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So within the next few days I need to decide where to go for grad school. The options are either staying in England or moving to California. (I've got an offer from UC Berkeley).
I'm finding it really hard to decide what to do :/ Staying would be easy, I like the city, all my things are here, family and old friends less than three hours away by flight, my would be supervisor is probably the world expert on what I would be doing.(Spin dynamics in biological systems as relating to bird navigation) and a great guy to boot.
BUT there is really nothing specific keeping me here, most of my friends will be gone, I don't have a girlfriend and moving to Cali would be a great adventure, one that I would probably never have the chance to experience again. There is also this notion people seem to have that American phds are "better". They sure are longer anyway, though that mostly seem to be due to lots of time being wasted TAing. In fact I guess that would be an argument for staying, finishing in 3-4 years as opposed to 4-5 would be nice. But then again the stuff I would be doing here is so very nieche that the "what to do afterwards" issue is a very real one.
At the moment I'm leaning towards going, I have a feeling that when I look back on my life I would regret it if I didn't take the chance to spend 4 years in california when I had it.
Anyone else been faced with major life decisions? What did you choose and what influenced your decision? How did things turn out in the end?
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If you're going to be far away from your family in a totally new surrounding, you better be prepared to aggressively make new friends and meet new people. Not doing that caused me such depression in college that my GPA tanked and I am now transferring to somewhere close to home.
Fortunately, California is home to many people on TL, so that shouldn't be a huge problem. Just one advice if you go to Cali: GET A CAR!! YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING WITHOUT A CAR IN CALIFORNIA!
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uc berkley, theres this thing with the homeless people there, all the students have names for each homeless guy. and dont be freaked out when you find out someone just came into your house and stole something =). Other than that the bay area is pretty nice, its all cold in the morning even in the summer. btw like jpak said you need a car. The bus system in the bay area is horrendous from i heard from a friend who lives there. $6 a bus ride lol.
you may or may not have the greatest time in cali, but i recommend you live outside your home for a while, you dont many opportunities to live outside your home country unless your some baller millionare who can fly anywhere in the world.
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we have berkeley sc2 lan parties!!
i live about 20-30 mins away from berkeley. great place to be. easy access to lots of good food, huge university with lots of women and lots of things to do in your spare time (berkeley itself is lively, short train trip to oakland or san francisco). weather is great too, although a little colder in berkeley since closer to the water (lol! cold in california means wear a sweatshirt with your shorts, instead of a t-shirt).
england has shitty food and shitty weather!!! rabble, rabble.
edit: wtf are you guys talking about?? you dont need a car. BART (the local train) goes to UC Berkeley's entrance and transports you everywhere you need to go outside of berkeley, and inside berkeley everything is right by the school.
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On March 15 2012 09:41 jpak wrote:
If you're going to be far away from your family in a totally new surrounding, you better be prepared to aggressively make new friends and meet new people. Not doing that caused me such depression in college that my GPA tanked and I am now transferring to somewhere close to home.
Fortunately, California is home to many people on TL, so that shouldn't be a huge problem. Just one advice if you go to Cali: GET A CAR!! YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING WITHOUT A CAR IN CALIFORNIA!
Hm that's interesting, most people I've talked to have said I would be fine with a bike plus the occasional busride. (I think I even get a ton of public transport for free through the university) Having to buy a car would be an annoyance to be sure.
And yes of course meeting new people would be very important, it's also part of the fun though.
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On March 15 2012 09:46 KlaCkoN wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 09:41 jpak wrote:
If you're going to be far away from your family in a totally new surrounding, you better be prepared to aggressively make new friends and meet new people. Not doing that caused me such depression in college that my GPA tanked and I am now transferring to somewhere close to home.
Fortunately, California is home to many people on TL, so that shouldn't be a huge problem. Just one advice if you go to Cali: GET A CAR!! YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING WITHOUT A CAR IN CALIFORNIA! Hm that's interesting, most people I've talked to have said I would be fine with a bike plus the occasional busride. (I think I even get a ton of public transport for free through the university) Having to buy a car would be an annoyance to be sure. And yes of course meeting new people would be very important, it's also part of the fun though.
you dont need a car.
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california has a sick SC2 scene :D
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Take the opportunity... It sounds absolutely wonderful, and you're so fortunate to be in that position.
Berkeley is an amazing school, you won't regret it.
