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Nice post, thanks for explaining. I knew about this and also the Olympia problem with china sneaking in younger participants. So I do get where the WCS rule is coming from.
But why can Reynor and Clem play Go4sc2 and other online tournaments and win money there? Reynor even played in at least 3 DHs so far (Bucharest 2013, 2014 and LotV Roccat Championship) and I guess many other smaller lans. None of those was a junior competition.
Edit: Btw I would love to see a Junior WCS. All of it could be online except for the finals, which would be held offline at the WCS Championships right before the normal final.
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On May 01 2016 23:53 Gwavajuice wrote: Take France for example, we're on the process of creating an eSport federation, there is no way on earth this process can succeed if this new federation is not given the same rules as any other sport federation. In the future, we will prolly have drug test during competitions (they have it in Chess)...
Here s an interesting link of debate about the minimum age : https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/7kebm7/why_should_clem_and_reynor_wait_until_2019_to/
You are comparing "drug test during competitions"... Did you ever hear about cheating in many country ? (Russia with olympics, France with bike race). I also dislike you way you claim the international rules are done and in the same time you re putting aside the case of korea. Is it so hard to recognize some ethnical humans have better emphasize with some abilities ?
You can also admit some young players have a dream they can realize one time in their life. And their right, whatever their nationality, is above your law.
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On December 26 2017 06:05 the_last_terran1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2016 23:53 Gwavajuice wrote: Take France for example, we're on the process of creating an eSport federation, there is no way on earth this process can succeed if this new federation is not given the same rules as any other sport federation. In the future, we will prolly have drug test during competitions (they have it in Chess)...
Here s an interesting link of debate about the minimum age : https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/7kebm7/why_should_clem_and_reynor_wait_until_2019_to/You are comparing "drug test during competitions"... Did you ever hear about cheating in many country ? (Russia with olympics, France with bike race). I also dislike you way you claim the international rules are done and in the same time you re putting aside the case of korea. Is it so hard to recognize some ethnical humans have better emphasize with some abilities ? You can also admit some young players have a dream they can realize one time in their life. And their right, whatever their nationality, is above your law.
Are you now suggesting that France is responsible for all illegal doping in biking because it hosts the Tour de France? I seemingly remember the most proliftic cheaters being American, Italian and UK (but that sport, like so many other extreme endurance ones, is riddled with this- and French athletes are not an exception.
That last statement you make is completely ridiculous. "Their right, is above your law". How I would love for that to be true, that my sense of entitlement would make me above the law. Very stupid statement.
Clem is a great up and coming star. He should become a major power house later, given how high is skill is in relationship to his age. But to pretend he has any chance of winning a major "open age" competition right now or even for a year or two (depending on how fast he progresses, and this is being politely optimistic) is borderline insane. Last competition, he qualified for- which is brilliant, but failed to even take a map. He'll have every opportunity to dedicate more of his time and participate in every competition at a later age. waiting for ~1 (+) year... Why is it such a big deal he was refused from one specific tourny?
The Korean underaged kids (IIRC) and the Chinese are capped on the amount of time they can access the internet or play online games... Or something along these lines- I could be very well be remembering a major falsehood but if that's the case I'm sure I'll be called out for it .
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User was warned for this post
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No rules or laws can stop shit parenting.
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On May 02 2016 09:25 ClanRH.TV wrote: Seems like the parallel that is being drawn here doesn't translate as well for esports. If you started playing video games, its 100% because you enjoyed them, not because your parents or country is forcing you. Ultimately, I believe esports are, in many ways, a completely different animal from real sports and its seems reasonable that certain rules that otherwise apply to one or the other shouldn't have to apply to both. Then again, the old crappy saying people love to use: "Rules are rules, and he broke them."
An athlete that goes into a conventional sport "because he/she enjoyed it" is still not allowed to compete underage. I don't see how this point is any relevant.
