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[D] Protoss 'Shock and awe'

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-18 05:51:45
June 06 2011 14:30 GMT
#1
[image loading]

Some of you may have noticed my recent activity lately thanks to MLG, and given this post, I feel obliged to contribute something before disappearing once again. So I've decided to sit down and write down a technique that Protoss players can employ in the midgame/lategame which I've been working on since about January. Hopefully it comes in useful!

Background and Motivation (skip this if you don't care about my thought process)

If you play Protoss, you will have encountered the incredibly frustrating multi-pronged drop that Terran players love to employ. After being killed by this one too many times, I sat down to think about the options that Protoss players have at their disposal. Common knowledge dictates that Protoss do not have such harassment options as our only remotely potent one (warp templars) was nerfed. Protoss just don't have the same options at our disposal.

I don't know why I was expecting for there to be a Protoss equivalent though - after all why should there be? All three races are unique and hence one should not expect for the same techniques to carry over from race to race; some general techniques obviously so, but there should be plenty of race specific techniques that don't.

What makes Protoss unique? The warp in mechanic obviously. In fact, this trait defines the race. And warp in allows units anywhere, any time (more or less anyway). We should all be accustomed to the power that warp in gives to Protoss aggression and ill simply elaborate on the 4gate as an example. The 4gate with proxy pylon allows reinforcements to be warped in directly into the battle, whereas other races must wait until the units have traversed the map.

Let me extend upon this into the midgame. Zerg and Terran are constantly training troops and rallying them to a location for them to be used later in battle. Protoss, on the other hand, simply decide where they want their next wave of reinforcements to be rather than setting a rally point. There is no transit time, they just appear there. In particular, Zerg will typically have units coming from all directions (due to the many hatch nature of zerg) and Terran will have a concentration of unit producing structures in their main with units rallied from there.

The important realisation from this is that Protoss can put their units anywhere whereas the other two races have their units originating from a source - a scattered source in the case of Zerg and a concentrated source in the case of Terran.

Now let's look at what Protoss pros tend to do with their power to warp in units anywhere on the map. The short story is that they either use it to defend from harass, or they just warp in units somewhere as if it were a rally point. In essence, they are completely wasting the power of the "anywhere, any time" power of the warp in mechanic by treating warp-in as a glorified "train unit" action.

And so, we arrive at the Protoss 'shock and awe '

What is the "Shock and awe"?

The "Shock and awe" strategy (technically known as rapid dominance) is a military doctrine based on the use of overwhelming power, dominant battlefield awareness, dominant maneuvers, and spectacular displays of force to paralyze an adversary's perception of the battlefield and destroy its will to fight. The doctrine was written by Harlan K. Ullman and James P. Wade in 1996 and is a product of the National Defense University of the United States. Thanks wikipedia!

With the preceding discussion in mind, in an ideal world where would you have your units warping in if you had the choice? Well here is a typical minimap screen from a game I pulled at random.
[image loading]

I've highlighted 4 areas of significance. Orange is currently where a fight is going on. Blue is the Zerg's 3rd expansion, green is the Zergs main and pink is where most Protoss will warp in their next round of units.

So let's think about it. Given you have the ability to warp in units anywhere you want unrestricted by pylon power, where would you choose? Clearly, warping in at the pink location is going to bring the least benefit - you're not supplementing your attack nor being aggressive with your fresh units (and hence giving your opponent a headache). So let's rule that one out.

That leaves orange, green and blue. Choosing between these is pretty difficult! I see the strongest arguments for orange and green, but can understand why you'd also go blue. At this stage, which position you want your units in isn't important - the important thing is that now you're thinking that warping in at pink is pretty dumb, and why would you do that given you have a choice?