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On March 15 2012 09:45 dAPhREAk wrote:
we have berkeley sc2 lan parties!!
i live about 20-30 mins away from berkeley. great place to be. easy access to lots of good food, huge university with lots of women and lots of things to do in your spare time (berkeley itself is lively, short train trip to oakland or san francisco). weather is great too, although a little colder in berkeley since closer to the water (lol! cold in california means wear a sweatshirt with your shorts, instead of a t-shirt).
england has shitty food and shitty weather!!! rabble, rabble.
edit: wtf are you guys talking about?? you dont need a car. BART (the local train) goes to UC Berkeley's entrance and transports you everywhere you need to go outside of berkeley, and inside berkeley everything is right by the school.
Haha maybe I would finally have a reason to pick up sc2 then  . What you are saying about the train is what I have heard from other people as well so that's a relief. Good food sounds nice too, as a stupid european its easy to have this idea that you'll be forced to live on burgers in the states lol.
Have you always lived in the area?
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Do you know which professor you'd be working with at Berkeley? Some professors will expect you to grind 60 hours a week in the lab with very little vacation time, while others are quite relaxed and reasonable. If you know the guy you'd be working with in England is not a slave driver that's pretty important imo.
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On March 15 2012 09:56 KlaCkoN wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 09:45 dAPhREAk wrote:
we have berkeley sc2 lan parties!!
i live about 20-30 mins away from berkeley. great place to be. easy access to lots of good food, huge university with lots of women and lots of things to do in your spare time (berkeley itself is lively, short train trip to oakland or san francisco). weather is great too, although a little colder in berkeley since closer to the water (lol! cold in california means wear a sweatshirt with your shorts, instead of a t-shirt).
england has shitty food and shitty weather!!! rabble, rabble.
edit: wtf are you guys talking about?? you dont need a car. BART (the local train) goes to UC Berkeley's entrance and transports you everywhere you need to go outside of berkeley, and inside berkeley everything is right by the school. Haha maybe I would finally have a reason to pick up sc2 then . What you are saying about the train is what I have heard from other people as well so that's a relief. Good food sounds nice too, as a stupid european its easy to have this idea that you'll be forced to live on burgers in the states lol. Have you always lived in the area?
born in southern california and raised in the bay area (northern california). still live here. i have a couple friends who went to uc berkeley. they would probably be willing to talk to you about it if you want, but it sounds like you have already gotten advice. i believe uc berkeley has a class on starcraft as well (which is kind of stupid, but its a novelty).
i would say experience all you can while you are young. a great way to experience the U.S. would be to live here for a few years while studying.
here is the bart map. i believe downtown berkeley is at the entrance of UC Berkeley.
http://bart.gov/stations/index.aspx
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I always encourage people to move away from home when they can ... you may never get another chance in life to experience different places / cultures, might as well do it when you have a nice opportunity to do so!
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Kentor
United States5784 Posts
PhD for what?
On March 15 2012 09:41 jpak wrote:
Fortunately, California is home to many people on TL, so that shouldn't be a huge problem. Just one advice if you go to Cali: GET A CAR!! YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING WITHOUT A CAR IN CALIFORNIA!
Wtf that's not true at all. There's plenty of places you can get to by just walking/busing in SF/Berkeley areas.
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United States24745 Posts
On March 15 2012 10:12 Kentor wrote:
PhD for what?
This is a good question... I couldn't quite tell from the OP.
Depending on the answer, you may find yourself way to busy to need to worry about things like friends or free time XD
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Well its because I don't really know yet =P It seems like in the states you are admitted to a programme not a group like you would be everywhere else. You then chose / fight for supervisors during your first weeks there. I have an offer from the chemistry department and I made it very clear in my application that I want to do physcial chemistry. There are two groups in Berkeley doing solar energy conversion stuff which seems very interesting. Then there is also a very very famous NMR group.
If I stayed in the UK I would be doing quantum mechanics of radical pair reactions in biological systems.
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On March 15 2012 10:12 Kentor wrote:PhD for what? Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 09:41 jpak wrote:
Fortunately, California is home to many people on TL, so that shouldn't be a huge problem. Just one advice if you go to Cali: GET A CAR!! YOU CAN'T DO ANYTHING WITHOUT A CAR IN CALIFORNIA! Wtf that's not true at all. There's plenty of places you can get to by just walking/busing in SF/Berkeley areas.
Spoiled by NYC transportation system
And yea, you may not even have much time for much, since you have to get a Ph.D.
I still say go to California, though.
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United States24745 Posts
On March 15 2012 10:23 KlaCkoN wrote:
chemistry
Yea I didn't mean your specialization, just the department.
