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I played WoW since a month after release, til the end of WotLK (Got to lich king, never actually killed him). The game got progressively more "casual friendly" which makes sense, because that is where the real money is, and Blizzard is in the business of making money (shocking, I know, but people seem to not be aware of this).
WoW gets lots of hate, but honestly it is probably one of the greatest RPG experiences ever made. I know I'm going to get shit for that, but it's true. The amount of time and content put into it is staggering, and it is the best supported game I've ever played. To this day, if I were stranded on a desert island and could only play 1 video game, I'd seriously consider WoW, because they are constantly making so much content.
I quit at the end of WotlK because it had gotten just too repetitive and predictable for me, and everyone I knew was quitting. I don't regret playing, though, and I still think (at least at its best) it was one of the greatest games I ever played.
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Once you realize that Blizzard doesn't give a shit but easy money, it is really easy to quit.
Patch 3.2 made me realize that. That Trial of the Circus was such a fucking joke. One room, 5-6 bosses, shitty lore, boring environment, repetitive hardmodes and worst of all, made Ulduar pretty much obsolete.
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I played WoW for about 5 years, I quit with the D3 release because I was starting to get sooooo bored.
I cleared all the raids, did a lot of achievements/pvp and then...nothing to do. I don't regret playing it though, because I made some great friends and I also have a lot of good memories.
So basically, my solution to "how do I quit WoW completely" was to almost complete the game (Not 100% obviously but as close to that as I could get)
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Cousin partially verifies that ideas are getting thin at blizzards WoW.
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I bought it when it came out, played till last September to focus on school. Had a LOT of fun (moreso around the earlier days, for sure), spent (too much) time on it, but I didn't regret it.
I have no intentions on going back, but I'm happy I played it for the time that I did.
Wow went from a great game in vanilla to a sucky game for noobs and kids in Wotlk, and then it just continued going down. I quit around TBC.
Edit:The same thing will probably happen to SC2 too.
You're can't "nerf balance". SC2 is a pvp game, the game is only as hard as your opponent makes it (which in this case, will always be very difficult). WoW is centered around PvE, which can easily be nerfed. Lower the mob's hp, dmg, etc.
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Good for you man! If you are anything like me, you'll still have "cravings" or a desire to go back and play every couple months just to see what's up. In the end though, WoW will always be the same formula with a few new "things" to try and spice it up but you'll just end up getting bored again, especially if you dont have friends to play with.
Alot of why I miss the game is due to nostalgia and the people I met back in vanilla and TBC. While it may not have had the highest skill curve, it was challenging in it's own right and nothing can take back those memorable first boss kills that many of us worked so hard to achieve or finally finishing those fucking heroics in green and blue quest gear (as a Ret Pally in TBC, yuck). After awhile, there's only so much Blizzard can or chooses to do before fights get repetitive and mechanics are recycled.
Cataclysm is a pretty big dissapointment for me. Not only did the people I grew up with quit playing WoW, the entire expansion was designed around redoing old content I felt. It played on the nostalgia factor for veteran players who wanted to live in the past and allowed newer players who picked up during the WotLK/TBC expansions to experience the content they never got to see. The classes have become so homogenized for the sake of "viability" in raids that playing someclasses feels too similar for me.
Mists of Pandaria seems like it will be a step in the right direction in regards to some aspects. I'll probably play it for a little while just to check things out but it will never have the same allure as it used to. Here's to hoping Guild Wars 2 does something right.
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On June 16 2012 03:46 micronesia wrote:
I finally tried wow recently to see what everyone is talking about (been avoiding it since it came out). It's fun/rewarding, although I don' t even have a lvl 70 character yet. I hear so many things about how it used to be better though.
I kind of want to respond to this, as a person that played for several years. Too many years.
As a single player game wow is actually pretty good, and pretty easy to immerse yourself in, even after they revamped everything and made the "Old World" a lot more linear. Dungeons are easier to get into than they were, and hell of a lot of easier than they were in vanilla, and you can pop into a dungeon with a random group that you couldn't before, clear it, and then just go back to what you were doing.
