Argh, tried to watch the vod, but it's too high quality for my crappy internet, it would take forever to load that vod. I think I'll try to load it overnight when I get to sleep.
Why there is no option in Justin.tv to select the quality of the vods?
I believe that Zerg is too weak in its current state, however, I think that the outcome of these matches was largely unaffected by balance.
IdrA made a few very simple mistakes (as in: mistakes that are easy to avoid but do huge damage to you if they occur) that cost him games he would've otherwise won.
In game one he basically threw 30-40 banelings plus a lot of lings away into a perfectly placed line of tanks and did almost no damage at all with them. This was just the wrong place to engage Jinro's army.
In the last game, as others have pointed out a lot, he had almost no upgrades (not even baneling speed), was economically behind (which is pretty bad for a Zerg) for a very long time in the game.
The crossfire game was basically over when IdrA had a lot less harvesters than Jinro from the very beginning on. Imo he got a little bit overeager with his 5-6 drones that tried to catch the marines that were about to attack, and then lost a lot of them + lings + lost mining time.
Unfortunately I don't remember Jinros 4th win, but even if that game was lost completely due to some imbalance in the game, one of these 3 games would've been enough to go over to the Metalopolis game.
All in all, Jinro simply played better in this series. I don't know what was up with IdrA, but somehow you could see in the later games that something affected him. Maybe he was tired or tilted, but he didn't play up to his potential. That doesn't mean that he played bad at all, in fact I think he still played as excellent as you can play with ling muta baneling, but as I pointed out above he just made a few crucial mistakes that cost him too many games.
anybody got a youtube link? the justin tv lags to much for my connection, i have check incontrol's Youtube channel but its not loaded yet, is it going be loaded there?
I believe that Zerg is too weak in its current state, however, I think that the outcome of these matches was largely unaffected by balance.
IdrA made a few very simple mistakes (as in: mistakes that are easy to avoid but do huge damage to you if they occur) that cost him games he would've otherwise won.
In game one he basically threw 30-40 banelings plus a lot of lings away into a perfectly placed line of tanks and did almost no damage at all with them. This was just the wrong place to engage Jinro's army.
In the last game, as others have pointed out a lot, he had almost no upgrades (not even baneling speed), was economically behind (which is pretty bad for a Zerg) for a very long time in the game.
The crossfire game was basically over when IdrA had a lot less harvesters than Jinro from the very beginning on. Imo he got a little bit overeager with his 5-6 drones that tried to catch the marines that were about to attack, and then lost a lot of them + lings + lost mining time.
Unfortunately I don't remember Jinros 4th win, but even if that game was lost completely due to some imbalance in the game, one of these 3 games would've been enough to go over to the Metalopolis game.
All in all, Jinro simply played better in this series. I don't know what was up with IdrA, but somehow you could see in the later games that something affected him. Maybe he was tired or tilted, but he didn't play up to his potential. That doesn't mean that he played bad at all, in fact I think he still played as excellent as you can play with ling muta baneling, but as I pointed out above he just made a few crucial mistakes that cost him too many games.
Actually TvZ(and alot of people can agree) is currently a very balenced match-up(This excludes close postions on gay maps like Meta/LostT/ Steppes), especailly with these maps. Idra and Jinro played great and to down play Jinro by saying Idra just wasn't playing his best because he made mistakes; well thats what happens in everygame people make mistakes, its what you do to make up for the mistakes is what seperates winners from losers.+ Show Spoiler +
Jinro mademistakes too, game 6 his lack of turrets resulted in him losing tons of SCVs and delaying his atack on Idra. But he got back up everytime.
Idra harassed the living crap out of Jinro yet Jinro in his Flash-esque turtle powers held the aggression, just held. And when the engagement happened his micro and macro rolled Idra.
I recommend that people stop leaning on the balence crutch everytime they lose or their favorite player loses. I know tanks and marines are gay, but so are mutas and banlings and infestors.
Idra is better player than jinro, because idra has longer dedication korea than jinro has had yet. Also Idra is more intelligent and we can see this in his play. Jinro is just result of hard work.
On February 22 2011 23:51 Tierfight wrote: Idra is better player than jinro, because idra has longer dedication korea than jinro has had yet. Also Idra is more intelligent and we can see this in his play. Jinro is just result of hard work.
I am probably feeding a troll, but isnt Jinro like 3-0 vs Idra now? And i would love to see you explain how Idra is more intelligent because i for sure cannot see this in his play.
