• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 23:34
CET 05:34
KST 13:34
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners10Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11
Community News
StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon!45$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship7[BSL21] RO32 Group Stage4Weekly Cups (Oct 26-Nov 2): Liquid, Clem, Solar win; LAN in Philly2Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win10
StarCraft 2
General
Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon! RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win
Tourneys
Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Where's CardinalAllin/Jukado the mapmaker?
Tourneys
[ASL20] Grand Finals [BSL21] RO32 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CET [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] RO32 Group B - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
PvZ map balance Current Meta How to stay on top of macro? Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Learning my new SC2 hotkey…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1475 users

[M] (2) Initiation

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
Post a Reply
Caviar
Profile Joined April 2011
70 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-09 17:39:31
April 03 2013 21:49 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Working Title
Author: Caviar
Players: 2
Size: 168x126 (Playable)
Bases: 12

Textures;
[image loading]

The maps still young.
I'm simply looking for suggestions, balance issues. You know feedback.

UPDATE: Published to NA servers
-Narrowed amount of space reapers can get into main
- Changed high ground around 3rd
- Fixed pathing around overall map
- Visual Improvements

Also from here on I will be streaming my progress on future maps @ twitch.tv/caviiar
I will try to stream a new concept every wweek.

Snapshots
+ Show Spoiler +


Middle Tower
[image loading]
Third
[image loading]




EatThePath
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States3943 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-03 22:10:10
April 03 2013 22:08 GMT
#2
Very pretty map. The way you did the towers they'll be dead very quick, since it's only 300hp to kill the rocks. You might want to change the numbers on those, because this is basically a map with no towers (not that that's a bad thing).

The 4 bases are a little tightly clustered, pretty well defensible from the tower area. You might want to shrink/remove the hole next to the tower that creates a choke with the town hall a the base against the cliff. It looks like a 2ff chokepoint with a town hall there, which is pretty tight to try and defend.

Other than that this looks pretty cool. Check out aircooled's new map in the wip thread for another use of the collapsible towers.

Come to think of it, how do you feel about putting the towers in a pocket that can be closed off with the rocks instead of killing the tower? I think that'd be more interesting here and we haven't seen a good use of that except some crappy pre-beta blizzard maps that didn't really use it well.
Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE
moskonia
Profile Joined January 2011
Israel1448 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-03 22:26:41
April 03 2013 22:19 GMT
#3
Can we get a pic of that nat? It seems quite open, and while it is OK to have open naturals you need to have them close to the ramp, so you can wall off a side with a maximum of 2 3x3 buildings, preferably 1 2x2 and 1 3x3 buildings or less. Other than that the flow of the map seems good, there are no free expansions and there are enough open and choked areas to allow people to use their tactical skills properly. A very fine map for what I can see.

About the destructible towers, it is a nice idea, although it is not necessary to have them since they don't cover every path, I think removing the rocks would make it easier on players, which is nice, but of course having them gives extra strategy to be made. On that note I think that you should add rocks to some ramps in the middle, that would make early game battle tactics to be more effective while not touching lategame ability to travel through the areas without being forced into tiny chokes.

EDIT: EatThePath that sounds good, hopefully either the rock's health will be increased to 1500-2000 or it will be used in the way you described. By the way it was used on a different map other than the one from Blizzard, this map: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=384261
Caviar
Profile Joined April 2011
70 Posts
April 03 2013 22:20 GMT
#4
On April 04 2013 07:08 EatThePath wrote:
Come to think of it, how do you feel about putting the towers in a pocket that can be closed off with the rocks instead of killing the tower? I think that'd be more interesting here and we haven't seen a good use of that except some crappy pre-beta blizzard maps that didn't really use it well.


The original version of this map I had it that way. I still might end up going back to that. It just seemed that if a team was able to destroy the original rocks then blocking off the tower wouldn't prove much use.

In its current state its really only there for the early game. By the time they are destroyed the third normal tower becomes more relevant in defending the 3rd and 6th.

Quakecomm
Profile Joined April 2012
United States344 Posts
April 03 2013 22:34 GMT
#5
Where is this map published? I'd love to test it. Looks good.
gorkey island is the only good map
Caviar
Profile Joined April 2011
70 Posts
April 03 2013 22:56 GMT
#6
On April 04 2013 07:34 Quakecomm wrote:
Where is this map published? I'd love to test it. Looks good.