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Berkeley is a pretty nice town. I just got here for grad school myself. As far as the talk about cars goes...the bay area is really the one part of the state I've lived where it isn't necessary. You can get around just fine with public transportation, at least compared to the LA area where I grew up. Plus its nice to have an excuse to go live somewhere new for a few years
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Kentor
United States5784 Posts
On March 15 2012 10:23 KlaCkoN wrote:
Well its because I don't really know yet =P It seems like in the states you are admitted to a programme not a group like you would be everywhere else. You then chose / fight for supervisors during your first weeks there. I have an offer from the chemistry department and I made it very clear in my application that I want to do physcial chemistry. There are two groups in Berkeley doing solar energy conversion stuff which seems very interesting. Then there is also a very very famous NMR group.
If I stayed in the UK I would be doing quantum mechanics of radical pair reactions in biological systems.
Congrats for getting in :p. I am actually finishing my undergrad in Chemistry here in May. I thought about going to graduate school for theoretical chemistry (did some undergrad research with simulations), but then I thought if I get a PhD I really can't do much with the skills that I would have learned in those 4-5 years, besides more research or teaching, which I'm already losing interest in. Plus I've always been interested in software, so I decided to try to get a job in the software industry and spend that 4-5 years developing skills that I feel would make a bigger difference to other people instead. I'm not saying what you would be doing would not make a big difference in the world, but the chances of that is pretty slim. So I would say, think about what you really want to do after you get that PhD.
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I'd do it, it's an adventure.
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I live in Berkeley. You don't need a car. Many people ride bikes or BART train. It is a wealthy city overall but there is also many homeless, and higher crime than you would expect. I never feel threatened or scared though. There are a lot of highly educated people from all over the world who have chosen to settle here so overall its a good vibe. Rents are not too bad but higher than average for the U.S.
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go to california wtf
you're stuck in england bro
ca >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> england
and you don't need a car in San Francisco/Berkeley/San Jose area because the BART, Caltrain, Metro etc systems are very good
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Not really sure what your priorities are. I can tell you straight up I'd rather live in the bay area any day than England any day, but that's not much help. What are specific things you'd like to know about?
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On March 15 2012 10:46 Kentor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 10:23 KlaCkoN wrote:
Well its because I don't really know yet =P It seems like in the states you are admitted to a programme not a group like you would be everywhere else. You then chose / fight for supervisors during your first weeks there. I have an offer from the chemistry department and I made it very clear in my application that I want to do physcial chemistry. There are two groups in Berkeley doing solar energy conversion stuff which seems very interesting. Then there is also a very very famous NMR group.
If I stayed in the UK I would be doing quantum mechanics of radical pair reactions in biological systems. Congrats for getting in :p. I am actually finishing my undergrad in Chemistry here in May. I thought about going to graduate school for theoretical chemistry (did some undergrad research with simulations), but then I thought if I get a PhD I really can't do much with the skills that I would have learned in those 4-5 years, besides more research or teaching, which I'm already losing interest in. Plus I've always been interested in software, so I decided to try to get a job in the software industry and spend that 4-5 years developing skills that I feel would make a bigger difference to other people instead. I'm not saying what you would be doing would not make a big difference in the world, but the chances of that is pretty slim. So I would say, think about what you really want to do after you get that PhD.
Well its sort why I am a bit hesitant about the bird navigation stuff, its so specialised that I might run the risk of ending up back where I started. "Stay at university or take banking/consulting job?" But I mean if I were to do say NMR there are tons of science related industry jobs available. And hey if you had spent four years in a theory group you would have been a guru in matlab or c++ or whatever they happened to use by the time you were done :p No I definitely see where you are coming from but I guess I'm just not done with learning new things just for the sake of learning. And since I am doing science I might as well take advantage of the fact that people will actually pay me to learn new stuff =p
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California is an awesome place. I am from Southern California and have gone to the bay area plenty of times. I would do it to be honest.
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On March 15 2012 11:15 UniversalSnip wrote:
Not really sure what your priorities are. I can tell you straight up I'd rather live in the bay area any day than England any day, but that's not much help. What are specific things you'd like to know about?
Haha England isn't too bad, a bit hierarchical at times but I think that's an anglo saxian thing and would be the same in states anyways. Apart from that I sort of like how english people seem to share a lot of the reserved, serious "let's stand in proper lines and talk about the weather" attitude I am used to from home lol. What's Cali like and why would you rather live there?
Priorities? Dunnu, do lots of science, find some nice people with which to share a few pints and have psudeo intellectual conversations. Play badminton?
