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On May 27 2014 17:16 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2014 08:18 The_Templar wrote:On May 27 2014 05:52 [BSP]Kain wrote:
I think that most importantly it's totally not worth it and not how difficult it is. ;d Someone has to do it, else there is no ESPORTS. The ones doing it are already very talented and get even better when full time. Get high na GM playing casually, then maybe think about going pro if you`re young enough. Not everyone can be stephano and even he wants to transition into a more viable career.
Doubt there'd be many professionals if everyone was that pragmatic.
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On May 27 2014 23:13 Saechiis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2014 17:16 Scarecrow wrote:On May 27 2014 08:18 The_Templar wrote:On May 27 2014 05:52 [BSP]Kain wrote:
I think that most importantly it's totally not worth it and not how difficult it is. ;d Someone has to do it, else there is no ESPORTS. The ones doing it are already very talented and get even better when full time. Get high na GM playing casually, then maybe think about going pro if you`re young enough. Not everyone can be stephano and even he wants to transition into a more viable career. Doubt there'd be many professionals if everyone was that pragmatic.
You really think pro's are just diamonds/masters who decided to go full time? A mate of mine (NvRossi) with a gaming background consisting of WoW arena went from bronze to arguably the best T in SEA towards the end of WoL, whilst doing a university degree. PiG was already a top Australian zerg before going full time. Now imagine guys with that kind of raw talent or a semi-pro BW background going full-time in a Korean teamhouse... Even if you work your ass off, you're not gonna beat far more talented guys/Koreans who put in the hours. The aspirants that aren't pragmatic are the ones that fail and waste months/years chasing a pipe dream they're not talented enough to catch.
I'm not saying you can't get VERY good at this game if you put in the effort. Just that you'll hit a wall trying to break into the ranks of those making a living off it (top 0.01%) if you're not extremely gifted in the first place.
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Any feedback would be great, I think its a very under-discussed topic IMO.
You are so wrong, it hurts OP.
People have said it a million times before about becoming a pro at video games, and I think it goes more generally for lucrative fun careers: You have to already be in love with the game / what you're doing and be really good already before you consider putting in the dedication it would take to become one of the very best. It's a decision you can make when you already put tonnes of time in without thinking about it just because you liked it. It's just daydreaming in pretty much any other scenario and you should put your time to better use.
The reason for this, I believe, is that it takes an intense interest in the activity and the subtleties of it to keep up the kind of effort and workload that such activities demand. Otherwise you just burn out and start bashing your head against the wall. Even if you were to practice 10 hours a day for years you wouldn't improve much if you didn't have a genuine interest in what you were doing.
Even super gosus like Mondragon who could take a game off a pro in WCG and enjoyed competing as amateurs did not think it was worth it to slave away in a practice house and throw their youths and futures away. It's really a terrible life decision even when you are pretty good.
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On May 27 2014 23:34 Scarecrow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 27 2014 23:13 Saechiis wrote:On May 27 2014 17:16 Scarecrow wrote:On May 27 2014 08:18 The_Templar wrote:On May 27 2014 05:52 [BSP]Kain wrote:
I think that most importantly it's totally not worth it and not how difficult it is. ;d Someone has to do it, else there is no ESPORTS. The ones doing it are already very talented and get even better when full time. Get high na GM playing casually, then maybe think about going pro if you`re young enough. Not everyone can be stephano and even he wants to transition into a more viable career. Doubt there'd be many professionals if everyone was that pragmatic. You really think pro's are just diamonds/masters who decided to go full time? A mate of mine (NvRossi) with a gaming background consisting of WoW arena went from bronze to arguably the best T in SEA towards the end of WoL, whilst doing a university degree. PiG was already a top Australian zerg before going full time. Now imagine guys with that kind of raw talent or a semi-pro BW background going full-time in a Korean teamhouse... Even if you work your ass off, you're not gonna beat far more talented guys/Koreans who put in the hours. The aspirants that aren't pragmatic are the ones that fail and waste months/years chasing a pipe dream they're not talented enough to catch. I'm not saying you can't get VERY good at this game if you put in the effort. Just that you'll hit a wall trying to break into the ranks of those making a living off it (top 0.01%) if you're not extremely gifted in the first place.
I think that someone who waits his entire life to find something he can casually be in the top 1% of isn't going to become a pro at anything. Like I said, there wouldn't be many pro's if all people thought you should only try to reach the top when you're a prescribed age and skill level, as if there's ever any guarantees of succes in any competetive environment. I doubt today's Starcraft pro players made a very calculated decision to play SC2 on a high level.
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Thanks for the all the replies, positive or negative. I love the different views and opinions from the members here at TL 
Most of the comments here make me wonder how anybody can have success in this game, even the current top players. How did they manage to become the best of the best? Luck? Dedication? something else?
