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aTnClouD
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Italy2428 Posts
October 09 2012 09:05 GMT
#101
Having been through deep depression for years and out of it I just realized that the thought op is giving was exactly what I was saying all the time to myself while in fact I was just not able to see that I wished for a different life all along and I couldn't make up with my ego to admit I failed in what I expected of myself when I was growing up, which ultimately made me feel empty and often unhappy. Not sure for how many depressed people this applies, but I was just blind in front of my problems and ultimately giving up my ego was the solution and after that I was able to look deep inside into myself, which made me realize what the real issue was and I ultimately got out of the emotional loop repeating itself every few months.
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/hunter692007/kruemelmonsteryn0.gif
inSeason
Profile Joined October 2010
United States40 Posts
October 09 2012 09:08 GMT
#102
On October 09 2012 15:56 JustToTry wrote:
I wanted to make an account just to reply to NonY's initial post. I'm not great at writing concise paragraphs, but I'll do my best.

+ Show Spoiler +
I've been battling depression for almost 9 years at this point. The only time that I ever admitted to somebody that I suffered from it was when I was recovering from a surgery earlier this year, in which while I was under the influence of a ton of pain killers and awakening from my anesthetic, I had an emotional breakdown in front of my mother and my surgeon about it (completely unrelated to the surgery I was having). The level of severity of my depression has plateaued at this point, but I can also say that it's worse than ever.

The one thing major thing that I believe I've learned from my experience with depression is how little we, as humans, are in control of what we think and our emotions and thoughts. You may respond with "Mind over matter, always", but that's not quite what I mean. What I mean is, is that no matter feelings you feel at any moment, your brain is still just like a computer, and there are still chemical reactions that affect your ability to control or change your feelings and thoughts at any point. I think of people who are able to push themselves really far mentally and physically, or who are great motivational speakers and will say something about how they live each day like it's their last, or how they might as well die if they don't push the limits. I strongly believe that this mindset is more of a result of their current mental state than an initiation to change their internal state. These type of positive mental states just can't be achieved with any psychology or inspiration, from my experience. Depression, as I think of it, is more than just an alteration of mental state, but rather an entire alteration of your brains programming, which makes me baffled as to how it begins (it started for me when I was going through puberty, so maybe it's genetic?).

I've tried anti-depressants, but they never worked. I've been taking ADHD medication for just over a year (since my diagnosis), and oddly enough, it greatly improves my motivation for a short period, yet I still feel completely hopeless at the same time. I've never felt stranger in my life than I do when that medication is working in full force. I feel like I could talk to anybody about how to improve their life, yet, feel like I want to end my own life simultaneously. Confusing to say the least.

My point in this rant is that one could argue that "this isn't Tyler speaking". Sure, I guess, but I actually believe that anybody can be anybody at any point. What you consider to be "you" is almost irrelevant to me. You can be naturally quiet and reserved, but you could probably be normally outgoing with the correct alteration of chemicals in your brain. I want to say that Tyler probably isn't as in control of his feelings as you may speak. I saw somebody earlier post something about how was going to propose to his girlfriend even though he was depressed because he knew blah blah blah blah blah. You still feel purpose in proposing to your girlfriend? Hmm, maybe your depression is different from mine then, because in my depression, having a girlfriend or not really doesn't make a difference. In my depression, I don't "care" if I'm ever happy. What I 'want' in my depression is to continue to feel as little as possible. I have some deep reasons that ensure I'll never commit suicide, so hopefully I can just live this life while feeling as little as possible. "Purpose" feels more trivial than ever. I will start practicing something on my piano, screw up, have no real to keep going, and stop playing for the night while pausing for a short moment to try to remember why I started playing in the first place.

