|
I'm going to take a break from my usual blogging about mechanical watches and talk about a subject I see all too often on these boards.
Please keep discussion in this thread civil as undoubtedly some of you will disagree with my advice.
To start, I am not a pick up artist nor is the things I write taken from the scores of dating books out there, however, a lot of it will echo sentiments found in some of these books.
I am probably fairly old by the standards of these boards and been through my share of relationships and this will be a rough composite of things gathered from my own experiences and things I've read. I will divide it in to multiple posts on various subjects if there is interest.
1. Do not make women the focus. Put the focus on yourself. Don't think to yourself "how do I get a girlfriend?" think to yourself "how do I improve myself?"
As much as the romantics like to think that there is the perfect person out there for you and that love conquers all, it simply isn't the case. Everyone, men and women, would like to find the mate with as many great qualities as possible. No woman will turn down a rich, powerful, buff, confident, funny, intelligent, worldly man.
Think about the men in popular culture that women swoon for. They aren't thinking about how to get women, they just work on themselves so that they are irresistible.
So start working on yourself. Working out is a good start because it has many major benefits.
1. When working out and weight lifting, your body produces more testosterone and correspondingly you will be much more confident. This is because testosterone is a hormone makes us take more risks and assess fewer risks, thus you will naturally be more confident.
2. You will be more energized to do other things in your life. You will think clearer and sleep better. You relieve a lot of stress from other events in your daily life.
3. Working out is not that expensive and while genes does play a factor in your muscle growth, everybody can improve. Also, since most people on these boards are in their late teens/early 20s, you have the time to work out and your body is in your prime, where you will have the most growth.
4. You simply look better. Clothes fit better, women start noticing. You start feeling you are the top dog in the room, giving you even more confidence.
Notice how I put looking better last. Its really very minor compared to the other benefits that working out gives you.
Because working out is the easiest of things to do to improve yourself (most of you would see a lot of change with just 1 year of a regimented workout program), that is why I listed it first.
But working out is just a small aspect of your overall improvement. Improve yourself financially if you already work out. If you have money and you are fit, then become more worldly, learn something new. Learn something new not to impress women but because you want to. Always have a goal in mind and never make a woman your goal.
 
|
To continue on the improving yourself idea. When I was younger, in my early 20s, I took Salsa lessons to try to meet women. Unfortunately, at the place where I learned, there was a dearth of available girls. But I didn't quit and I continued on for 7 months. Later that year I moved to another area of town and when I went to the salsa club there, I saw a litany of attractive women who were new to salsa dancing who I found would much rather dance with me than the more attractive dude who is standing on the sidelines.
More importantly, from a guy that before that point, only did stuff like play starcraft and watch anime, I realized that dancing isn't that hard and got me over the self inhibition. Thus I was able to pick up other forms of dance more easily, hip hop, country, etc... I no longer thought "oh maybe I don't look so good out there, I better stand back." I thought " hey I'm the shit because I have these moves down pat."
|
Nicely written. I think i might benefit from this.
Just a few questions that popped into my mind while reading:
1. How old are you?
2. Where did you find the motivation to write this?
3. If this is about the relationships, where is the advice beyond the first few days?
|
1. I am about to turn 29.
2. I saw a lot of relationship threads in the blogs section and that prompted me to write something.
3. There is a lot that can be said that I haven't said yet about improving yourself, both while trying to find a girlfriend and while already in a relationship. and beyond improving yourself, there are other aspects. I just don't want to write a superlong post if there is no interest.
|
I agree that it is great to find ways to improve oneself. In doing this, however, it is good improve in areas that are meaningful to you. Don't become buff to impress women. (It should be noted that most women, statistically, prefer more "average" body types... NOT highly ripped/muscled men. This is often hard for men to understand, since men typically focus more on the physical aspect of women then women do towards men.) Work out because you want to feel good and be healthy.
The thing is, not all women are interested in "rich worldly men." Acquire wealth if that is meaningful to you, but if you aren't ambitious in "worldly" ways, this does not mean you have to give up on romance. There are plenty of men and women who are non materialistic and non ambitious in conventional "worldly" ways. Such people will very much appreciate a mate with similar values. Given that I actually try to limit my income to less than 10,000 USD a year, it was important to me that any potential mate not care a lot about having a lot of money, since I certainly couldn't share that interest or providefor such a person in a meaningful way.
