EPT[CPL] News and Announcements - Page 15
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Ethelis
United States2400 Posts
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Dark.Carnival
United States5095 Posts
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Saracen
United States5139 Posts
On December 11 2009 08:53 TheAntZ wrote: If the coaches wish to choose their own players, then stick with 14 pls. If they agree to coach the players who signed up in time but didn't get a spot, then by all means that sounds great I'm fine if another two teams are chosen in the way these previous teams have been chosen (as long as you absolutely stop at 16). The thing is, community-run leagues like this are fragile. The only motivation the average participant has for participating is based on how much of an impact he feels he is making. This works great for small, strict leagues. But when you start bending the rules and expanding participation to accommodate people, EVERYONE will start to feel more detached. Eventually, you get a snowball effect: one person will stop caring, then a few more, then some teams will drop out, and the entire league will collapse. Trust me, I've been there... | ||
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Ruken
United States858 Posts
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TheAntZ
Israel6248 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:06 Saracen wrote: I'm fine if another two teams are chosen in the way these previous teams have been chosen (as long as you absolutely stop at 16). The thing is, community-run leagues like this are fragile. The only motivation the average participant has for participating is based on how much of an impact he feels he is making. This works great for small, strict leagues. But when you start bending the rules and expanding participation to accommodate people, EVERYONE will start to feel more detached. Eventually, you get a snowball effect: one person will stop caring, then a few more, then some teams will drop out, and the entire league will collapse. Trust me, I've been there... Exactly, its not right that the first 13 teams get randomly assigned and the other coaches can pick their players. If a rule is to be applied to any team, it should be applied to all teams. | ||
l10f
United States3241 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:06 Saracen wrote: I'm fine if another two teams are chosen in the way these previous teams have been chosen (as long as you absolutely stop at 16). The thing is, community-run leagues like this are fragile. The only motivation the average participant has for participating is based on how much of an impact he feels he is making. This works great for small, strict leagues. But when you start bending the rules and expanding participation to accommodate people, EVERYONE will start to feel more detached. Eventually, you get a snowball effect: one person will stop caring, then a few more, then some teams will drop out, and the entire league will collapse. Trust me, I've been there... Looks like I'm going to have to say no to them  I just hate saying no to people. | ||
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rei
United States3594 Posts
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StorrZerg
United States13919 Posts
Teams where divided onto even races 2 z 2 p 2 t as well as only max 2 d+ players. as long as the team added fits in with the requirements who cares? Teams where also divided up into time zones Again this league is designed to help players get better. If it really is a problem please pm me to talk about it | ||
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l10f
United States3241 Posts
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Saracen
United States5139 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:13 rei wrote: l10f, Here is another idea, how about put those of us who are not chosen into the existing teams as back ups? they will be allow to show up as practice partner during training, but only allow to play if one of the starters is unavailable to play. Which helps out on the stability of each team, and more insurance that each team will have someone showing up for each match. Having practice partners is great, as long as they aren't actually a "part of the team." That means, coaches aren't obligated to teach them, and they shouldn't be able to play in matches. From a PM I sent: Sure, you could give the option to take in [more] people, but, from my experience, it's just not going to be the best for the league. When I first saw CPL, I thought "oh shit, not another LKL..." But the sole reason that convinced me that this might not fail was that there is a great degree of symbiosis between the coaches and the players - the ENTIRE team. A two coach: six player ratio is great because each team member is given a strong sense of responsibility - they have a huge say in the success or failure of the team. The larger you make the team, the less responsibility each participant will feel, until the team inevitably falls apart. The thing is, you can say, "oh, that won't be us. We'll give it 110%." But you can only speak for yourself. You can't fight human nature. If people feel like they aren't making a direct impact on the team, they won't care, and the team will inevitably fall apart. From a coach's perspective: You're managing roughly three random people. They aren't your real-life friends. You probably have never met them before, online or off. It's going to be hard enough as is to stay motivated to constantly teach these three people - patiently bear with their mistakes, encourage them when it doesn't seem like they're improving, keep at it when they seem to ignore (or forget) your advice. Add on another two or three and you're going to find yourself focusing all your attention on the one or two or three who you like the best, leaving the others with little or no attention. | ||