I often think of great composers and artists who had "blue periods" or "sad periods" and often painted pictures and composed music to reflect it. I find this amazing, seeing as my experience with depression has been, more than ever, deprived of any sensation at all. I see their paintings and think "wow... this is amazing... how the hell can you paint this while feel depressed? They must not feel depressed, they must feel sad or something", because for my depression, my world is smaller than ever. It's small whether I'm in my room, at a party, at a concert, or at a family dinner. I don't think I can ever write a song in this state. I can't think of anything original in this state. I feel almost nothing and can't think of anything outside of the current state I'm in. My life is like dried oatmeal; everything is dark grey, dark grey, dark grey, there's no change in color or shade at all. If I found out that my family was killed in a car accident, I might think "Oh no, this is the worst thing to have ever happened in my life. I feel like shit. Actually, to be honest, I don't feel any different than usual. I feel like shit everyday". It's very, very hard to admit that I probably wouldn't feel any different if something like that happened to my family, but honestly, everyday single day I feel the same way that I would if my family died.

My point in this is that I realize that for me, and probably for NonY, we are actually in the least amount of control of "changing" our current state than ever. NonY admitted that he believes nothing has a purpose, and that's how I feel, but I also know that there may have been one day, or one hour, or maybe just one minute in the last 5 years where if you asked him the same question about purpose in life that he would have had a different answer. But that time isn't now, and he probably isn't in a state where you are going to get an ounce of optimism or change in him. He may be able to look back in the next few months, or years, and think that his reactions to all of these things are really stupid, but he definitely can't do that now.... at least if he's anything like me he can't. Not while suffering from depression.


tl;dr..... just don't read it. It's too long, and I can't shorten anything from it.


Paragraph 5 is exactly how I feel. By definition, I think my parents might be what is considered the most adequate parents, very wealth and very caring. Nonetheless, if one of them drop dead, it would just be another day.

Okay, I'm going to skip all the shit about how we relate, questions.

Do you ever laugh because you feel like you should be laughing in a situation? Almost like a projection of how you think feelings should be?

Do you ever feel like you're kidding yourself? That perhaps you do care about everything?

Every time I spend time with other people, I might feel fine in the moment, but afterwards I feel like the whole thing was a waste of time. This happens every time without fail. Does this happen to you?

I ask this, because sometimes I feel that my body is fucking with me almost. Like my emotions are just a cruel joke.
The Fruit Has Been Dealt!
lannisport
Profile Joined February 2012
878 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-09 09:28:59
October 09 2012 09:18 GMT
#103
There is meaning and purpose everywhere, in fact even in places where there is none we humans tend to impose one anyway. Depression sucks because it robs you of your ability to do this. It's not merely "feeling sad". No, not everybody "gets depressed" from time to time. It's much deeper than that. It's more of a loss. A great loss. A loss of motivation, all the joy in your life, a loss of any sense of control in your life.

Think about something that you find completely dull and meaningless. Like doing an entire sink of dishes. Think about how that feels in your gut and body.Then make a list of everything in life that energizes you and makes you feel alive. Maybe seeing Jangbi win the last ever OSL final, laughing until you cry with a buddy, doing a noble deed, sex with your girlfriend, going to a concert of your favourite band, eating the best sushi you've tasted, accomplishing something--think of your most primal and greatest desires. Now imagine that instead of feeling that oh so sweet ecstasy as you do these activities, replacing that instead with that feeling you get doing a sink full of dishes. That's the start of major depression. That sweet kiss from your girlfriend that would've normally felt like the greatest thing in the world? A plate to scrub. Your favourite tv show? A pot to wipe.

And that's when things start to feel hopeless. And why it doesn't matter if you're surrounded by people who love you or that you've accomplished great things in life.
zefreak
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States2731 Posts
October 09 2012 09:29 GMT
#104
On October 09 2012 13:55 vOdToasT wrote:
1: Why would you need a "meaning" when you can master magnificent things like musical instruments, or StarCraft: Brood War? Those things are motivation enough to get out of bed.

2: Why would you need a "meaning" when you can try to understand the universe? You yourself are part of the universe, and you were created in the universe, by the universe. When you investigate and understand the universe, something self-aware and conscious that was created by something that is not conscious, asks what the universe is and how it works. So it's actually the universe asking itself what it is, and attempting to answer it, in the form of you. And that's pretty fucking awesome.