Really, one of the best things you can do is assess your own values and interests, and try to find ways to connect with people who share those values. If you aren't much of a drinker or social person, it doesn't make sense to go to bars to pick up women. If you aren't religious, it doesn't make sense to go to church to meet women. Try to figure out ways to connect with people who share your values and interests. Don't limit your connections to women you are interested in. Make connections with all kinds of people, and especially those who share interests and values, because they can in turn help you connect to women who you will be compatible with. My best friend is a gay man, and it is through him that I met my fiance. He introduced me to her at a potluck for people interested in gathering fruit for free from city trees.
In the end, the main thing about finding a good mate is to be aware of yourself, your own values, and to try to be around people who are similar. I think the big obstacles to relationships mostly revolve around small/non existent social networks and lack of exposure to single women with similar interests and values.
|
I agree wholeheartedly that you should not do any of the above to impress women and that the focus should be self improvement.
I also definitely agree with your sentiments regarding making connections and socializing with everyone, men and women. You never know what you can learn from talking to someone that you can apply somewhere else. Notice nowhere do I say anything about going to bars and picking up women. In fact you shouldn't go anywhere for the express purpose of meeting women.
That said, improving yourself financially definitely opens a lot of doors. It allows you to pursue the many interests that you may have. You wouldn't want money to be the reason that you aren't able to do something you always wanted to do.
I think you actually agree a lot with what I said.
|
I'm pretty happy with my body, but girls always say I'm too skinny. So two days ago I told this to a girl and she said that I shouldn't change my body just to impress girls.
It's apparent girls want guys with big muscles... but having huge muscles doesn't necessarily make one healthier. You see muscly people all the time who drink a lot and do drugs.
2. You will be more energized to do other things in your life. You will think clearer and sleep better. You relieve a lot of stress from other events in your daily life.
While generally exercise is a great way to relieve stress, some forms of exercise, the violent ones, have a tendency to make people more violent. Could be the increase in testosterone.
In addition, I don't believe that exercise drastically increasing muscle mass has anything to do with increased metabolism or increased energy. http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/anatomyandphysiology/a/rmr.htm
Exercise of the intensity and duration commonly performed by recreational exercisers (e.g., walking for 30- 60 minutes or jogging at a pace of 8-10 minutes per mile for 20-30 minutes) typically results in a return to baseline of energy expenditure well within the first hour of recovery. The post-exercise calorie bonus for this type of exercise probably accounts for only about 10-30 additional calories burned beyond the exercise bout itself.
4. You simply look better. Clothes fit better, women start noticing. You start feeling you are the top dog in the room, giving you even more confidence.
But what if you aren't fat and you don't see the need to be any stronger in your everyday life?
Overall I think what Inky says is more important. Meeting women with similar interests is the way to go to find a girl. Either way, it can't hurt to improve oneself for the sake of improving oneself.
|
Improving yourself while already in a relationship.
A lot of guys did the right things while trying to find a girlfriend but once they are in a relationship, they become lazy and stagnant. Don't.
Recently I've read some threads here where the guy says that his girlfriend broke up with him or cheated on him because she said she no longer found him sexually attractive. He wondered whether he should have worked out more during the relationship. While that certainly could have helped, that isn't the root of the problem. In reality, he could have improved himself in many ways. This keeps the relationship feeling new and also gives the man goals that are independent of his woman.
We've been led to believe by movies and tv and books that women want a man that worships them and caters to their every whim but in reality nothing kills attraction more than a man that is at his woman's beck and call. Humans are very adaptable to their situation and surroundings. Thus, while she will at first be really happy that you really want to know her needs and want to please her, she will quickly get used to this. At that point, what was once cute has now become mundane and on top of that, she has lost respect for you.
Thus, improve yourself while in a relationship to put the focus on you and improve your overall situation and to distract you from putting too much emphasis on her.
|
This is not really a workout thread so I'm not going to go in to the specifics of what you should workout on. I didn't state any metrics towards the type of exercises you should do in my OP.
