• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:27
CEST 14:27
KST 21:27
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro4 Preview: On Course0Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview6[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Progenitors8Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun13[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Inheritors16
Community News
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !7Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple0RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event12Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results12026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers25
StarCraft 2
General
Code S Season 1 - RO8 Preview Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book Weekly Cups (April 27-May 4): Clem takes triple Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 524 Death and Taxes The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 523 Firewall Mutation # 522 Flip My Base
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Quality of life changes in BW that you will like ? [ASL21] Ro4 Preview: On Course Why there arent any 256x256 pro maps? RepMastered™: replay sharing and analyzer site
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro8 Day 3 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro8 Day 4 Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates What's the deal with APM & what's its true value
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Daigo vs Menard Best of 10 OutLive 25 (RTS Game)
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread The Letting Off Steam Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How EEG Data Can Predict Gam…
TrAiDoS
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2208 users

TSL Musings

Blogs > zer0das
Post a Reply
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-04-09 06:40:33
April 09 2008 06:37 GMT
#1
I've never ever played competitive Starcraft until the past week. I usually stuck to playing with a friend and when he couldn't play, US East (yeah, yeah). He used to beat me all the time... like 95%. Eventually my APM increased from around 75 or so to about 90-95 on average. I still didn't win, but 2-3 months down the road something clicked and I beat him about 75% of the time now.

Within the past two weeks my apm rose another 10 or so to 105 as Protoss (my main race). So I decided to dive into Iccup partly due to TSL and see how I fared.

I went 1-7 the first 8 games. I did win my second game, but it was pretty atrocious. Two things became clear: players are quite a bit smarter than on bnet, and my PvP is atrocious.

First game- a loss in a game I should have won. The guy was zerg and straight teched to hive. I killed his third expo but he sent a ton of lings and ultras to my natural and mauled me because I made too many goons. He pressured me a lot with lings early so I couldn't really scout, and I figured he was going hydra. He only had 68 apm.

Eventually I started winning and I'm currently 14-19, with most of the wins coming in my past 10 games or so. I still suck atrociously at PvP (I've probably played all of five PvP's against my friend since we random, and we've gotten maybe 5 mirrors in 200 games). I either die to zealot rushes rather quickly (after losing to the guy with 68 apm, I lost to a Protoss with 62 apm... how does someone with few actions beat me with a zealot rush? >.< ) or I'm too conservative and I get rolled by dragoons. In the event I survive that far the guy has probably suicided all his troops to kill my cannons so his dts can rape me. My observers never, ever pop in time to deal with dts (hence why I started going cannons). I honestly cannot figure this matchup out, and I thought I had a decent grasp of it (although I know in practice it has always been my weak point).

My PvT is quite a bit better, but I still struggle to scrap together a win. Terrans seems to be much more aggressive and though I can usually secure a third expansion, its later than I'm used to, and I never seem to be able to have the resources to devote to arbiters. What used to be 200 apm Terrans without a clue on bnet are now Terrans quite capable of rolling me if I'm not constantly on my guard. I can smash FD's and pressure pretty well now, but occasionally I botch my timing a bit (usually on the attack).

PvZ I'm quite a bit better at than most mediocre Protoss. I feel like I have to fast expand though, and I never did that on bnet. On the plus side, I never ever seemed to win fast expanding on bnet and I've gotten more than a few wins out of it now. One of my recent losses in the matchup was to a bunch of lings slipping past my cannon/partial wall-in on Katrina thus screwing my expansion. The other was to pure muta that I tried to scout but couldn't, and by the time I did it was too late. There were some suspicious moves by the guy, but it didn't register at the time.

My solution to PvP has been to play ZvP instead. ZvP is probably by far my best matchup, so it doesn't make much sense not to play it when my PvP is so terrible. My apm is on average 20 higher playing as zerg (and I hit a high of 141 for an entire game tonight), and my hydra micro is such that I can beat most D level players easily by just going pure hydra. My only loss in this matchup was to someone who zealot rushed me and sealed my choke off before I had any lings to harass his zealots.

