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brain stimulation

Blogs > ahrara_
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
ahrara_
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Afghanistan1715 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-04-23 02:37:41
April 23 2009 02:36 GMT
#1
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8012496.stm?

A detailed simulation of a small region of a brain built molecule by molecule has been constructed and has recreated experimental results from real brains.

The "Blue Brain" has been put in a virtual body, and observing it gives the first indications of the molecular and neural basis of thought and memory.

Scaling the simulation to the human brain is only a matter of money, says the project's head.

The work was presented at the European Future Technologies meeting in Prague.

The Blue Brain project launched in 2005 as the most ambitious brain simulation effort ever undertaken.

This is by far the coolest thing I've read in weeks. I had no idea neuroscience had progressed this far. I mean, if you're simulating part of a human brain, you've practically created an artificial intelligence.

Can anyone who's studying the field give us a little more insight? Is this really all it's trumped up to be?

**
in Afghanistan we have 20% literacy rate
Try
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States1293 Posts
April 23 2009 02:38 GMT
#2
That's pretty fucking tight. However, I fail to see how this would benefit human society.
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24701 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-04-23 02:42:35
April 23 2009 02:42 GMT
#3
From the article:

Wolfgang Wahlster of the German Research Center for Artificial Intelligence, and a chief German government scientific adviser on ICT, thinks that the reductionist strategy of the project is flawed - that it won't see the forest for the trees.

"Imagine you could follow in one of the most advanced Pentium chips today what each and every transistor is doing right now," he told BBC News.

"Then I ask, 'What is happening? Is Word running? Are you doing a Google search?' You couldn't answer. Looking at this level you cannot figure it out.

"This is very interesting research and I'm not criticising it, but it doesn't help us in computer science in having the intelligent behaviour of humans replicated."

This sums up my thoughts better than I could have articulated them.

edit: Try, if their assumptions are right, then this would hugely benefit society! But, I'm skeptical...
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
ahrara_
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Afghanistan1715 Posts
April 23 2009 02:43 GMT
#4
wouldn't a sufficiently accurate simulation capture the emergent properties of the brain?
in Afghanistan we have 20% literacy rate
deathgod6
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States5064 Posts
April 23 2009 02:44 GMT
#5
On April 23 2009 11:38 Try wrote:
That's pretty fucking tight. However, I fail to see how this would benefit human society.

Have you ever seen any SciFi movies with artificial intelligence?
4.0 GPA = A rank 5.0 GPA = Olympic --------- Bisu, Best, Fantasy. i ♥ oov. They can get in my BoxeR anyday.
Deleted User 3420
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
24492 Posts
April 23 2009 02:50 GMT
#6
On April 23 2009 11:43 ahrara_ wrote:
wouldn't a sufficiently accurate simulation capture the emergent properties of the brain?


not to say it wouldn't, but if the simulation isn't organic then why would it ?
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-04-23 02:51:54
April 23 2009 02:50 GMT
#7
On April 23 2009 11:44 deathgod6 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2009 11:38 Try wrote:
That's pretty fucking tight. However, I fail to see how this would benefit human society.

Have you ever seen any SciFi movies with artificial intelligence?


like The Matrix franchise? Or the Terminator franchise?

+ Show Spoiler +

I, for one, welcome my body heat-harvesting machine overlords
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
ahrara_
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Afghanistan1715 Posts
April 23 2009 02:51 GMT
#8
On April 23 2009 11:50 travis wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2009 11:43 ahrara_ wrote:
wouldn't a sufficiently accurate simulation capture the emergent properties of the brain?


not to say it wouldn't, but if the simulation isn't organic then why would it ?

uh, because you can simulate organic behavior?
in Afghanistan we have 20% literacy rate
ulszz
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
Jamaica1787 Posts
April 23 2009 02:53 GMT
#9
On April 23 2009 11:38 Try wrote:
That's pretty fucking tight. However, I fail to see how this would benefit human society.

i fail to see how you fail to see how this doesn't benefit humanity. fuk society

anyways that crazy if money really is the only issue in creating a brain
everliving, everfaithful, eversure
Deleted User 3420
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
24492 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-04-23 02:58:02
April 23 2009 02:55 GMT
#10
On April 23 2009 11:51 ahrara_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2009 11:50 travis wrote:
On April 23 2009 11:43 ahrara_ wrote:
wouldn't a sufficiently accurate simulation capture the emergent properties of the brain?


not to say it wouldn't, but if the simulation isn't organic then why would it ?

uh, because you can simulate organic behavior?


maybe I misinterpreted you.

by "emergent properties", did you mean consciousness or properties of consciousness?
or did you mean something else?
Bebop Berserker
Profile Joined April 2009
United States246 Posts
April 23 2009 03:02 GMT
#11
On April 23 2009 11:38 Try wrote:
That's pretty fucking tight. However, I fail to see how this would benefit human society.