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mark05
Canada807 Posts
On December 11 2009 08:49 l10f wrote: But then I'd have to reject both teams, to keep the teams even. So stick with the current 14? It seems like most people want it that way. I will follow the popular opinion, as I did with everything else. nooo add 2 team plz thats what most ppl want according to irc | ||
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l10f
United States3241 Posts
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tredmasta
China152 Posts
On December 11 2009 07:19 l10f wrote: Alright: For those spots for the no-shows (didn't join the team) at the end of tomorrow EST (Means 0:00 EST Friday) I will start adding people who posted that they still wanted to join beginning from page 1 of this post given: 1. They are at the timezone of one of the teams available. 2. They are at a rank that wouldn't make the team imbalanced (At most 2 D+ at least 1 D-) 3. They play a race of which the team does not have two players (2Z 2P 2T to a team) 9 people have yet to join. Team 15 and 16 will be made, but Team 15 has all of the players requested by the coach, therefore will not include people from this post. Team 16, the coach has requested two people, and I will include the first 4 people that fit the three requirements posted above. I'd still like to play. D level toss, PST or EST is fine. | ||
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StorrZerg
United States13919 Posts
if you had 16 teams you can split them into 4 regions with 4 teams each. each playing a team. top 2 from the region can advance to round of 8. | ||
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Saracen
United States5139 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:31 mark05 wrote: nooo add 2 team plz thats what most ppl want according to irc And then, once those two teams are added, irc will want another two teams because the people voicing their opinions are the ones who aren't on a team. This will keep going until everyone who wanted to join is in. You understand that there has to be a limit. The smaller the limit, the better, in order for the league to run as smoothly as possible. It looks like there will be open spots by Friday (two people from my own team still haven't responded to me), so eight or so more of you will still be able to join. And if this league is successful, the others will likely be given priority for the next league. But that's only IF this league is successful, and if we keep tacking people on, there's a higher and higher chance it it will fail. | ||
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l10f
United States3241 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:43 StorrZerg wrote: 12 has a good ratio 14 doesn't if you had 16 teams you can split them into 4 regions with 4 teams each. each playing a team. top 2 from the region can advance to round of 8. Look, as much as I'd love to get as many people to play, I can't go against popular opinion. My primary goal is to make this league succeed. The secondary goal is to have more people play. | ||
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mark05
Canada807 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:32 l10f wrote: I agree with Saracen. Current rules are fine IMO. 3:1 is a very good ratio, and 14 teams sound fine too. how is 14 better than 16?. ... seriously edit: afaik ppl also seem to prefer 16 than 14... just put the limit at 16 teams | ||
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l10f
United States3241 Posts
If you've been reading, the problem is that we would have to bend the rules in order to make it 16, and that could cause the league to fall apart. The problem isn't with limiting with 14 teams, but in that StorrZerg wants to pick his own set of 6 players. | ||
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StorrZerg
United States13919 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:44 Saracen wrote: And then, once those two teams are added, irc will want another two teams because the people voicing their opinions are the ones who aren't on a team. This will keep going until everyone who wanted to join is in. You understand that there has to be a limit. The smaller the limit, the better, in order for the league to run as smoothly as possible. It looks like there will be open spots by Friday (two people from my own team still haven't responded to me), so eight or so more of you will still be able to join. And if this league is successful, the others will likely be given priority for the next league. But that's only IF this league is successful, and if we keep tacking people on, there's a higher and higher chance it it will fail. Eah the difference is team 15 and 16 where all ready told they would be in, and now its on the boarder because people think its unfair that those 2 coaches got to pick players. teams 13 and 14 by your logic should be removed as well. 14 is a harder number to work with than 12 or 16. when trying to set up league practice. Coaches are volunteering their time to help lesser skilled players get better, as long as teams 15 and 16 abide by the rules of ranking and race it should not matter. the players on those teams still want to play as well. | ||
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mark05
Canada807 Posts
On December 11 2009 09:47 l10f wrote: If you've been reading, the problem is that we would have to bend the rules in order to make it 16, and that could cause the league to fall apart. The problem isn't with limiting with 14 teams, but in that StorrZerg wants to pick his own set of 6 players. dont see anything wrong with that if they meet the level requirement ... i think itd run smoother with 16.... even if u have to bend the rules... its the 1st season, ideal to make changes like that | ||
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