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On April 11 2012 19:14 ImbaTosS wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 16:57 Atoissen wrote:On April 11 2012 16:32 Sawamura wrote:On April 11 2012 16:15 USvBleakill wrote:On April 11 2012 15:57 Sawamura wrote:On April 11 2012 15:53 USvBleakill wrote:
This have nothing to do with "BW is so much better, SC2 is so mainstream, the elephant in the room, LoL is way better than starcraft, DotA is better than Jesus blablabla..."
It all comes down to money, nothing else.
If RedBull wakes up next morning and say "well formula one sucks we give TeamLiquid 50 billions a year to build a SC2 team", then we will see LiquidBisu, LiquidFlash and LiquidJaedong within a week.
It´s that easy. The problem is RedBull will use that 50 billion to spent on other thing that will help the business in a long run than sponsor a sc2 team with that money . Sorry but if you think sc2 is really that huge globally you got to be delusional . It isn't even at a bw spectator level where old grandma and uncle bring their grandchildren to watch their games . If sc2 reaches that kind of spectator level than it's possible that a 10million contract will be probable but not 50 billion ... well.. äh.. well maybe you have missed the point of my post a little bit^^ ESport 2012 is not indie, it´s not nerd, it´s not crazy kids in dark rooms with no girlfriend. It´s a business. And in a business the guy with the most money will call what happens next. What i wanted to say is that if someone come with more money then the others, we will see Flash as the next Angry Birds bonjwa. 98% of this thread is going in the BW < = > SC2 direction what is totally irrelevant because $ > everything. Who says esport 2012 is indie ? Bw and Cs was the original esport before all this imposter who comes up saying "for esports" and so . I don't remember people using the word for esport this and that we just play the game enjoy it . If money is everything than probably it's good to leave esport once and for all back than bw professionals have to live on instant noodles and just passion so they can live their dream as a pro gamer . I dislike the idea that every new games that comes out with flashy graphics over throws oldies that has stand the test of time and if everyone is going to follow the trend of "okay new game comes out , ditch old game and follow the hype " than you can kiss e-sport goodbye because it's nothing but a money milking machine. No passion and no love for the game all are just there to milk the damn scene. Now days living condition have improve for pro gamers they don't need to suffer under terrible conditions besides playing the game 14 hours in korea .Let's just say that the zealot for the protoss is right with him saying "my life for bw " always. I really doubt that alott of people want BW dead, and noone will ever take the game away from you. You can play it for the rest of your lives! The thing I think he means by $ -> everything is that BW doesnt generate enough money to withhold its position as a major competitive "sports"... A sport that gives salaries to its players, and hires coaches, cooks etc. And without salaries, coaches etc. you want have the same professionalism. Because of the high interest in SC2 around the world (Not so much in korea ofc.) it has started to make alott of money, money that even the best BW players at a time will want to have a piece of(that is ofc if they want to switch too SC2). Its not that many people that says SC2 is a better game then BW, its mostly that its more user friendly for new watchers/players. Man, I cant even install BW on my new computer because its 2 old... So, with most of us knowing about these facts, and knowing that KeSPA is transitioning, we just hope that both the best players and the majority of the crowd follows, because we want this to grow... Its not about disrespecting BW and its fans. Sorry for my english, its not the best, but I hope you can understand my points QQ I still don't see the monetary incentive for a switch. It's no secret that 99% of SC2 pros make absolute peanuts. I mean, 20-30,000 $ IN TOTAL so far. Which pretty much equates to lower than minimum wage (in this country at least). A few have made some good money, but still it's important to note that they haven't made particularly great money. For example, 250,000 for some of the most valuable days of your life, is really not enough to set you up in the long run. The whole switching for money thing? I REALLY don't buy it. Prize winnings as a primary source of income is a terrible risk when the very absolute best you can expect to earn for a very limited time, is equal to just 2 years of a high middle-class salary (again, in Britain at least).
Much of the monetary incentive to switch is from the sponsor side. For a sponsor promoting a technical product (Intel, Kingston), it helps if there is some incentive to upgrade your computer with their product. SC2 can be that incentive. BW cannot. This is why there is always sponsor pressure to promote a newer product that pushes technical requirements up.
