• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 20:22
CET 02:22
KST 10:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting10[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3
Community News
[BSL21] RO32 Group Stage0Weekly Cups (Oct 26-Nov 2): Liquid, Clem, Solar win; LAN in Philly2Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win62025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales!10BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION3
StarCraft 2
General
RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" Weekly Cups (Oct 26-Nov 2): Liquid, Clem, Solar win; LAN in Philly Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four
Tourneys
Monday Nights Weeklies SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia $3,500 WardiTV Korean Royale S4 Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace
Brood War
General
SnOw on 'Experimental' Nonstandard Maps in ASL [BSL21] RO32 Group Stage [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions Ladder Map Matchup Stats SnOw's ASL S20 Finals Review
Tourneys
BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION [ASL20] Grand Finals Small VOD Thread 2.0 The Casual Games of the Week Thread
Strategy
How to stay on top of macro? Current Meta PvZ map balance Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Dawn of War IV Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread ZeroSpace Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Dating: How's your luck? Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The Big Reveal
Peanutsc
Challenge: Maths isn't all…
Hildegard
Career Paths and Skills for …
TrAiDoS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1651 users

too much on casual

Blogs > StatixEx
Post a Reply
StatixEx
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United Kingdom779 Posts
October 20 2012 16:35 GMT
#1
in response to a thread that was closed "the casual player or something"

My personal thoughts on this is that this in not a casual game as its not automated enough and when i look at all the games i play this IS the hardest to do well and there is so much frustration involved.

Games take too long (unless u simply play the art of 1 basecheese/allin, and even this takes some time for you to read up on the game and execute it well)you finally die and start again. look at all the games where all the nubs migrate to, lol, cod, whatever game really i dont mean that really . . youre playing again in 3 secs when you die. Sc2 you could have 20-60 minute per game to lose to a spam of unitA and not be able to do anything about it only go over the replay and see just how much you sucked that last game. To play again with it all in mind but forget to do it!

Sc2 is a hard and demanding game. it will never have a casual base. Im a school teacher and 1200 kids have NEVER heard of starcraft when i disclose this is my favourite game. this is the only evidence you need. The people ive introduced it to soon came round to saying that they wasted their money.... the game is shit! (actual words) . . . nubs! i wont have anyone over 10 years younger than me tell me about gaming! they simply want pewPew for 5mins and feel instant Opness in their play.

Sc2 im sorry is for the real gamer. If you belong to this crew just think yourself lucky your part of a more mature (not all time of course) intellectual way to play. We should stop with all this make sc2 the no1 game in the world, to do this you have to introduce a leveling system and custom skins! jk of course!


*
mordk
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Chile8385 Posts
October 20 2012 17:13 GMT
#2
The thing is... hard games like this need a casual base to get viewers. Casuals form by far the largest pool of people in any given game. Like Grubby said, one of the reasons WC3 scene lived long was the DotA player base, who could easily relate to the normal WC3 game and thus watch,

I see what you're saying, but for SC2 to survive as an e-sport it needs watchers. If you just want a tough game to play yourself and don't really care about big competitions etc, then I agree.

I say don't make the game easier, not at all. Make it so custom games are better, the distribution platforms for them are better, and the bnet 0.2 social features are stronger. That will keep SC2 healthy.
StatixEx
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United Kingdom779 Posts
October 20 2012 17:40 GMT
#3
agreed, yes, its why cod gets near double the sales over games like halo. the fan base. the game of course to thrive in this kind of environment needs to attract more gamers constantly playing the game. As well you have to consider this game is £30 standard at least! the other ones which are steam rolling massive are free. youll never beat a free game when your main demographic is supposed to be 11 - 24. I did my degree in game programming and had to explore all of this and even then we found counterstrike was the prefered game because people could pick up a £5 copy of half life and then dl cs and tf for free. Even unreal with tac ops made some waves and then came all of the other mods! were great times but now with the idea of an esport and sponsors, unless blizz makes this game free to play somehow youll never get the numbers over these other games. . i mean, i played lol just this morning . .its a good game (not my thing tho) and i have paid nothing for a generally great game! I think this whole argument might come down to ltd or plc companies and the decisions made by the shareholders
DanLee
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada316 Posts
October 20 2012 20:08 GMT
#4
On October 21 2012 02:13 mordk wrote:
The thing is... hard games like this need a casual base to get viewers. Casuals form by far the largest pool of people in any given game. Like Grubby said, one of the reasons WC3 scene lived long was the DotA player base, who could easily relate to the normal WC3 game and thus watch,