Its private right now. But It will be published later this week on NA when I fix a few key things.
ZigguratOfUr
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Iraq16955 Posts
April 04 2013 00:35 GMT
#7
Very polished map, and I really like how the top of the map is layed out. The natural seems kinda open; maybe put rocks to make the top of the large entrance smaller initially, like that the player can better defend the ramp, and the bottom of the opening. The map is quite big, which is fine, but the bottom middle base, doesn't seem to contribute in the slightest to the map's synergy. It will probably almost never be taken, and troup movements through it would probably not happen often, since its not in the way of anything of tactical value. The map would probably be fine with having the middle bottom base completely removed, and replaced with empty space, and the lanes around it made into narrow paths leading into the back of the fifth bases.
OprahWindfury
Profile Joined April 2013
United States12 Posts
April 04 2013 01:17 GMT
#8
This map looks eerily like Habitation Station...

http://bit.ly/ZAItuh
People don't know what they like, they like what they know.
Caviar
Profile Joined April 2011
70 Posts
April 04 2013 01:22 GMT
#9
On April 04 2013 10:17 OprahWindfury wrote:
This map looks eerily like Habitation Station...

http://bit.ly/ZAItuh


I know. When I saw that map posted I almost decided to abandon this project because of the similarity.
Caviar
Profile Joined April 2011
70 Posts
April 04 2013 01:47 GMT
#10
Updated and published to NA servers
EatThePath
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States3943 Posts
April 04 2013 02:16 GMT
#11
Well, they're pretty different for 2p mirror in concept and execution. Hopefully will try this out soon and see if I have any more feedback.
Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE
SidianTheBard
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2474 Posts
April 04 2013 02:19 GMT
#12
On April 04 2013 10:22 Caviar wrote:

I know. When I saw that map posted I almost decided to abandon this project because of the similarity.


I can see some similarities but nahhh, I'm glad you decided to keep working on this. I like the flow of the bases here and I like that there isn't any dead space at all really towards the middle of the map.

I'm a little worried it could be a bit too much open and therefore be way too strong for zergs? Besides the harassable third there doesn't seem to be many tight choke points for a protoss or terran to move their way through the map. Might want to make a few points more choked off.

I think I'd like if the whole lower level was completely sand/dirt. Over by the low ground 3rds they are back to the manmade stuff. I think I'd like it better and it might flow better if the whole lower level was just dirt/rocks/etc.

Lastly, I hate the gases on the 12 and 6 o'clock expansions. I never really liked those types of super vulnerable opposite side of the minerals gases. But it's just preference really.

Great work, looks amazing & it should play out perfectly.

Good job bud!
Creator of Abyssal Reef, Ascension to Aiur, Battle on the Boardwalk, Habitation Station, Honorgrounds, IPL Darkness Falls, King's Cove, Korhal Carnage Knockout & Moonlight Madness.
Fatam
Profile Joined June 2012
1986 Posts
April 04 2013 02:31 GMT
#13
I think it would play pretty differently than Habitation Station b/c of a few key paths being different.
+ it's a bit wider of a map and more open.

As far as improving the map, I would try to narrow a few areas (esp. the ramps to the 12/6 o'clock bases, to make them more appealing). Right now once you get outside your nat pretty much all the chokes and hallways are big and there's not much variety in size. I think (especially since highground matters less in SC2) it's important to have a variety of sized areas so that where the battle happens actually matters. Just my 2 cents though.

aesthetics/layout is pretty solid overall. look forward to how sexy it can look w/ more aesthetics added.

p.s. - it's hard to tell for sure, but it looks like it might have the 3 pylon block problem that Planet S had (where you can 3 pylon block despite the unbuildable plate being there) on the right side. On the left side the plate is on the opp side of ramp which prevents Nexus wall FFE. Nitpicky stuff but just something i noticed.


Search "FTM" in SC2 | Latest Maps: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-maps/528528-2-ftm-siegfried-station http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-maps/525489-2-ftm-crimson-aftermath http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-maps/524737-2-ftm-grime
lost_artz
Profile Joined January 2012
United States366 Posts
April 04 2013 05:07 GMT
#14
On April 04 2013 10:22 Caviar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 04 2013 10:17 OprahWindfury wrote:
This map looks eerily like Habitation Station...

http://bit.ly/ZAItuh


I know. When I saw that map posted I almost decided to abandon this project because of the similarity.