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United Kingdom1711 Posts
On April 11 2012 22:21 Muffinman53 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 21:47 Dental Floss wrote:On April 11 2012 21:12 cuppatea wrote:On April 11 2012 19:14 ImbaTosS wrote:On April 11 2012 16:57 Atoissen wrote:On April 11 2012 16:32 Sawamura wrote:On April 11 2012 16:15 USvBleakill wrote:On April 11 2012 15:57 Sawamura wrote:On April 11 2012 15:53 USvBleakill wrote:
This have nothing to do with "BW is so much better, SC2 is so mainstream, the elephant in the room, LoL is way better than starcraft, DotA is better than Jesus blablabla..."
It all comes down to money, nothing else.
If RedBull wakes up next morning and say "well formula one sucks we give TeamLiquid 50 billions a year to build a SC2 team", then we will see LiquidBisu, LiquidFlash and LiquidJaedong within a week.
It´s that easy. The problem is RedBull will use that 50 billion to spent on other thing that will help the business in a long run than sponsor a sc2 team with that money . Sorry but if you think sc2 is really that huge globally you got to be delusional . It isn't even at a bw spectator level where old grandma and uncle bring their grandchildren to watch their games . If sc2 reaches that kind of spectator level than it's possible that a 10million contract will be probable but not 50 billion ... well.. äh.. well maybe you have missed the point of my post a little bit^^ ESport 2012 is not indie, it´s not nerd, it´s not crazy kids in dark rooms with no girlfriend. It´s a business. And in a business the guy with the most money will call what happens next. What i wanted to say is that if someone come with more money then the others, we will see Flash as the next Angry Birds bonjwa. 98% of this thread is going in the BW < = > SC2 direction what is totally irrelevant because $ > everything. Who says esport 2012 is indie ? Bw and Cs was the original esport before all this imposter who comes up saying "for esports" and so . I don't remember people using the word for esport this and that we just play the game enjoy it . If money is everything than probably it's good to leave esport once and for all back than bw professionals have to live on instant noodles and just passion so they can live their dream as a pro gamer . I dislike the idea that every new games that comes out with flashy graphics over throws oldies that has stand the test of time and if everyone is going to follow the trend of "okay new game comes out , ditch old game and follow the hype " than you can kiss e-sport goodbye because it's nothing but a money milking machine. No passion and no love for the game all are just there to milk the damn scene. Now days living condition have improve for pro gamers they don't need to suffer under terrible conditions besides playing the game 14 hours in korea .Let's just say that the zealot for the protoss is right with him saying "my life for bw " always. I really doubt that alott of people want BW dead, and noone will ever take the game away from you. You can play it for the rest of your lives! The thing I think he means by $ -> everything is that BW doesnt generate enough money to withhold its position as a major competitive "sports"... A sport that gives salaries to its players, and hires coaches, cooks etc. And without salaries, coaches etc. you want have the same professionalism. Because of the high interest in SC2 around the world (Not so much in korea ofc.) it has started to make alott of money, money that even the best BW players at a time will want to have a piece of(that is ofc if they want to switch too SC2). Its not that many people that says SC2 is a better game then BW, its mostly that its more user friendly for new watchers/players. Man, I cant even install BW on my new computer because its 2 old... So, with most of us knowing about these facts, and knowing that KeSPA is transitioning, we just hope that both the best players and the majority of the crowd follows, because we want this to grow... Its not about disrespecting BW and its fans. Sorry for my english, its not the best, but I hope you can understand my points QQ I still don't see the monetary incentive for a switch. It's no secret that 99% of SC2 pros make absolute peanuts. I mean, 20-30,000 $ IN TOTAL so far. Which pretty much equates to lower than minimum wage (in this country at least). A few have made some good money, but still it's important to note that they haven't made particularly great money. For example, 250,000 for some of the most valuable days of your life, is really not enough to set you up in the long run. The whole switching for money thing? I REALLY don't buy it. Prize winnings as a primary source of income is a terrible risk when the very absolute best you can expect to earn for a very limited time, is equal to just 2 years of a high middle-class salary (again, in Britain at least). $250k of discretionary income for a teenager with no living costs is huge. It would take the average person a long, long time to generate that sort of disposable cash. Add a salary on top of that and the perks of being flown all over the world and having a global fan base and, for the elite few at least, it's a pretty good lifestyle. Except you do it at the expense of everything else. If you want to go to college like QXC Then you basically give up being the best or making that kind of money. 250,000 sounds like a lot of money, but if you go to college and get a technical degree you can expect to make 50k to 60k every year...forever. $250,000 is a lot when you have virtually $0 living expenses. Their housing, food, transportation, etc. is all paid for. Yeah, you can go to college and make $50,000 a year, but most people graduate with a butt load of debt to pay off, and have $30,000+ a year in living expenses. Big difference between total income and disposable income.
