| Forum Index > BW General |
|
benzoic-acid
Korea (South)427 Posts
On March 14 2004 20:19 analogkensho wrote: His weakest MU, stats wise, is TvT tho... a disturbingly common MU these days. TT_TT;; he beat nada 3-1 in a major tournament for same race matchup, anything above 60% is really, really good he's considered top 3 (at worst) tvt, and most consider him equal to nada | ||
|
Orlandu
China2450 Posts
Everyone knows that in Korea any top player can beat another top player on any given day. Therefore, Oov would have to keep up a very nice streak to keep such an advantage in percentage over Nada when he has played the same amount of games. Until then, it's not wise to compare the two based on stats alone unless you're talking about an equal number of games, i.e. stats for a particular league, like MBC. Anyway, still nice stats. Very impressive regardless of how he compares to Nada. | ||
Klogon
MURICA15980 Posts
| ||
|
analogkensho
United States358 Posts
On March 14 2004 20:43 benzoic-acid wrote: he beat nada 3-1 in a major tournament for same race matchup, anything above 60% is really, really good he's considered top 3 (at worst) tvt, and most consider him equal to nada Hmmm thanks for info, didn't know that offhand. Still too many TvTs tho... -_- | ||
|
Brett
Australia3822 Posts
| ||
|
useLess
United States4781 Posts
Thats only comparison with percentages. If he had gone 3-0 and get that 100%, would that change the idea? | ||
|
hasuwar
7365 Posts
edit..yeah, basically what hovz said ;o | ||
|
Klogon
MURICA15980 Posts
| ||
|
Chibi[OWNS]
United Kingdom10597 Posts
| ||
|
benzoic-acid
Korea (South)427 Posts
On March 14 2004 20:49 Klogon wrote: Unless you pull stats that are recent. I believe that Saro posted some liquibet stats a while back that are pretty accurate for recent games only stats. those stats were pretty old, at least 2-3 months, i think. most games from this OGN SL werent in there | ||
|
RuGbUg
United States2347 Posts
On March 14 2004 22:13 Chibi[OWNS] wrote: well... the 90-25 guy would have had ~8 losses by the time he hit 30 games, whereas the 30-0 would still have a clean sheet.. i'd be routing for the 30-0 guy tbh so what about a 90-3 vs a 29-0 guy? (if you're just getting picky on exact ratios instead of the point being made) | ||
|
Make7UpYours
893 Posts
| ||
|
benzoic-acid
Korea (South)427 Posts
I said that oov will be the best player if he beats nada in the finals. Best, as in "most likely to win a game right now," not "who has accomplished the most." However, pro-gaming is very, very dynamic. You cant look at old stats because they are more misleading. ALL of oov's games have come in the past year or so, while nada's are spread over a few years. If you want to use old stats, then chrh and themarine are still both top 10, according to pgr21.com (i believe). People who accomplished a lot may actually suck now. It is players like oov, goodfriend, and nada (2 years ago) who people should consider, because they are dominating RIGHT NOW, not 6 months ago, not a year ago, not 3 years ago. If you want discount oov for the lack of games played, then you can say that sync or themarine is better than oov, even though everyone knows they are not. all you people that are saying stats are misleading, you are the ones that are misusing them Given oov's stats and his dominance in pretty much anything he has played in, if he does beat nada in MSL, he is definitely the top pro as of that moment. | ||
|
benzoic-acid
Korea (South)427 Posts
On March 14 2004 22:30 Make7UpYours wrote: Beating Nada wouldn't make Oov #1 automatically either. TheMarine had a winning percentage against Boxer back in the day but there wasn't any doubt who was the better player overall (at least for most people). I think for Oov to be accepted as the best he needs to get an OGN win. Nada was also in the same situation when he was rising to the top and wasn't really universally accepted as the best until his 2002 OGN win. you contradict yourself here. everyone knew that boxer was better than themarine overall, even though themarine had a pretty even record with boxer. nobody is sure whether nada or oov is better, which is why i am considering their head to head. also, i never said that head to head means everything, i am just using it as a piece of evidence to build up a case within the pro-gaming community (hardcore fans + top amateurs + pro gamers) everyone knew that nada was the best player. it is the common fan that didnt realize that until he won OGN. | ||
|
PoP
France15446 Posts
| ||
|
IcedEarth
United States3661 Posts
On March 14 2004 22:30 Make7UpYours wrote: Nada ]was also in the same situation when he was rising to the top and wasn't really universally accepted as the best until his 2002 OGN win. Finally, someone says that. I never heard of him til that time. | ||
