• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:07
CEST 20:07
KST 03:07
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Weekly Cups (July 27-Aug 2): SHIN's big week0SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-68SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-64PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August)14Neeb returns to progaming; rejoins ONSYDE18
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft 2 at SC4ALL II Invite #3/8 - Clem Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard" Geoff 'iNcontroL' Robinson has passed away Neeb returns to progaming; rejoins ONSYDE
Tourneys
PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25) SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-6 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 537 Hostile Territory Mutation # 536 Railroad Switch Mutation # 535 Assembly of Vengeance
Brood War
General
Making an Online Broodwar Manager Game ASL22 General Discussion [Personal Project Share] Terran Defense v0.60 Data needed BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-6 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues 2v2v2v2 Tournament
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Early Access is Now Live! Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
The Games Industry And ATVI European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
The Clem Fan Club INnoVation Fan Club The Scarlett Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
What is a Gamer?
TrAiDoS
Hello guys!
LIN1s
ASL S22 English Commentary…
namkraft
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 3506 users

Non-dualism

Blogs > ShaperofDreams
Post a Reply
ShaperofDreams
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada2492 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-30 21:46:17
August 30 2010 21:43 GMT
#1
This is an email that i just wrote for someone. I found it very fun to write about so I'm deciding to post it here too.

It's a response to someone who wants philosophy asking me what I read.


For the reading material I recommend "I Am that". It's a recorded conversation between a bunch of people from a lot of different places with a famous Yogi (enlightened non-dualist). It's very dense but if you read it well and a few times it guaranteed WILL change your life for the better.

You have to be a pretty introspective\philosophical person to "get" it though. i have attempted describing it to some people and its like speaking to a wall. I'm pretty confident in you though judging by your blog\writing.

Also its important to understand that all of the religious phrases in there are analogies\metaphors. God = the universe\everything that is\isn't.

It's also important to have a good understanding of language of human paradox and ideas. The way we think and the way our language is set up makes us constantly contradict ourselves simply because no thinking machine can comprehend "everything" just like we cannot actually comprehend the number 1 billion.

Our way of thought is just a system of paradoxes created and used to explain the incomprehensible.

I will attempt to explain the universe to you as a diagram

Imagine a beam of light being projected through a film, to show up as an image on a screen:

---------------|---------------------------------|


--light ray--the film--modified light ray--screen--

The ray of light is everything that is or isn't. Simply everything. The world.

The film is the human mind. The machine that we use to filter the ray of light and create an image\perception.

The screen that holds this resulting projection is the Personal World. Life as you perceive it. Life out of context. Life full of suffering and of joy. The constant tennis match between pain and pleasure.

Why isn't the screen true to the ray of light passing through? The human mind is always contradicting itself, it can't comprehend the whole so it looks at details.

Once you understand that you cannot trust your own mind or opinion at all it frees you in a way. I became even more introspective. Studying the prison I had built around myself.

I could go on forever but it would be redundant if you read the book. I hope this babble brings some interesting brainstorm material for you as you read.

You can google "i am that" and the first result will be a free online book.


I hope you take this seriously and actually read the book, i accidentally put a lot of effort into writing this. whatever it was fun.

peace

Bitches don't know about my overlord. FUCK OFF ALDARIS I HAVE ENOUGH PYLONS. My Balls are as smooth as Eggs.
Sleight
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
2471 Posts
August 30 2010 21:55 GMT
#2
You are delving into the pretty established Buddhist understanding of existence.

The 'self' does not exist in a traditional sense. The term "I" is only true in a convenient sense, that there is a certain individuality to each's experience, but not in the sense that there is any "you"-ness to who "you" are.

We all know what a river is, but there is no "river"-ness to it. Such is human existence. There is nothing eternal or unchanging about the river, it continues to run, but it is impermanent and dynamic.

Eternalists say that the self/soul is infinite and they are wrong, for we can look around and see that every day we are in a flux of what makes us who we are.

Nihilists say that the self/soul is nothing and they are wrong too, for we can look around and see that things exist unto themselves.

Each person is the sum of their karmic trajectory, their causes, conditions, and all of those around them. That is the essential understanding to moving forward with the non-dualism of our existence. To try and skip ahead and discuss how we perceive life is challenging without first accepting that there is no 'self' and there is not "no self".

One Love
ShaperofDreams
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada2492 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-30 22:19:48
August 30 2010 22:17 GMT
#3
Thanks Sleight I'm interested in getting a little community thread for this type of discussion. I know at least a few TLers that are into non-dualism.

I'm happy about the word "flux" that you gave me. I've been looking for that forever

edit: i really like talking and discussing this stuff with people because in a way we are practicing it. its like meditative introspection with more minds and experiences to work with\analyze.
Bitches don't know about my overlord. FUCK OFF ALDARIS I HAVE ENOUGH PYLONS. My Balls are as smooth as Eggs.
ella_guru
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada1741 Posts
August 30 2010 22:32 GMT
#4
I think that the things philosophy talks about aren't meant to be talked about. It is very interesting, but it seems in general those who knew the most of what these things speak about , spoke the least about them, likely because they knew words fail the human experience.

