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On November 02 2011 15:23 iNkA wrote:
I don't understand that when you want to argue arterro being re-featured you just hate on me. I don't get it at all. I know and like attero as well. i hope he gets re-featured, but i'm not going to go out and hate on someone else because he isn't
Where's the hate? Where I say you've achieved less than him? That's perspective and it's not like you're worse or better than him, just less achieved and that could be for a number of reasons.
Don't take things personal, you're merely a jumping point to reiterate my original arguments. If I hated on you, I would have said you don't deserve to be refeatured (which isn't true). I more saying that if you got refeatured, then someone I feel strongly about equally deserves the same conclusion and chance.
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i actually have quite a few more achievements than him. TL database isn't up to date on that.
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On November 02 2011 15:32 iNkA wrote:
i actually have quite a few more achievements than him. TL database isn't up to date on that.
Send me them, I'll be glad to update your Liquipedia page without an issue or problem.
I privately messaged you to avoid derailment.
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On November 02 2011 15:21 Peas wrote:This is what I wrote in the main thread Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 13:37 Peas wrote:
I beseech you representatives and administrators of Team Liquid to explain why this change to featured (and thus un-featured) streams was necessary. I suppose there is something to say for streamlining (pun intended), but its not like the list of featured streams was becoming unmanageably long. It seems to me that there is a not so insignificant number of streamers who stand to lose a lot a viewers (and thus a lot of revenue). This appears particularly sucky to me, irrespective of whether or not their streams meet your seemingly inconsistent and arbitrary metric.
Whats also ludicrous is Gordon Hayward maintaining featured status. Its a super slow night for streaming and he's barely cracking 250 viewers. Moreover, he in no way relies on streaming to generate revenue towards his livelihood.
its gordon freaking hayward man. how can you argue that he shouldnt be featured?
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On November 02 2011 15:45 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 15:21 Peas wrote:This is what I wrote in the main thread On November 02 2011 13:37 Peas wrote:
I beseech you representatives and administrators of Team Liquid to explain why this change to featured (and thus un-featured) streams was necessary. I suppose there is something to say for streamlining (pun intended), but its not like the list of featured streams was becoming unmanageably long. It seems to me that there is a not so insignificant number of streamers who stand to lose a lot a viewers (and thus a lot of revenue). This appears particularly sucky to me, irrespective of whether or not their streams meet your seemingly inconsistent and arbitrary metric.
Whats also ludicrous is Gordon Hayward maintaining featured status. Its a super slow night for streaming and he's barely cracking 250 viewers. Moreover, he in no way relies on streaming to generate revenue towards his livelihood. its gordon freaking hayward man. how can you argue that he shouldnt be featured?
He's a bad player, he has no accomplishments, he does not draw many viewers, and he does not contribute in any meaningful way to the community.
Fin.
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He's a notable character, that's why he's featured (hence other)
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On November 02 2011 15:51 Peas wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 15:45 dAPhREAk wrote:On November 02 2011 15:21 Peas wrote:This is what I wrote in the main thread On November 02 2011 13:37 Peas wrote:
I beseech you representatives and administrators of Team Liquid to explain why this change to featured (and thus un-featured) streams was necessary. I suppose there is something to say for streamlining (pun intended), but its not like the list of featured streams was becoming unmanageably long. It seems to me that there is a not so insignificant number of streamers who stand to lose a lot a viewers (and thus a lot of revenue). This appears particularly sucky to me, irrespective of whether or not their streams meet your seemingly inconsistent and arbitrary metric.
Whats also ludicrous is Gordon Hayward maintaining featured status. Its a super slow night for streaming and he's barely cracking 250 viewers. Moreover, he in no way relies on streaming to generate revenue towards his livelihood. its gordon freaking hayward man. how can you argue that he shouldnt be featured? He's a bad player, he has no accomplishments, he does not draw many viewers, and he does not contribute in any meaningful way to the community. Fin.
He may be a bad player with no accomplishments, and not have as many viewers as most top players, but the value of having a NBA player publicizing that he plays Starcraft is a huge contribution to the community through the additional publicity he receives.
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On November 02 2011 15:51 Torte de Lini wrote:
He's a notable character, that's why he's featured (hence other)
what does it matter if hes a notable character if he doesnt draw viewers?
On November 02 2011 15:53 duk3 wrote:
He may be a bad player with no accomplishments, and not have as many viewers as most top players, but the value of having a NBA player publicizing that he plays Starcraft is a huge contribution to the community through the additional publicity he receives.
Assuming he does publicize that he plays starcraft, what does that have to do with streaming? Streaming here is not publicity, its preaching to the choir.
