On April 21 2012 01:53 RatInPink wrote: many of my friends and people here seems supriced that the best players in the world have an easy time whit sc2, its not like the games are that different
Well there was a lot of hype about Forgg. And he is now average. I am not saying all BW pros will be like that, but this is what we know so far.
What happens when good BW players move over?
You mean like HyuN? Here's what he has to say on it
Some StarCraft: Brood War players like MVP, MC, and Nestea have found success in StarCraft 2. Do you think other StarCraft: Brood War players will do as well?
I don’t think I can say for sure regarding this topic. The players who successfully switched over to StarCraft 2 worked that much harder to do well. If more players from StarCraft: Brood War continue to switch over, they will also need to work really hard in order to succeed as well. HyuN has been playing for 6 months now and has only began to break into Code A. Source: http://polarfluke.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=348
Yea sure Hyun shitting on the SC2 scene and his peers was definitely an option sure... Just want to point out that these interviews from progamers don't mean anything at all. Theres only one answer to give...
On April 21 2012 01:53 phosphorylation wrote: It's just tremendously sad and unnatural that sc2 will be forced onto viewers only because the sponsors want it, rather than because the players, coaches (most), or most importantly, viewers want it
It does not bode well for this initiative and esports in general.
(I am talking purely about the scene in Korea, just so I don't get misinformed comments).
Thing is... ultimately sponsors follow viewers. After all, that's the reason they're sponsoring in the first place - to reach viewers.
I think it's too early to think of this as "the death of BW". More like "sponsors are getting edgy and want to try something new, to compare it".
At the end of the day though, the viewers have the power to watch what they want to watch, and the sponsors must listen.
I think the sponsors are leapfrogging the viewer intent here, due to few factors. Newness of the alleged "sequel" of sc2. The match-fixing scandal. The unprecedented longevity of BW as esports.
Sponsors can't afford to leapfrog viewer's intent, the whole deal of sponsoring is reaching out to the highest number of viewers as possible. Don't fool yourself.
... They are in Korea, simply because in korea, current BW interest and viewrs >>> current SC2 interest and viewers. They think in the long term, SC2 holds more potential for drawing viewers. That may be correct or but it also may be bullshit. But that's why they are so eager on the switch.
Also, I don't think sponsors care about deficiencies in SC2 as much as fans do. We complain about unit design and interface design and all that jazz, but sponsors couldn't care less about that stuff. What they see is a sorta new game with an eye-openingly large international following and inconclusive speculation on whether or not a complete transition could succeed in Korea.
Just finished translating, I still need to format it so that it's readable... but I'm already 1 hr late on my lunchtime... so I'm going to heat my lunch, then send it one by one. Thanks for being patient, and hopefully the translation will make you a bigger eSports fan than you ever was!
For me, who was extremely skeptical and negative about the new format (I even made a jest blog to make fun of how ridiculous it would be), after translating it (which requires me to read it carefully over and over) I feel like I'm just a spoiled brat. eSports forever, I will support the teams as long as they exist!
On April 21 2012 01:53 phosphorylation wrote: It's just tremendously sad and unnatural that sc2 will be forced onto viewers only because the sponsors want it, rather than because the players, coaches (most), or most importantly, viewers want it
It does not bode well for this initiative and esports in general.
(I am talking purely about the scene in Korea, just so I don't get misinformed comments).
Thing is... ultimately sponsors follow viewers. After all, that's the reason they're sponsoring in the first place - to reach viewers.
I think it's too early to think of this as "the death of BW". More like "sponsors are getting edgy and want to try something new, to compare it".
At the end of the day though, the viewers have the power to watch what they want to watch, and the sponsors must listen.
I think the sponsors are leapfrogging the viewer intent here, due to few factors. Newness of the alleged "sequel" of sc2. The match-fixing scandal. The unprecedented longevity of BW as esports.
Sponsors can't afford to leapfrog viewer's intent, the whole deal of sponsoring is reaching out to the highest number of viewers as possible. Don't fool yourself.
... They are in Korea, simply because in korea, current BW interest and viewrs >>> current SC2 interest and viewers. They think in the long term, SC2 holds more potential for drawing viewers. That may be correct or but it also may be bullshit. But that's why they are so eager on the switch.
