• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:19
CEST 15:19
KST 22:19
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple2BSL Season 2312Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon101Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism10
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool How do you feel about the StarCraft shooter announcement at BlizzCon 2026? Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser
Tourneys
2026 GSTL Grand Finals Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) 2026 GSTL Announcement
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 544 Double Trouble The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses Mutation # 542 The Ascended
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder NaDa's Body SC4ALL II: Brood War Player Announcement 3/4 - soO [ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy BSL Season 23
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 2 [IPSL] IPSL is Back With Winter 26-27! PLAYzone Challenge - open offline tour in Prague
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation Nintendo Switch Thread Diablo IV
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread All you football fans (soccer)!
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Violent-Cooperative Play and…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 13443 users

Ladder Report 2.4

Blogs > Dromar
Post a Reply
Dromar
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States2145 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-26 19:06:07
July 26 2011 18:56 GMT
#1
Personal stuff in spoilers, ladder stuff below.
+ Show Spoiler +

It's been a while. Quite a bit has happened. I injured my right knee drunken dancing a couple months back (Sam's 21'st birthday), and had to keep off it for a while, which really sucked, because I was just starting to get into running as part of my new, more healthy lifestyle. Could that have had something to do with it? I dunno. So I took it easy with the leg, and it was starting to feel better, until 3 weeks later, I was being drunk and stupid and injured it again.
At this point I had moved out of my parent's house to live with a friend of mine, and things were going pretty okay. Unfortunately that fell through, and I'm back living with my parents until I can find a job. I've been looking, but not much luck. I need to be more proactive in searching. But it sounds like I'll be able to get some adjunct work at a nearby community college in a couple months, and that'll at least be enough to pay rent, food, etc. to live in town while I look for something better.
A couple weeks ago, a friend of mine had a pool party. The party was pretty tame compared to normal because of the insane heat wave that was going through, but it picked up (IMO) once I got drunk and got in the pool. In my drunken stupidity, I put too much pressure on my knee again, but it wasn't so bad this time because I was in the pool. I think I'm good to run again, but I don't want to push my luck. In the meantime, I've pretty much mastered the art of dancing without moving my right knee.
Finally, I've lost 13 lbs since I decided to take better care of my health and nutrition about 3 months ago, and I definitely feel stronger. I've also been browsing the TLHF thread regularly, and asking any questions I've had in there. I'm not doing olympic lifts or anything yet, but I am eating much more healthy food. Cutting out the unhealthy food has actually been easier than I thought, until recently, I've been craving soda, pizza, BBQ, etc. Not sure why. I think I just need to diversify my food a bit, as I've been eating pretty much the same foods for the past 3 months (primarily lean chicken, vegetables, and fruit).



1v1:

Zerg(40 games)
(12)ZvZ: 5-7 41.6%
(17)ZvP: 9- 8 52.9%
(11)ZvT: 3- 8 27.2%

17-23 42.5%

This Season:
Zerg(111 games)
(40)ZvZ: 21-19 52.5%
(47)ZvP: 27-20 57.4%
(24)ZvT: 11- 13 45.8%

59-52 53.1%

At this point I've noticed something that I used to notice on ICCup occasionally: my games aren't as satisfying because right after the games I'm usually thinking one of the following:
"That guy was legitimately better than me, and I got stomped."
"That guy was pretty much a noob. Of course I won."
I'm not really getting much satisfaction from winning because the people I beat make such obvious mistakes, where it really just would have been embarrassing to lose to them. OTOH, when I lose it's actually to someone who I think "if we played again, he would probably beat me again, because he's better." It's much less likely to be some bullshit strat that only works once, which is good I guess.
In order to improve from here (and once again gain satisfaction from winning), I'm going to have to put in a lot more effort to refine my play, just as the people who beat me have. I'm not sure if I'm willing to put in that much effort.

ZvZ:
So, I gave up my old build, and I've been practicing 14/14 or hatch first, map dependent. My 14/14 games have gone pretty mediocre, mostly because everyone I play against has much more experience in 14/14 vs 14/14 than I do. My banelings get caught morphing, and I'm much more likely to lose several lings to a baneling while I'm not paying attention. The couple games where I opened hatch first went okay though, but at this time I'm just in a "try some stuff out" mode to learn more about the matchup. Right now, my heart is leaning toward hatch first.

Q:When do you guys scout (or do you even scout) in ZvZ when you open 14/14? How about if you open hatch first?

ZvT:
Even though I don't run into many Terran players on ladder, I've definitely played this matchup the most against my practice partner. The thing is, he has a style that is much different to that of the ladder Terrans that I run into. Ladder Terrans do a lot of 2rax openings, and my practice partner used to as well, and I got comfortable with them to the point where he just stopped because it wasn't worth it. But I got a bit rusty against 2rax since then, cutting a few too many corners in favor of macro.
Ladder Terrans also love cloaked banshees, which always mess me up.

Q:How do you deal with cloaked banshees? I'm fine with queens, I just need a good way to detect. Do you get a quick enough lair? Do you get spores? Because spores only protect themselves. I've been getting a late gas in favor of pumping drones hard, and spores just aren't working for me. Am I supposed to build 3 spores each at my main and nat just to detect and keep the banshees away? That seems like a win for the Terran already.