The Warp Prism gives you that choice. One 200 mineral unit suddenly allows you warp in at any location you have pre-chosen. What the shock and awe is going to employ is using the warp prism to warp in units while attacking, rather than using it while your units are not being active. This is the key difference between traditional warp prism use and what is being suggested here. But let's make this perfectly clear and set up some conditions for success:

The scenario
- You have armies of approximate strength (i.e. one army isn't going to steam roll the other in a fight)
- You have 6+ warpgates (more the better) and a warp prism
- We're in a multibase situation

The plan is:
- Warp in a 'final' round of units for your army
- Be aggressive with your army so that his army must take note and get into position
- Send warp prism to desired location (more on this later) and set into phasing mode
- You want to time it so that your next round of units will warp in as this sets up

Three things will happen:
- Your armies will fight. This means that you will (hopefully) annihilate the bulk of each others armies. The warp ins will be useful no matter where they are.
- His army will pull back to defend the warp ins. In this case you go kill an expo.
- Some of his army pulls back to defend. In this case you crush him army.

The first case is of particular interest as:
- If your warp prism is with your army, you might have enough units to overpower him right there and get a decisive army advantage.
- If your prism is in his expo, you might be able to shut it down since he needs reinforcements to clean it up.
- If your prism is in his main, you might be able to kill off his next round of units (vs terran) or kill his tech (zerg).

Let me make this clear though. If your round of warp ins get annihilated for no gain, meaning he still has his reinforcements, tech and economy, then the game is essentially over. This is like a hang bang attack in Brood War - it IS an all in. Fortunately, it's not that difficult to do damage and not die. But it's important to keep in mind that since you are warping in everything on the front lines (as you would with a 4gate) that if all those units die, you are left with no units (like a failed 4gate) meaning you are probably going to get rolled.

For the rest of this discussion, I will assume that both armies have engaged and the armies have more or less annihilated each other.

Where to warp?

Let me bring up this picture once again:

[image loading]

vs Zerg

I find that this strategy is most effective against Zerg because of how their reinforcements come from multiple locations, and that I have a surplus of minerals in most games.

When I was first testing this strategy, my idea was that warping in at the orange location was the best thing possible. After testing this against Camlito (aka Edge on SEA) I found that warping in at orange generally was useless. Why?
- Warping in more stalkers generally doesn't help if you dont have colossus or storm to back it up. For big army fights you really want to have the heavy tech units, not dumb stalkers.
- It was difficult to set up the prism in a useful location given the mobility of zerg
- Against mutalisk strategies, it would be easily picked off in battle
I would upload the replays, but they are on a very old patch so they are kinda annoying to watch. So while orange seems logical, it doesn't yield that gain you would expect.

That leaves the choice between blue and green. Again, I found that warping in at blue was 'good' but not 'great'. Sometimes I'd be able to kill the hatch, but not usually. And typically speaking, I wouldn't get many drone kills because they would just run away (and zealots suck at chasing drones). So there really wasn't that much return from the investment. So that left warping in in green.

And here is where things get great. By warping units directly into their main you suddenly have access to both their economy AND their tech - something expansions generally lack. Warp in 8-10 Zealots into a Zergs main while all his forces are concentrating on your army and you can easily snipe off his pool and warren, or pool and spire or whatever you like before his reinforcements come to clean things up. It means that the Zerg can't just go and kill you, and has to retreat home to defend. And lastly, the main is often the furthest away from the action. I think its a brilliant move and can often give you enough time to stall for more expensive gas units for your next major army.

So to recap:
- We engage with our army
- Simultaneously warp in 8-10 zealots or dark templar into the Zergs main with an objective to kill drones first, then tech after the drones flee
- If we trade armies and you do no damage with warp ins, we lose. If we trade armies and we kill his tech we are in a good position to rebuild our expensive gas units.

I notice that a lot of PvZ's have the Zergs looking to trade armies and then win on the remax. This strategy cuts that down by neutralising the zerg remax via killing tech/reinforcements. Plus this doesn't use up any gas as primarily you are warping in zealots to do damage! Yay!

Now all my reps against megalisk doing this got wiped so megalisk, if you are reading this, please send me them so I can upload them here!!! All I have is this poorly executed game against Rayzorblade (high masters) - http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/Plexa/blitzk/plexa_vs_ray_1.sc2replay
On June 09 2011 02:34 Plexa wrote:
http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/Plexa/sc2_reps/plexa_vs_energizer.sc2replay

Managed to get it right once in this game. Big hydra/roach vs colossus/stalker engagement while i simultaneously warp in zealots and snipe off hydra tech and roach tech.