3: Concepts like " good ", " bad "; " evil ", " healthy " and " unhealthy " are words that humans attached to existing things. What is health, when you really think about it? It is certain configurations of protons, neutrons, and electrons in a creature's body. And even though the standards for what is healthy change over time (Dying at the age of 50 is unhealthy today, but wasn't in the past), we can OBJECTIVELY say that some creatures are more healthy than others. Even though we invented the concept of health, and even though the standards for health change over time, it is a fact that some creatures are more healthy than others. The word " health " is describing something that would exist whether the word existed or not. Whether humans would observe it, or understand it, or not.

Now, if you replace the word health with evil, that wall of text would still be correct. Suffering is universally disliked by living creatures. The very definition of suffering means that you dislike it. One physical sensation or emotion might be suffering for one creature and not for another, but suffering is disliked by both. Suffering is objectively bad for living
creatures.

Remember that " good " and " bad " are concepts invented by living creatures. The universe itself does not care whether you have a good or a bad life, whether you suffer or not. But it is, as a matter of fact, bad for living creatures to suffer, and good for them not to. For THEM. Not for the universe, but for them.

We have observed and imagined things like being raped, having your eyeballs removed with a knife, and having your intestines cut to pieces while in your belly, and we have assigned the word " bad " to them. We haven't decided that those things are bad, we have only assigned a word to describe what they are. And to us, they are, as a matter of fact, bad. (Because they make you suffer)

It is bad for life to suffer, and good for it not to.

The universe doesn't care whether things are good or bad, but there are things that are objectively good, and objectively bad, for living creatures.

As a living creature, I have decided to enter the struggle for justice, to reduce suffering. To make things better for all life.

PS: I am aware that it's not objectively better for me just because things are better for other life forms, but that huge wall of text can be applied to yourself. When you make your life better, it's objectively better. What your life just became is what the word " good " means. I think you should at least care about that, even if you don't care about making the situation better for other life forms. That's why you should master a musical instrument, Brood War, or live with someone you love!

PPS: I suppose if you ONLY care about making things good for yourself, and not making the universe good, then you might as well kill yourself since it doesn't matter when you are dead anyway. But the reason I live is to make the world good.


Your reasoning is a bit off. Health is arbitrary, as is good and evil.
www.gosu-sc.com - Starcraft News, Strategy and Merchandise
WrathOfAiur
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany243 Posts
October 09 2012 09:39 GMT
#105
If you look at it from an evolutionary standpoint, the only purpose is to survive to reproduce. being happy is not really a goal or a purpose in itself, but a tool to secure survival. so the default setting of a human is to seek happiness. being depressed or even having self-destructive behavior is of course not helping to survive.

it turns out environmental factors have a much larger role in these "mental illnesses" than previously thought. Although some people are genetically predisposed for such things, you can change the gene expressions by changing environmental factors.

humans today eat and live pretty unnaturally compared to 20.000+ years ago, but our genes haven't changed that much since then.

Environment and “experience-dependent adaptability.” That’s the crux of epigenetics. We have more influence on our mental and physical health than we previously thought. While we can’t control every aspect of our environment or our emotional experiences, we have the considerable potential to ameliorate those factors. In terms of physical health, we can eat well, supplement wisely, exercise strategically, sleep adequately, and reduce our exposure to toxins as much as possible. For our mental health, we can do all of the above as well as learn effective ways to cope with the stress in our lives (as well as find overall fulfillment). While physical activity can help us feel less stressed in the short term, a personally beneficial meditation practice (yoga, Tai Chi, Transcendental, etc.) can fundamentally change our response to stress. Over time, our efforts can potentially modify the expression of those genes that are involved in stress response and very likely related areas of mental health like anxiety and depression. While some of us might be more genetically predisposed to certain physical and mental health conditions, epigenetics offers hope that our own choices and practices can play a significant role in their prevention and treatment.

source: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/epigenetics-and-depression/#ixzz28nCJtk97

a major factor seems to be stress. but stress means also physical stress. sitting in front of a computer all day can be a factor. but physical stress can be caused by little things like inflammations on a cellular level. let's say you eat too much omega-6 fatty acids compared to omega-3. you probably have systemic inflammation without even realizing it and thus are more stressed. all these little things can add up.
GhostFall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States830 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-09 09:45:11
October 09 2012 09:43 GMT
#106
so if I'm getting this right, you don't feel a particularly strong will to survive, or a particularly desire to be happy, because in the end whats the point behind it? The universe is this large vast thing, and even if you lived forever, anything you ever did would be worthless in grand scheme of things, if there is a grand scheme of things.