I remember playing Snute in some weekly tournament before anybody knew who he was. Of course he crushed me, but looking back it makes me think. How many people do we consistently see in GM season after season, and we have no idea who they are. They're considered "nobodys". Why?
If they are GM they are clearly talented enough, but why are they not "pro's" or on a popular team? A couple have said they might not have the opportunity (or luck), or desire. Like Snute, I played him, he was a good player, and I had no idea who he was. I don't know how he became on TL's radar, but once he was part of the team....he quickly became maybe the best foreigner Zerg right now? He was given the opportunity.
How many top ladder players even want to be part of a team or try for greater success? How many would take that chance if they were given that chance? Maybe that number is just really low in reality.
Another example: There was this guy on Leno I saw, would at the time, made like over $100,000 by doing the contests found on the back of potato chip bags and whatnot. He said he thought about how many people actually do those, and how many of those people actually do those seriously. In the end it he found the competition from the those contests wasn't that big.
I wonder if we all just assume every SC2 player on ladder has the desire to become pro, so of course the odds would be very low. But in reality, how many have serious aspirations about it? A large number....? A small number....?
Couple others have said another big factor is time. Right now PvT is my worst matchup. I know I need to improve, study replays, play practice games, watch streams, do anything and everything to improve. But I can't. No time.
So it takes someone like me twice, maybe three times as long to fix one hole in their play, as opposed to someone being paid to play [for a team] and has more time to focus on fixing a problem.
To me this is the main reason I'm only Diamond. Can't tell you how many times I've thought after a game "oh I need to work on this or that" but completely forget about it because I would then play next 2 or 3 days later.
So, to me, the way I see it, the 2 main factors - time and opportunity need to be on your side to make a serious run at being pro.
Agree to disagree?
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I agree. PvT is just a really difficult match-up, and you really almost need to be the luckier player to win in PvT. Terran has so many options that it makes it hard to prepare for.
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Dont want to rain on anyones parade.
But when you are pro at something it means it is your job and a source of income.
I am a professional programmer - i am an amateur games developer.
If you are talking going pro at sc2 either
1) you have another source of income that pays for your sc2 life which will be a mild supplement to it
2) it is your main source of income.
If its 2) then you get to spend all day playing and training. If it is 1) then you are only playing like 3-4 hours a day assuming you have a healthy life style around a full time job. If you can do that then you are probably good enough ability wise to go pro - that will show in your results at tournaments.
i think a lot of peopel who could become pro probably break themselves trying. and you gotta love them for it
Really its early days for pro gamers in computer games. What we really need are tournaments with buy ins and a payout structure.
Pro gamers are like pro artists or a lot of pro musicians. At some point unless you are lucky (and i believe you make your own luck) you have to accept that you are just unemployed.
I almost went pro playing poker ... having a real job turned out to suit my lifestyle far better. Ill never be good enough at sc2 - or any game now no matter how much time i put in.
As for seriously do it: I think you will find gamers to be a very interesting breed of person. I love gamers because imo the are th ecross section of society that loves to not just own people but practice the skills to figure out how to pick up a task and analyse it in order to figure out how to become an expert. Its very meta imo. Everybody at some point gets very very strong at once game, what they learn doing that becomes what they use to quickly get v good at any game.
your example of the guy doing coupons and shit: He turned it into a game rather than a hobby. When he got good enough for that game to pay his living then he was a pro at it. IMO you do not decide to become pro, you find that you are a pro. I bet many 'pros' dont think they are pro enough and are still aiming to make it pro properly.
Do shit because you enjoy it and for its own sake. If you are not pro and you've been playing since WOL you arnt going to be.
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¸Yea I've been playing since beta of WoL too, I'm diamond also, and all this means that I have a SERIOUS lack of talent, I'm not even CLOSE to having what's required to TRY and turn pro. You have to be realistic about it too.
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When I was in diamond, I got to masters in under three weeks just from playing games. I didn't study anything, I knew next to nothing about build orders, and I wasn't playing for hours every day. I'm just a regular guy. Plenty of other people have done the same thing. It's naive to think that if you just work hard you're going to be able to become a pro. If you're not young and very talented, your chances are incredibly small.
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hard enough for only a select few people to make it 
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Just read all the comments.
To OP:
Just like many others (99%+ of ppl). You don't have the talent to become a real pro. End of story. It's better to get a bitchslap to reality than waste your time trying/thinking.
There are many factors you need to go pro, but the most important one is to have talent in all factors of the game or to exceedingly excel in one/several of them. How to know if you somehwat got talent? Well, praise blizzard for having matchmaking, for other people to host tournaments. Those are easy ways to find out. IMO Grandmaster should be treated as bronze if you want to go pro, if you cannot easily attain grandmaster status on ladder then you should forget about becoming pro.
And don't give me excuses about time. If you really want to become pro, and with that, best of the best, you should be able to obtaining grandmaster should be EASY. Even with only a few games per day.
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EPT