Also, I don't think sponsors care about deficiencies in SC2 as much as fans do. We complain about unit design and interface design and all that jazz, but sponsors couldn't care less about that stuff. What they see is a sorta new game with an eye-openingly large international following and inconclusive speculation on whether or not a complete transition could succeed in Korea.
True. I also neglected to point out the demise of MBCGame as another contributing factor.
Even though the S-class players are waayyy better than everyone else, who is currently playing Sc2, they still will need some time to adjust to the game. Their understanding of the game, their mechanics and their pure awesomeness will speed up this process a lot, but I think that it will take at least half a year until they could really compete.
Maybe the superstars like Flash and Jaedong will prove me wrong, but I'm also kinda concerned about their motivation to switch. I mean, they've won everything in BW and are a level above almost everybody else there...if they don't do it for the money, I think they won't do the full switch.
On April 21 2012 02:20 OpticalShot wrote: Okay, I've had a lot of PM's whew!
Just finished translating, I still need to format it so that it's readable... but I'm already 1 hr late on my lunchtime... so I'm going to heat my lunch, then send it one by one. Thanks for being patient, and hopefully the translation will make you a bigger eSports fan than you ever was!
For me, who was extremely skeptical and negative about the new format (I even made a jest blog to make fun of how ridiculous it would be), after translating it (which requires me to read it carefully over and over) I feel like I'm just a spoiled brat. eSports forever, I will support the teams as long as they exist!
Oh I can't sleep like this I will be waiting for you while you eat your lunch ...
Glad that they are switching. But won't jump on the BW players will dominate day 1 etc etc bandwagon. Seen stuff like this in many sports. Often with underwhelming results. So I reserve judgement for now. But I am damned exited to watch what happens.
On April 21 2012 02:22 Snerren wrote: Glad that they are switching. But won't jump on the BW players will dominate day 1 etc etc bandwagon. Seen stuff like this in many sports. Often with underwhelming results. So I reserve judgement for now. But I am damned exited to watch what happens.
CS 1.6 players(Team 3d,Complexity) were dominating Cs Source players in CGS I wouldn't be so sure that the skills won't be transferred to a similar game after all sc2 is also a RTS game .
On April 21 2012 02:22 Snerren wrote: Glad that they are switching. But won't jump on the BW players will dominate day 1 etc etc bandwagon. Seen stuff like this in many sports. Often with underwhelming results. So I reserve judgement for now. But I am damned exited to watch what happens.
Agreed. Now, if only some player will discover a way to make SC2 remotely interesting to watch (other than taking a shot everytime 2 massive armies collide in the middle of the map ofc).
On April 21 2012 02:20 OpticalShot wrote: Okay, I've had a lot of PM's whew!
Just finished translating, I still need to format it so that it's readable... but I'm already 1 hr late on my lunchtime... so I'm going to heat my lunch, then send it one by one. Thanks for being patient, and hopefully the translation will make you a bigger eSports fan than you ever was!
For me, who was extremely skeptical and negative about the new format (I even made a jest blog to make fun of how ridiculous it would be), after translating it (which requires me to read it carefully over and over) I feel like I'm just a spoiled brat. eSports forever, I will support the teams as long as they exist!
This will be my last OSL... I will enjoy every single zergling death, goon dance, scarab dud, mine drag, and beautiful storms... great honor to go with High Templar icon. BW forever <3
Just a quick note about SKT vs T8 in SC2 happening, I think there was a slight mistranslation.. It was a SC1 battle that T8 beat SKT in 4:2.
주훈 - ...이건 여담인데 프로리그 결승전 때 저희가 SK텔레콤의 스파링 파트너를 해줬거든요. 사실 우리 팀은 포스트시즌에서 일찍 탈락해서 그때도 스타2만 연습하고 있었어요. 스타2만 하던 선수들이 갑자기 스타1을 다시 하려니까 처음에는 ‘화면에 랙이 걸린 것 같다’부터 시작해서 웅성웅성 대더라고요. 단축키를 헷갈려 하는 선수들도 많았고. 그런데 또 그 날 오후가 되니까 그런 말들이 쏙 들어가요. 실제로 연습 경기도 잘 했고 오히려 우리 선수들이 SK텔레콤 선수들을 4:2로 이겼죠(웃음). 또 스타2가 굉장히 빠르다 보니까 스타1 컨트롤이 더 좋아지는 선수들도 있더라고요. 처음에는 불평불만이 생기겠지만 계속 하다 보면 잘 적응할 것 같기도 해요.