|
hasuwar
7365 Posts
On March 14 2004 21:43 Klogon wrote: Well hasu, that's entirely not correct unless the guy who's 30-0 on WGTour start off playing versus A ranked players instead of C6, which is essientially what oov is doing. You read my post backwards, congrats. On March 14 2004 22:13 Chibi[OWNS] wrote: well... the 90-25 guy would have had ~8 losses by the time he hit 30 games, whereas the 30-0 would still have a clean sheet.. i'd be routing for the 30-0 guy tbh What I was saying was, the first 30 games are easy for good players..it's when you get to the higher ranks that you start losing... if the 30-0 guy played more, he'd start losing | ||
|
SpuniasauR
Australia1500 Posts
On March 14 2004 22:52 IcedEarth wrote: Finally, someone says that. I never heard of him til that time. heh i reckon!!! benzoic, were not comparing his all-time accomplishments, cuz then noone comes close to say the old school greats (maynard, gundam or others who have moves named after them, but they arent shit now) or boxer. we're just saying how can u compare (for example) 8-1 versus 150-15. sure u can look at ratios, but if oov has something different in his style which is getting him wins NOW that we honestly wont notice in bad res obs vods, the pro players sure as shit will notice and find ways to bring him down soon. if he still dominates in the longer run, then maybe hes adjustable/intelligent enough to be the best. although nada has nowhere near the charisma and funny ass style of our king boxa, u gotta admit his game is almost flawless and he can handle ANYTHING thrown at him, in any matchup. THATS WHY hes been fuckin em up for years. let oov prove hes more than a flash in the pants, otherwise u really cant say hes the best, cuz hes the new kid, wait till the other pros learn his moves and are playing him at their level. think of this; when these players come up they watch boxer/nada vods, reps etc etc etc and they can see their moves/tendencies problems that the players have. WHO THE FUCK WAS ILOVEOOV when he first entered the pro scene? people are still learning about him, wat makes a player god is the ability to still play great AFTER people have studied the ways to bring u down. | ||
|
ZyPhReX
1192 Posts
| ||
|
Klogon
MURICA15980 Posts
huh? If you misunderstood, I didn't mean that oov was playing c6, but that he started off playing A level players. A person going 30-0 versus the best gamers in the world and going 30-0 versus random players is totally different. But lets say we apply this standard of the players starting off their records versus the very best because the 90-25 player on WGTour would also have around 30 newbie bashing wins. So now that both players have these amazing records of 90-25 and 30-0 on TV Games (hypothetically), then they are both very talented players. But in your post you said the 30-0 will start losing a lot more after he played started to play more. This is true and not true at the same time because the 30-0 player is already playing the best of the best, so there isn't a higher tier of players that will even out his record. But on the other hand, if he even loses ONE game, it will ruin his perfect record and every loss after that will significantly affect his ratio. But a 30-0 player has shown is he UNDEFEATABLE 30 games in a row versus the very best in the world. This is amazing! The 90-25 player has been beaten in approx 1/3 of his games, so we can assume once out of every three games, he will lose (on average) so he isn't an undefeatable monster, but just a very very good player.In that situation, I would bet my money on the 30-0 player because he is probably still unstopable and has proven his utter dominance of the scene at the current moment. He will probably continue the dominance for some time (30 wins in a row at that level is near impossible unless you are truely unstopable) and so you could use that statistic to say AT THE MOMENT, the 30-0 player is the best, even if he hasn't played more games IN THE FUTURE, because we aren't worried about what he will player like later, but instead concentrating on what he is NOW. This had little to do with the conversation, but... on second thought, it did somewhat as people are talking about statistics. But oov is far from 30-0 so I guess it doesn't apply. | ||
| ||
StarCraft 2 StarCraft: Brood War Dota 2 League of Legends Counter-Strike Super Smash Bros Heroes of the Storm Other Games |
|
The PondCast
WardiTV Invitational
Replay Cast
RongYI Cup
herO vs Maru
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
Replay Cast
Wardi Open
Monday Night Weeklies
Sparkling Tuna Cup
|
|
|
EPT
