• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 15:32
CEST 21:32
KST 04:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8
Community News
StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026)48Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double2Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple3BSL Season 2313Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026) SC4ALL: II SC2 Complete Invited Player Lineup How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) 2026 GSTL Grand Finals SC2 INu's Battles#21 [ 3-Days tournament ] ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder Fantasy returning? BW General Discussion ASL22 General Discussion a Announcement on the JEDI Ringing
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro8 Day 4 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 3 [ASL22] Ro8 Day 2
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Zero
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread All you football fans (soccer)! Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Escaping Into Video Games: G…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8936 users

Learning kills joy

Blogs > Fumapl
Post a Reply
Fumapl
Profile Blog Joined September 2017
59 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-09-29 20:10:58
September 29 2017 20:06 GMT
#1
Title sums up my view of the world around me pretty neatly, especially when it comes to video games.

Aquiring new skills by practicing, and learning in general makes me feel frustrated and angry. It's not even a conscious thought that i feel i can control rationally. Facing the fact that i can't just perform tasks, just play and win from time to time, fills me with such huge amounts of anger and despair that's it really hard to take sometimes. There are times when the word "depression" comes to mind, but i've never been diagnosed with anything and that would just be plain offensive to people really fighting with that, I just probably have a very shitty mentality.

Past a certain, pretty low, point i don't get better in anything I do. I learn very slowly and with very little steps, not understanding anything on the fly and having to train every smallest detail at least for some time. Maybe that's why?

I tried to ask myself where do I find joy and fun in playing games? In multiplayer all my positive emotions seem condensed on the win screen, if I don't reach that, any good feelings i maybe had in a game perish forever.

I'm jealous of people enjoying learning, but I don't know how to change, and is it even possible to change. I feel stuck and lost, but on the other hand something pulls me here, theres only so much time I can spend on passive entertainment, and I use it to the fullest, but then the vicious cycle is born.

Wish I was able to learn abilities just through general "doing them", I know many people do.

Wonder if there are other people who feel like me?

Back to losing games on stream, won 1 during ~2h (prolly like 8 or so matches).

***
imgbaby
Profile Blog Joined May 2015
158 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-09-30 08:01:56
September 29 2017 22:03 GMT
#2
Good luck
Like a bird on a wire, like a drunk in some midnight choir I have tried in my way to be free
Jealous
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
10390 Posts
September 30 2017 06:06 GMT
#3
"I'm really not very old, but I have been younger than I am now, and something I wish I hadn't done was inadvertently train myself to be a very low effort, poor work ethic sort of person when I was a kid. I blew a lot of opportunities by putting the minimum amount of effort necessary to get everyone off my back, and now I legitimately have a hard time doing anything I don't want to do.

On a systemic level.

Addictive personality, poor willpower, and a slacker's attitude exacerbated by depressive spells that eat up a large portion of the free time I have."
"The right to vote is only the oar of the slaveship, I wanna be free." -- бум бум сучка!
Chef
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
10810 Posts
October 01 2017 20:41 GMT
#4
I think you got it right with having a poor mentality. In my opinion mentality and attitude can change over time with effort. It's much harder to change your circumstances and opportunities than it is to change your attitude.

You should probably think about it a little more deeply. Avoid jumping to conclusions like "I learn too slow," "I get angry when I lose," "I only like seeing the victory screen." Each of these things deserves more attention and you could work on to improve. You might learn slowly because you lack experience to make connections to things you already know. You might get angry when you lose because you're too focused on validating yourself. You might only enjoy games when you see the victory screen because you're giving too little attention to the other valuable things we get from games.

You might just not like competitive games. Lots of people get a less stressful feeling of progression and learning from single player and cooperative games, where achievement is beating a set challenge and not hitting the moving target that is another person's ability in the game. Competitive games are much harder to just sit down and win a few, because contrary to what you said about some people getting it by just doing it, competitive games in particular often have a study portion to them, especially StarCraft where you can't do anything without memorising build orders.

Anyway, regardless of your intelligence, putting yourself down while you try to learn is going to make it harder to learn. I think anytime I was intimidated by how difficult something seemed, it always became a lot easier to start the learning process accepting I would make mistakes along my way to mastery, that mistakes aren't just an inconvenience along the way, they are the actual knowledge of mastery. Which is just to say you can't take the learning process itself as a sign of your lack of intelligence. Getting upset over mistakes is the attitude problem holding you back.
LEGEND!! LEGEND!!
Glider
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
United States1353 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-10-05 14:45:55
October 05 2017 14:34 GMT
#5
Learning doesn't kill joy. It's all these extra factors you associate and often attach themselves to learning (which ironically is bad habits you learned over time, that make you think learning is to blame.)

Pure learning creates joy. When you mixing in garbage thoughts in there like 1) comparing your learning to others, then having a emotion judgement about it. that certainly can potentially cause negative emotion. 2) the frustration you feel is not from learning but this act of comparison and competing, that fucks up your joy. You place arbitrary emphasis on thoughts like why am I not learning as fast this guy or that person, why am I not improving as fast as i think i should, then feel bad about it. that kill joy.