It would be nice if people wouldn't talk to me as if I didn't understand what various amounts of money means to a young person. I really do, for a number of reasons. But the fact is, it is not enough reimbursment for what they have to give up. Not to mention that there are maybe... 2 or 3 players who have made over 100k so far. All of whom are Koreans. Not so good...
Point of this is, you can do something for passion/love of the game etc which I absolutely respect, but I think this is going to be the source of a lot of biiig regrets for people down the line, who realise how little it meant in the long term, and how badly it affects their lives going forward. It also makes me wonder how anyone gets into the game professionally without being terrified about their future.
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On April 12 2012 01:11 ImbaTosS wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 22:21 Muffinman53 wrote:On April 11 2012 21:47 Dental Floss wrote:On April 11 2012 21:12 cuppatea wrote:On April 11 2012 19:14 ImbaTosS wrote:On April 11 2012 16:57 Atoissen wrote:On April 11 2012 16:32 Sawamura wrote:On April 11 2012 16:15 USvBleakill wrote:On April 11 2012 15:57 Sawamura wrote:On April 11 2012 15:53 USvBleakill wrote:
This have nothing to do with "BW is so much better, SC2 is so mainstream, the elephant in the room, LoL is way better than starcraft, DotA is better than Jesus blablabla..."
It all comes down to money, nothing else.
If RedBull wakes up next morning and say "well formula one sucks we give TeamLiquid 50 billions a year to build a SC2 team", then we will see LiquidBisu, LiquidFlash and LiquidJaedong within a week.
It´s that easy. The problem is RedBull will use that 50 billion to spent on other thing that will help the business in a long run than sponsor a sc2 team with that money . Sorry but if you think sc2 is really that huge globally you got to be delusional . It isn't even at a bw spectator level where old grandma and uncle bring their grandchildren to watch their games . If sc2 reaches that kind of spectator level than it's possible that a 10million contract will be probable but not 50 billion ... well.. äh.. well maybe you have missed the point of my post a little bit^^ ESport 2012 is not indie, it´s not nerd, it´s not crazy kids in dark rooms with no girlfriend. It´s a business. And in a business the guy with the most money will call what happens next. What i wanted to say is that if someone come with more money then the others, we will see Flash as the next Angry Birds bonjwa. 98% of this thread is going in the BW < = > SC2 direction what is totally irrelevant because $ > everything. Who says esport 2012 is indie ? Bw and Cs was the original esport before all this imposter who comes up saying "for esports" and so . I don't remember people using the word for esport this and that we just play the game enjoy it . If money is everything than probably it's good to leave esport once and for all back than bw professionals have to live on instant noodles and just passion so they can live their dream as a pro gamer . I dislike the idea that every new games that comes out with flashy graphics over throws oldies that has stand the test of time and if everyone is going to follow the trend of "okay new game comes out , ditch old game and follow the hype " than you can kiss e-sport goodbye because it's nothing but a money milking machine. No passion and no love for the game all are just there to milk the damn scene. Now days living condition have improve for pro gamers they don't need to suffer under terrible conditions besides playing the game 14 hours in korea .Let's just say that the zealot for the protoss is right with him saying "my life for bw " always. I really doubt that alott of people want BW dead, and noone will ever take the game away from you. You can play it for the rest of your lives! The thing I think he means by $ -> everything is that BW doesnt generate enough money to withhold its position as a major competitive "sports"... A sport that gives salaries to its players, and hires coaches, cooks etc. And without salaries, coaches etc. you want have the same professionalism. Because of the high interest in SC2 around the world (Not so much in korea ofc.) it has started to make alott of money, money that even the best BW players at a time will want to have a piece of(that is ofc if they want to switch too SC2). Its not that many people that says SC2 is a better game then BW, its mostly that its more user friendly for new