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On March 15 2012 11:30 KlaCkoN wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 11:15 UniversalSnip wrote:
Not really sure what your priorities are. I can tell you straight up I'd rather live in the bay area any day than England any day, but that's not much help. What are specific things you'd like to know about? Haha England isn't too bad, a bit hierarchical at times but I think that's an anglo saxian thing and would be the same in states anyways. Apart from that I sort of like how english people seem to share a lot of the reserved, serious "let's stand in proper lines and talk about the weather" attitude I am used to from home lol. What's Cali like and why would you rather live there? Priorities? Dunnu, do lots of science, find some nice people with which to share a few pints and have psudeo intellectual conversations. Play badminton?
my brother played badminton at UCB. he said the taiwanese exchange students were intense.
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On March 15 2012 11:33 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2012 11:30 KlaCkoN wrote:On March 15 2012 11:15 UniversalSnip wrote:
Not really sure what your priorities are. I can tell you straight up I'd rather live in the bay area any day than England any day, but that's not much help. What are specific things you'd like to know about? Haha England isn't too bad, a bit hierarchical at times but I think that's an anglo saxian thing and would be the same in states anyways. Apart from that I sort of like how english people seem to share a lot of the reserved, serious "let's stand in proper lines and talk about the weather" attitude I am used to from home lol. What's Cali like and why would you rather live there? Priorities? Dunnu, do lots of science, find some nice people with which to share a few pints and have psudeo intellectual conversations. Play badminton? my brother played badminton at UCB. he said the taiwanese exchange students were intense.
They always are ~~ I'm a very casual player myself but when you spend all day everyday doing matlab having a hobby that makes you jump around a lot is a good way of lowering the risk of dying from a heart attack at age 30 =p
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Go Cali!
Trying not to be biased but this could be one of the most eye opening experiences ever. It's not like Washington (the state) or Kansas or Florida, It's mutha effin CA. And the Bay Area at that; Which I believe to be one of the most diverse places you could be. Good and bad which of course you will find out about, but I mean I'm SO sure it'll be a huge experience. I'm just in favor of trying awesome opportunities when you find them.
If we flipped the script and I was from Berkeley and offered a position for grad school either at Berkeley or England, I'd take England for suree. I mean when else do you get the opportunity?
Edit: As for the car thing, I think it depends on how much freedom you want to do things. I don't find Berkeley to be huge or anything, and I really like BART (although I haven't had the chance to be on many other alternatives)
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Try something new, it's good for you. I'm guessing you are around 21, that's an age old enough to move out of your comfort zone a little bit (at least you won't have any language issues).
However, most of my UK friends from London hate it in Manhattan. They complain about the food, the service, the train system, and just about anything and everything; so that's something for you to think about as well.
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Go to California, American girls love British guys, and California girls are some of the best.
Also, it will definitely be an adventure! Innout burger is amazing!
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Go west my friend! If you have the opportunity to travel to another part of the world, why not? When you're getting old, will you say, "darn, good thing I didn't go to California when I had the chance. Good ol' England is all I need." When you're young, you have the chance to take risks and explore the world, so why not? Will there be any time in your life where you can just pick up and leave and do whatever you want?
After I finished college, I went straight to California from Texas and it was one of the best decisions I could have made. I went to Southern California (socal) rather than Northern California (norcal) but I have some friends from the area and they are some of the nicest people I've met. It seems like everyone is really laid back and not materialistic/self centered compared to some socal people. In n Out, as others have mentioned is really good. You're basically living 1 hour from the beach and 1 hour away from snowboarding the mountains albeit it's a bit colder up north. I'm sure there are lots and lots of people who follow SC2 there and I'm sure you wouldn't have any trouble meeting friends. If you want to stretch your wings, get a change of scenery, I would do it in a heartbeat. Well, actually I did and never regretted it at all. It's a chance to develop yourself more as a person.
If you don't do it now, when will you do it? Take the risk while you still can. Best of luck on your decision. 
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The obvious advice would be to go because:
+ new country / culture
+ maybe only opportunity to do this
+ new people
+ your friends are gone anyway you said
+ no girl friend who keeps you
+ prestigious?
+ one important step more on your CV (been abroad in UK AND US to study = leet)
opposed to:
- your prof is a really great guy and one of the leading experts in the field you wanna work in later (probably important if you REALLY want to do this)
- you know your way around (this will be the reason for regrets later "I only stayed because it was convenient - how stupid")
- less visits to your family (or more expensive traveling)
- is there loyalty involved towards your prof?
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From what I read into your post you know it "feels right" to make the step because you would regret it later otherwise. I guess you should do what feels right, some opportunities only come once and you have probably seen everything there is to be seen where you are now so why not go somewhere where everything is fresh and new.
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EPT
