• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 19:01
CET 01:01
KST 09:01
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10
Community News
[BSL21] Ro.16 Group Stage (C->B->A->D)4Weekly Cups (Nov 17-23): Solar, MaxPax, Clem win2RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket13Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge2[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation14
StarCraft 2
General
When will we find out if there are more tournament Weekly Cups (Nov 17-23): Solar, MaxPax, Clem win SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket
Tourneys
Tenacious Turtle Tussle [Alpha Pro Series] Nice vs Cure RSL Revival: Season 3 $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 501 Price of Progress Mutation # 500 Fright night Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death
Brood War
General
Which season is the best in ASL? [BSL21] Ro.16 Group Stage (C->B->A->D) Data analysis on 70 million replays FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle soO on: FanTaSy's Potential Return to StarCraft
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group B - Sun 21:00 CET [BSL21] GosuLeague T1 Ro16 - Tue & Thu 22:00 CET [BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group A - Sat 21:00 CET
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft How to stay on top of macro? Current Meta PvZ map balance
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason The Perfect Game Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games?
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Where to ask questions and add stream? The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
The Health Impact of Joining…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1909 users

Droning On #2: Better late than never

Blogs > Umpteen
Post a Reply
Umpteen
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United Kingdom1570 Posts
August 01 2011 08:34 GMT
#1
Couldn't quite get this finished in time for Friday...

ZvP on Shakuras.

Spawned in close-air positions.
Me: Speedling expand.
Him: Forge-expand.
My response: Continually scouted the front of his natural while gritting my teeth and droning like a madman. Placed a couple of spines at my natural in case he poked with anything, and a little later dropped a spore crawler at each base in case of DTs or air. Got two bases nicely saturated with decent gas timings, sent an overlord over his main and started making roaches.
His attack: He rolls out across the map with a river of stalkers just after I placed my third at around 8:30. To be quite honest, there looked to be so many of them that I almost gave up then and there. They turned out to be blink stalkers too, as he hopped up into my main. Rather to my surprise, I managed to hold by maintaining roach production.
My follow-up: Finding myself in uncharted territory (that is to say, still alive after a 6/7 gate blink stalker push) I pushed forward to contain him at his ramp. He seemed to be trying to take the pocket third but I denied it.
FATAL MISTAKE:I made the classic Zerg error of waiting too long and maxing on Lair tech units, and also failed to take any more bases. Sitting at 200/200 with money and larvae in the bank, I decided to try and take him with a 300-food push, throwing everything I had up his ramp while remaking roaches and belatedly teching to hive. I barely scratched his army and he pushed out immediately. My roaches and corruptors spawned, and I was eventually able to take down his forces, but not until after it took out my third. With no reserves and only one mining base, I was dismayed to see he had taken a third in the meantime. His next stalker push came while I was gloomily trying to resaturate a new third, and I had to GG.

Specific lessons learned:

The follow-up to holding off a big two-base Protoss push is to contain, expand, and tech, because when he pushes out again he's going to have his big force-multipliers: Colossi and suchlike. I could have had broodlords at the back of his natural and what became his third so easily, so much earlier. I could have been dropping roaches into his main, lobbing infested terrans into his natural, gooping up his gateways with overseers. I could have had three more bases.

General lessons learned:

This was the first time I'd ever held off a 6-7 gate push, and I did it by brutally crushing that nagging voice telling me to get some early units 'just in case'. For the first seven minutes or so I had four lings, all of which got used poking up his ramp into the cannons. I kept my money really low for that opening period - scarily low: it was weird to start roach production on two bases with two queens and to only be able to make three roaches, both larvae and resource-wise. In fact, it felt like I must have done something wrong, and that's perhaps the most important lesson of all. I need to re-educate the part of my brain that tells me I'm doing well when I'm able to spam out nine or ten roaches at a time.


ZvZ on Antiga Shipyard

Me: Speedling expand.
Him: Hatch first with spines and lings.
My early attack: Ran lings and roaches past his spines into his main, taking out a queen and keeping him busy for a bit. Sloppy macro in the meantime meant I had a bunch of minerals, which I quickly turned into two more expansions at my third and the nearest gold.
His response: He teched hard and attacked with mutalisks. I had to sacrifice my fourth base, but was able to use queens and a couple of spores in my main and natural to drive him off.
My follow-up: Made a large hydralisk force off three bases and pushed across the map. He'd continued teching hard and had broodlords out, but couldn't prevent me erasing his natural. He had the tech advantage but I had the production, and was able to go toe-to-toe at the central raised watchtower with a constant stream of hydra whittling down his mutalisk numbers and focusing down broodlords. I did a ling-runby into his main and took down the completely undefended greater spire, retook my fourth base, patrolled lings for hidden expos and crushed through with a massive switch to corruptors to take the game.

Specific lessons learned:

To be honest, it was a bit of a scrappy game and I don't think there was much to glean from it.

General lessons learned:

Bite the bullet and expand, especially on a map like that one. Play to my strengths: if I've made units, use them.