It's may be similar but overall this is much more refined, especially on the topic of aesthetics.
gronnelg
Profile Joined December 2010
Norway354 Posts
April 04 2013 07:54 GMT
#15
On April 04 2013 14:07 lost_artz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 04 2013 10:22 Caviar wrote:
On April 04 2013 10:17 OprahWindfury wrote:
This map looks eerily like Habitation Station...

http://bit.ly/ZAItuh


I know. When I saw that map posted I almost decided to abandon this project because of the similarity.


It's may be similar but overall this is much more refined, especially on the topic of aesthetics.

This map also is more open, and less chokey, which is a good thing. I like this map.
Lulzez || My stream: http://www.twitch.tv/gronnelg
CycoDude
Profile Joined November 2010
United States326 Posts
April 04 2013 08:46 GMT
#16
i don't like the base between the watch tower and main. it's a huge area for reapers to come into the main, and you can put siege tanks there and easily siege the main. i would like an impassible area filling that space.

i don't like that "finger" behind the third's mineral line. again, i think this makes it too easy to harass that base (especially with siege tanks). i'd get rid of it and just expand that null zone that's already below it.
Caviar
Profile Joined April 2011
70 Posts
April 04 2013 13:38 GMT
#17
On April 04 2013 17:46 CycoDude wrote:
i don't like the base between the watch tower and main. it's a huge area for reapers to come into the main, and you can put siege tanks there and easily siege the main. i would like an impassible area filling that space.

i don't like that "finger" behind the third's mineral line. again, i think this makes it too easy to harass that base (especially with siege tanks). i'd get rid of it and just expand that null zone that's already below it.


Ive had similar concerns. I have a few ideas in the works on tweaking the third outside the base aswell as the "finger' area without streamlineing the map to much.
TheFish7
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United States2824 Posts
April 04 2013 23:45 GMT
#18
Quite good overall IMO, although I also agree about the "finger" over the 3rd. very nice work using different textures sets and making it feel very natural. I feel that some of the configurations of the mineral lines could be improved.

Is the base between the main and the watchtowers 6m2g or am I seeing things?
~ ~ <°)))><~ ~ ~
Caviar
Profile Joined April 2011
70 Posts
April 06 2013 19:19 GMT
#19
New version uploaded
Im taking a break from working on this map to work on a few other projects continued feedback is appreciated though
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
23:00
OSC Elite Rising Star #17
ReBellioN vs HiGhDrA
Shameless vs Demi
LetaleX vs Mute
Percival vs TBD
Liquipedia
BSL 21
20:00
ProLeague - RO32 Group B
spx vs rasowy
HBO vs KameZerg
Cross vs Razz
dxtr13 vs ZZZero
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 182
ProTech130
Ketroc 45
StarCraft: Brood War
Snow 190
sorry 70
Noble 54
Icarus 7
Dota 2
monkeys_forever406
NeuroSwarm108
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox1490
Mew2King34
Other Games
summit1g16632
JimRising 550
fl0m549
WinterStarcraft363
ViBE145
Models0
kaitlyn0
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick872
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 5
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21649
League of Legends
• Rush1277
• Hupsaiya68
• HappyZerGling63
Other Games
• Shiphtur471
Upcoming Events
OSC
4h 27m
Wardi Open
7h 27m
Wardi Open
11h 27m
Replay Cast
18h 27m
WardiTV Korean Royale
1d 7h
Replay Cast
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
Classic vs Solar
herO vs Cure
Reynor vs GuMiho
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Solar vs Zoun
MaxPax vs Bunny
[ Show More ]
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Classic vs Creator
Cure vs TriGGeR
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
CranKy Ducklings
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
herO vs Gerald
ByuN vs SHIN
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
BSL 21
5 days
Tarson vs Julia
Doodle vs OldBoy
eOnzErG vs WolFix
StRyKeR vs Aeternum
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Reynor vs sOs
Maru vs Ryung
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
6 days
BSL 21
6 days
JDConan vs Semih
Dragon vs Dienmax
Tech vs NewOcean
TerrOr vs Artosis
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-07
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.