The one thing that's struck me as quite different is everyone has a much better sense of timing and tends to exert much more pressure than any bnet players I've ever encountered. I'm always super jittery for matchs, but I think it's helped me keep my apm up. Occasionally it has interfered enough to hinder my macro, but hopefully with time that will go away. At any rate, I'm well on my way to D+.

And here's my profile if anyone wants to look.

http://www.iccup.com/iccscprofile/294473/

****
paper
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
13196 Posts
April 09 2008 06:42 GMT
#2
gl gl don't give up ; )
Hates Fun🤔
IntoTheWow
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
is awesome32278 Posts
April 09 2008 07:12 GMT
#3
Sounds like you improve a lot lately. Don't give up!

(watching progaming pumps me up to play :D)
Moderator<:3-/-<
useLess
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
United States4781 Posts
April 09 2008 07:18 GMT
#4
With PvP, its important to scout. Theres the 1gate/core or the 2gate open, and what youll have to do is match him in the number of gateways. Or, what I did in one of my PvP ( http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=69058 ) was opt for a shield battery and pull some probes to help.
Moonlight Shadow
Play
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Australia608 Posts
April 09 2008 07:24 GMT
#5
apm isnt EVERTHING...though it does help. My apm is 150+ and can hit highs of 300+ and atm i am about 4-15 on iccup and you could probably beat me if you are beating D+ players.
jmascis
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Invitational
12:00
Wardi Spring Cup
ByuN vs Rogue
Solar vs Ryung
Zoun vs Percival
Cure vs SHIN
WardiTV293
LiquipediaDiscussion
RSL Revival
10:00
Season 5: Group D
Zoun vs LamboLIVE!
Cure vs TBD
Tasteless1464
IntoTheiNu 737
Ryung 426
IndyStarCraft 214
Rex123
LiquipediaDiscussion
Sparkling Tuna Cup
10:00
Weekly #131 (TLMC 22 Edition)
Classic vs KrystianerLIVE!
CranKy Ducklings94
CranKy Ducklings SOOP10
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Tasteless 1464
Ryung 426
IndyStarCraft 214
Rex 123
TKL 113
Railgan 71
StarCraft: Brood War
BeSt 576
EffOrt 493
Mini 371
ZerO 264
Last 255
Mind 147
Rush 144
Pusan 93
Backho 73
hero 68
[ Show more ]
Shine 53
Nal_rA 51
Liquid`Ret 50
sorry 46
Movie 38
ToSsGirL 36
yabsab 27
Shinee 19
GoRush 16
Noble 12
IntoTheRainbow 12
Dota 2
Gorgc4844
monkeys_forever142
XcaliburYe136
Counter-Strike
x6flipin315
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor142
Other Games
gofns25488
singsing2111
B2W.Neo1138
Liquid`RaSZi689
DeMusliM424
KnowMe125
DenverSC230
MindelVK18
ZerO(Twitch)15
fpsfer 2
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL25858
Other Games
gamesdonequick2685
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 37
• iHatsuTV 6
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1685
• TFBlade1047
Other Games
• WagamamaTV284
Upcoming Events
BSL
6h 33m
Dewalt vs DragOn
Aether vs Jimin
GSL
19h 33m
Afreeca Starleague
21h 33m
Soma vs Leta
Wardi Open
23h 33m
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 3h
OSC
1d 11h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 21h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 21h
Light vs Flash
Replay Cast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Korean StarCraft League
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
BSL
6 days
GSL
6 days
Cure vs TBD
TBD vs Maru
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W6
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
KK 2v2 League Season 1
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
SCTL 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2

Upcoming

YSL S3
Escore Tournament S2: W7
Escore Tournament S2: W8
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026: Closed Qualifier
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.