The only real downside to that is a number's failure, unless they've tweaked it, where because the story path is so linear when you quest, if you stop at specific points to dungeon or pvp or pick flowers and craft, you actually can get yourself into a crappy experience where you're not getting any experience from your quests, BUT you're also at a low enough level where if you go to down (there's a board that points you to quests at your level) you might not be quite at the point where it gives you something new (basically level wise you should be at the end of the zone you're at but not high enough to pick up the next zone, but the zone is actually a large chain that won't let you skip very well). But that's it. And if you're solo-ing...it doesn't really matter because you're probably just enjoying the storyline and picking herbs and have whatever gear you want to have, whether you're happy finding stuff or go to the auction house...and everything's fine.
As a solo game I think today I could still pick up wow and play through the storyline and tool around the world and enjoy myself (even though there would still be parts where I just couldn't do it again because I've levelled at least fifty characters to max since wrath, and that's not counting any of the toons i had in bc or vanilla, and honestly, even then, i might be able to if i just relaxed and did it).
The problem really is the raiding content and the gear, and the fact that when you get to max level you actually are only limited by your own motivation. That's what wow's complaints I think really boil down to.
People who WANT to have to have time to do stuff complain about needing attunements and gear needing to take more time, and it being ridiculous that you can gear up in literally a few hours from hitting max level. A lot of people attribute that to "oh no you want to be a special snow-flake", and it really isn't (though with a few people it definitely is); quite simply, it's just that...if i make a druid...I know for a fact I can have it at max level and geared for end game (with-in three days (not three days played, start on a tuesday done by firday)) geared for end-game, REGARDLESS of what end-game is, within a few hours of max level if i can afford it. If i can't afford it, AND i don't know how to make money or im lazy, i can grind dungeons and still be good enough to make the minimum gear requirement for end-game. for end-game.
Which leads to this problem where basically, if it's not a raid night or rated pvp night...i actually don't have anything to do. Other than maybe...play the auction house for more money...or level another character I can't use...or grind pvp which is just painful and i honestly just don't need to do. Achievements? Okay, go back do all the quests on my toon and explore around and get lost again...And then what? Every other toon, the same thing? Are you crazy? Then you can go into reasons that the actual end-game content is or isn't exciting and balance bla bla bla, but that's not really important; what is important is that i dinged three days ago, then max geared my toon with stuff better than the end-game raid i'm doing, and then waited three days to get into this raid. fuck how hard or easy it is. what the hell else am i doing during those three days? what am i doing in the next few MONTHS after that raid? oh that's right, whatever i did in those three days...because the only limit on how fast i do everything i do is literally whatever i feel like. The alternative if you're that active is hard-modes, which are not interesting in the slightest as they're a rehash with more limiters and stricter scales to what you just did. And as soon as you beat it again..what do you do? when you aren't in that raid, what do you do?
What if you want to stay going slow? Gear up a tier at a time. Well...the explorer in you might enjoy it. If you can find 9 other people to do it with you. Unfortunately the content itself is nerfed each time there's new content so when i say the explorer in you might enjoy it that's what i mean. You aren't going to do the fights how they were designed and even without the right gear it's nerfed enough that you aren't ever going to have to worry about standing in the wrong bad shit or anything like that.
So yes, WoW, as a single - player game, actually awesome I think. I think when I pick up SWTOR I'll probably say the same thing about it; great single player, fuck the end-game and the multiplayer. I am so glad I fell absolutely in love with starcraft.
Shit that was long I'm sorry.
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On June 16 2012 04:26 DwmC_Foefen wrote:
Wow went from a great game in vanilla to a sucky game for noobs and kids in Wotlk, and then it just continued going down. I quit around TBC.
Edit:The same thing will probably happen to SC2 too.
Starcraft 1 got steadily better over 12 years. I think it's more likely SC2 will follow the path of SC1 than WoW.