watchers/players. Man, I cant even install BW on my new computer because its 2 old... So, with most of us knowing about these facts, and knowing that KeSPA is transitioning, we just hope that both the best players and the majority of the crowd follows, because we want this to grow... Its not about disrespecting BW and its fans. Sorry for my english, its not the best, but I hope you can understand my points QQ I still don't see the monetary incentive for a switch. It's no secret that 99% of SC2 pros make absolute peanuts. I mean, 20-30,000 $ IN TOTAL so far. Which pretty much equates to lower than minimum wage (in this country at least). A few have made some good money, but still it's important to note that they haven't made particularly great money. For example, 250,000 for some of the most valuable days of your life, is really not enough to set you up in the long run. The whole switching for money thing? I REALLY don't buy it. Prize winnings as a primary source of income is a terrible risk when the very absolute best you can expect to earn for a very limited time, is equal to just 2 years of a high middle-class salary (again, in Britain at least). $250k of discretionary income for a teenager with no living costs is huge. It would take the average person a long, long time to generate that sort of disposable cash. Add a salary on top of that and the perks of being flown all over the world and having a global fan base and, for the elite few at least, it's a pretty good lifestyle. Except you do it at the expense of everything else. If you want to go to college like QXC Then you basically give up being the best or making that kind of money. 250,000 sounds like a lot of money, but if you go to college and get a technical degree you can expect to make 50k to 60k every year...forever. $250,000 is a lot when you have virtually $0 living expenses. Their housing, food, transportation, etc. is all paid for. Yeah, you can go to college and make $50,000 a year, but most people graduate with a butt load of debt to pay off, and have $30,000+ a year in living expenses. Big difference between total income and disposable income. It would be nice if people wouldn't talk to me as if I didn't understand what various amounts of money means to a young person. I really do, for a number of reasons. But the fact is, it is not enough reimbursment for what they have to give up. Not to mention that there are maybe... 2 or 3 players who have made over 100k so far. All of whom are Koreans. Not so good...
10 people, 1 of them stephano (though i'm not sure how much taxes affect this). => http://sc2earnings.com/
But i agree, compared to BW top earnings, SC2 is not interesting for players. However, for sponsors, international tournaments will always be more interesting than local tournaments.
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How long until we know if this is official?
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Things are:
1. BW is the shit (by that mean BW is awesome)
2. BW is more popular in korea
3. SC2 is more popular worldwide.
So, if somehow KeSPA could show to sc2 fans some BW games - they can gain lots of international audience (for BW, 'cos it is awesome, yes even more awesome than sc2).
I think that what they bring to do, but they should be very careful not fuck up things.
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This is like mixing up a match of CS1.6 and CS:S.
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On April 12 2012 02:18 Black[CAT] wrote:
This is like mixing up a match of CS1.6 and CS:S.
I'd say the differences in CS1.6 (Which is the best there ever was) and CS:S are much more subtle than those between BW and SC2. Maybe a mixing matches of CS1.6 and SF? or Kart Rider and Mario Kart? Or maybe even LoL and Dota and Dota 2.
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On April 12 2012 02:34 rslee wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 02:18 Black[CAT] wrote:
This is like mixing up a match of CS1.6 and CS:S.
I'd say the differences in CS1.6 (Which is the best there ever was) and CS:S are much more subtle than those between BW and SC2. Maybe a mixing matches of CS1.6 and SF? or Kart Rider and Mario Kart? Or maybe even LoL and Dota and Dota 2.
Yea thats a better analogy
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United Kingdom1711 Posts
On April 12 2012 02:01 Russet wrote:
How long until we know if this is official?
Nobody knows. KeSpa are terrible at actually giving people any information whatsoever.