On February 22 2011 23:51 Tierfight wrote: Idra is better player than jinro, because idra has longer dedication korea than jinro has had yet. Also Idra is more intelligent and we can see this in his play. Jinro is just result of hard work.
I am probably feeding a troll, but isnt Jinro like 3-0 vs Idra now? And i would love to see you explain how Idra is more intelligent because i for sure cannot see this in his play.
Lol yea dont feed him, it doesnt matter how many times Jinro beats IDra, or eliminates him from something, Idra will still somehow be better lol fanboys will be fanboys i guess. Gratz to Jinro for showing the world who the best foreigner is. I think beating Idra all three times they have met in a competitive match should be enough to prove that
On February 22 2011 23:51 Tierfight wrote: Idra is better player than jinro, because idra has longer dedication korea than jinro has had yet. Also Idra is more intelligent and we can see this in his play. Jinro is just result of hard work.
lol this is both the funniest and worst post ever. So Idra is better because he has been in korea longer and because you can see that he is more intelligent?
Idra is 3-8 vs Jinro now. This last series he cant blame it on imb maps, he cant blame it on chees, he cant blame it on anything. He got outplayed by a better players, simple as that.
Jinro is a better player then Idra is. What will happen tomorrow though nobody can tell so why worry to much about it?
On February 22 2011 23:51 Tierfight wrote: Idra is better player than jinro, because idra has longer dedication korea than jinro has had yet. Also Idra is more intelligent and we can see this in his play. Jinro is just result of hard work.
What exactly do you see in his play that is intelligent? I'm honestly curious.
Idra's play seem to never evolve, hes doing the same thing for months now (TvZ). A good player for sure, and most likely intelligent - but intelligent playstyle? far from it, atleast when you compare to the likes of Jinro.
Do you rememeber one of the first games Jinro had in the gsl, when he macroed against a zerg on scrap station? He crushed, with his own intelligent playstyle. When almost everyone else did allin strats.
Then against MC, he again shows us that a different style then the standard is possible, and he does it against the best protoss in the world.
lol..who's that main guy? i don't wanna sound racist, but that was some hilarious real ghetto starcraft, rapping wu-tang during the last game.
and haha, my favorite moment:
guy A: "i would really like to know what his income is" ghetto guy: "he has 4k/2k" guy A: "no, I mean income" ghetto guy: "that's the money coming in?" guy A: "yea.."
4-2 win for Jinro. Jinro won first 2 games, Idra took 3ed and jinro 4th. idra 5th and the jinro closed it in game 6.
My question now is what is Idra going to blame it on? Maps, chees, imb units or just the fact that he playes terran?
on xel naga he has nothing to blame but himself, 2nd game was nice map abuse by Jinro, should have reacted better, as for the mech game where he could kill like 5 units in the whole game and for last game where almost pure marine obliterated his 5 base eco with Hive, well im sure he'd be blaming that on balance.
yea, blame that on balance when 30 minutes into game you don't have baneling speed and no upgrades against pure 3/3 marines, rofl.
what you are saying is true, but you re not playing Z, then you'd know how frustrating and upsetting is to lose to the basic infrantry unit mass 30 min into the game when you have max tech and good eco, even if you crush several armies. probably not imba, but sure as hell mind wrecking. imagine your voidray-colo-motership army getting destoyed by mass zerlgins with some support
I'm sure it can be frustrating, but imagine if a Protoss player forgot the range upgrade and never upgraded his attack. Any colossus based force would be considerably less effective and he would have no one to blame but himself. Baneling speed and upgrades aren't really optional, especially when faced with mass infantry. Whether the race is frustrating doesn't really matter in that game, there were much bigger issues.
4-2 win for Jinro. Jinro won first 2 games, Idra took 3ed and jinro 4th. idra 5th and the jinro closed it in game 6.
My question now is what is Idra going to blame it on? Maps, chees, imb units or just the fact that he playes terran?
on xel naga he has nothing to blame but himself, 2nd game was nice map abuse by Jinro, should have reacted better, as for the mech game where he could kill like 5 units in the whole game and for last game where almost pure marine obliterated his 5 base eco with Hive, well im sure he'd be blaming that on balance.
yea, blame that on balance when 30 minutes into game you don't have baneling speed and no upgrades against pure 3/3 marines, rofl.
what you are saying is true, but you re not playing Z, then you'd know how frustrating and upsetting is to lose to the basic infrantry unit mass 30 min into the game when you have max tech and good eco, even if you crush several armies. probably not imba, but sure as hell mind wrecking. imagine your voidray-colo-motership army getting destoyed by mass zerlgins with some support
BW was the same crap. Mass Medic Marine all game long. But then Zerg would get defilers and go UltraLing with All Ups. Alot of Zergs are neglecting both the Ultralisk and the infestor
Idra played typically one dimensional, macro up, get Mutas, harass, hope it works and run over his opponnent.