ZvP on Nezarim Crypt

Me: Speedling expand.
Him: 3-gate expand.
My response: I convinced myself he was going to play aggressively (zealots and stalkers out first rather than sentries) and made rather too many roaches. I droned and took a third behind them, kept an eye on his ramp and saw that he was expanding and placing cannons. I made sure he wasn't taking a third, and - mindful of my earlier mistakes - teched up to hive and a greater spire in good time, as well as placing three more bases on my side of the map. I made a few mutalisks and sent them into his base, and was able to take advantage of his simcity to kill a lot of probes.
His attack: He poked with DTs at my third but I saw them off with minimal damage. My mutalisks finally induced him to push out with an odd mixture of zealots, immortals, a few phoenix and a couple of void rays. I had a huge roach-ling army out in the middle of the map and managed to flank him quite nicely, taking out almost everything he had.
FATAL MISTAKE:This was more bad luck than anything. While placing the expansions, I'd accidentally broken my keybinds, so that only a single incomplete hatchery was now bound to '1', rather than all six bases. Thus, despite having dilligently spawned larvae in preparation for remaxing, I found myself inexplicably unable to build anything to take care of his few remaining forces, which took advantage of my confusion and charged into my main. Although I saved most of my tech with hasty spines and spore crawlers - crucially took out my hive and spawning pool. Without the ability to make spines and spores, and with my lair rebuilding, he was able to put a DT in each of my expansions and whittle them all down. I made a valiant last stand with some lings, roaches and broodlords but couldn't break his heavily cannoned third and had to GG.

Specific lessons learned:

I shouldn't have overreacted at the start and made so many roaches. As it happened that wasn't a factor in the loss, but I could have had a much stronger economy and earlier tech if I'd made do with a couple of spines - I had ample scouting info.

I expanded in a timely fashion and my overall plan - to hit broodlord tech in time to counterpush - would have worked perfectly but for the unfortunate keybind mixup.

General lessons learned:

Once again, map presence was key. I could have done even better by occupying the tower closer to his base; that would have given me longer to remax.

ZvT on Abyssal Caverns

Spawned close air positions.
Me: Roach expand
Him: Mass BF hellions
My response: I scouted exactly what he was doing, spread overlords to watch for drops and made roaches to hold the front.
His attack: His 10-12 blueflame hellions, when they came, killed a total of 3 drones. He then proceeded to try and drop, but lost everything again to queens and roaches. Meanwhile I sneaked a third, which he later dropped, losing all but a single hellion in exchange for a few drones.
FATAL MISTAKE: Distracted by his harass and with no clear plan (similar to the 7-gate blink build yesterday, I'd never survived versus BF hellions before and had no idea what to do next) I didn't pay enough attention to what he was making, and my macro slipped horribly, teching to hive far too late.
His follow-up: He turtled up on two bases with masses of turrets and siege tanks, adding on a couple of thors, and then pushed out, catching me with 2000/1000 in the bank and dithering over what to build. The short push distance gave me no time to recover and he rolled over me.

Specific lessons learned:

I think that the correct follow-up to fending off mass BF hellions is to tech, because the Terran is geared up for mech, can turtle very hard, but has no immediate ability to attack. A couple of broodlords would have made all the difference, and I could easily have had them in time.

The existence of a food chain is inescapable if we evolved unsupervised, and inexcusable otherwise.
Gprime
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Canada198 Posts
August 01 2011 10:34 GMT
#2
interesting. i should do this kind of thing. you must learn a lot from writing these.
diablo 3 killed my skill.
Bippzy
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States1466 Posts
August 01 2011 13:20 GMT
#3
On August 01 2011 19:34 Gprime wrote:
interesting. i should do this kind of thing. you must learn a lot from writing these.


Espiecially cuz hes zerg. If he was toss, he'd be like " I didnt abuse blink enough, i engaged in a bad choke so my colos got mind controlled, sentry loss was detrimental to my engagements as well. Also, when i see third expansions i should do 8 gate all ins"

With zerg its how to react to defend/kill/get more bases.
With toss it's how to defend while getting 1-2 bases to get the army you want, or killing.
LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
00:00
Biweekly #36
CranKy Ducklings53
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft374
Liquid`TLO 154
elazer 149
ProTech128
Nina 23
CosmosSc2 13
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4721
Artosis 721
ggaemo 68
Aegong 33
Dota 2
syndereN273
Counter-Strike
Fnx 235
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox766
Other Games
tarik_tv7055
Grubby3433
shahzam574
C9.Mang0301
ViBE154
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick198
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream160
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 20 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• HeavenSC 38
• davetesta24
• Adnapsc2 8
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• mYiSmile167
• 80smullet 8
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21479
League of Legends
• Doublelift4040
Other Games
• imaqtpie1451
• Scarra620
• Shiphtur223
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
9h 59m
Replay Cast
22h 59m
OSC
1d 16h
LAN Event
1d 17h
Replay Cast
1d 22h
Replay Cast
2 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
[ Show More ]
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
StarCraft2.fi
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Wardi Open
5 days
StarCraft2.fi
5 days
Wardi Open
6 days
StarCraft2.fi
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

SOOP Univ League 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
Slon Tour Season 2
META Madness #9
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2

Upcoming

BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.