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Best option:
Keep SC2 out of PL.
bring back battle.net attack but for SC2 so we can see BW pros rape and laugh at SC2 players
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On April 12 2012 03:44 only.her0 wrote:
Best option:
Keep SC2 out of PL.
bring back battle.net attack but for SC2 so we can see BW pros rape and laugh at SC2 players
I like your attitude..not
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On April 11 2012 22:56 Muffinman53 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 22:47 architecture wrote:
People throwing around the 250k earnings, you do realize there is such a thing as taxes? You lose 40-50% immediately. No, I'm completely unaware of taxes. But still, taxes don't change the story. So you're making $125k and the person coming out of college is making 25-30k a year. The proportions are still the same.
I don't know where this argument started, but I'm curious what it is about. Can you give a quick summary? What's the point you're trying to prove? It's definitely a lot of money, but I'm not sure what the original argument was. Hopefully not that people should drop out of college because top 20 progamers make a lot of money (although at 20th, 50k of unstable income isn't even comparable to the career a good education can get you. I would presume most progamers aren't in the running for a great education tho, rather the top incomes would be a strange means to pay for a good education after the scene dies down/they stop winning).
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I came to SC right before SC2 release, so I don't have as much experience watching BW as most people here, though I watched every OSL/MSL final I could find on nevake. I have to say that I hope we'll see Jaedong and Flash (and with them, everyone else I guess) in SC2 soon, so we could finally put a rest to the speculations of "what would happen if they switched??". I think I can understand why it would be sad to see BW "die" like this, but it doesn't seem to me that they have much choice financially. A lot of people are gonna be upset no matter how this turns out, I just hope to see some great matches in both games the next two months (last (?) OSL and what not).
P.S. : I secretly hope that if/when Jaedong switches, he destroys the hopes and dreams of everyone he plays.
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On April 12 2012 02:09 elagrion wrote:
Things are:
1. BW is the shit (by that mean BW is awesome)
2. BW is more popular in korea
3. SC2 is more popular worldwide.
So, if somehow KeSPA could show to sc2 fans some BW games - they can gain lots of international audience (for BW, 'cos it is awesome, yes even more awesome than sc2).
I think that what they bring to do, but they should be very careful not fuck up things.
Agreed. If they were planning to dump BW entirely, they'd do it right now, and none of this half-and-half stuff. If they wanted to have an SC2 scene, they'd make it separate. The only reason to mix is to get fans of one game to watch the other. Since they're talking about getting in the international scene...it's not like they're trying to get the foreign BW scene to switch to SC2.
So, if they're trying to get people to watch another game, the options are
1. Get Korean BW fans into SC2.
2. Get foreign SC2 fans into BW.
There isn't actually an incentive for the former. Korean BW fans are already watching PL. It's not like they're going to watch it harder. There's no tangible benefit to KeSPA to have them watching SC2, and there's a loss of pride if BW tanks, because BW is historically special.
They are absolutely trying to get foreign SC2 fans to watch BW, and to pay for the privilege because the SC2 scene is much more willing to support the game than the BW scene is. I can't think of any other logical reason they'd intermingle.
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On April 12 2012 11:45 Ribbon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 02:09 elagrion wrote:
Things are:
1. BW is the shit (by that mean BW is awesome)
2. BW is more popular in korea
3. SC2 is more popular worldwide.
So, if somehow KeSPA could show to sc2 fans some BW games - they can gain lots of international audience (for BW, 'cos it is awesome, yes even more awesome than sc2).
I think that what they bring to do, but they should be very careful not fuck up things. Agreed. If they were planning to dump BW entirely, they'd do it right now, and none of this half-and-half stuff. If they wanted to have an SC2 scene, they'd make it separate. The only reason to mix is to get fans of one game to watch the other. Since they're talking about getting in the international scene...it's not like they're trying to get the foreign BW scene to switch to SC2. So, if they're trying to get people to watch another game, the options are 1. Get Korean BW fans into SC2. 2. Get foreign SC2 fans into BW. There isn't actually an incentive for the former. Korean BW fans are already watching PL. It's not like they're going to watch it harder. There's no tangible benefit to KeSPA to have them watching SC2, and there's a loss of pride if BW tanks, because BW is historically special. They are absolutely trying to get foreign SC2 fans to watch BW, and to pay for the privilege because the SC2 scene is much more willing to support the game than the BW scene is. I can't think of any other logical reason they'd intermingle.