Jinro actually did Mech play one game, he also showed great Marine spreading, general macro, ability to defend the said Muta harassment AND keep up his upgrades.
He did all this on macro maps. What are you trying to say buddy?
I am trying to say that excuses should not be used, Jinro is legit, its no mere coincidence that he got so far in 2 different GSL's, only to be beaten by amazing players.
Idra seems to be falling off, either due to lack of practice or outright lack of interest, he simply did not look as sharp.
lol..who's that main guy? i don't wanna sound racist, but that was some hilarious real ghetto starcraft, rapping wu-tang during the last game.
and haha, my favorite moment:
guy A: "i would really like to know what his income is" ghetto guy: "he has 4k/2k" guy A: "no, I mean income" ghetto guy: "that's the money coming in?" guy A: "yea.."
:D
Yea great to listen to, I watched it live and this pair are much more entertaining .
4-2 win for Jinro. Jinro won first 2 games, Idra took 3ed and jinro 4th. idra 5th and the jinro closed it in game 6.
My question now is what is Idra going to blame it on? Maps, chees, imb units or just the fact that he playes terran?
on xel naga he has nothing to blame but himself, 2nd game was nice map abuse by Jinro, should have reacted better, as for the mech game where he could kill like 5 units in the whole game and for last game where almost pure marine obliterated his 5 base eco with Hive, well im sure he'd be blaming that on balance.
yea, blame that on balance when 30 minutes into game you don't have baneling speed and no upgrades against pure 3/3 marines, rofl.
what you are saying is true, but you re not playing Z, then you'd know how frustrating and upsetting is to lose to the basic infrantry unit mass 30 min into the game when you have max tech and good eco, even if you crush several armies. probably not imba, but sure as hell mind wrecking. imagine your voidray-colo-motership army getting destoyed by mass zerlgins with some support
Because you press your hive hotkey once during a game does not mean you deserve to win anything.
The game is way more than unit x for unit z. When it reached the endgame point, Jinro had a better unit mix because he worked harder for it. If its mass marines or mass thors is irrelevant.
Also, it's not like Idra had amazing upgrades either. Jinro was ahead of him in tech and won, that's exactly what you're saying... 3/3 marines, medivacs+ 2/0tanks > crappy upgraded mutas and no speed banes, both unit mix-wise and tech-wise. Idra got Brood lords and infestors way to late, when his army was pretty much shattered from constant aggression.
SC isn't a game of tier one units getting obsolete endgame, especially when they're heavily upgraded and against unit's they're supposed to do well against, namely mutas...
Here is the problem with Idra. The guy has given up on Zerg. you can tell he doesnt want to play Zerg anymore but he still does. Really idra, switch off of zerg already. You got a show about imbalance where you complain about zerg, you go 30 mins with jinro and lose to marine/tank. You dont get baneling speed and go muta/ling and dont upgrade your lings!
Come on man..just change races already. You wasting your time with Zerg. You even GG too early cuz you so annoyed with Zerg race. Now is a good a time as any since you giving up your Code S slot.
Idra got overeager/ greedy/ fooled in the 1st game when Jinro made him walk 1 mile into siege tank range. it was just ridiculous blind attack by Idra... 2nd game bunker rush and idra really should learn to make 1 spine crawler for safety on such maps, instead of drowning like a madman and losing 5 drones + making zerglings... 3rd game idra got lucky positions and won game... nothing special 4rth game IDra shouldve scouted... he couldve broken the terran with mass roach but not really sure why he didnt scout? by far his worst game... 5th game Lost temple idra lucky again 6th game even though Idra had 4 or 5 bases he forgot baneling speed and the outcome was quite fair for such a mistake...
Overall: he never got roaches, and i think theyre crucial for tvz. Jinro kept making his turrets knowing idra makes mutas... In most of the games all Idra had to do is a roach all in... but he kept teching to spire and Jinro had 1 million turrets everytime. He needs to do other strategies like overlord drops with banelings/roach on mineral lines and the worm thing nydus canal can be used for escape and offense.