mainstream it also failed to hit its mark. You said ""failed to financially dominate the market". It totally and utterly crushed the RTS market. You're making it seem like SC2 is in the same boat as CnC4/RA3 or something, an actual failure. And even if you look at user scores and critic scores, it wasn't panned,like I said I have no clue what you're even talking about there. I also have no clue what you're talking about when you say "dozens of balance patches". Should we call every game that has multiple balance patches failures? And looking at the state of Western BW and WC3 tournaments/playerbase post 2010, I'd argue it did its job at uniting the playerbase. RTS in itself is very niche, so I don't know how you can claim it became niche. And isn't the fact that it is the most popular RTS in itself mean it had broad appeal? We had a lot of people get involved with pro gaming and especially Team Liquid, only because of SC2. I'm not saying the game doesn't have its flaws and problems, it had and still has tons, but to dismiss it as a failure is incredibly disingenuous. | ||
|
MuNi
United States72 Posts
| ||
|
Demurity
United States424 Posts
| ||
|
FlaShFTW
United States10158 Posts
On February 21 2017 19:26 bartus88 wrote: SC2 is undeniably better balanced, the BW community had to do the balancing by making maps that counter-acted the imbalances. But that is not something most people here would like to hear, they can only focus on the negatives of SC2. The few pages of this thread are pretty sad to read. Both are amazing games, but this community is way too blinded by bitterness to have a decent discussion. There's a good reason I went from reading this subforum daily to reading it once every 3 months, around the time this thread was made. | ||
|
[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On February 22 2017 05:08 MuNi wrote: None of this matters. The better game will outlast the weaker game. Survival of the fittest. BW FOREVER. True. Darwinism always wins out in the end. Which is why SC2 is kinda starting to fade (even despite LotV being released only about a year ago), and BW is resurgent. SC2 caught a big wave upon launch thanks to the Starcraft name (which SC1/BW established), and because of Blizzard's huge and single-minded commitment to it (which included temporarily killing off the BW Pro scene, sadly and counterproductively). But in the end, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink. The best game designs and best games will endure, and the "Good try, but..." games will fade, no matter how heavily they're promoted. It's like movies... a big-budget, super-heavily-marketed summer blockbuster that is nonetheless not that great at its core will have the big opening weekend, but then fade away after that. It doesn't have 'legs', to use industry-speak. But BW has legs. In spades. | ||
|
duke91
Germany1458 Posts
On February 21 2017 19:26 bartus88 wrote: SC2 is undeniably better balanced, the BW community had to do the balancing by making maps that counter-acted the imbalances. But that is not something most people here would like to hear, they can only focus on the negatives of SC2. The few pages of this thread are pretty sad to read. Both are amazing games, but this community is way too blinded by bitterness to have a decent discussion. There's a good reason I went from reading this subforum daily to reading it once every 3 months, around the time this thread was made. Alternative balance facts | ||
|
ninazerg
United States7291 Posts
On February 21 2017 07:45 Hildegard wrote: In my opinion SC2 is better balanced than BW. Well, it's okay to be wrong. | ||
|
Jae Zedong
407 Posts
That is a catastrophical discrepance from a statistical point of view, I don't think most people even realize how lopsided that really is. | ||
|
[[Starlight]]
United States1578 Posts
On February 22 2017 18:15 Jae Zedong wrote: The last thread I read about balance in the SC2 section was about a matchup that now has a measured winrate of 29-71%, lol. Good balance there buddy. That is a catastrophic discrepancy from a statistical point of view, I don't think most people even realize how lopsided that really is. Basically that's like vanilla Starcraft prior to the 1.04 patch. It was that lopsided... Zerg win rates were about like that vs the other two races, according to ladder stats. But Bliz largely fixed that with 1.04, i.e. less than 8 months after SC came out. What's SC2's excuse? | ||
2Pacalypse-
Croatia9504 Posts
| ||
| ||