That might be true, but I still think they most likely just want to jump into SC2 scene to get the foreign fans to watch the SC2 Proleague. Getting them to watch the BW is more of a bonus than a true purpose.
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On April 12 2012 12:17 Veldril wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 11:45 Ribbon wrote:On April 12 2012 02:09 elagrion wrote:
Things are:
1. BW is the shit (by that mean BW is awesome)
2. BW is more popular in korea
3. SC2 is more popular worldwide.
So, if somehow KeSPA could show to sc2 fans some BW games - they can gain lots of international audience (for BW, 'cos it is awesome, yes even more awesome than sc2).
I think that what they bring to do, but they should be very careful not fuck up things. Agreed. If they were planning to dump BW entirely, they'd do it right now, and none of this half-and-half stuff. If they wanted to have an SC2 scene, they'd make it separate. The only reason to mix is to get fans of one game to watch the other. Since they're talking about getting in the international scene...it's not like they're trying to get the foreign BW scene to switch to SC2. So, if they're trying to get people to watch another game, the options are 1. Get Korean BW fans into SC2. 2. Get foreign SC2 fans into BW. There isn't actually an incentive for the former. Korean BW fans are already watching PL. It's not like they're going to watch it harder. There's no tangible benefit to KeSPA to have them watching SC2, and there's a loss of pride if BW tanks, because BW is historically special. They are absolutely trying to get foreign SC2 fans to watch BW, and to pay for the privilege because the SC2 scene is much more willing to support the game than the BW scene is. I can't think of any other logical reason they'd intermingle. That might be true, but I still think they most likely just want to jump into SC2 scene to get the foreign fans to watch the SC2 Proleague. Getting them to watch the BW is more of a bonus than a true purpose.
Well, yeah, I'm sure they're not betting the farm on the foreign SC2 scene saving BW, but if they just wanted to cash in on SC2, they'd just do SC2. So, even if they're not optimistic it'll work, I'm sure they'll at least make the effort, and get some English-language casters who'd be good in both SC2 and BW....though I don't know any SC2 casters with tons of BW experience except Day[9] (doing his own thing), Incontrol (wants to play, not cast), and Tastosis (working for KeSPA's rival). CatsPajamas, Totalbiscuit, and Doa all I know have no BW background. Maybe poach Moletrap or get Klazart/Cholera out of retirement? I don't think there are any primarily BW casters who follow SC2 at a high level.
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1019 Posts
They are trying to put in SC2 mainly because it would be easier to attract sponsors; it's difficult to go ask a company representative for money for a 12 year old game. I don't think they are solely trying to calculate how many foreign fans they can attract if SC2 appears in proleague. Everything is happening in korea - they are going to cater to korean audiences first. And how are they going to get foreigners to watch? I don't think OGN broadcasts to foreign countries. Are they going to set up streams or something? Make this like gomTV lol?
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On April 12 2012 13:37 white_horse wrote:
They are trying to put in SC2 mainly because it would be easier to attract sponsors; it's difficult to go ask a company representative for money for a 12 year old game. I don't think they are solely trying to calculate how many foreign fans they can attract if SC2 appears in proleague. Everything is happening in korea - they are going to cater to korean audiences first. And how are they going to get foreigners to watch? I don't think OGN broadcasts to foreign countries. Are they going to set up streams or something? Make this like gomTV lol?
They host a live stream for LoL with English casters on own3D.
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On April 12 2012 14:13 HeroHenry wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 13:37 white_horse wrote:
They are trying to put in SC2 mainly because it would be easier to attract sponsors; it's difficult to go ask a company representative for money for a 12 year old game. I don't think they are solely trying to calculate how many foreign fans they can attract if SC2 appears in proleague. Everything is happening in korea - they are going to cater to korean audiences first. And how are they going to get foreigners to watch? I don't think OGN broadcasts to foreign countries. Are they going to set up streams or something? Make this like gomTV lol?
