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On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW
Well OSL/MSL/PL all still count as tournaments... so does ISL.... and all the best koreans didn't switch so I would say they are extremely comparable.
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On March 07 2011 14:28 Antisocialmunky wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW Well there's that one that Artosis never got around to ending so Foreigner BW lives.
ascension was it?
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On March 07 2011 14:28 Antisocialmunky wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW Well there's that one that Artosis never got around to ending so Foreigner BW lives.
ICCup Starleague? While nothing on the scale of current SC2 tournies and even past major BW events a $1,000 prize pool is not totally insignificant.
It is nevertheless true though that most of the players in the tournament were no where near top foreigner level when SC2 came out.
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Two things:
1. Doesn't WCG usually play 2 RTS games? In the past it was SC and WC3? Why not do SC and SC2? Both of them still have bigger scenes than WC3. I suppose WC3 fans would be upset about that but...
2. It's in South Korea this year, isn't it? Uhm.... removing SC from the tournament in the long term is probably a good idea since the gap between foreigners and progamers was already absurdly huge even before most of the top foreigners retired, but doing so this year might be a bad, bad move. They would have a much easier time filling stadiums with Flash and Jaedong. Well... WCG better hope that Boxer, NaDa, and/or July qualify for WCG...
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Not that surprised. WCG isn't for Koreans only, and SC2 is much more followed worldwide than SC1.
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On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW
haha cause they were smart. 1.6 to CSS == BW to SC2 amirite?
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On March 07 2011 11:53 Release wrote:
Watching sc2 is so much less exciting than watching sc1.
I can see that they chose sc2 because of the more players, but the spectators will suffer.
I was hoping for one more year so Jaedong or Flash would make it to the hall of fame.
Which spectators are you talking about? Although i dont have actual evidence of numbers im pretty positive i can say that SC2 has wayyyy more viewers and a much larger fan base in the foreign communities than SC1. Resulting in more people watching stream/attending event which = more money for WCG and higher popularity.
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On March 07 2011 14:37 DreamChaser wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 11:53 Release wrote:
Watching sc2 is so much less exciting than watching sc1.
I can see that they chose sc2 because of the more players, but the spectators will suffer.
I was hoping for one more year so Jaedong or Flash would make it to the hall of fame. Which spectators are you talking about? Although i dont have actual evidence of numbers im pretty positive i can say that SC2 has wayyyy more viewers and a much larger fan base in the foreign communities than SC1. Resulting in more people watching stream/attending event which = more money for WCG and higher popularity.
he's talking about content
BW was much more fun for the viewers
EDIT: Was? more like still is...
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On March 07 2011 14:33 etheovermind wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW Well OSL/MSL/PL all still count as tournaments... so does ISL.... and all the best koreans didn't switch so I would say they are extremely comparable.
OSL/MSL/PL are korean events, ISL is an online only tournament
I am specifically referring to the foreigner scene in that post, of course BW is still going strong in South Korea. But WCG is a worldwide event and the non korean interest in BW is just lacking, sponsors have no incentive to fund BW tournaments especially now that SC2 is released. When SC2 was announced there was somewhat of a resurgence in the foreign scene, with TSL, dreamhack and some zotac cups but basically every good nonkorean/non chinese skilled player has left the scene
Its just naive to assume that WCG will add BW again, honestly I would be surprised if they did. Last years WCG had an incredibly poor turnout in terms of spectators and players which doesn't sit well with sponsors at all - and without sponsors you simply cannot have a tournament
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On March 07 2011 14:33 etheovermind wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW Well OSL/MSL/PL all still count as tournaments... so does ISL.... and all the best koreans didn't switch so I would say they are extremely comparable.
Yeah, but it's pretty pointless to have a game of only regional mainstream appeal and prowess in the World Cyber Games. It would be like putting Australian rules football or American football in the Olympics. It would be a laughable concept, IMO.
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The games will be sorely missed. The fact that the Korean's played so relaxed produced some SICK games when they faced off. Can't say I didn't see this coming though....ah well.
When's the next OSL?
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On March 07 2011 14:40 hazz. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 14:33 etheovermind wrote:On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW Well OSL/MSL/PL all still count as tournaments... so does ISL.... and all the best koreans didn't switch so I would say they are extremely comparable. OSL/MSL/PL are korean events, ISL is an online only tournament I am specifically referring to the foreigner scene in that post, of course BW is still going strong in South Korea. But WCG is a worldwide event and the non korean interest in BW is just lacking, sponsors have no incentive to fund BW tournaments especially now that SC2 is released. When SC2 was announced there was somewhat of a resurgence in the foreign scene, with TSL, dreamhack and some zotac cups but basically every good nonkorean/non chinese skilled player has left the scene Its just naive to assume that WCG will add BW again, honestly I would be surprised if they did. Last years WCG had an incredibly poor turnout in terms of spectators and players which doesn't sit well with sponsors at all - and without sponsors you simply cannot have a tournament
Why do people act like korean tournaments don't count? In terms of viewers total I would imagine that BW still has more views worldwide because of how many views they get from S.Korea.
