• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:30
CET 14:30
KST 22:30
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8
Community News
2026 KongFu Cup Announcement4BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled12Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains16Weekly Cups (March 2-8): ByuN overcomes PvT block4GSL CK - New online series21
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains GSL CK - New online series BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT
Tourneys
[GSL CK] #2: Team Classic vs. Team Solar [GSL CK] #1: Team Maru vs. Team herO 2026 KongFu Cup Announcement RSL Season 4 announced for March-April PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026] Map Editor closed ?
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 517 Distant Threat Mutation # 516 Specter of Death Mutation # 515 Together Forever
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Gypsy to Korea ASL21 General Discussion BSL 22 Map Contest — Submissions OPEN to March 10 Are you ready for ASL 21? Hype VIDEO
Tourneys
ASL Season 21 Qualifiers March 7-8 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL22] Open Qualifiers & Ladder Tours IPSL Spring 2026 is here!
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Fighting Spirit mining rates Zealot bombing is no longer popular?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread PC Games Sales Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Five o'clock TL Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Mexico's Drug War Russo-Ukrainian War Thread NASA and the Private Sector
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread 2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion General nutrition recommendations Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Money Laundering In Video Ga…
TrAiDoS
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3023 users

Ladder Report 1.4

Blogs > Dromar
Post a Reply
Dromar
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States2145 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-29 00:23:20
March 05 2011 04:02 GMT
#1
This week is crunch time. I need to finish my thesis by the end of spring break. Hopefully the ladder reset will hit by the time I get around to playing again. It's long overdue IMO.

Onto the analysis:

1v1 analysis:

Zerg(39 games)
(18)ZvZ: 7-11 38.8%
( 8)ZvP: 4- 4 50.0%
(13)ZvT: 9- 4 69.2%

18-19 48.6%

This Season:
Zerg(281 games)
(109)ZvZ: 47-62 43.1%
( 82)ZvP: 54-28 65.8%
( 90)ZvT: 52-38 57.7%

153-128 54.4%

This set of games was a ZvZ gauntlet, and it wasn't so great. More on that below. I feel like the limited amount of time that I play is really affecting my winrate now, as I've played quite a few close games that I feel I should have won.

New maps are "meh." I've got Delta Quadrant, Slag Pits, and Backwater Gulch thumbed down. I played a couple games on Slag Pits before I thumbed it down, and the close spawn distances are absurd.

ZvZ:
Well, my ZvZ is still complete shit. Well, it was at least. I really couldn't figure out what was going wrong. When it was a macro game, they had more roaches; I think I was playing too safe early and falling behind economically. When I try to be aggressive with roaches, they always have just enough to defend and a superior economy. If I drone up, I get walked over by roaches. I dunno, I just suck with roaches in ZvZ I guess.

So I decided to completely retool my ZvZ. I got the inspiration from a game where my slow lings got owned by speedlings. I knew all along that ling speed is really important, but I never realized how strong a position I can be in if I have ling speed and my opponent doesn't. And if he has a smaller army at the time ling speed finishes, it's often game.

So my thought was to get ling speed as quickly as possible, and make nothing but lings as soon as my pool was done, which will either
a) win me the game outright if he's unprepared or just droned too hard, or
b) give me complete map control to expo.

So right now I'm going back to basics, with an overpool with quick speed. One thing to note is that I'm not getting my queen right as my pool finishes; I get the queen a bit later instead. It seemed unintuitive at first, but the goal of the build is map control first and foremost, since I tend to do better in those games. Also, if my opponent gets a "standard" 13pool or so, and gets a queen, I'll be moving in with speedlings before those larva can actually help him.

Honestly, I have no idea if the build is horrible or what, but that's what I'm going with right now until I find something better. I've just been so lost in ZvZ that I'm trying to keep it simple: make lings, get speed, kill or expo.

Coincidentally, after I worked out the build I decided to go with, I saw this thread, which outlines a build with a similar goal. My build is a slightly more economic one, with a couple more drones and a few less lings, but similar.


ZvP:
I still have no trouble holding off one-base protoss, but protoss who go sentry-expand and can actually macro are giving me a run for my money. I think I may have to forego the usual roach/hydra/corruptor in favor of muta/ling/bling in some cases, because on some maps (Typhon Peaks?) it seems like it's tough to find a good place to engage the deathball.

P.S. Voidrays are a pain in the ass.