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On June 16 2012 04:06 Omnipresent wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2012 03:53 micronesia wrote:On June 16 2012 03:48 TemujinGK wrote:On June 16 2012 03:46 micronesia wrote:
I finally tried wow recently to see what everyone is talking about (been avoiding it since it came out). It's fun/rewarding, although I don' t even have a lvl 70 character yet. I hear so many things about how it used to be better though. It's comments like this that make me not want to pick it up. Every time i think to go to the store to purchase it I get another negative review, or a comment about how it is on a rapid downhill slope ;; There is going to be a bias, though. The people who you hear are the early players, and they design the game more and more to benefit newer players (us). I don't think you should let that alone determine it for you (you don't need to go to a brick and mortar store btw... I think you can just do it through battle.net?) MMOs aren't really challenging. Even in the most advanced raid content, any given player doesn't really have a particularly difficult task. You've got to pay attention and play flawlessly, but that's no nearly as hard as it sounds. Coordination and consistency are the tough parts. So a lot of the joy of playing an MMO (especially an easy one like WoW) at a max level is building up your character. You should feel stronger every patch or every time you get a new piece of gear. Also, as petty as it sounds, you should feel stronger than other players. And players whith less experience should want to as powerful. It sounds lame when you describe it, but it's pretty important. The other thing they've been doing is breaking up servers. A server is a community. Each server used to have its own standards for behavior (what's rude and what isn't. What is expected of you. etc.). You knew who you could count on vs who was unreliable, and who you could trust vs who would try to screw you. It's difficult for a company like Blizzard to maintain player and faction balance on so many servers, so they've opted to eliminate server boundaries wherever possible. This means the guys you group with for any given dungeon, or now, even raid, are people you'll likely never encounter again. If you screw them out of loot, there's no social backlash. If you freeload (which is only possible because the content is so easy), it's not like people can turn you down for groups in the future. They've broken down the social structure, and it really shows. And yeah, you can just download it.
I played from TBC to the end of WotLK and had a great time. Had some great guilds with good friends. I went back in Cata and just felt really...disconnected. It's hard to complain about it because all the cross server play and random PUGs really did make queuing easier, but god did it kill the sense of community you used to feel playing the game. I still really want to go back even now, but I keep thinking up reasons not to.
That's pretty much where the game is for me right now, more reasons not to play than to do so.
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On June 16 2012 14:54 Tachion wrote:Show nested quote +On June 16 2012 04:06 Omnipresent wrote:On June 16 2012 03:53 micronesia wrote:On June 16 2012 03:48 TemujinGK wrote:On June 16 2012 03:46 micronesia wrote:
I finally tried wow recently to see what everyone is talking about (been avoiding it since it came out). It's fun/rewarding, although I don' t even have a lvl 70 character yet. I hear so many things about how it used to be better though. It's comments like this that make me not want to pick it up. Every time i think to go to the store to purchase it I get another negative review, or a comment about how it is on a rapid downhill slope ;; There is going to be a bias, though. The people who you hear are the early players, and they design the game more and more to benefit newer players (us). I don't think you should let that alone determine it for you (you don't need to go to a brick and mortar store btw... I think you can just do it through battle.net?) MMOs aren't really challenging. Even in the most advanced raid content, any given player doesn't really have a particularly difficult task. You've got to pay attention and play flawlessly, but that's no nearly as hard as it sounds. Coordination and consistency are the tough parts. So a lot of the joy of playing an MMO (especially an easy one like WoW) at a max level is building up your character. You should feel stronger every patch or every time you get a new piece of gear. Also, as petty as it sounds, you should feel stronger than other players. And players whith less experience should want to as powerful. It sounds lame when you describe it, but it's pretty important. The other thing they've been doing is breaking up servers. A server is a community. Each server used to have its own standards for behavior (what's rude and what isn't. What is expected of you. etc.). You knew who you could count on vs who was unreliable, and who you could trust vs who would try to screw you. It's difficult for a company like Blizzard to maintain player and faction balance on so many servers, so they've opted to eliminate server boundaries wherever possible. This means the guys you group with for any given dungeon, or now, even raid, are people you'll likely never encounter again. If you screw them out of loot, there's no social backlash. If you freeload (which is only possible because the content is so easy), it's not like people can turn you down for groups in the future. They've broken down the social structure, and it really shows. And yeah, you can just download it. I played from TBC to the end of WotLK and had a great time. Had some great guilds with good friends. I went back in Cata and just felt really...disconnected. It's hard to complain about it because all the cross server play and random PUGs really did make queuing easier, but god did it kill the sense of community you used to feel playing the game. I still really want to go back even now, but I keep thinking up reasons not to. That's pretty much where the game is for me right now, more reasons not to play than to do so.
That sounds about right.