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Yeah I really would have loved to still have seen both games. But I guess that they are joining the rest of the crowd.
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well, at least it means there is one less tournament for me to follow. i'm definitely not going to be watching any starcraft 2.
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imo getting rid of SCBW isn't really surprising seeing as how its pretty much a complete smackdown by the koreans the past few years. Even watching the USA qualifiers it was pretty obvious that there was only a small handful who even prepared and that the rest had been playing evidentially more SC2 than BW.
Glad to see they decided to add SC2 though as opposed to scrap SC all together.
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On March 07 2011 14:42 etheovermind wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 14:40 hazz. wrote:On March 07 2011 14:33 etheovermind wrote:On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW Well OSL/MSL/PL all still count as tournaments... so does ISL.... and all the best koreans didn't switch so I would say they are extremely comparable. OSL/MSL/PL are korean events, ISL is an online only tournament I am specifically referring to the foreigner scene in that post, of course BW is still going strong in South Korea. But WCG is a worldwide event and the non korean interest in BW is just lacking, sponsors have no incentive to fund BW tournaments especially now that SC2 is released. When SC2 was announced there was somewhat of a resurgence in the foreign scene, with TSL, dreamhack and some zotac cups but basically every good nonkorean/non chinese skilled player has left the scene Its just naive to assume that WCG will add BW again, honestly I would be surprised if they did. Last years WCG had an incredibly poor turnout in terms of spectators and players which doesn't sit well with sponsors at all - and without sponsors you simply cannot have a tournament Why do people act like korean tournaments don't count? In terms of viewers total I would imagine that BW still has more views worldwide because of how many views they get from S.Korea.
Because its the World Cyber Games? You represent your country in WCG. What good is representing your country if hardly anyone outside Korea is even interested? Koreans don't even care that much about WCG... they televised the WCG Korea qualifiers but thats more of an exhibition match type of thing than anything, WCG doesn't carry much prestige in Korea. It doesn't make sense to have a game that has very little interest on an international level just because one country in the world has a huge interest in it
BW was dropped because it is not popular enough outside of South Korea to warrant showcasing it at an international event such as WCG
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On March 07 2011 14:42 etheovermind wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2011 14:40 hazz. wrote:On March 07 2011 14:33 etheovermind wrote:On March 07 2011 14:26 hazz. wrote:
The situation of 1.6/css and bw/sc2 aren't even comparable.
hardly any 1.6 players switched over and there were hardly any source tournaments but there were still a ton of 1.6 tournaments. almost the whole foreigner scene either retired or switched to Sc2 when it was released and there are now no foreign tournaments for BW Well OSL/MSL/PL all still count as tournaments... so does ISL.... and all the best koreans didn't switch so I would say they are extremely comparable. OSL/MSL/PL are korean events, ISL is an online only tournament I am specifically referring to the foreigner scene in that post, of course BW is still going strong in South Korea. But WCG is a worldwide event and the non korean interest in BW is just lacking, sponsors have no incentive to fund BW tournaments especially now that SC2 is released. When SC2 was announced there was somewhat of a resurgence in the foreign scene, with TSL, dreamhack and some zotac cups but basically every good nonkorean/non chinese skilled player has left the scene Its just naive to assume that WCG will add BW again, honestly I would be surprised if they did. Last years WCG had an incredibly poor turnout in terms of spectators and players which doesn't sit well with sponsors at all - and without sponsors you simply cannot have a tournament Why do people act like korean tournaments don't count? In terms of viewers total I would imagine that BW still has more views worldwide because of how many views they get from S.Korea.
Though the Korean tournaments still are going strong, it doesn't hide the fact that there are almost no non-Korean BW tournaments nowadays. Dreamhack and Assembly have both switched to SC2. TSL switched to SC2. Regional WCG events used to be the biggest non-Korean BW LANs, but with WCG now switching to SC2, they will most likely now be SC2 events.
The fact is that the rest of the world has switched over to SC2 competitively, and this is evident in the huge number of non-Korean SC2 events whereas there are almost no non-Korean BW events. BW surviving in Korea doesn't guarantee BW surviving in the rest of the world, and should foreign pros switch back to BW, the foreign BW scene would be only a pitiful shell of its former self.
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Looks like WCG just lost my support.
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A truly sad day has befallen on all of the Starcraft community..
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I wonder if they removed WC3 from the line up too. If WC3 and BW were replaced by SC2 and LoL, I will honestly have no reason to watch WCG. It will be a hollow tournament.
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EPT