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I suspect that there is going to be a major divide on this issue between the United States and the rest of the world. Looking at the comments already posted I can see that developing. A lot of people in the US seem to think child beauty pageants are acceptable, for example, or watch youth league sports and/or push their children very hard to succeed at youth league sports. Little thought is given to the impact this has on the child and the responsibility is typically abdicated to the parents the same way that the US federal government often abdicates responsibility to the regional governments of individual constituent states. The idea that parents don't always know what's best for their children or that isolated pockets of the country shouldn't be allowed to make their own rules relating to human rights comes off as an unthinkable alien concept to many. I won't pretend to know if this attitude results in a net benefit to US society or not but it comes off as wishy-washy in situations like this one where the international community has made commitments on an issue and the US continues to vacillate. "Signed, but not ratified" is the same self-inflicted wound that has been undercutting US efforts to maintain the status quo in the South China Sea.
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this is honestly pretty solid logic.
while sc2 is not (and will almost certainly never be) big enough that parents would force their kids to train from a young age in order to win championships, you can easily see how this could happen in other esports that are now managing to have serious rewards. for example, winning a dota2 TI could potentially make you set for life if it was saved and invested properly, and there's no doubt that a child literally raised on playing dota (or another game) for hours a day at a super young age would be wayyyyyyyy ahead of the curve. while delaying their ability to compete wouldn't necessarily avoid the issue entirely, it could help there to be less urgency in taking over child lives at such an early age.
again, as I said, this will never be an issue in sc2 but I do think for professional esports competitions this could be an important thing to have established down the road.
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How old was Maru and TY when they started they esports career again? I don't understand why Clem or Reynor suppose to be different, especially when their parents allow them to participate and, as saw in Valencia- Clem's father accompanies him on tournaments.
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Clem and Reynor aren't allowed to compete even after they turn 16, because age is checked at 1st of January instead of whenever a particular tournament begins.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51357 Posts
On December 26 2017 18:09 hiroshOne wrote: How old was Maru and TY when they started they esports career again? I don't understand why Clem or Reynor suppose to be different, especially when their parents allow them to participate and, as saw in Valencia- Clem's father accompanies him on tournaments. Maru was 13 in 2010 when he was on his first game of GSL Open Tournament Season 1! Crazy indeed, as a football quote i'll use "If your good enough, your old enough"
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On December 26 2017 19:46 Pandemona wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2017 18:09 hiroshOne wrote: How old was Maru and TY when they started they esports career again? I don't understand why Clem or Reynor suppose to be different, especially when their parents allow them to participate and, as saw in Valencia- Clem's father accompanies him on tournaments. Maru was 13 in 2010 when he was on his first game of GSL Open Tournament Season 1! Crazy indeed, as a football quote i'll use "If your good enough, your old enough" And now Maru is 20.
God, I feel old.
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On December 26 2017 18:09 hiroshOne wrote: How old was Maru and TY when they started they esports career again? I don't understand why Clem or Reynor suppose to be different, especially when their parents allow them to participate and, as saw in Valencia- Clem's father accompanies him on tournaments.
Creator was like 15 when he got to the blizzcon final iirc
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51357 Posts
On December 27 2017 03:25 pvsnp wrote:Show nested quote +On December 26 2017 19:46 Pandemona wrote:On December 26 2017 18:09 hiroshOne wrote: How old was Maru and TY when they started they esports career again? I don't understand why Clem or Reynor suppose to be different, especially when their parents allow them to participate and, as saw in Valencia- Clem's father accompanies him on tournaments. Maru was 13 in 2010 when he was on his first game of GSL Open Tournament Season 1! Crazy indeed, as a football quote i'll use "If your good enough, your old enough" And now Maru is 20. God, I feel old. Haha yeah that is what i thought xD
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8722 Posts
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On December 26 2017 06:36 MyTHicaL wrote:
That last statement you make is completely ridiculous. "Their right, is above your law". How I would love for that to be true, that my sense of entitlement would make me above the law. Very stupid statement.
As often, i understand well english but fail to be understood. I should say "Their right to dream and make you (...) haphazard could exist if law-writers were not so strickles about the rules".. They are so many examples of a stupid date fixed by law with no relation with anything (insurance company) - What you will endure when you re getting old is the weight of counting your age and i can t support this law which make unfair the feeling of our youngest mates...
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