WHAT!?!?!?! Seriously? No offense man , but wtf. This would give us the ability to create HIGHLY intelligent robots(i.e. slaves), and would allow us to create super-human brains eventually that could solve problems for us.Not to mention , give us insight to the question of what a human is and how our brains work.This is just the tip of the iceberg btw. It could go as far as prosthetic brains or even 100% understanding of the universe.
Whatever happens, happens.
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24701 Posts
April 23 2009 03:03 GMT
#12
On April 23 2009 12:02 Bebop Berserker wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2009 11:38 Try wrote:
That's pretty fucking tight. However, I fail to see how this would benefit human society.


WHAT!?!?!?! Seriously? No offense man , but wtf. This would give us the ability to create HIGHLY intelligent robots(i.e. slaves), and would allow us to create super-human brains eventually that could solve problems for us.Not to mention , give us insight to the question of what a human is and how our brains work.This is just the tip of the iceberg btw. It could go as far as prosthetic brains or even 100% understanding of the universe.

That aside, the article specifically mentioned some more short-term practical applications such as modeling the effects of drugs on the brain.
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
RoieTRS
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States2569 Posts
April 23 2009 03:05 GMT
#13
I remember an article about how some dude somehow took part of a rat's brain and grew it (?) and put it inside of an airplane. The brain could control the plane, and it eventually learned how to fly, etc.
konadora, in Racenilatr's blog: "you need to stop thinking about starcraft or anything computer-related for that matter. It's becoming a bad addiction imo"
Lemonwalrus
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States5465 Posts
April 23 2009 03:06 GMT
#14
If they were to recreate my brain, molecule by molecule, would the finished product have my memories?

Not sure if anybody knows the answer yet, but just curious.
ahrara_
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Afghanistan1715 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-04-23 03:07:03
April 23 2009 03:06 GMT
#15
On April 23 2009 11:55 travis wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2009 11:51 ahrara_ wrote:
On April 23 2009 11:50 travis wrote:
On April 23 2009 11:43 ahrara_ wrote:
wouldn't a sufficiently accurate simulation capture the emergent properties of the brain?


not to say it wouldn't, but if the simulation isn't organic then why would it ?

uh, because you can simulate organic behavior?


maybe I misinterpreted you.

by "emergent properties", did you mean consciousness or properties of consciousness?
or did you mean something else?

i meant behavior that emerges in the synthesis of a bunch of components, but is not apparent in the individual components. for example, individual brain cells are incapable of higher thought, but when you throw a bunch of them together, they began exhibiting new kinds of behavior as a collective.

i wasn't talking about any existentialist/spiritual stuff.
in Afghanistan we have 20% literacy rate
SayaSP
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Laos5494 Posts
April 23 2009 03:07 GMT
#16
Make it play starcraft
[iHs]SSP | I-NO-KI BOM-BA-YE | のヮの http://tinyurl.com/MLIStheCV , MLIS.
il0seonpurpose
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Korea (South)5638 Posts
April 23 2009 03:08 GMT
#17
I sound stupid but I really don't get the article
ahrara_
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Afghanistan1715 Posts
April 23 2009 03:09 GMT
#18
On April 23 2009 12:06 Lemonwalrus wrote:
If they were to recreate my brain, molecule by molecule, would the finished product have my memories?

Not sure if anybody knows the answer yet, but just curious.

as long as whatever properties of those molecules that may impact memory are accurately simulated. i don't see why not, unless you believe that consciousness takes some kind of higher, intangible form. but if you believe that, science is not the field for you.
in Afghanistan we have 20% literacy rate
Lemonwalrus
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States5465 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-04-23 03:13:34
April 23 2009 03:11 GMT
#19
On April 23 2009 12:09 ahrara_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2009 12:06 Lemonwalrus wrote:
If they were to recreate my brain, molecule by molecule, would the finished product have my memories?

Not sure if anybody knows the answer yet, but just curious.

as long as whatever properties of those molecules that may impact memory are accurately simulated. i don't see why not, unless you believe that consciousness takes some kind of higher, intangible form. but if you believe that, science is not the field for you.

If you have ever read any post I have made in a science thread on TL you should know that I don't believe that.

Edit: I'm a bio major, the question would probably be better worded as "Does the position of the molecules store the data within the brain (i guess kinda like 0's and 1's in computer code) or is it some other system that I am unaware of that they would have a hard time replicating?"
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24701 Posts
April 23 2009 03:13 GMT
#20
On April 23 2009 12:11 Lemonwalrus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 23 2009 12:09 ahrara_ wrote:
On April 23 2009 12:06 Lemonwalrus wrote:
If they were to recreate my brain, molecule by molecule, would the finished product have my memories?

Not sure if anybody knows the answer yet, but just curious.

as long as whatever properties of those molecules that may impact memory are accurately simulated. i don't see why not, unless you believe that consciousness takes some kind of higher, intangible form. but if you believe that, science is not the field for you.

If you have ever read any post I have made in a science thread on TL you should know that I don't believe that.

I think he was speaking more generally/theoretically rather than implying that those were your views specifically.
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
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