So I'm in complete agreement that there is no point in life. There is no meaning, there is no purpose. But I've always found it easy to justify (1) feeling a will to survive and (2) feeling a desire to be happy.

Completely ignoring the depression and just thinking about things rationally, I think it's safe to say being alive and sentient is better than not being alive and sentient. It's a simple value system. Being alive may hold no value compared to the universe, but to you a person, it holds some non zero amount. Any non zero amount is better than a zero amount. So you could say a will to survive comes from the simple fact that surviving is better than not surviving.

Similarly, the desire to be happy is better than no desire to be happy. The argument is very similar. A desire to be happy compared to no desire to be happy holds pretty much no value to the universe, but holds some personal value to you. And even though, you ultimately may and most likely also have no value to universe, in a model of everything there is a positive in the desire to be happy side. And thus, following this line of reasoning you can say a desire to be happy at some infinitesimal point holds a non zero positive value, versus the zero value of no desire to be happy.

Now for whatever reason, your brain is wired up so that a desire to be happy holds little value to you. So when you ask yourself "What is the point of having a desire to be happy, the value is essentially nothing?". And I guess this is where your blog post stems from. This is an incorrect question. Instead you should ask, "What holds greater value, a desire to be happy which has basically zero value, or no desire to be happy which does has zero value?".

Of course that is a rational explanation. Depression I imagine can be irrational, but it doesn't hrut to bring some rational thought into a system.
Random()
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Kyrgyz Republic1462 Posts
October 09 2012 09:56 GMT
#107
On October 09 2012 15:56 JustToTry wrote:
I wanted to make an account just to reply to NonY's initial post. I'm not great at writing concise paragraphs, but I'll do my best.

I've been battling depression for almost 9 years at this point. The only time that I ever admitted to somebody that I suffered from it was when I was recovering from a surgery earlier this year, in which while I was under the influence of a ton of pain killers and awakening from my anesthetic, I had an emotional breakdown in front of my mother and my surgeon about it (completely unrelated to the surgery I was having). The level of severity of my depression has plateaued at this point, but I can also say that it's worse than ever.

The one thing major thing that I believe I've learned from my experience with depression is how little we, as humans, are in control of what we think and our emotions and thoughts. You may respond with "Mind over matter, always", but that's not quite what I mean. What I mean is, is that no matter feelings you feel at any moment, your brain is still just like a computer, and there are still chemical reactions that affect your ability to control or change your feelings and thoughts at any point. I think of people who are able to push themselves really far mentally and physically, or who are great motivational speakers and will say something about how they live each day like it's their last, or how they might as well die if they don't push the limits. I strongly believe that this mindset is more of a result of their current mental state than an initiation to change their internal state. These type of positive mental states just can't be achieved with any psychology or inspiration, from my experience. Depression, as I think of it, is more than just an alteration of mental state, but rather an entire alteration of your brains programming, which makes me baffled as to how it begins (it started for me when I was going through puberty, so maybe it's genetic?).

I've tried anti-depressants, but they never worked. I've been taking ADHD medication for just over a year (since my diagnosis), and oddly enough, it greatly improves my motivation for a short period, yet I still feel completely hopeless at the same time. I've never felt stranger in my life than I do when that medication is working in full force. I feel like I could talk to anybody about how to improve their life, yet, feel like I want to end my own life simultaneously. Confusing to say the least.

My point in this rant is that one could argue that "this isn't Tyler speaking". Sure, I guess, but I actually believe that anybody can be anybody at any point. What you consider to be "you" is almost irrelevant to me. You can be naturally quiet and reserved, but you could probably be normally outgoing with the correct alteration of chemicals in your brain. I want to say that Tyler probably isn't as in control of his feelings as you may speak. I saw somebody earlier post something about how was going to propose to his girlfriend even though he was depressed because he knew blah blah blah blah blah. You still feel purpose in proposing to your girlfriend? Hmm, maybe your depression is different from mine then, because in my depression, having a girlfriend or not really doesn't make a difference. In my depression, I don't "care" if I'm ever happy. What I 'want' in my depression is to continue to feel as little as possible. I have some deep reasons that ensure I'll never commit suicide, so hopefully I can just live this life while feeling as little as possible. "Purpose" feels more trivial than ever. I will start practicing something on my piano, screw up, have no real to keep going, and stop playing for the night while pausing for a short moment to try to remember why I started playing in the first place.