I see what you're saying, but for SC2 to survive as an e-sport it needs watchers. If you just want a tough game to play yourself and don't really care about big competitions etc, then I agree.

I say don't make the game easier, not at all. Make it so custom games are better, the distribution platforms for them are better, and the bnet 0.2 social features are stronger. That will keep SC2 healthy.

it's called battle.net 2.0 I think
nty
AnachronisticAnarchy
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States2957 Posts
October 20 2012 22:53 GMT
#5
On October 21 2012 05:08 DanLee wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 21 2012 02:13 mordk wrote:
The thing is... hard games like this need a casual base to get viewers. Casuals form by far the largest pool of people in any given game. Like Grubby said, one of the reasons WC3 scene lived long was the DotA player base, who could easily relate to the normal WC3 game and thus watch,

I see what you're saying, but for SC2 to survive as an e-sport it needs watchers. If you just want a tough game to play yourself and don't really care about big competitions etc, then I agree.

I say don't make the game easier, not at all. Make it so custom games are better, the distribution platforms for them are better, and the bnet 0.2 social features are stronger. That will keep SC2 healthy.

it's called battle.net 2.0 I think


Not a typo. Many people think that battle.net 2.0 was a huge step down from its predecessor, thus battle.net 0.2.
"How are you?" "I am fine, because it is not normal to scream in pain."
iPlaY.NettleS
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Australia4354 Posts
October 20 2012 23:08 GMT
#6
Yeah but look at BW.Casuals didn't play ladder they played pub 3v3 BGH , Fastest map possible and UMS games.
SC2 puts you into the straightjacket of ladder because it's so easy to get ladder games compared to customs due to the new bnet system.Nexus Wars, Desert Strike and turret defense games have been in the top 10 since the game launched and no-one joins games on page 3 and more - once the casual audience gets bored of the same old customs they drop off and stop playing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7PvoI6gvQs
DanLee
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada316 Posts
October 21 2012 07:00 GMT
#7
On October 21 2012 07:53 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 21 2012 05:08 DanLee wrote:
On October 21 2012 02:13 mordk wrote:
The thing is... hard games like this need a casual base to get viewers. Casuals form by far the largest pool of people in any given game. Like Grubby said, one of the reasons WC3 scene lived long was the DotA player base, who could easily relate to the normal WC3 game and thus watch,

I see what you're saying, but for SC2 to survive as an e-sport it needs watchers. If you just want a tough game to play yourself and don't really care about big competitions etc, then I agree.

I say don't make the game easier, not at all. Make it so custom games are better, the distribution platforms for them are better, and the bnet 0.2 social features are stronger. That will keep SC2 healthy.

it's called battle.net 2.0 I think


Not a typo. Many people think that battle.net 2.0 was a huge step down from its predecessor, thus battle.net 0.2.

It's called battle.net 2.0 I think
nty
Blisse
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada3710 Posts
October 21 2012 07:12 GMT
#8
I always think the problem was playing 30-40 minutes to just... lose is too frustrating. Then having this happen 100, 200, 300 times with no concrete or obvious reason why. Or that the reason why is so blatantly obvious, but you still do it another 100 times and lose the same way.

And each of those 100 times is another 20 minute game of, "ugh why can't I play better," instead of "whoa, even though I'm crap, that was so fun, like DotA or LoL or Halo." You don't really notice that you're crap in those games.