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On November 02 2011 15:56 Peas wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 15:51 Torte de Lini wrote:
He's a notable character, that's why he's featured (hence other) what does it matter if hes a notable character if he doesnt draw viewers? Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 15:53 duk3 wrote:
He may be a bad player with no accomplishments, and not have as many viewers as most top players, but the value of having a NBA player publicizing that he plays Starcraft is a huge contribution to the community through the additional publicity he receives. Assuming he does publicize that he plays starcraft, what does that have to do with streaming? Streaming here is not publicity, its preaching to the choir.
I think they make the assumption that he draws no viewers based on a couple of months and not of one day or particular time in the day.
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I'm pretty much fine as long as MrBitter is still featured. I have a sneaking suspicion that he wouldn't be featured if it weren't for the ESL job though (because then he can be listed as a caster/community guy, as opposed to a player) or maybe the 12 weeks with the pro's was good enough of a contribution to remain featured?
Either way i'm happy ^^
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On November 02 2011 16:03 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 15:56 Peas wrote:On November 02 2011 15:51 Torte de Lini wrote:
He's a notable character, that's why he's featured (hence other) what does it matter if hes a notable character if he doesnt draw viewers? On November 02 2011 15:53 duk3 wrote:
He may be a bad player with no accomplishments, and not have as many viewers as most top players, but the value of having a NBA player publicizing that he plays Starcraft is a huge contribution to the community through the additional publicity he receives. Assuming he does publicize that he plays starcraft, what does that have to do with streaming? Streaming here is not publicity, its preaching to the choir. I think they make the assumption that he draws no viewers based on a couple of months and not of one day or particular time in the day.
To be honest, tonight was the first time I saw him streaming. I'm on TL often and daily. I really don't know the numbers he generates, but I think I can safely assume they are not great. Maybe the are, and if they are thats fine. If they are sub 300 numbers, however, its unfair and rather unseemly to keep him featured over more deserving streamers.
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He could be featured for his contributions to the scene (promotion, speaking well of E-sports).
We shouldn't focus on who to defeature, but more on who deserves to be featured rather. There's no official limit to how many people can be featured, just a bar or standard to reach.
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One person I reccomend featuring is the TL user's stream, blackcitadel (whitecitadel on twitch tv). He is a high level that has featured players such as ZENEX Yong, gave his account blackcitadel to Startale Rainbow. But the main reason to why he should be featured is because he gives high level coacing to almost all class players, for free! Thats right he coaches for free in his own time for almost up to 12 hours taking player after player, because he likes doing it. This is why he should be featured so that more people can recogise of how good of a person he is and also a nice person he is, cheers 
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On November 02 2011 16:08 Peas wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 16:03 Torte de Lini wrote:On November 02 2011 15:56 Peas wrote:On November 02 2011 15:51 Torte de Lini wrote:
He's a notable character, that's why he's featured (hence other) what does it matter if hes a notable character if he doesnt draw viewers? On November 02 2011 15:53 duk3 wrote:
He may be a bad player with no accomplishments, and not have as many viewers as most top players, but the value of having a NBA player publicizing that he plays Starcraft is a huge contribution to the community through the additional publicity he receives. Assuming he does publicize that he plays starcraft, what does that have to do with streaming? Streaming here is not publicity, its preaching to the choir. I think they make the assumption that he draws no viewers based on a couple of months and not of one day or particular time in the day. To be honest, tonight was the first time I saw him streaming. I'm on TL often and daily. I really don't know the numbers he generates, but I think I can safely assume they are not great. Maybe the are, and if they are thats fine. If they are sub 300 numbers, however, its unfair and rather unseemly to keep him featured over more deserving streamers.
if you dont think that a nba player who plays sc2 should be featured then there really is no reason to talk with you. its just beyond belief that you dont think that is awesome. oh, by the way, gordon got sc2 mentioned on espn, yahoo sports, cbs sports, etc. wtf has protech done?
here is the website, so you can realize how dumb your posts sound about him:
http://espn.go.com/espn/thelife/videogames/blog/_/name/thegamer/id/6948686/gordon-hayward-joins-pro-gaming-league?readmore=fullstory
one more edit, i guess you think that if obama started playing sc2, we should ignore him too. amiright?
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On November 02 2011 16:09 Torte de Lini wrote:
He could be featured for his contributions to the scene (promotion, speaking well of E-sports).
We shouldn't focus on who to defeature, but more on who deserves to be featured rather. There's no official limit to how many people can be featured, just a bar or standard to reach.
What promotion has he actually done...honestly? Assuming its substantial, which I dont think it is, I am willing to grant you that one point. Also, I am not on a quest to de-feature. I am trying to point out inconsistencies.
Speaking of there being no limits....I asked this on the last page. Why did so much de-featuring have to occur in the first place?