I often think of great composers and artists who had "blue periods" or "sad periods" and often painted pictures and composed music to reflect it. I find this amazing, seeing as my experience with depression has been, more than ever, deprived of any sensation at all. I see their paintings and think "wow... this is amazing... how the hell can you paint this while feel depressed? They must not feel depressed, they must feel sad or something", because for my depression, my world is smaller than ever. It's small whether I'm in my room, at a party, at a concert, or at a family dinner. I don't think I can ever write a song in this state. I can't think of anything original in this state. I feel almost nothing and can't think of anything outside of the current state I'm in. My life is like dried oatmeal; everything is dark grey, dark grey, dark grey, there's no change in color or shade at all. If I found out that my family was killed in a car accident, I might think "Oh no, this is the worst thing to have ever happened in my life. I feel like shit. Actually, to be honest, I don't feel any different than usual. I feel like shit everyday". It's very, very hard to admit that I probably wouldn't feel any different if something like that happened to my family, but honestly, everyday single day I feel the same way that I would if my family died.

My point in this is that I realize that for me, and probably for NonY, we are actually in the least amount of control of "changing" our current state than ever. NonY admitted that he believes nothing has a purpose, and that's how I feel, but I also know that there may have been one day, or one hour, or maybe just one minute in the last 5 years where if you asked him the same question about purpose in life that he would have had a different answer. But that time isn't now, and he probably isn't in a state where you are going to get an ounce of optimism or change in him. He may be able to look back in the next few months, or years, and think that his reactions to all of these things are really stupid, but he definitely can't do that now.... at least if he's anything like me he can't. Not while suffering from depression.

tl;dr..... just don't read it. It's too long, and I can't shorten anything from it.


Wow, the second paragraph is exactly the realization that I have come to. I tried, however, to be open about all that with my parents and they just don't get it, they simply can't grasp the physiological nature of it. I tried comparing it to someone having a maimed leg while others would shout at them all the time for not being able to run properly, and saying something like "Dude, just come play basketball with us. How hard can it be to run? You just have to shake it off and do it". You can't "shake off" a physically damaged limb in exactly the same way as you can't "shake off" a malfunctioning brain. There is no reasoning yourself out of a broken leg, you simply have to live with it.
FeltFace
Profile Joined September 2011
Australia577 Posts
October 09 2012 09:57 GMT
#108
Depression is finite. Rational thinking believes this statement to be true. Call me at the rate of $$.$$ per minute to find out more

Maybe challenge yourself Nony, because there are heaps of people you can inspire.

-A fan of you
pigdestroyer
Profile Joined May 2012
Belgium3 Posts
October 09 2012 10:14 GMT
#109
On October 09 2012 16:08 coL.Minigun wrote:

Show nested quote +
On October 09 2012 16:01 TheKefka wrote:
Can someone that suffers from clinical depression explain to me some things.Why don't you just kill yourself?
Tyler states there is no point to life,which I agree with.If you share that view and you are in a constant state of low mood,have no interests and pleasures in life,what is the point?Why not just end it?Are you too scared to do it?


Many due, hence suicides. The ones that don't have many different reasons not too...I can't speak for others, but it's incredibly hard to actually kill yourself. The guilt from the pain it would cause loved ones. Wanting to be happy, knowing how to get there, but unable to motivate yourself enough to do it.


Just throwing my own 'thoughts' about this in here.... I know I'm not a Plato, Thales, Pythagoras, Socrates, Nietzche ...and my knowledge about them only goes so far, but having an opinion is awesome.