ZvP:
So I've been trying new things in this matchup, and it's been going okay-ish. First, I've given up on getting mutas before roach, because it's just too easy to lose to a timing attack, or at least get deflected without doing very much damage against better players. Second, I've been going hatch first and just pulling a drone or two if I have to to keep cannon rushes from working. The overpool build I was doing just wasn't strong enough against macro tosses who didn't suck. So it's either hatch first or speedling expand. I'm still having trouble against FE tosses who take a quick third though. I'm not sure how to deny it short of having a sizable army already in the making when I scout it. There's a very small timing window for me to get an attack force across the map before there are cannons/ff/a couple warp-in rounds off of 6 gates to hold it off. At that time I'm usually saturating my own third. But again, I think that's because of my weak opening I was using at the time.
That said, at this time, a good percentage of my ZvP wins are still coming from players who do some sort of one-base shenanigans (dt, vr-phoenix, 4gate with late [or no] expo, one base blink stalker, etc.), which pretty much never worked on me and never will.

Questions, comments, and constructive criticism welcome.

edit: how cool is it that ZeNEX is streaming their ladder games now? I watched a bunch of Puzzle and Coca yesterday, and wow Korean's are aggressive!

*
imPERSONater
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States1324 Posts
July 26 2011 19:12 GMT
#2
I'm a hatch first dude, when you get your scout into their base, look to see if they are still mining gas after the initial 100. If they do, that means they are planning aggression. If they are, IMMEDIATELY after your pool finishes make a roach warren. If you do this, the first roaches should pop as he is moving in with banelings. Or with scouting you can find out if he is going roach all in. Then it is up to micro to mitigate the damage. If he isn't getting gas it is either all lings, or a FE. If you don't see him put down a fast expo, then make banes because you are probably getting +1ling attacked or just mass lings!

I also love the fast hatch in ZvP, but I do a 13pool --> 15 hatch. Even if they pylon block you get out lings pretty quick and can get down the expo. Most of the time I can just get the hatch down outright though because the toss player is generally lazy with the probe once they see the fast-ish pool. Take for granted I'm just moved into masters, so probably mid-masters at best.

Hope this helps and good luck!
Fan of: IdrA, Sen, Stephano, Snute, Axlav, Hero
ggofthejungle
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Romania392 Posts
July 26 2011 22:16 GMT
#3
i enjoyed reading this and your past ladder reports. i plan to make my own. maybe I'll try playing some more z instead of t. thx for the insights keep em coming
Dromar
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States2145 Posts
July 26 2011 22:19 GMT
#4
On July 27 2011 07:16 ggofthejungle wrote:
i enjoyed reading this and your past ladder reports. i plan to make my own. maybe I'll try playing some more z instead of t. thx for the insights keep em coming


I'm glad to hear it! I feel strongly that thinking about your play outside the game is one of the most important parts of improving as a player. That's how I started doing this.
UnitedKronos
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
139 Posts
July 26 2011 22:19 GMT
#5
Good read, especially your analysis of MUs. Well done.
Oh hai. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
ggofthejungle
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Romania392 Posts
July 27 2011 17:08 GMT
#6
i started analyzing my own games but i only had time for two games yesterday. i wrote down mistakes i made. oh boy for the first game i found a full page of mistakes i could correct since it was a 28 min tvp, plenty of engagements. i watched replays before but never wrote down an analysis of my own play. i found it really helpful to see it in writing. i am semi-aware of my mistakes but never knew i made so many.

it would prolly be too boring to post the whole game analysis here as I'm not looking for any tips yet. also posting too many blog entries would clog the blog section unnecessarily. maybe a weekly or biweekly analysis would work better since i dont have time to play too many games.

i am diamond but i know i can be low masters material if i study my game and play more. thanks for the inspiration, ill post my results when i play more games

Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Invitational
11:00
WardiTV 10, Group C
IntoTheiNu 1263
WardiTV813
ComeBackTV 623
IndyStarCraft 135
Rex112
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
IndyStarCraft 135
Rex 112
Zoun (SOOP) 13
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 42726
Larva 1924
ggaemo 225
Last 191
Zeus 124
910 51
HiyA 40
ToSsGirL 37
yabsab 12
Rock 9
[ Show more ]
Noble 7
JulyZerg 7
Icarus 6
Dota 2
Gorgc7318
Fuzer 126
Counter-Strike
kRYSTAL_91
Heroes of the Storm
crisheroes296
Other Games
B2W.Neo772
hiko681
Lowko386
XBOCT301
DeMusliM213
XaKoH 176
Pyrionflax142
Liquid`LucifroN131
Liquid`VortiX73
djWHEAT27
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream14164
StarCraft: Brood War
Afreeca ASL 393
Other Games
BasetradeTV32
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 11
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• mYiSmile15
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1498
League of Legends
• Jankos1766
• Nemesis1077
Upcoming Events
The PiG Daily
8h 41m
ByuN vs Rogue
herO vs SHIN
Serral vs TBD
Clem vs TBD
CranKy Ducklings
20h 41m
AI Arena Tournament
1d 3h
BSL: Ladder Tournament
1d 5h
GSL
1d 18h
Yamato Cup
2 days
BSL Open Qualifier
2 days
BSL Open Qualifier
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Soma vs Jaedong
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Leta vs Soulkey
PiGosaur Cup
4 days
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-09-23
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Calamity Invitational
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.