So it's all these extra crap that kill joy, not the concept of learning itself, which really brings joy. If you only feel good when you are "winning", or if a learning experienced matched your limited expectations, then you should re-evaluate your idea of what you consider is learning.

Need to seriously look at wtf is actually causing you emotion distress. And 9/10 it's ego, and it's competition, it's what you think should happen vs reality. But those are all arbitrary crap decided by your mind. even the fastest learners come across people who school them. Learning by itself is a pure idea that brings joy, the shit YOU attach to it, then blame the whole thing on learning. That's the issue. no one like to look at their own mentality.

You may learn certain things faster or slower than public average. But that's not a good or bad thing. You seem to place a lot more weight on winning and get to certain result in a certain time per your own expectation rather than just enjoy the game, and learn as you go and not give a flying f how you perform as long as you are enjoy yourself, continually improving, how slow or fast that maybe.

I think it really comes down to this, your overly concern about what you think of you, and what YOU think others thinks of you (since it really all comes down to you). You have a messed up idea of "should", when things don't match it, you fuck yourself over with stress. Now that part you should hate, that fucks up the joy. Not learning.

Just my limited opinion.


On September 30 2017 05:06 Fumapl wrote:
Title sums up my view of the world around me pretty neatly, especially when it comes to video games.

Aquiring new skills by practicing, and learning in general makes me feel frustrated and angry. It's not even a conscious thought that i feel i can control rationally. Facing the fact that i can't just perform tasks, just play and win from time to time, fills me with such huge amounts of anger and despair that's it really hard to take sometimes. There are times when the word "depression" comes to mind, but i've never been diagnosed with anything and that would just be plain offensive to people really fighting with that, I just probably have a very shitty mentality.

Past a certain, pretty low, point i don't get better in anything I do. I learn very slowly and with very little steps, not understanding anything on the fly and having to train every smallest detail at least for some time. Maybe that's why?

I tried to ask myself where do I find joy and fun in playing games? In multiplayer all my positive emotions seem condensed on the win screen, if I don't reach that, any good feelings i maybe had in a game perish forever.

I'm jealous of people enjoying learning, but I don't know how to change, and is it even possible to change. I feel stuck and lost, but on the other hand something pulls me here, theres only so much time I can spend on passive entertainment, and I use it to the fullest, but then the vicious cycle is born.

Wish I was able to learn abilities just through general "doing them", I know many people do.

Wonder if there are other people who feel like me?

Back to losing games on stream, won 1 during ~2h (prolly like 8 or so matches).

Jealous
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
10390 Posts
October 05 2017 15:13 GMT
#6
^ Listen to this man.
"The right to vote is only the oar of the slaveship, I wanna be free." -- бум бум сучка!
hp.Shell
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2527 Posts
December 14 2017 23:01 GMT
#7
You need to learn about the other kind of joy, the long, slow-burning, long-lasting type of joy.

When you win or achieve something, you get this sudden burst of joy that is like a huge spike of emotion.

What you want is the kind of joy that comes from getting just a little better at something. Progress. Looking back over days and weeks and seeing how far you've come. Comparing yourself today to who you were yesterday.

This type of joy isn't as big of a spike as the winning type, but you can feel almost as good when you think, "Wow, I'm actually sorta good now." You start to have pride, and you respect yourself when you're good at something.
Please PM me with any songs you like that you think I haven't heard before!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 28m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
mouzHeroMarine 699
UpATreeSC 126
JuggernautJason47
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 17184
Rush 125
Dewaltoss 107
Sexy 27
Bale 12
Dota 2
qojqva2052
monkeys_forever206
Counter-Strike
fl0m1457
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor1928
crisheroes1292
Liquid`Hasu827
Other Games
summit1g4245
Grubby3297
FrodaN713
Beastyqt642
shahzam405
byalli238
ArmadaUGS175
C9.Mang0157
KnowMe156
Mew2King56
Organizations
Other Games
BasetradeTV199
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream94
StarCraft 2
angryscii 28
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• 80smullet 33
• FirePhoenix9
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• imaqtpie866
• WagamamaTV266
• Shiphtur250
Upcoming Events
OSC
4h 28m
Stellar Fest
17h 28m
OSC
1d 2h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 14h
Online Event
1d 15h
FEL
1d 20h
AI Arena Tournament
1d 21h
BSL: Ladder Tournament
1d 23h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
INu's Battles
2 days
herO vs Classic
Percival vs Rogue
[ Show More ]
BSL Open Qualifier
2 days
BSL Open Qualifier
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Rush vs Light
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Soma vs Soulkey
INu's Battles
4 days
SHIN vs Cure
ByuN vs Zoun
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
INu's Battles
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-30
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Calamity Invitational

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.