On November 02 2011 16:10 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 16:08 Peas wrote:On November 02 2011 16:03 Torte de Lini wrote:On November 02 2011 15:56 Peas wrote:On November 02 2011 15:51 Torte de Lini wrote:
He's a notable character, that's why he's featured (hence other) what does it matter if hes a notable character if he doesnt draw viewers? On November 02 2011 15:53 duk3 wrote:
He may be a bad player with no accomplishments, and not have as many viewers as most top players, but the value of having a NBA player publicizing that he plays Starcraft is a huge contribution to the community through the additional publicity he receives. Assuming he does publicize that he plays starcraft, what does that have to do with streaming? Streaming here is not publicity, its preaching to the choir. I think they make the assumption that he draws no viewers based on a couple of months and not of one day or particular time in the day. To be honest, tonight was the first time I saw him streaming. I'm on TL often and daily. I really don't know the numbers he generates, but I think I can safely assume they are not great. Maybe the are, and if they are thats fine. If they are sub 300 numbers, however, its unfair and rather unseemly to keep him featured over more deserving streamers. if you dont think that a nba player who plays sc2 should be featured then there really is no reason to talk with you. its just beyond belief that you dont think that is awesome. oh, by the way, gordon got sc2 mentioned on espn, yahoo sports, cbs sports, etc. wtf has protech done? here is the website, so you can realize how dumb your posts sound about him: http://espn.go.com/espn/thelife/videogames/blog/_/name/thegamer/id/6948686/gordon-hayward-joins-pro-gaming-league?readmore=fullstoryone more edit, i guess you think that if obama started playing sc2, we should ignore him too. amiright?
Lets assume you are right and he has contributed something tangible and significant to the community. Granting him a featured stream because of this, and in spite of low viewership constitutes something like a reward. You did this for us so in turn we will feature you. Thats fine. I think that contribution to the sc2 community should be, at best, a supplementary factor in deciding who gets featured. Let me use hyperbole to make my point a little more clear. If, as you suggest, Obama started playing sc2 but his stream got 0 viewers, I think it would be foolish and unfair to feature him. Why do it? Just because? The same goes for Hayward. Again, you can use the argument that he has contributed to the growth of the community, but as I mentioned, I dont think thats enough.
Lets really distill this issue down as much as we can. Streaming exists because there is a desire for it within the community. Streaming is, ultimately, a service to the fans. Featuring some streams makes it more convenient to access those streams. Given that streaming is first and foremost a service to the fans, and unless featuring a particular stream serves some auxiliary purpose, why would anything be more important, or even remotely as significant, as average viewership in determining which streams should be featured?
In other words, overvaluing factors other than average viewership is doing a disservice to the fans.
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On November 02 2011 16:26 Peas wrote:
Again, you can use the argument that he has contributed to the growth of the community, but as I mentioned, I dont think thats enough.
well, all i can say is that tl.net disagrees with you, and justifiably so.
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On November 02 2011 16:29 dAPhREAk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 16:26 Peas wrote:
Again, you can use the argument that he has contributed to the growth of the community, but as I mentioned, I dont think thats enough.
well, all i can say is that tl.net disagrees with you, and justifiably so.
read the edit in my last post and please, try to justify the idea that contribution should be enough in and of itself to get featured. Moreover, neither of us have all the information or know precisely why he is featured. Perhaps tonight was an anomaly and he does pull in a huge audience. I'd really like to know the numbers so I can stop speculating.
Anyway, let me put it this way, if Hayward averaged 17 viewers would you still think he deserves to be featured. What's the real difference between 17 average viewers, and 200?
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Recommending an addition to the November/December Added list.
Megumixbear has continuously showed herself VERY active in the Starcraft 2 community.
-She hosts tournaments monthly for ALL leagues and adds a great deal of commentary to the games she spectates during the tournament aswell as outside of the tournaments
-She offers great indepth coaching
-She has participated at MANY e-sports conventions such as being an interviewer as IPL3
-She is extremely involved with her viewers, giving her stream an ideal and unique difference from all other streams out there
So bottom line is, I recommend that Megumixbear is added to the Featured list for November/December and hold a position on the featured list for some time.
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On November 02 2011 16:42 shortyyguy wrote:
Recommending an addition to the November/December Added list.
Megumixbear has continuously showed herself VERY active in the Starcraft 2 community.
-She hosts tournaments monthly for ALL leagues and adds a great deal of commentary to the games she spectates during the tournament aswell as outside of the tournaments
-She offers great indepth coaching
-She has participated at MANY e-sports conventions such as being an interviewer as IPL3
-She is extremely involved with her viewers, giving her stream an ideal and unique difference from all other streams out there
So bottom line is, I recommend that Megumixbear is added to the Featured list for November/December and hold a position on the featured list for some time.
I concur with PP.
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On November 02 2011 16:42 shortyyguy wrote:
Recommending an addition to the November/December Added list.
Megumixbear has continuously showed herself VERY active in the Starcraft 2 community.
So bottom line is, I recommend that Megumixbear is added to the Featured list for November/December and hold a position on the featured list for some time.
^This. And also, she often brings to stream DDE, Strifecro and Day9.
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EPT
