• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 13:04
CEST 19:04
KST 02:04
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16)25Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format16[IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend!5Weekly Cups (July 6 - 12): Protoss strike back12BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion8
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) [D] Wireframe Casting Removed Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard" Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format Is the larve respawn broken?
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) WardiTV Summer Cup 2026 GSL CK #5 Race War RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event HomeStory Cup 29
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 534 Burning Evacuation Mutation # 533 Die Together Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Recent recommended BW games Recommended FPV games (post-KeSPA) Etiquete rules in Asl? Pros Debate: Zerg Unfairly Nerfed? (ASL S22 map)
Tourneys
Escore Tournament - Season 3 Small VOD Thread 2.0 [IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread MLB/Baseball 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story Tennis[sport] Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
Northern Ireland Global Starcraft The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
The Experiences We Want and …
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8638 users

Enjoying ZvZ!

Blogs > HomeFlux
Post a Reply
FenrirSC
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
Sweden31 Posts
August 01 2012 00:00 GMT
#1
I haven't been playing as much as my goal has been these last few days. The goal of 5 games a day that is.

However I excuse myself with the fact that when I have been playing I've mostly played more than 5 games. Not today though. Today, I could only fit in 2 games.

However, it seems as though I'm improving still. I'm beating gold and platinum players, me being in silver. I have also started utilizing macrohatches more as well as spinecrawlers. I have still not gotten it in to my head that I need a lot of spinecrawlers in the lategame.

I have been playing a lot of ZvZ on ladder since there are a lot of zergs it seems. Everyone always complain about the matchup but I don't really see why. I find it really enjoyable and it's all about making the right decisions at the riught times rather then just being a cointoss.
Both early- and lategame I find really interesting. Earlygame seems to be a lot of control if there is earlygame agression, I have lousy control but seem to do okay anyways by targeting down banelings with fewer banelings.

I try to stay away from the earlygame since I feel it's slightly more random and if you slip up just with a single mouseclick you can lose. That's why I just macr up by droning until about the seven minute mark when I build double evo, a roach warren and Lair. From there I go in to infestor and ultra.

The thing about the mid/lategame is that a lot of zergs seem to go muta. which I don't mind since I seem to always win against players going muta. Just build a bunch of spores and counterattack. I might lose a base but then I make sure that he loses at least one base. Eventually my infestors pop and I'm able to repel the mutas as well and from there it's just a win.

Things I need to work on are taking a third in ZvZ's as well as scouting so I can find out if my opponent really is going muta or not. I need to work on my scouting in all matchups.

****
YoUr_KiLLeR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
United States3420 Posts
August 01 2012 00:26 GMT
#2
zvz is a fun, dynamic matchup. its underappreciated!
what the fuck do you have to say for yourself now you protoss jackass can you retaliate in any way
FenrirSC
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
Sweden31 Posts
August 01 2012 00:28 GMT
#3
Indeed! If this is th way the ladder looks, I could definitely live whith it.
ParkwayDrive
Profile Joined July 2011
United States328 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-01 02:20:56
August 01 2012 02:19 GMT
#4
personally ive thought zvz to be the best and most exciting matchup since release. i could watch ling/bane micro for hours. mutas now becoming more strategical instead of all or nothing. muta splitting vs infestors? yes please.

there was a dull period in the matchup when people werent comfortable going up to hive and would just sit on roach/festor all game. that kind of sucked but now that hive is in the picture the matchup is totally badass again. the decision of what to use festor energy on in the late game when broods/ultras are out for both sides is just so interesting.

and once burrowed festors are more common and multitasked better? once nydus gets figured out? o man the possibilities.
AimlessAmoeba
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada704 Posts
August 01 2012 02:36 GMT
#5
I wish I shared your enthusiasm... ZvZ is something I just can't seem to keep my stress level down during.
9-BiT
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States1089 Posts
August 01 2012 03:33 GMT
#6
To me the reason I dislike zvz is that you can be dominating the whole game, and then forget detection, or forget spores, or not get hydras, and lose to something stupid like mass mutas or a few infestors that burrow under your bases. I can completely outplay someone in every way, but forget detection, and that means I lose the game, which means that the best player doesn't have a huge advantage unless they play perfectly.
kwark_uk: @father_sc learn to play maybe?
ParkwayDrive
Profile Joined July 2011
United States328 Posts
August 01 2012 03:54 GMT
#7
im confused, how is forgetting detetction considered outplaying your opponent?
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Big Brain Bouts
16:00
#122
SHIN vs Elazer
Percival vs Nicoract
Reynor vs Lambo
RotterdaM966
Liquipedia
Epic.LAN
13:00
Epic.LAN 48 Group Stage
epiclan40
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 966
UpATreeSC 103
Livibee 65
BRAT_OK 47
RushiSC 41
MindelVK 9
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4793
Rain 2093
GuemChi 1988
EffOrt 979
Mini 572
Hyuk 422
BeSt 354
ZerO 231
Rush 227
Larva 191
[ Show more ]
firebathero 136
Dewaltoss 132
ggaemo 92
hero 77
Sharp 67
Hyun 46
Sexy 40
soO 39
Free 39
Terrorterran 33
sorry 32
Rock 22
Mong 22
Hm[arnc] 19
NaDa 17
Yoon 11
Purpose 8
ajuk12(nOOB) 7
Dota 2
qojqva3696
Trikslyr69
Fuzer 46
Counter-Strike
fl0m1432
ScreaM1213
byalli682
allub339
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor146
Other Games
singsing1934
Beastyqt479
B2W.Neo420
XaKoH 159
ToD147
QueenE70
ZerO(Twitch)15
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick2366
StarCraft 2
TaKeTV382
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 4
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• TFBlade1315
Other Games
• Shiphtur393
• imaqtpie13
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
6h 56m
RSL Revival
15h 56m
Clem vs Lambo
Scarlett vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
16h 56m
Epic.LAN
19h 56m
IPSL
22h 56m
Dragon vs Hawk
RSL Revival
1d 15h
Classic vs Trap
herO vs SHIN
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 16h
OSC
1d 19h
IPSL
1d 22h
Bonyth vs Ret
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
[ Show More ]
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
PiGosaur Cup
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
CrankTV Team League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-07-13
HSC XXIX
Eternal Conflict S2 E2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
YSL S3
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
Escore Tournament S3: W3
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
SCTL 2026 Spring
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026

Upcoming

ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 1
Escore Tournament S3: W4
ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 2
Escore Tournament S3: W5
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E3
Logitech G Connect 2026
StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.