Here is what happens - in pictures:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
Here is a battle. While the Zerg is completely committed to this fight I'm warping in Zealots into his base:
[image loading]
I send the Zealots to kill off his tech - in particular his hydra den and roach warren:

[image loading]
Hydra den dead, roach warren will die shortly after.

[image loading]
Battle over, but he's not going to be building any more hydralisks or roaches. Plus his reinforcements need to tend to my zealots, else lose the rest of his tech. This allows me to push forward and sentry abuse his split forces and gain a massive adv.

Here is another rep: http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/Plexa/sc2_reps/PvZ_FiwiFaki_into_Shoc.sc2replay

vs Terran

The same methodology applies. Warp prisms in battle typically are useless since you can't warp in storms anymore, but sometimes an additional round of zealots can help. Rogue expansions tend to have Planetaries, making zealot warps useless. So once again we look to warping in the Terran main.

We consider the following facts about Terran:
- Without medivacs, marines and marauders get destroyed by upgraded chargelots
- Terran units are really weak individually, but their power grows exponentially as they increase in number
- Terran are really vulnerable if you are attacking their unit producing structures

Hence, a round of Zealots in their main do a lot of damage (esp. if you keep warping in). Primarily you will be cutting down lone marines/marauders without any support while the Terran army is engaging your army - and Zealots should destroy them without too much problem. Your next target, imo, should be techlabs and reactors - they die quick and take ages to rebuild. You could go for SCVs, however, or things like Starports.

The important thing is to keep piling on the pressure in his main if you manage to kill his army. It's highly likely that you will be able to do terrible terrible damage if you keep warping in Zealots and kill off his reinforcements, one unit at a time. If you didn't manage to kill his army... don't dedicate too much else you will die to a counter attack very easily. Instead, view this one round of warp ins as a stall while you recoup your losses.

On June 18 2011 14:50 Plexa wrote:
State was nice enough to play some off race games against me and I managed to use this a few times.

http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/Plexa/blitzk/plexa_vs_state.sc2replay

While I harass with prisms most of the game there are a few points where I'm employing this tactic. For instance, at the start when I pressure with colossus I warp in zealots into his main rather than to beef up my attack. Would warping in more stuff into my army have won the game? I don't know for sure, but I don't think so. Nevertheless, state couldn't defend both places at once and lost a lot of SCVs.

There's also a time when he's pressuring my base and when most protoss would be warping in stuff into their army, I warp in Zealots into his main. Right decision? Again, I don't know. But I think it worked quite well.

You can judge the effectiveness for yourself.


What units do I warp in?

I've implicitly suggested that you warp in Zealots and Dark Templar so far. But let me justify that. Firstly, Zealots are cheap and have amazing DPS - so they kill shit quickly, which is exactly what you want to do. It also minimises your investment into the warp in if it fails. Dark Templar are also obvious, without detection or with easily snipable detection, they can do terrible terrible damage. Further, DTs can morph into archons which are amazing against Zerglings (the zerg remax of choice these days it seems).

Stalkers I would avoid because they are frail and predominantly a harass unit, not a do tons of damage quickly then die unit. I could see a case for them if you have blink, but that relies on you being able to escape with most of your Stalkers still alive. i haven't been able to get that to work... yet...

High Templar used to be great in this. Now they plain suck because they just sit there unable to do anything.

Sentries *should* be used as if you can perma forcefield the ramp against Zerg (not so much against Terran) then you have a free base to slaughter. However, given that you are already attacking with your army (and II assume, microing it) I don't think you have the multitasking to be able to pull this off. However, if you do pull it off - instant fame. Indeed, I reckon someone like Huk could do it but its not easy. Hence I avoid them, but I should get in the habit of trying to ff ramps.

But I'm only Gold league?! How does this help me!

Check the assumptions - it doesn't require any skill level to execute. However, I will say that it is difficult to get right and takes a bit of practice. But once you are used to it you should be able to do it most of the time. This is a technique that I think gives the edge to you in an even skilled match. It is a technique which places pressure on your opponent, and when you apply pressure to your opponent it means he's more likely to make mistakes, and the lower the league you are in the more severe those mistakes are. So I would argue that if you are in gold league, and can pull this off, you will probably will the game as a result.