ZvT:
My record is better than I expected for this set of ZvTs. I started going for infestors instead of mutas as suggested by MrBitter and others, with positive results. If my infestor micro didn't suck so much, my wins would be rollovers instead of hardfought. I had the same problem with defiler micro in BW. I'll get better with more practice, but some of these games I was forced to get mutas to deal with viking or banshee harass.

I've been following up the infestor/ling/bling with fast tech to broodlords. Ling/bling/infestor/broodlord is pretty strong . Especially with 3/3 cracklings and 3/3 broodlings coming out of the broodlords.

Questions:
ZvZ:
1. Any thoughts on the build idea I outlined above? Do roaches stop this completely? Does this get owned by banelings? I've only played a few games with this build so far (and went 3-1, losing to a 6pool that I mismicro'd against) and so I don't have much experience against a variety of builds here. My intuition says that a 3 roach wall into some sort of big roach timing attack will own this, but again, I haven't had the chance to try to survive that using this open.

ZvP:
Honestly I just need to play better here. I've been tricked a couple times by those sneaky tosses, wherein I got a bit lazy scouting, and just sent lings to see their army composition, rather than flying my overseer in to see his production and tech. The tosses had left their colossus and voidray in their main, only exposing ZSS to my lazy scouting. So, no corruptors, and I lose.

ZvT:
1. When I open infestor, how do I properly predict and deal with blue flame hellions? Factory + tech lab looks like tanks, but when they come out with 6+ blue flame hellions I'm in deep shit. So the question is, how do I correctly identify blue flame hellions before they're killing all my lings? And second, how do I react? Should I just be getting a roach warren and maybe a few roaches every game to deal with this possibility?
2. I lost one game to a quick hellion/marauder attack into banshee rush. I held the hellion/marauder attack, though I took some damage, but then was completely unprepared for the banshee. It seems the Terran's idea is to open hellion to prompt roaches from me, which get owned by marauder, AND delay my tech, making it unlikely I'll be able to deal with banshee. The Terran's goal is to do as much damage as possible with the hellion/marauder, but there's a bit more emphasis on taking out the queens so that the banshee is instant gg. Really scary build for me, and honestly if I played Terran, I'd be doing this all the time. So, any suggestions? My best guess is to respond to the hellions with speedlings and good micro, and to take out the first hellion/marauder attack with only mass speedling while teching to muta with 3 queens, but I'm really not sure how well speedling will do against hellion/marauder that is micro'd even remotely well. So, yeah, any advice on this?

Reps:
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/146443-1v1-terran-zerg-metalopolis
ZvT infestor/ling opening. Kinda sloppy as I mentioned above.

No good replays really this time.


As always, comments and constructive criticism welcome.

Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Wardi Open
12:00
#78
WardiTV764
OGKoka 368
Rex121
IntoTheiNu 18
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko383
OGKoka 368
Rex 121
herO (Afreeca) 68
Vindicta 19
StarCraft: Brood War
Horang2 7576
Sea 2710
Soma 1019
EffOrt 562
Mini 540
Light 414
ZerO 393
Stork 388
Snow 384
Rush 242
[ Show more ]
ggaemo 236
BeSt 220
hero 192
Killer 154
Pusan 113
Mind 92
Aegong 74
sorry 71
PianO 66
Shinee 62
Barracks 54
NotJumperer 39
sSak 29
[sc1f]eonzerg 27
IntoTheRainbow 20
Terrorterran 19
GoRush 14
soO 13
scan(afreeca) 12
SilentControl 11
Noble 10
Britney 1
Dota 2
qojqva1761
League of Legends
JimRising 174
Counter-Strike
x6flipin523
allub283
markeloff162
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King128
Heroes of the Storm
crisheroes204
Other Games
singsing2525
B2W.Neo1030
hiko504
shoxiejesuss443
Pyrionflax190
Fuzer 183
XaKoH 171
QueenE66
Hui .50
ZerO(Twitch)13
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream607
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 76
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1438
• Doublelift1317
• TFBlade367
Upcoming Events
Monday Night Weeklies
3h 30m
WardiTV Team League
22h 30m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 10h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 21h
OSC
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
KCM Race Survival
2 days
WardiTV Team League
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
KCM Race Survival
3 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Team League
3 days
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Maru vs Zoun
Cure vs ByuN
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
BSL
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
herO vs MaxPax
Rogue vs TriGGeR
BSL
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Afreeca Starleague
6 days
Sharp vs Scan
Rain vs Mong
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-03-15
WardiTV Winter 2026
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Jeongseon Sooper Cup
BSL Season 22
CSL Elite League 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
2026 Changsha Offline CUP
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
NationLESS Cup
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.