They host a live stream for LoL with English casters on own3D.
And on Twitch.tv too... So I think they can invite some Enlgish caster for foreign viewers.
BW is awesome - useless to argue, but time is goings and how was said here, to OGN is hard to find sponsors.
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On April 12 2012 13:23 Ribbon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 12:17 Veldril wrote:On April 12 2012 11:45 Ribbon wrote:On April 12 2012 02:09 elagrion wrote:
Things are:
1. BW is the shit (by that mean BW is awesome)
2. BW is more popular in korea
3. SC2 is more popular worldwide.
So, if somehow KeSPA could show to sc2 fans some BW games - they can gain lots of international audience (for BW, 'cos it is awesome, yes even more awesome than sc2).
I think that what they bring to do, but they should be very careful not fuck up things. Agreed. If they were planning to dump BW entirely, they'd do it right now, and none of this half-and-half stuff. If they wanted to have an SC2 scene, they'd make it separate. The only reason to mix is to get fans of one game to watch the other. Since they're talking about getting in the international scene...it's not like they're trying to get the foreign BW scene to switch to SC2. So, if they're trying to get people to watch another game, the options are 1. Get Korean BW fans into SC2. 2. Get foreign SC2 fans into BW. There isn't actually an incentive for the former. Korean BW fans are already watching PL. It's not like they're going to watch it harder. There's no tangible benefit to KeSPA to have them watching SC2, and there's a loss of pride if BW tanks, because BW is historically special. They are absolutely trying to get foreign SC2 fans to watch BW, and to pay for the privilege because the SC2 scene is much more willing to support the game than the BW scene is. I can't think of any other logical reason they'd intermingle. That might be true, but I still think they most likely just want to jump into SC2 scene to get the foreign fans to watch the SC2 Proleague. Getting them to watch the BW is more of a bonus than a true purpose. Well, yeah, I'm sure they're not betting the farm on the foreign SC2 scene saving BW, but if they just wanted to cash in on SC2, they'd just do SC2. So, even if they're not optimistic it'll work, I'm sure they'll at least make the effort, and get some English-language casters who'd be good in both SC2 and BW....though I don't know any SC2 casters with tons of BW experience except Day[9] (doing his own thing), Incontrol (wants to play, not cast), and Tastosis (working for KeSPA's rival). CatsPajamas, Totalbiscuit, and Doa all I know have no BW background. Maybe poach Moletrap or get Klazart/Cholera out of retirement? I don't think there are any primarily BW casters who follow SC2 at a high level.
Right now it's all just a speculation, though. So it depends on whether they are going to really do to the double game format or not and how long they are going to do it. But one thing that is quite certain is that if they incorporate SC2, whether it is making a new league or making it as a double game format, they can monetize the foreign fans. And by doing it as a double game format, they might even have an excuse to monetize the BW part of the league too.
On April 12 2012 13:37 white_horse wrote:
They are trying to put in SC2 mainly because it would be easier to attract sponsors; it's difficult to go ask a company representative for money for a 12 year old game. I don't think they are solely trying to calculate how many foreign fans they can attract if SC2 appears in proleague. Everything is happening in korea - they are going to cater to korean audiences first. And how are they going to get foreigners to watch? I don't think OGN broadcasts to foreign countries. Are they going to set up streams or something? Make this like gomTV lol?
If their goal is to expand to foreign market, then yeah they need to set up broadcasting streams. Sure, GomTV is not successful in Korea but in foreign market, they still cannot be regarded as failure too. I would say they succeed to a certain extent in the foreign market with their marketing campaign. If they can make 10k foreign viewers pay 20$ for HQ streams and vods each Proleague season, that's 200k $ they can make and make them less reliance on the sponsors. And they can do that while still cater to Korean audiences.
About sponsoring, that is partly true but I think they would aim to get more sponsors through LoL more than SC2, since LoL has much larger player base. SC2 could also attract sponsors too but might not be as much as LoL. Still, I kinda doubt that LoL viewers are less incline to pay for streams or vods. I might be wrong but looking at how the game is, it still make me question about this.
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EPT