I'm not quite sure why you guys put so much emphasis on finding girls of similar interests though. I used to think this was really important but over time I realized that if you are attractive enough, girls will try to pick up your interest. If a girl is in to you, you can say the most retarded or boring things and she'll laugh at everything. I mean the opposite happens too. You're telling me that if some supermodel told you she would love to be your girlfriend if you would only learn how to fold origami with her, you would turn her down? So to me, interest/hobbies are the last of my concerns when looking at qualities of a girl.
What should be first and foremost when evaluating a girl for long term relationship possibilities is her moral stance and her maturity.
But this is delving in to subjects I want to explore later.
|
Alright, then what do you do after you've been catering to a lot of your girl's whims for a while and you feel like she doesn't find you that sexually attractive anymore? Does it come down to just continuing to make goals for yourself, independent of her like you said, and basically acting single while still being in a relationship?
|
well it depends on how long you've been catering to her whims and how bored she is of you.
If there is still some attraction left that she has for you and she has not had another eligible guy that she finds very attractive hit on her, the relationship could be still very much healthy enough to save.
So yes, basically start improving yourself in some way and drastically reduce how much you cater to her whims. Also slightly reduce how often you see her.
Lets say a guy has been in a relationship for a while but its stagnating. One day he starts working out pretty hardcore and his girlfriend can see a small physical transformation and also starts noticing other women taking notice of her boyfriend. He also has an excuse for not catering to her whims "sorry babe, can't run your errands, I got to hit to gym".
She starts wondering why is her boyfriend doing this? She also starts thinking, hmmm, maybe there is more to him than meets the eye. The other women noticing you also makes her think "hey, I have a real good guy here, I have a guy that other girls like, so I better keep on to him".
I mean you never hear of a woman dumping her guy right after he has drastically improved himself in some way right?
Now granted, your goal might be something like getting a higher education degree or something like that where it doesn't attract more women. But then again, if your girl likes you just because you are at her beck and call and isn't willing to compromise for your noble goal of say getting a Masters, is she really worth it to be your girlfriend?
Basically your strategy is to let her know "I am in a relationship with you but I am also a prize with many good qualities. If I am not with you, its not the end of the world and I can easily find another woman" without overtly saying it. Never get angry at her. Focus on yourself and be more indifferent to what she wants. You might say "but lixlix, how does she know I still like her" and I'll answer "you've been showing her all along that you like her, believe me, she knows".
Lets say you meet some resistance like she says something like "you're spending so much time at the gym, you never see me anymore or help me with things." laugh it off, grab her tummy or ass and say "well maybe you should come work out a bit too" then give her a deep kiss.
|
What a let-down, I came to this thread bursting with expert advice, but it turns out that people here already have it 
|
Losers pursue women and constantly worry about improving themselves for their sake. Real men pursue real passions, and take the women as they come. True story.
|
Exactly.
Improve yourself because you want to be awesome. You are the superhero off on a great adventure. She is just along for the ride.
|
I find working out boring. If you're willing to endure repetitive boredom for 10 hours a week in order to get/keep a slightly(?) more attractive woman, then we're two very different people. If confidence should come from anywhere, IMO it should be from doing the things you really like passionately and creatively, not the results in any form external.
OP says : "Learn something new not to impress women but because you want to."
Assumption is that everyone wants to. Yet I believe wanting to means you're drawing strength for that willpower from your ego, not "abstract want". We want the feelings of mastery, success, control, etc. Careful though, if you become too self-absorbed like that people won't like you much, no matter how many interesting tidbits you can throw at them. It can become a narcissistic obsession because the good feelings feed upon themselves.
Then again, I'm the addictive type. I'm also the type to feel that anything ego-based is fundamentally harmful to relationships.
|
Most of the relationship problems I've seen on this forum have come from people not being narcissistic at all and forgetting their own needs. I seriously doubt that the intended audience this post is designed to help will do a quick change in to a ego maniacal narcissist.
Its funny how so many people are jumping in to say that they don't need to work out to be confident or find women or maintain a relationship. If you are super successful without having to work out, thats great, but for those that are having trouble in the confidence/finding a girlfriend/maintaining a relationship department, working out is a great and easy way to improve things and who knows, might start to enjoy it when you see the gains.