The other problem is that the devleopers don't understand the trouble. Whenever players complain about LFD or LFR, they always point that both are really popular, and technically optional. They're popular because they're convenient, and while technically optional, good luck finding a dungeon group without LFD. In any event, it's beside the point. LFD isn't bad because it's hard to use (it clearly isn't). It's bad because of what it did to the server communities and how seriously Blizz needed to nerf all the content in order to make it accessible to LFD groups. A dungeon should be a challenge, not something you have to run through really quickly once a day for points.
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United Kingdom20263 Posts
I had the same experience as you, almost exactly. I was only 9 when i started playing though (dec 05) and didnt raid in classic, nothing aside from kara and grull in TBC (and i worked my ass off to get there), but i did enjoy the game very much and how the things were back then and every new change makes me sad..
I was considering playing "casually" in MOP, but the free instant level 80 with full blue gear on any class you want, and the announcement of removing the ability to queue for non-heroic dungeons at 90 but also making heroics notably easier than their cataclysm counterparts (which i never had any major difficulty clearing in PUG's, let alone with people with any amount of gaming skill) makes it seem completely pointless.
Playing sc2 only made me realize more how easy WoW is to play by comparison.. My friend playing 2-4 hours a week killed lich king in WOTLK, Cata made things far easier, and the announcements of reduced difficulty in MOP makes me want to slam my head against desk.
To use something that got brought up in a debate i had recently over returning to try out MOP, you can literally use the return to WoW instant level 80 on any class you want, level to 85, gear up, and kill the hardest boss in the game in under 24 hours, all solo or in a PUG group, without massive difficulty. There is nothing else to do, and i do not subscribe to the "lets kill the boss on a harder difficulty level, so we can get better gear, gear that we do not need to make any content in the game easier or more beatable because the next tier will be avalible on LFR too, and beatable without a large amount of effort or the earned gear" mindset that everybody seems to somehow ignore.
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On June 16 2012 08:08 Zenbrez wrote:
You're can't "nerf balance". SC2 is a pvp game, the game is only as hard as your opponent makes it (which in this case, will always be very difficult). WoW is centered around PvE, which can easily be nerfed. Lower the mob's hp, dmg, etc.
Your statement is alittle wonky bro as balance was around the classes, the tiers content didn't get nerfed normally till the new stuff came out well until wrath came out and that was the norm becauce leveling toons to cap was retardedly easy and people wanted to farm alts and shit which is one way to play the game but hey I'd rather be laddering off-racing lol. And true wow was centered around PvE for like a vast majority of the player base PvP in that game was wasn't done very well after TBC as it's class balancing get really bad in that aspect as they were too busy trying to make black and pink fucking dragons and recycling old content and making up shitty new content exception of course to UlllDUUUUAAAAAAAAARRR as I liked to call it.
True Starcraft 2 is a pvp game but sometimes balance is not brought to you by the player unless of course i.e they are abusing a obvious gimmick or broken game mechanic but obviously those don't always through the normal stages of development (cough cough honor among thieves talent and the reign of paladins op cough cough) but come on hellions were making zergs punch walls all the time you could obvious say yes its the player just making the game harder for anyone who wants to just fast expand every game but they made queens better because hellions were being a pest or hindrance in the TvZ match up as they were being abused. Yes PvE players in wow don't have that same issue but they sometimes created weird or creative ideas to deal with the poor decisions the wow team developed in encounters until they were mathematically impossible as which has happened some how otherwise the insist plague known as the battle.net forums gets spammed with garbage the stuff I have attempted to read there is just soo convoluted and dumb it hurts to read
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I tried out WoW a few years back at the recommendation of a friend, and I can definitely see how so many people loved the game at one point or another. Even though it wasn't really my kind of game, I still had a great deal of fun just learning about the community on my server and exploring all of the different content that it has. I can imagine that someone who has invested more time into the game than I did could really have developed an attachment to it.
From the experience of myself and some friends of mine (who played the game much longer than I), you're making a good decision. Pretty much all of us found something new to do with our free time that we now get a lot of enjoyment from. In fact, leaving WoW lead me to SC (and TL soon after) which had a massive positive effect on my life. Hopefully you'll have a good experience like I did!
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On June 16 2012 03:01 stilee wrote:
wow sux dood
User was warned for this post
Lololololol, the shit quality and red letters are great combo.
And wow dude, that's a big decision ur making right there and I'd say it's a good decision. If u aren't playing sc2, youve gotta play it. One Of the best games
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For me, I started in tbc and quit once cata came out. I have even tried to play it again, but I just don't want to. I guess it is a good and bad thing.
