EPTWhy is Hearthstone so popular despite a superior game having been in existence for years?
Hearthstone Popularity Is Puzzling
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Salv
Canada3083 Posts
Why is Hearthstone so popular despite a superior game having been in existence for years? | ||
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ButteryBoo
Canada22 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
That's really what most of these F2P online TCGs are really--adaptations of MtG mechanics put to an F2P model, which, as it turns out, is what people want. The gameplay of MtG is fine, it's just that the business model makes the barrier to entry very high for people interested in the game, regardless of what level they're interested in it at. There's obviously free options like MWS and Cockatrice, but these essentially lose the collection aspect of the game, which is part of the appeal for casual players. As a result, these only satisfy a very small sub-audience's needs. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
Very forgiving learning curve, satisfying rewards/progression/internet-swag. It's a gold mine. | ||
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Masq
Canada1792 Posts
On September 23 2013 10:53 Salv wrote: Why is X so popular despite a superior game having been in existence for years? | ||
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Xiphos
Canada7507 Posts
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HardlyNever
United States1258 Posts
I've only watched streams of hearthstone, but just from that I can say that the arena version of hearthstone (what seems to be the most popular way to play by far), is much better than the last block of mtg to draft, as far as strategy (I've only drafted twice in m14, and it is pretty meh imo). I'd say the midgame in particular (around turns 5-8) almost always has more "real" choices than your average game of mtg draft. A big part of that is all minions being able to be removal, essentially, but there is more to it than that. Honestly, I don't really like mtg that much anymore, but I think hearthstone has a lot of potential for the future, especially the arena format (I think the "constructed" format is kind of weak right now, but that is many due to a small card pool and some class balance issues they have to work out). | ||
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Cheren
United States2911 Posts
Also you say it has "less strategy" but it's only been out a few months. Blizzard still has lots of time to add mechanics (if they want) and tons of new cards. | ||
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Esoterikk
Canada1256 Posts
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Wuster
1974 Posts
On September 23 2013 11:04 TheYango wrote: MtG honestly could have exploded if they made MODO F2P in the same vein as LoL/etc. They just preferred to get a larger profit margin off a smaller audience. That's really what most of these F2P online TCGs are really--adaptations of MtG mechanics put to an F2P model, which, as it turns out, is what people want. The gameplay of MtG is fine, it's just that the business model makes the barrier to entry very high for people interested in the game, regardless of what level they're interested in it at. There's obviously free options like MWS and Cockatrice, but these essentially lose the collection aspect of the game, which is part of the appeal for casual players. As a result, these only satisfy a very small sub-audience's needs. I'm curious if anyone here's played the WoW TCG, I picked up a demo pack at Blizzcon and it feels quite a bit like Hearthstone (minus raids and questing) so I'm sure part of the hype is tapping into an existing player base. I also don't find it all that similar to Magic other than the basic CCG mechanics. I played a little Magic Online recently and it's much clunkier than Hearststone for the following reasons: Strict phases Defender assigns blocking Defender is always given time to play an instant or w/e in reaction I didn't mind this when I played Magic way back when with friends or at the schoolyard, but IMO it really doesn't work out as an online mechanic. So some people would call this dumbing things down, but I think it was the right call. Personally I really like how they used Heros to differentiate decks rather than the open nature of picking colored / artifact cards too. There's the immediate benefit that this'll be much easier to balance than what MtG has had to deal with. | ||
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Erik.TheRed
United States1655 Posts
On September 23 2013 11:38 Esoterikk wrote: I got a beta key early but never play it anymore, I don't find it fun at all constructed is pretty Pay to win which makes sense as its a TCG and Arena costs to much for too little reward, that and I don't find the game itself THAT fun makes me not play it. Eh? I've heard from most people that one of the things Hearthstone does consistantly well at is NOT being a pay-to-win game, mainly due to the fact that it isn't a TCG but rather a CCG. That means that instead of having to comply to the market value in order to build your deck it's possible to convert your earnings (dust and gold) into those cards that you need. As I understand, this entire process isn't so long-winded that it will take the non-paying player a super long time to get a competitive deck so I doubt hearthstone will be anything more than a "pay to have a short-time advantage on a new deck". | ||