= Coach Ju: This is just a side note, but T8 was SKT's sparring partner for the PL finals. Honestly, after having been knocked out of playoffs, we had been practicing only SC2. When our players had to go back to playing SC1 all the sudden [for SKT to practice], people were saying stuff like 'I feel like the screen is lagging.' Lots of them were confusing hotkeys, also. However, by afternoon, the complaints subsided completely. Our players actually performed well in the practice games and even beat SKT 4:2 (laughs). Also, due to SC2's fast-paced gameplay, some players actually improved their SC1 mechanics. There will be complaints initially, but I feel that, with time, the players will adapt quite well.
Also, STX has a grandmaster on their team, apparently. SKT only practiced SC2 for two weeks last season, and coach Park prohibited players from playing SC2 after that.
Thanks for the translations though! Interesting news... sad news... ;_;
On April 21 2012 01:50 N.geNuity wrote: I don't really see how a switch to sc2 gives players who weren't getting a chance to play any more opportunities, proleague speaking. They can do online tourneys/foreign tourneys I guess, but then they should just join an already existing sc2 team.
Bo5 mixed sets or Bo5 sc2 is still Bo5. And considering the whole Bo7 wasn't implemented because of scheduling/whatever sc2 isn't going to help that.
I'd be so fucking mad if next proleague is Bo7 mixed sets, because they could have just made normal proleague Bo7.
ByuL who was on Samsung KHAN joined Fnatic, Also Anyppi (or what was his name)joined IM.
oh I didn't know anyppi joined IM. thanks for the info. Looks like he just played his first games or whatever too.
2) some coaches agree that SC2 seemed boring in comparison to BW.So when they have to force the players to play this game later on, they feel like players wouldn't be doing it for fun anymore = it actually will be forcing it.
WHAT THE FUCK I won't be as bitter if BW dies out due to lost in viewer interest - at least it's a natural death. Hopefully the korean viewers do their part to convince the sponsors......
On April 21 2012 01:04 Jakkerr wrote: A BW to SC2 switch sounds awesome to me. Then we will have 1 very strong RTS game instead of 2 games cannabalizing eachother.
What you're really saying is:
"BW getting devoured SC2 sounds awesome to me. Then we'll have 1 strong RTS game instead of 2 games cannibalizing each other"
On April 21 2012 01:58 Ssin wrote: What will be really funny is if the same thing happens where Koreans completely shutout all foreigners in sc2 and the foreign scene dies again. Then we can move back to BW.
What is really funny is that has already happened ;p
There is what, 2 foreigners that are even considered close to average Korean Progamer skill? Stephano and Naniwa, can't think of anyone else off the top of my head. Foreign scene representation in any competition that Korean teams choose to participate in is underwhelming. Ever since the Korean teams decided to acknowledge foreign tournaments it's been a complete slaughter. Code B Koreans are better and far more consistent than the best foreigners. It's only logical to assume that BW pros will be able to widen the gap at least slightly more.
Go read the featured article about foreigners at IPL4.
Ok. I read it. It's just a bunch of excuses for the foreigners. And look at my post history if you want. I knew about Illusion, I've known and said he's an exceptional foreigner for a while. And otherwise, IPL was only one tournament. Foreigners are getting dominated at every other tournament on top of IPL. By the nature of SC2 there will be SOME upsets, yet still 15/16 top spots go to Koreans. That is insane domination.
On April 21 2012 02:38 Potling wrote: "We should use SC2 as a way of expanding our way of ESPORTS to the foreigners" So racist. They think foreigners are only capable of a shallower game.
:p
Haven't you read the depth of their anti-BW / pro SC2 arguments? >_>
I've got a serious questions, Why don't kespa use the SC2:BW and that way BW does not die and they get the benfits of the improved graphics and ops controls
EPT
HyuN?
...