Survival is intuitive. Not only human beings but also animals, bacteria, .... share this thing, it is the cycle of life. Mankind is known for being different than the rest because of its ability to think rationally. If one searches for a meaning, a reason, .... and they cannot find it after having tried everything possible in their own power, then indeed why would you not commit suicide? If you think about it rationally there is no reason not to end it right there.

What is more human than suicide?
Random()
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Kyrgyz Republic1462 Posts
October 09 2012 10:36 GMT
#110
On October 09 2012 19:14 pigdestroyer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 09 2012 16:08 coL.Minigun wrote:

On October 09 2012 16:01 TheKefka wrote:
Can someone that suffers from clinical depression explain to me some things.Why don't you just kill yourself?
Tyler states there is no point to life,which I agree with.If you share that view and you are in a constant state of low mood,have no interests and pleasures in life,what is the point?Why not just end it?Are you too scared to do it?


Many due, hence suicides. The ones that don't have many different reasons not too...I can't speak for others, but it's incredibly hard to actually kill yourself. The guilt from the pain it would cause loved ones. Wanting to be happy, knowing how to get there, but unable to motivate yourself enough to do it.


Just throwing my own 'thoughts' about this in here.... I know I'm not a Plato, Thales, Pythagoras, Socrates, Nietzche ...and my knowledge about them only goes so far, but having an opinion is awesome.

Survival is intuitive. Not only human beings but also animals, bacteria, .... share this thing, it is the cycle of life. Mankind is known for being different than the rest because of its ability to think rationally. If one searches for a meaning, a reason, .... and they cannot find it after having tried everything possible in their own power, then indeed why would you not commit suicide? If you think about it rationally there is no reason not to end it right there.

What is more human than suicide?


Well you could have kids, and attempt to make those kids the "better versions" of you in hope that they, or their kids will be able to ultimately find some meaning or purpose.
corumjhaelen
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
France6884 Posts
October 09 2012 10:36 GMT
#111
Dear Nony,
You might want to read this : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Myth_of_Sisyphus
Best regards.
‎numquam se plus agere quam nihil cum ageret, numquam minus solum esse quam cum solus esset
TheFinalWord
Profile Joined May 2010
Australia790 Posts
October 09 2012 10:45 GMT
#112
On October 09 2012 19:14 pigdestroyer wrote:


Just throwing my own 'thoughts' about this in here.... I know I'm not a Plato, Thales, Pythagoras, Socrates, Nietzche ...and my knowledge about them only goes so far, but having an opinion is awesome.

Survival is intuitive. Not only human beings but also animals, bacteria, .... share this thing, it is the cycle of life. Mankind is known for being different than the rest because of its ability to think rationally. If one searches for a meaning, a reason, .... and they cannot find it after having tried everything possible in their own power, then indeed why would you not commit suicide? If you think about it rationally there is no reason not to end it right there.

What is more human than suicide?


Realistically, even if you were 100% certain that there was no meaning to life and no possibility of discovering a reason you still have no more reason to commit suicide than to continue living. Suicide is sometimes painful, depressing and messy to your friends and loved ones and involves taking an action while living just requires following your instincts.

Also there is great possibilities for joy in life even if you are depressed. Tyler asks why be happy? Is feeling good from being happy not a good enough reason? I like being happy. I strive to be happy, not because there is a reason for being happy but because feeling happy feels good. Since there is no reason to die and it goes against instincts it makes no sense to commit suicide and since you are already living you might as well strive to feel good.
Wrongspeedy
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States1655 Posts
October 09 2012 11:12 GMT
#113
On October 09 2012 13:39 travis wrote:
What point to life would you possibly expect, lol.

You get hungry right? Do you go eat when you get hungry?

Let go of your longing and just be happy with what is right in front of your face!


Sometimes its really hard to see your nose in-front of your face.

I was having some depressed-ish life thoughts as I was driving home from work and I made this post on facebook.

"When I was a kid, half the size of what I am today. I used to think I could be whatever I wanted to be, I was very serious about it, and no one could tell me otherwise. That feeling began to dissipate and I don't know it anymore. I started to let other people live between my ears. I became cynical, resentful, angry, detached. Now I don't even know where I begin. Just want to do my part so that I can feel connected to everyone else without the resentment. Big or small, I am tired of feeling confused. Oh well, one foot in front of the other."