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Tobberoth
Sweden6375 Posts
Magic is a really fun game to play, but it's also ridiculously expensive. WotC just puts a bit of nice paint on paper squares and then sell them as if they were made from silver. In MTGO it's even worse, they just take a photo of said card, then sell it for the same price. Even if you just want to play casually, you can count on having to pay quite a lot to have fun with it. Ease of access... You can buy any magic set and play with it, but it's really not that simple if you want to play it properly, you have to check up on the current sets, what sets are allowed in standard, learn all of these cards, buy them... it's quite a lot of work if you really want to get into it. So yeah, take a person who has a few thousand cards in MTGO and a person who has all of the Hearthstone cards. MTG is deeper and more complex... but most people won't get to that point in MTGO, while they can easily get there in Hearthstone. | ||
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MarlieChurphy
United States2065 Posts
1. Its easy to learn and play (unlike mtg which is daunting with their game of rules that override other rules) 2. Its online an easily accessable via free beta 3. Its got a huge userbase via blizzard fanboys 4. There is a bit of a lull in the fantasy/rpg/nerd roll genre in gaming right now. 5. A lot of Youtubers and popular figures (like some you mentioned) are doing a lot of coverage of it right now. And the reason for this is because of the other reasons above. | ||
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NarutO
Germany18839 Posts
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Steveling
Greece10806 Posts
On another note the hs hype made me want to play a ccg and thus I found out about might and magic duels of champions, imo by far the best. There are 8 blocks to position your creatures with all sorts of positional keywords so it's very tactical. If only they could make a good draft mode it would be perfect. As it is I already haven't logged in doto2 for like the past 2 weeks. | ||
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goody153
44282 Posts
On September 23 2013 15:34 MarlieChurphy wrote: I would say it is popular for a couple of variables: 1. Its easy to learn and play (unlike mtg which is daunting with their game of rules that override other rules) 2. Its online an easily accessable via free beta 3. Its got a huge userbase via blizzard fanboys 4. There is a bit of a lull in the fantasy/rpg/nerd roll genre in gaming right now. 5. A lot of Youtubers and popular figures (like some you mentioned) are doing a lot of coverage of it right now. And the reason for this is because of the other reasons above. regarding number 1 .. MTG actually has a easier rules of the game .. its one of the easiest card games i tried .. and has the most entertaining deck building ever tried YugiOh ? every card has a rule of its own and sometimes overlaps the rules sometimes other card sometimes it doesnt .. not to mention its rules change almost every month | ||
520
United States2822 Posts
On September 23 2013 11:39 Wuster wrote: I'm curious if anyone here's played the WoW TCG, I picked up a demo pack at Blizzcon and it feels quite a bit like Hearthstone (minus raids and questing) so I'm sure part of the hype is tapping into an existing player base. I also don't find it all that similar to Magic other than the basic CCG mechanics. I played a little Magic Online recently and it's much clunkier than Hearststone for the following reasons: Strict phases Defender assigns blocking Defender is always given time to play an instant or w/e in reaction I didn't mind this when I played Magic way back when with friends or at the schoolyard, but IMO it really doesn't work out as an online mechanic. So some people would call this dumbing things down, but I think it was the right call. Personally I really like how they used Heros to differentiate decks rather than the open nature of picking colored / artifact cards too. There's the immediate benefit that this'll be much easier to balance than what MtG has had to deal with. The WoW TCG was amazing. It was like Magic if Magic were based around Commander being the main competitive format instead of normal Constructed. It's a shame it's dead forever now. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On September 24 2013 05:28 scintilliaSD wrote: The WoW TCG was amazing. It was like Magic if Magic were based around Commander being the main competitive format instead of normal Constructed. It's a shame it's dead forever now. I used play Arenas with a guy who won $10000 in a WoW TCG tournament. Just wanted to name drop without a name  | ||