I'm not sure what exactly you meant with regards to ego being bad for relationships but everybody has an ego and an ego is good for the relationship. It allows you to more easily communicate what you want out of a relationship. Also, its an old adage but before somebody can love you, you really have to love yourself.
|
Hmm, what you're saying makes sense, yet to me there has always seemed to be a strong antagonism between viewing yourself and others through ego's lens, and the opening up/letting guard down which is so relevant to a relationship (I mean relationship in the largest sense here, not just romantic). On the surface and pragmatically, this is more or less the case. But inside the way you think and value things, I can't see those two attitudes overlapping. Either you are concerned with the safety, security and growth of your ego, or you let it go and give other people your candid attention - that is, attention without having those ego-things still in the back of your mind shaping your attitude towards the other.
|
I think I defy the obsession people have with the body. You don't need to work out or have big muscles to attract women. Lots of women don't even find it very attractive if you spent too much time working out because it means you're obsessed with your body.
I believe that personality is the most important factor in relationships. With it, ordinary features of your partner become very alluring, imperfections are seen as what makes him or her special, and basically they become the most attractive person in the world to you because your mind wants them to be.
Obviously they have to be within the range of your 'type,' but I just want to point out that not every girl's type is someone who spends 2 hours at the gym every day lol. I find it really unattractive when a girl tells me about working out, because I feel like it means she doesn't think her body is attractive without doing so. And that makes me sad.
PS: I make a distinction between living an active lifestyle and working out. To me living an active lifestyle is important and keeps a person's body healthy, but working out is a bit of a waste of time unless you actually have a career that depends on it.
|
If any of the guys that come to this thread are frustrated about not getting women i advise them not to be too upset. Nothing in life is for free, and everything costs you something. Especially women. You might be thinking that there is something wrong with you, or you might be at the point where you feel like getting girls is an impossible feat for you. Dont feel that way. Relationships are like business deals. Two companies merge together because they both think the deal will work out better for them in the long run. And when you put it that way, there really isnt any romance or glory. Its just a social contract made out of fear of being alone. There is nothing beautiful about that. For every moment you have with her that is "great", you will have dozens of other moments where you wish you were single again, and could do whatever you want. I think many of you who cant get a girlfriend build it up to be greater than it really is. Its work dude. Its frustration. Its constant upkeep. Its constant guesswork. Unless you find a girl who just happens to think you are GOD for no reason and will never get used to you or bored of you then you are working 24/7 to please her whether you realize it or not. Some guys like being that role. Some guys like being told what to think and do and told what is a waste of time or what to value. Its worth it to them just to have the girl. If you are one of those guys then yeah, all this advice works.
But.
Take a look at what it costs you. Lets imagine for a minute that you do all these things, and, some girl around you notices and starts to like you because of the illusion of success you have created. Btw, yeah, its an illusion. Doing a bunch of things that humans have grown to see as symbols of success and confidence doesnt really equal success and confidence. And it doesnt equal any of the actual traits that keep a relationship strong after the attraction phase wears off either. But anyways lets say you run out and do all that stuff. Start working out. Start going back to school. Start dressing like every dude you see on tv. Start acting like you "own the room" everywhere you go. How long can you do all those things day to day before you realize its just not "you"? How much time left do you have on this planet to live? Is it worth it to you to run around like a fool doing everything you can to please other peoples vision of whats confidence and success? Maybe it seems like it at first, before youve got her, but once youve had her for awhile, are you still willing to be something you are not just to keep someone into "you"?
For some guys, yes, it is worth it to them to do all of those things to impress girls. So, great, thats great for them. But to anyone not willing to lead a false lifestyle crossing their fingers and hoping and praying that somebody notices i say dont feel ashamed and dont feel like you are missing out on anything that great. For what its worth all my guy friends in relationships want out and the ones not in relationships want to find one asap. The grass is always greener. Dont beat yourself up over the miniscule. You arent missing out on anything by not being with chicks. Its not really that great.
|
I really like the attitude of the OP. Great stuff, and a very healthy approach in general.
On the subject of working out, it's awesome if you do it for the health benefits. You can be toned, but you don't have to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger or Ronnie Coleman.
Life is a lot more enjoyable when you can pull up to the hiking trail or ballpark and have no problems participating whatsoever. Improves your quality of life. Nothing wrong with that.
Edit : I also love the fact that people are freely sharing their advice without the agenda of trying to hustle you into paying $$$ for their material. It seems like everytime I turn around, people want you to support them by giving them money.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