Then I went to this website that I get daily quotes from and found this.

"What is the centre? The centre is the 'me', the 'me' that wants to be a great person, that has so many conclusions, fears, motives. From that centre we think, but that centre has been created by the reaction of thinking. So can the mind be aware of thinking without the centre, just observe it? You will find how extraordinarily difficult it is just to look at a flower without naming it, without comparing it with other flowers, without evaluating it out of like or dislike. Experiment with this, and you will see how really difficult it is to observe something without bringing in all your prejudices, all your emotions and evaluations. But, however difficult, you will find that the mind can be aware of itself without the centre watching the movement of the mind."

Then I found my favorite players blog! <3 The meaning of life to me (at first I wrote "I feel like the meaning of life..." then I derp'd) is just to contribute to the people around me what I can, to the very best of my extent. I should not compare myself to others, but I should hope the my contribution big or small, helps advance the people and other living things (somewhat) of this planet, to a better way of living. Maybe I am not a flame, maybe I am just a spark, or whatever brought the spark about. Its not important to me. What is important is that I gave it my all, that I am happy more than I am sad, and that I lived by the morals I established to the best of my ability without my conditioning.

Love you Nony!
It is better to be a human dissatisfied than a pig satisfied; better to be Socrates dissatisfied than a fool satisfied.- John Stuart Mill
OptimusYale
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Korea (South)1005 Posts
October 09 2012 11:16 GMT
#114
You know what....all I can say is that your point is very Schaupenhauer-esque. I think reading the world as will and representation will give you a decent idea at what our natures are, and also ways to alleviate the stress.

Personally, I'd say listen to music (not modern stuff, classic music is composed in an entirely different nature and is actually incredibly soothing to the soul). Try to get lost in Art, really look at the picture....see yourself in the picture and let it reflect your soul. This takes hours, and some fine fine art, but it definitely is possible to do. Those are probably the only solutions I can suggest. The only other thing is to just enjoy the happy time, and distance yourself from the depressive side. Find what excactly is disilussioning you and step away from that.

Good luck on your path
Potling
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Norway298 Posts
October 09 2012 11:47 GMT
#115
I have a few things I want to contribute, about how to find happiness.

This quote from Franklin Schmidt resounded with me, consider it well:

The author of Ecclesiastes never seems to find contentment. Why? Because
he fails to recognize that we humans are tribal by nature. We cannot find
contentment by ourselves but only through connections to others. We find
contentment by being part of something larger than ourselves, this being our
tribal instinct. Morality is built into all of us and this makes cooperation and
societies possible. A moral person who is part of a group/tribe/society that he
believes in will be far more content than an immoral person who has infinite
wealth and physical pleasures.

[..]

One should find a society worth conforming to, and then conform to it, because
this is the only way to find lasting contentment. This is the only way to escape
the sense of futility expressed in Ecclesiastes. And the reason for this is
because we humans are designed to live as part of a society and we can only find
contentment by doing what we were designed to do.


On another note, as some have pointed out, your happiness depends primarily on
your mental state, and it's hard to take control of that, "mind over
matter"-esque. There are adjustments to your life you can make to improve your
mental state. You have to find out what works for you. A few examples that have
made me happier:

- Cut out pornography and masturbation completely, starting today. There are
zero downsides.
- Seek out beauty. Distance yourself from our horrible modern "culture". Buy
beautiful paintings, and listen to Beethoven, Mozart, Tchaikovsky, etc.
- Eat a good diet (lots of eggs, bacon and steak) so you get the energy you need
to control your life.

Finally, there is religion. Lots of people cursed with an active intellect and
consequent realization of futility have found happiness and meaning in
Christianity. It seems foolish to not make an honest attempt to find God - what
have you to lose? I have not succeeded with this, though.