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moopie
12605 Posts
On September 23 2013 15:34 MarlieChurphy wrote: I would say it is popular for a couple of variables: 1. Its easy to learn and play (unlike mtg which is daunting with their game of rules that override other rules) 2. Its online an easily accessable via free beta 3. Its got a huge userbase via blizzard fanboys 4. There is a bit of a lull in the fantasy/rpg/nerd roll genre in gaming right now. 5. A lot of Youtubers and popular figures (like some you mentioned) are doing a lot of coverage of it right now. And the reason for this is because of the other reasons above. Thats what I think too. The popularity of Blizzard + simple rules + not TOO many cards so that casuals can get familiar with all the mechanics relatively fast. | ||
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Kreb
4834 Posts
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Xiron
Germany1233 Posts
On September 23 2013 10:53 Salv wrote: Why is Hearthstone so popular despite a superior game having been in existence for years? Why is SC2 so popular despite a superior game having been in existence for years? Because it's new, easier accessible and trendy. Watch Hearthstones popularity shrink within the next 1-2 months. Then it won't even be on the front page of twitch anymore. | ||
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MarlieChurphy
United States2065 Posts
On September 23 2013 22:30 goody153 wrote: regarding number 1 .. MTG actually has a easier rules of the game .. its one of the easiest card games i tried .. and has the most entertaining deck building ever tried YugiOh ? every card has a rule of its own and sometimes overlaps the rules sometimes other card sometimes it doesnt .. not to mention its rules change almost every month In repsonse to NarutO, and you. The game is harder to learn and play than Hearthstone. That's my point. It takes longer, the rules are more convoluted and specific with phases and modifers to base rules etc. Every new set that comes out also changes how the card text is read or adds some new rules or card types or whatever. It is essentially a game of rules and rule changes. Whether you think this is hard or not, it's still a fuckton more to learn and is essentially harder on that basis. | ||
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Ettick
United States2434 Posts
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LuckyFool
United States9015 Posts
I guess it really does appeal to casuals, I still don't get how/why beta keys are going for 200-300+ on ebay though. Seems absurd. | ||
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FallDownMarigold
United States3710 Posts
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moopie
12605 Posts
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TheTenthDoc
United States9561 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On September 24 2013 16:28 moopie wrote: MTG has a huge card base. If you as a potential player want to play against others, you have to familiarize yourself with what potential cards/decks they might throw at you. There are more than 10000 different cards in the game, and for people wanting to learn MTG that's pretty daunting. That's not really a compelling argument because given how cards are divided into formats, you're pretty rarely going to be exposed to more cards than you can handle unless you willingly choose to do so. | ||
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Wuster
1974 Posts
I'm sure a lot of people have the same mentality of writing off Magic unintentionally. | ||
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Thrill
2599 Posts
MODO client is not accessible to new players. Blizzard > WotC | ||
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MarlieChurphy
United States2065 Posts
On September 25 2013 06:58 Thrill wrote: MtG handles mana & mulligan in really shitty ways. MODO client is not accessible to new players. Blizzard > WotC That probably the one thing that I didn't fully understand. How does that work exactly? I see people select a few cards and then it randomly draws ones you don't choose? But then you start with 7 cards right? | ||
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ninazerg
United States7291 Posts
On September 23 2013 10:53 Salv wrote: Why is Hearthstone so popular despite a superior game having been in existence for years? I've been wondering that since 2010. | ||
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prOxi.swAMi
Australia3091 Posts
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Tal
United Kingdom1018 Posts
I also feel like it's too damn complicated, but not actually that deep. Once you understand some of the more tricky interactions, the best play is often obvious. I still really enjoy playing, but am glad we're seeing people try to do better, as there's a lot of room for improvement. Still didn't get a hearthstone beta key, but I'll try it when it comes out. | ||
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