I encourage you to do what you like though!
Each day gets better : )
Tooplark
Profile Joined October 2008
United States3977 Posts
August 31 2010 00:35 GMT
#5
I just got around to reading Plato. Specifically, his dialogue on the nature of knowledge. I highly recommend it. (Theaetetus)

There's also the shadows in a cave analogy. Plato says, yes, there is some river-ness to a river; in fact, that is what we must seek to define about the river.
WHAT POW'R ART THOU WHO FROM BELOW HAST MADE ME RISE UNWILLINGLY AND SLOW
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
August 31 2010 01:11 GMT
#6
The river thing is an idiom Heraclitus used.
Sleight
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
2471 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-31 01:53:12
August 31 2010 01:51 GMT
#7
On August 31 2010 07:32 ella_guru wrote:
I think that the things philosophy talks about aren't meant to be talked about. It is very interesting, but it seems in general those who knew the most of what these things speak about , spoke the least about them, likely because they knew words fail the human experience.

I encourage you to do what you like though!


There are only a few questions the Buddha would not answer, for they are unable to be explained without creating misunderstanding. This is not one of them and quite essential to Right View.

I just got around to reading Plato. Specifically, his dialogue on the nature of knowledge. I highly recommend it. (Theaetetus)

There's also the shadows in a cave analogy. Plato says, yes, there is some river-ness to a river; in fact, that is what we must seek to define about the river.


Plato is clearly in exact opposition. It is a classic sutra, where the monk Nagasena and the Greek King Milinda have a open debate and we can show that there can be no innate essence to anything. Plato's ideas are weak and fall quite clearly in a rationale debate on the issue. The whole notion of things existing beyond the mind's notion is quite ludicrous philosophically and even the most basic of today's science answers the whole debate quickly.

For sake of argument, I will just answer you as Nagasena did the Greek King, long before Plato was even a gleam in his ancestor's eye.

"Does the carriage make a chariot? Do the wheels make a chariot? Does having just a carriage, axle, wheels, flag, and so forth make a chariot? Is it only a chariot in certain combination of carriage, axles, wheels, flag, and so forth? What is it then without the flag? Without the reins? Clearly, the chariot is only a name which we have given to an idea, a representation of something for sake of convenience. Who are you so afraid of that you lie, Great King, for clearly there is no thing innately a chariot which can be found here."
One Love
ella_guru
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada1741 Posts
August 31 2010 02:10 GMT
#8
On August 31 2010 10:51 Sleight wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 31 2010 07:32 ella_guru wrote:
I think that the things philosophy talks about aren't meant to be talked about. It is very interesting, but it seems in general those who knew the most of what these things speak about , spoke the least about them, likely because they knew words fail the human experience.

I encourage you to do what you like though!


There are only a few questions the Buddha would not answer, for they are unable to be explained without creating misunderstanding. This is not one of them and quite essential to Right View.

Show nested quote +
I just got around to reading Plato. Specifically, his dialogue on the nature of knowledge. I highly recommend it. (Theaetetus)

There's also the shadows in a cave analogy. Plato says, yes, there is some river-ness to a river; in fact, that is what we must seek to define about the river.


Plato is clearly in exact opposition. It is a classic sutra, where the monk Nagasena and the Greek King Milinda have a open debate and we can show that there can be no innate essence to anything. Plato's ideas are weak and fall quite clearly in a rationale debate on the issue. The whole notion of things existing beyond the mind's notion is quite ludicrous philosophically and even the most basic of today's science answers the whole debate quickly.

For sake of argument, I will just answer you as Nagasena did the Greek King, long before Plato was even a gleam in his ancestor's eye.

"Does the carriage make a chariot? Do the wheels make a chariot? Does having just a carriage, axle, wheels, flag, and so forth make a chariot? Is it only a chariot in certain combination of carriage, axles, wheels, flag, and so forth? What is it then without the flag? Without the reins? Clearly, the chariot is only a name which we have given to an idea, a representation of something for sake of convenience. Who are you so afraid of that you lie, Great King, for clearly there is no thing innately a chariot which can be found here."


Already we deviate from the truth!
Each day gets better : )
exeexe
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Denmark937 Posts
August 31 2010 02:24 GMT
#9
this is why ghosts exist.-
And never forget, its always easier to throw a bomb downstairs than up. - George Orwell
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 53m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ByuN 466
uThermal 278
BRAT_OK 89
ProTech72
RushiSC 24
MindelVK 15
EmSc Tv 12
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 17298
firebathero 393
Soma 381
Rush 217
Dewaltoss 142
Larva 89
Mong 47
ZZZero.O 32
HiyA 28
Bale 25
[ Show more ]
Terrorterran 15
zelot 12
Sexy 11
Dota 2
qojqva2212
Counter-Strike
fl0m2183
byalli652
x6flipin579
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu169
Other Games
Grubby3876
FrodaN1774
ceh9730
ArmadaUGS158
XaKoH 142
elazer133
C9.Mang0128
Trikslyr55
Mew2King55
UpATreeSC48
JuggernautJason0
Organizations
StarCraft 2
EmSc Tv 12
EmSc2Tv 12
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 69
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 20
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV587
• lizZardDota2145
League of Legends
• imaqtpie1758
• TFBlade917
Counter-Strike
• Nemesis2133
Other Games
• Shiphtur428
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
5h 53m
Escore
15h 53m
IntoTheTV X SOOP
16h 53m
Big Brain Bouts
21h 53m
DnS vs Rex
Reynor vs Cure
Replay Cast
1d 5h
RSL Revival
1d 14h
herO vs SHIN
Clem vs Solar
Serral vs Rogue
Ladder Legends
1d 23h
Ladder Legends
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
OSC
2 days
[ Show More ]
OSC
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
The Patches Monday
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
PiG Sty Festival
4 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-08-05
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
Acropolis #5
RSL Revival: Season 6
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W6
Escore Tournament S3: W7
CSLAN 4
ASL Season 22
Escore Tournament S3: W8
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
Thunderpick World Champ.
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
Logitech G Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.