It hurts because it takes so much energy, mental and physical effort to continue playing and not hate yourself for sucking. And then you still do when you're better. (this is also the reason it's so wtf watching Stephano not care and still crush)

They're the reason I love playing Starcraft and watching good Starcraft players game the crap out of each other, but also why I hate playing ranked or watching frustrating losses. And they're also the reason the ladder can't be "casual".
There is no one like you in the universe.
Kazahk
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States385 Posts
October 21 2012 07:45 GMT
#9
On October 21 2012 16:12 Blisse wrote:
I always think the problem was playing 30-40 minutes to just... lose is too frustrating. Then having this happen 100, 200, 300 times with no concrete or obvious reason why. Or that the reason why is so blatantly obvious, but you still do it another 100 times and lose the same way.

And each of those 100 times is another 20 minute game of, "ugh why can't I play better," instead of "whoa, even though I'm crap, that was so fun, like DotA or LoL or Halo." You don't really notice that you're crap in those games.

It hurts because it takes so much energy, mental and physical effort to continue playing and not hate yourself for sucking. And then you still do when you're better. (this is also the reason it's so wtf watching Stephano not care and still crush)

They're the reason I love playing Starcraft and watching good Starcraft players game the crap out of each other, but also why I hate playing ranked or watching frustrating losses. And they're also the reason the ladder can't be "casual".

I love it. Then again I am a cool minded and analytical individual.
Rngesus blessed me with a tooth half, then shunned me with a spinach roll.
Tipany
Profile Joined November 2010
United States368 Posts
October 21 2012 08:15 GMT
#10
On October 21 2012 08:08 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:
Yeah but look at BW.Casuals didn't play ladder they played pub 3v3 BGH , Fastest map possible and UMS games.
SC2 puts you into the straightjacket of ladder because it's so easy to get ladder games compared to customs due to the new bnet system.Nexus Wars, Desert Strike and turret defense games have been in the top 10 since the game launched and no-one joins games on page 3 and more - once the casual audience gets bored of the same old customs they drop off and stop playing.

Essentially what this guy said is where SC2 and Bnet 2.0 failed. Blizzard took all the steps in the wrong direction and killed off the UMS/casual base.
wat.
StatixEx
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United Kingdom779 Posts
October 21 2012 08:59 GMT
#11
@kazahk, you know i think i posted the very same thing in the destiny thread. Me persoanlly love the game too much but you are right. its all well and good listening to all of these pros, buying coaching and then having that magical inspiting moment where you think youve nailed it, only to launch a game and forget what youre doing because the games nature. Holy shit im being attacked at 6 minutes WTF . . my X isnt down yet . . then the frustration wheel starts again!

Great addition to the thread that, its a big factor kids who want quick gaming cant get their heads around, hence lol is a 30 minute game but you can clearly see what you have to do and to be fair if ur in a PUG u can just blame the group but have the ^^ feeling you played really well ^^.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
23:00
WardiTV Mondays #57
CranKy Ducklings143
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SpeCial 262
Nathanias 76
Livibee 52
CosmosSc2 50
StarCraft: Brood War
Horang2 4485
NaDa 63
Dota 2
PGG 189
Counter-Strike
taco 18
Other Games
summit1g9828
tarik_tv6127
shahzam610
C9.Mang0271
Maynarde129
ToD53
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1070
Counter-Strike
PGL241
Other Games
BasetradeTV120
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta25
• Sammyuel 10
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21335
League of Legends
• Stunt254
Other Games
• Scarra572
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
8h 38m
WardiTV Korean Royale
10h 38m
LAN Event
13h 38m
Replay Cast
1d 7h
WardiTV Korean Royale
1d 10h
LAN Event
1d 13h
OSC
1d 21h
The PondCast
2 days
LAN Event
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
LAN Event
3 days
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
4 days
LAN Event
4 days
IPSL
4 days
dxtr13 vs OldBoy
Napoleon vs Doodle
Replay Cast
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
5 days
LAN Event
5 days
IPSL
5 days
JDConan vs WIZARD
WolFix vs Cross
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 21 Points
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025

Upcoming

BSL Season 21
SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.