• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 06:14
CEST 12:14
KST 19:14
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners5Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview5[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21
Community News
[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June2Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th151Weekly Cups (May 18-24): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League6
StarCraft 2
General
TL Poll: How do you feel about the 5.0.16 PTR balance changes? Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) Douyu Cup 2026 Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed Mutation # 528 Infection Detected Welcome to the External Content forum
Brood War
General
Data needed Quality of life changes in BW that you will like ? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW fans in southern Sweden, look here! 25 Years Since Brood War Patch 1.08
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals [BSL22] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CEST [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread PC Games Sales Thread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Summer Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Cricket [SPORT] NBA General Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How Streaming Impacts Game P…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8040 users

TSL Musings

Blogs > zer0das
Post a Reply
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-04-09 06:40:33
April 09 2008 06:37 GMT
#1
I've never ever played competitive Starcraft until the past week. I usually stuck to playing with a friend and when he couldn't play, US East (yeah, yeah). He used to beat me all the time... like 95%. Eventually my APM increased from around 75 or so to about 90-95 on average. I still didn't win, but 2-3 months down the road something clicked and I beat him about 75% of the time now.

Within the past two weeks my apm rose another 10 or so to 105 as Protoss (my main race). So I decided to dive into Iccup partly due to TSL and see how I fared.

I went 1-7 the first 8 games. I did win my second game, but it was pretty atrocious. Two things became clear: players are quite a bit smarter than on bnet, and my PvP is atrocious.

First game- a loss in a game I should have won. The guy was zerg and straight teched to hive. I killed his third expo but he sent a ton of lings and ultras to my natural and mauled me because I made too many goons. He pressured me a lot with lings early so I couldn't really scout, and I figured he was going hydra. He only had 68 apm.

Eventually I started winning and I'm currently 14-19, with most of the wins coming in my past 10 games or so. I still suck atrociously at PvP (I've probably played all of five PvP's against my friend since we random, and we've gotten maybe 5 mirrors in 200 games). I either die to zealot rushes rather quickly (after losing to the guy with 68 apm, I lost to a Protoss with 62 apm... how does someone with few actions beat me with a zealot rush? >.< ) or I'm too conservative and I get rolled by dragoons. In the event I survive that far the guy has probably suicided all his troops to kill my cannons so his dts can rape me. My observers never, ever pop in time to deal with dts (hence why I started going cannons). I honestly cannot figure this matchup out, and I thought I had a decent grasp of it (although I know in practice it has always been my weak point).

My PvT is quite a bit better, but I still struggle to scrap together a win. Terrans seems to be much more aggressive and though I can usually secure a third expansion, its later than I'm used to, and I never seem to be able to have the resources to devote to arbiters. What used to be 200 apm Terrans without a clue on bnet are now Terrans quite capable of rolling me if I'm not constantly on my guard. I can smash FD's and pressure pretty well now, but occasionally I botch my timing a bit (usually on the attack).

PvZ I'm quite a bit better at than most mediocre Protoss. I feel like I have to fast expand though, and I never did that on bnet. On the plus side, I never ever seemed to win fast expanding on bnet and I've gotten more than a few wins out of it now. One of my recent losses in the matchup was to a bunch of lings slipping past my cannon/partial wall-in on Katrina thus screwing my expansion. The other was to pure muta that I tried to scout but couldn't, and by the time I did it was too late. There were some suspicious moves by the guy, but it didn't register at the time.

My solution to PvP has been to play ZvP instead. ZvP is probably by far my best matchup, so it doesn't make much sense not to play it when my PvP is so terrible. My apm is on average 20 higher playing as zerg (and I hit a high of 141 for an entire game tonight), and my hydra micro is such that I can beat most D level players easily by just going pure hydra. My only loss in this matchup was to someone who zealot rushed me and sealed my choke off before I had any lings to harass his zealots.

The one thing that's struck me as quite different is everyone has a much better sense of timing and tends to exert much more pressure than any bnet players I've ever encountered. I'm always super jittery for matchs, but I think it's helped me keep my apm up. Occasionally it has interfered enough to hinder my macro, but hopefully with time that will go away. At any rate, I'm well on my way to D+.

And here's my profile if anyone wants to look.

http://www.iccup.com/iccscprofile/294473/

****
paper
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
13196 Posts
April 09 2008 06:42 GMT
#2
gl gl don't give up ; )
Hates Fun🤔
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32278 Posts
April 09 2008 07:12 GMT
#3
Sounds like you improve a lot lately. Don't give up!

(watching progaming pumps me up to play :D)
Moderator<:3-/-<
useLess
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
United States4781 Posts
April 09 2008 07:18 GMT
#4
With PvP, its important to scout. Theres the 1gate/core or the 2gate open, and what youll have to do is match him in the number of gateways. Or, what I did in one of my PvP ( http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=69058 ) was opt for a shield battery and pull some probes to help.
Moonlight Shadow
Play
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Australia608 Posts
April 09 2008 07:24 GMT
#5
apm isnt EVERTHING...though it does help. My apm is 150+ and can hit highs of 300+ and atm i am about 4-15 on iccup and you could probably beat me if you are beating D+ players.
jmascis
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 47m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko447
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 3114
Jaedong 619
Rush 191
EffOrt 108
Pusan 105
Leta 103
Dewaltoss 67
Mind 60
ToSsGirL 48
Backho 40
[ Show more ]
Soma 32
Liquid`Ret 25
soO 24
sorry 22
ggaemo 20
Sacsri 20
[sc1f]eonzerg 8
NotJumperer 4
Dota 2
XcaliburYe128
Counter-Strike
fl0m3760
olofmeister1384
shoxiejesuss638
kennyS460
Other Games
Fuzer 76
Sick25
SortOf18
MindelVK4
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV170
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 25
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota252
League of Legends
• Jankos1819
• Nemesis1641
Upcoming Events
OSC
2h 47m
Maestros of the Game
3h 47m
Classic vs Maru
Serral vs herO
TBD vs Clem
TBD vs Rogue
Replay Cast
13h 47m
CranKy Ducklings
23h 47m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 4h
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
1d 8h
eOnzErG vs Mihu
Messiah vs XuanXuan
Jaystar vs TerrOr
Dewalt vs Bonyth
eOnzErG vs XuanXuan
Mihu vs TerrOr
Messiah vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 23h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
2 days
Jaystar vs Dewalt
eOnzErG vs TerrOr
XuanXuan vs Bonyth
Mihu vs Dewalt
Messiah vs Jaystar
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
TerrOr vs Dewalt
OSC
2 days
[ Show More ]
Wardi Open
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Season 22
2026 GSL S2
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
Acropolis #4 - GSB
SCTL 2026 Spring
Maestros of the Game 2
WardiTV Spring 2026
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Murky Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Douyu Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #3
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.