The good: I don't spend hours upon hours in wow
The bad: it was such a great game, ulduar was one of the best things ever, and it's sad to see them not making raids like that anymore
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I quit (got banned and never came back, actually), during TBC because I could see what the game was going to be all about from then on. I'll still have fond memories of 1-60 though.
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On June 18 2012 06:47 tsuxiit wrote:
I quit (got banned and never came back, actually), during TBC because I could see what the game was going to be all about from then on. I'll still have fond memories of 1-60 though.
I thought they struck a pretty good balance in BC. Dungeons were accessible, but challenging. Gear was relatively difficult to obtain, but not so much that you'd be stuck farming t4 for months just to reach t5 (while the leaders were progressing through t6). They didn't even nerf most of the content until right before wrath.
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I have to say, from a totally different perspective, that I started playing WoW after Cataclysm was released - yes a very late bloomer, and I actually found the changes they'd made since vanilla fantastic. I mean it still took me somewhere around 2-3 months playing pretty solidly to level up to 85 (feral cat). Without the dungeon finder etc it just wouldn't have been possible for me to play.
So I'd say most of the changes they introduce to WoW are meant to lure new players into the game rather than satisfy the needs of the existing player-base (who I suppose they assume are "hooked" anyway). That is kind of sad for their loyal players who've supported WoW from the start, I agree, but at the end of the day Blizzard is a company and for whatever reason they've decided new players is better for them than satisfying old players.
I know for Ultima Online people used to set up free "shards" of the game world which used a game version from the old days before they split the world into Trammel/Felucca - because a lot of the original players hated the changes. Is there anything like that for WoW? Can you play on free community based servers which accommodate players who want things back the way they used to be?
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On June 18 2012 10:06 DRTnOOber wrote:
I have to say, from a totally different perspective, that I started playing WoW after Cataclysm was released - yes a very late bloomer, and I actually found the changes they'd made since vanilla fantastic. I mean it still took me somewhere around 2-3 months playing pretty solidly to level up to 85 (feral cat). Without the dungeon finder etc it just wouldn't have been possible for me to play.
So I'd say most of the changes they introduce to WoW are meant to lure new players into the game rather than satisfy the needs of the existing player-base (who I suppose they assume are "hooked" anyway). That is kind of sad for their loyal players who've supported WoW from the start, I agree, but at the end of the day Blizzard is a company and for whatever reason they've decided new players is better for them than satisfying old players.
I know for Ultima Online people used to set up free "shards" of the game world which used a game version from the old days before they split the world into Trammel/Felucca - because a lot of the original players hated the changes. Is there anything like that for WoW? Can you play on free community based servers which accommodate players who want things back the way they used to be?
If it took you 3 months to hit 85 you were doing something wrong, or just really took your time because you enjoy being thorough. Either way I assume you kept killing targets and completing quest long after they stopped giving experience. Even without heirlooms, it shouldn't take you anywhere near that long. I think the last 80 I leveled in wrath took me something like an average of 30 min a level from 1-70 (longer 70-80), and leveling has been nerfed a ton since then (less exp per level, more exp per quest/dungeon, improved dungeon finder, built in quest helper, more streamlined/linear quest lines).
The truth is, WoW leveling is really a formality at this point. There's no real reason for it. It's way too fast. this is especially bad for new players because they'll likely move so quickly that they hit max level with little to no clue how to play their class/spec and a general misunderstanding of game mechanics.
As for your last question, yes. Private servers do exist, but I don't know where you'd go about finding a reliable or well populated one. Because WoW is designed as an MMO, it's really difficult to play if you can't interact with hundreds of other players. Basically, if you can't trade or form groups, you miss out on most of the game. Players have been asking for classic/BC servers for years, but Blizzard has outright rejected the proposition.
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I haven't really seriously raided in WoW for like a year and a half but I'm still looking forward to reactivating my account for at least a month when Pandaria comes out. The environments really look beautiful and I'm hoping it will be more like the level experience of WotlK which I enjoyed much more than the Cata leveling experience.
New content is always fun for the first time (especially the initial leveling experience). The fun only wears off when you start repeatedly doing the same thing over and over, which is unfortunately what the end-game is entirely based on.
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