EPTIf starcraft 2 only changed the interface.... - Page 3
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ihatett
United States2289 Posts
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NettleS
522 Posts
On May 20 2005 17:40 Tal wrote: What this is about, is the interface. As a fairly average kinda playing games type person, I have to say that SC's interface is a piece of shit. You play a game and have to deal with a truly ridiculous amount of pointless crap to enjoy it. Some things which should be changed: 1: When you build a worker unit, it should fucking go and mine. Once your gas geyser is done, the optimum amount of workers should mosey on down and get your gas straightaway. You shouldn't have to do it yourself, because it's intensely boring. If you don't want this stuff to happen automatically, then there should be an option for it, but your average gamer DOES NOT want to spend a good portion of every game telling their probes to go and mine. 2: (this is more radical): You should be able to tell a building to 'pump' units/peons/upgrades, and specify which order of priority your cash is allocated (e.g pump zealots and probes, but make sure money goes to zeals instead of probes first). I think this also would mean less time doing boring stuff. If you are a progamer then you can not use this feature, and by building each thing at the exact right time for your personal strategy, probably get some kind of advantage over someone who doesn't, though maybe not if in an epic micro battle. 3: You should be able to do a similar thing to ensure supply generating shit is made at the optimal times. So you mark out a series of spaces for depots and pylons, and they are built in the order you marked them to coincide with them finishing a bit before you hit supply limit. 4: You should be able to select all your units at the same time. The first thing I noticed when playing was that I could only pick 12 units. This is unneccessary in the extreme. Smart players will naturually split their units into groups to let them micro better and flank well etc. But when I build 100 lings, it would be nice to send them in one instant wave without having to give myself rsi to do so. 5: When all your units are selected, you should be able to use all their individual hotkeys. I can't think of a reason not to. Oh and you should be able to customise your hotkeys. 6: The map should be already revealed but in fog of war, so you know where everything is on an unfamilliar map. This just makes sense, and would encourage more varied maps being used. Those are the basics, but I imagine I could think of more. Oh workers should split automatically. The overall point is that it makes the game much more fun to play. Non-pro gamers can now play very high level style games, able to concentrate on strategy and micro, without having to do boring crap for 30-70% of the game. Pro gamers, freed of distractions will be able to pull off mindblowing pieces of micro. 1.I'll throw up an example here , you are building gas when you are rushed early with 10 scv and 4 marines.You bring your 'grunt' units along with your miners to attack when suddenly 3 miners go to the gas.Could be annoying. 2.OK so a pro isn't allowed to use this 'feature'....so lets say im the greatest non pro in the world and im using this feature.Some pro team picks me up and i'm not allowed to use this feature now.I'm fucked , no way i can compete with pros if suddenly a feature i have becomed so accustomed to is switched off.This is akin to map hacking. 3.So you get the AI to build your supplies when you are close to the limit? you still have to tell them where to be built or are they built randomly? If you want this feature you can use BWCoach anyway... 4.Been mentioned elsewhere , too powerful for zerg , although 16 units selectable for the upgrade would be nice 5.I can think of a reason not to.What if you have units in your group with the same hotkey.I have 6 mutalisks and 6 defilers in my group , i press g to morph to guardian , which morphs 6 guardians and gives me plague and a pointer.I accidentaly mis-click and plague my units.Even without mis-clicking i still have to press 'escape' , which will then cancel the morphing guardians  6.Wouldn't mind it , but would still decrease the skill required to play. Also the next starcraft RTS game will have to be in 3d , whether it is an update or a new game.2d SC RTS now wouldn't sell 1/4 of what the original did. | ||
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hasuwar
7365 Posts
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Remiraz
Singapore5 Posts
On May 20 2005 17:40 Tal wrote: What i'm basically saying, is what if Blizzard decided to make a sequel to starcraft, but did it with some sense. So like the CS making people, they realised the basic game is SO strong and great and fun, that changing that will fuck up the game. You do know that the people making CS (gooseman basically) are noobs at competitive gaming right? They have been fucking up CS for every version and never give a crap about game balance. Remember back in 6.1 when AWP owns all? Until now AWP owns all in tournaments. | ||
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Remiraz
Singapore5 Posts
On May 20 2005 17:40 Tal wrote: 6: The map should be already revealed but in fog of war, so you know where everything is on an unfamilliar map. This just makes sense, and would encourage more varied maps being used. This was indeed done in one patch. Very good move, don't know why they removed it. People avoid playing new maps because they're not familiar with them, so this help even the odds. Pros already memorised the map anyway (well, who here don't know LT?) so no harm to them. But Blizz scrap it when "preview map" in chat room feature came out. Wonder why. Since we can preview the entire map, why not just remove the shroud. Shroud = The blackness that blocks the terrain. Fog = Fog of War. Why would this reduce the skill required?? Any serious players would have memorised the map in the first place. | ||
Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
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Ammo
Canada32 Posts
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Brett
Australia3820 Posts
On May 21 2005 01:43 Rekrul wrote: Tal gets an A for effort and an F for content ;/ | ||
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ChApFoU
France2982 Posts
The game you describe is definitely not a RTS game, looks more like a micro UMS edit : like tell me what's the purpose of the "supply" concept if it builds all by itself ? if you want a game like that just make UMS where random unit spawns every 20 seconds in your base | ||
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Tal
United Kingdom1013 Posts
1stly, making these changes does not dumb down starcraft at all. It would feature exactly the same level of strategy as it does at the moment. What it does dumb down is having to multi-task with boring things. You still have to make all the normal choices that we talk about in the strategy forum: What build to use, what strategy to use, what units to build, when to get what upgrades, when to harass when to attack, reacting to opponent etc... All you actually lose is the added distraction of spamming a load of hotkeys every 10 seconds in the middle of some gripping battle, or quickly clicking back to base and telling your probes to mine. Someone said this means that pro gamers wouldn't be as 'pro' anymore, or something like that but I disagree. There is a lot of room for improvement in micro, and you still have to multi-task if attacked in multiple places at once. It would still be the best RTS game of all time. Capfou said that I'd like the computer to do the macro itself. In one way, yes. I just want to choose what units to build and not have to go back every 30 seconds to ensure they're still being built. Does anyone actually enjoy having to do this? I'm also going to explain some of the things people have questioned: 1: You'd be able to turn off this option, so if you suspect an early rush, you could make it so your probes wouldn't go mine gas or whatever. 2: this feature wouldn't be 'switched off' for pros, but odds are they would switch it off themselves for those small timing advantages (e.g gundam's perfected gundam rush), particularly in the early game. 3: The supply thing isn't really that neccessary, but it would be nice to have a way of ensuring that while you launch some huge attack there is something less to worry about. 4: People's counter argument to this is complete shit. It would unbalance zerg?? Wtf? A pro player is fast enough that they basically can send everything all at once...it doesn't unbalance the game. It just means they have to devote unneccessary spamming time to get it to happen. Which is shit. 5: Obviously hotkeys could be slightly changed so nothing in the same race shares them. Also different hotkeys for burrow and lurker burrow could be put in. 6: no real objections have come against this, but anyone who thinks that you should just learn the map off by heart can shut the fuck up. It's thinking like that which means everyone just plays LT. Cheers | ||
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IronMentality
United States1129 Posts
Unless you want to make Starcraft average map size 512x512 with 1000 units all of your suggestions are useless | ||
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GG15-Style
Panama593 Posts
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L!MP
Australia2067 Posts
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Tal
United Kingdom1013 Posts
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-_-
United States7081 Posts
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EnDeR_
Spain2537 Posts
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Liquid`Jinro
Sweden33719 Posts
Holy fucking shit. Scimmed through to paragraph 2, oh lord.. Look, I can barely enjoy any RTS games other than BW. And why is that? Because the BW interface is so good it is SICK. It is fast, efficent, not annoying at all (units doing shit by themselves is so fucking annoying --;;;;;;;  .Cuddly made some good suggestions, and some IMO bad ones but whatever --;; I guess chances are I wont like BW 2 :< | ||
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Doctorasul
Romania1145 Posts
Proper arguments have been brought for and against all your suggestions. From there on it's just a matter of taste. I believe most people here enjoy the current setup of the game. Making a game with those features is fine, just don't call it "Starcraft 2", more like "Warcraft 4", that would fit just right. | ||
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CuddlyCuteKitten
Sweden2510 Posts
On May 21 2005 05:38 FrozenArbiter wrote: I didn't read all of your post.. Getting past 'SCs interface is a piece of shit' was hard enough, then you want workers to do their shit by themselves!?!? Holy fucking shit. Scimmed through to paragraph 2, oh lord.. Look, I can barely enjoy any RTS games other than BW. And why is that? Because the BW interface is so good it is SICK. It is fast, efficent, not annoying at all (units doing shit by themselves is so fucking annoying --;;;;;;; .Cuddly made some good suggestions, and some IMO bad ones but whatever --;; I guess chances are I wont like BW 2 :< Which suggestions didn't you like? | ||
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ScGoOn
Uruguay52 Posts
bye | ||
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