I wish everyone good luck on their journies.
sCnDiamond
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany340 Posts
October 09 2012 11:48 GMT
#116
It's amazing how well you wrote this stuff down. I came to the same conclusions.
formerly spinnaker.
Marti
Profile Joined August 2011
552 Posts
October 09 2012 12:00 GMT
#117
There's no point to life. Animals just live. They don't ask themselves why / why not, they just live. And we humans are "cursed" with intelligence. Tho i don't know how much better is being an happy idiot than a sad smartass.
Having said that we could all just wire our brains and press a button to release dopamine as we please... but then we'd probably stop eating / drinking / caring and die quickly. Although that's more pleasure than happiness, but then again happiness as we see it is a quite modern idea...
There's also the idea that, you could just be, generally satisfied with your life...
#adun giveafuck - - - "Did this guy just randomly finger me?" - Sayle
Wayne123
Profile Joined July 2011
88 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-09 12:28:39
October 09 2012 12:24 GMT
#118
I think it´s all about attitude. In the past I often felt really sad and to demotivated to do anything. However, I decided to change my attittude completly 2-3 years ago and I became a lot happier. To me, the key is not giving a fuck about what happens around you. Once I stopped thinking about thinks like "What do other people think about me?" or "Can I do this? How will other other people react?" I became a lot happier. It doesn´t matter to me what random people think about me and my actions or what the society wants us to do. I just do what I think is the correct thing to do no matter what.(I only change my opinions if a few close friends or my family have good arguments against what I´m doing.) Also, a lot of bad things happen around us. People murder each other, childrens die in Africa because they have nothing to eat while we have so many obese people, people cheat and hurt people they love, ... But to be honest, I don´t give a fuck about that. Why should I?`It´s not my business and thinking about such stuff or even trying to do something against this hopeless situation would make me really unhappy. I´m aware that this kind of thinking is selfish and egoistic but somehow I´m happy most of the time since I chose not to care anymore.

Although I think there´s no deeper meaning to our existence because, let´s face it, compared to the amount of people on this planet or the whole universe one human life means nothing, our existence is still valueable. I mean, considering the big picture, our life is meaningless. However, my life isn´t meaningless to me. I still can enjoy myself and do stuff I like.
revel8
Profile Joined January 2012
United Kingdom3022 Posts
October 09 2012 12:41 GMT
#119
I think to find happiness, you have to realise who you are. You need to figure out what your values are, then you have to live by these values. You should strive to look at yourself in the mirror and be proud of who you have become. It is not about where you are born or the circumstances you were born into, you cannot control that. You can control your own actions. If you behave in a way that you personally deem as worthwhile you will feel more worthwhile and can be proud of yourself.

Good luck, Nony. I hope you figure this out. There is a solution but you just need to find it. Go find your happiness.
EnderSword
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada669 Posts
October 09 2012 12:42 GMT
#120
On October 09 2012 21:24 Wayne123 wrote:
I think it´s all about attitude. In the past I often felt really sad and to demotivated to do anything. However, I decided to change my attittude completly 2-3 years ago and I became a lot happier. To me, the key is not giving a fuck about what happens around you. Once I stopped thinking about thinks like "What do other people think about me?" or "Can I do this? How will other other people react?" I became a lot happier. It doesn´t matter to me what random people think about me and my actions or what the society wants us to do. I just do what I think is the correct thing to do no matter what.(I only change my opinions if a few close friends or my family have good arguments against what I´m doing.) Also, a lot of bad things happen around us. People murder each other, childrens die in Africa because they have nothing to eat while we have so many obese people, people cheat and hurt people they love, ... But to be honest, I don´t give a fuck about that. Why should I?`It´s not my business and thinking about such stuff or even trying to do something against this hopeless situation would make me really unhappy. I´m aware that this kind of thinking is selfish and egoistic but somehow I´m happy most of the time since I chose not to care anymore.

Although I think there´s no deeper meaning to our existence because, let´s face it, compared to the amount of people on this planet or the whole universe one human life means nothing, our existence is still valueable. I mean, considering the big picture, our life is meaningless. However, my life isn´t meaningless to me. I still can enjoy myself and do stuff I like.


Read the rest of the thread and you'll see its absolutely nothing to do with 'attitude' you can't get a new perspective or something and cure depression any more than you could cure Diabetes by 'Envisioning Insulin'
Bronze/Silver/Gold level Guides - www.youtube.com/user/EnderSword
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