Final thoughts

My mindset towards this is that it is a midgame all in. You are foregoing building up a second army and gambling on the strength of Protoss units in low numbers to cause enough damage to put you ahead. Being a midgame all in it's difficult to assess whether the tactic was worth it or not, in my experience I have determined that it is - and I hope that that remains true for you as well. I've managed to use this to great effect to stall for more gas units while dealing some solid damage. Given the current metagame of PvZ where Zergs are forcing army trades with blings and roaches, this strategy can be really annoying to deal with and give you those extra seconds you desperately want.

Aiur fighting!
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
TigerKarl
Profile Joined November 2010
1757 Posts
June 06 2011 14:38 GMT
#2
This is definitely one strategy or aspect that will have to be explored in the future. In the last months protoss in general have relied to much on the stuff that they already know. Even to a point that i feel as a Zerg player that right now this matchup is heavily in favour of Zerg.
Now one thing i've already adjusted to is to build one spine and one spore crawler whenever i feel ahead, because DTs or any warp ins seem to me as reasonable ways to come back into a game when you're behind.
so because of the lack of stim i really find the terran drop otions much stronger, but Protoss will still benefit from using Warp Prisms and drops.
FlaminGinjaNinja
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United Kingdom879 Posts
June 06 2011 14:39 GMT
#3
Nice write up! I saw Kiwikaki do something similar against Axslav (PvP) in the EG masters cup. Engaging the army and warping in zealots into the mineral line with a warp prism, it was really effective as there was nothing Axslav could do since he'd just warped in units to the main battle.

The next game Axslav tried it against Kiwikaki but it was scoutted and shut down.

I don't think it would be as effective vs a Zerg as the other two faces because of the general spread of overlords providing vision and the speed of zerg units. Thats not to say that it won't do damage and possibly win you tyhe game.

Protoss need to start using more drop play in all matchups, it's the one thing that Protoss really arnt utalising
GinjaNinja.661 EU I'd like to thank my sh*t keyyboard for always messing up my 'Y's
Malyce
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Switzerland112 Posts
June 06 2011 14:40 GMT
#4
This is very interesting, and I've seen it work to great effect in pro games. I wouldn't mind doing a bit of experimenting myself.

The only difficulty I see is that the protoss army is known to gain in effeciency when in a blob. Terran and Zerg are much stronger when it comes to attacking in small numbers. In other words if a T or a Z use their reenforcements to kill your reenforcements (basically your drop), they're being more cost-effecient than you are.

I am theorycrafting and I admit that any time you force you opponent to multitask, it's a good thing. However if both players have a similar level of multitasking, I feel like a protoss splitting up his units will always be behind a T or Z doing the same.
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-06 14:55:25
June 06 2011 14:44 GMT
#5
On June 06 2011 23:40 Malyce wrote:
This is very interesting, and I've seen it work to great effect in pro games. I wouldn't mind doing a bit of experimenting myself.

The only difficulty I see is that the protoss army is known to gain in effeciency when in a blob. Terran and Zerg are much stronger when it comes to attacking in small numbers. In other words if a T or a Z use their reenforcements to kill your reenforcements (basically your drop), they're being more cost-effecient than you are.
Partly true. Gateway units in general suck in blobs. Whereas if you have critical mass of Colossi everything dies what we're doing here is using small groups of units which add less to the blob than the heavy gas units so we're not wasting that much. Moreover, 10 Zealots are pretty good at killing small groups of low tech TZ units

I am theorycrafting and I admit that any time you force you opponent to multitask, it's a good thing. However if both players have a similar level of multitasking, I feel like a protoss splitting up his units will always be behind a T or Z doing the same.
The key difference with this is that the units you are warping in are units that would normally not be included within your army. They would comprise your reinforcements or 2nd army. Hence we're not actually splitting things up - we're just sending absolutely everything at our disposal to attack rather than have them idling at home.

On June 06 2011 23:39 FlaminGinjaNinja wrote:
Nice write up! I saw Kiwikaki do something similar against Axslav (PvP) in the EG masters cup. Engaging the army and warping in zealots into the mineral line with a warp prism, it was really effective as there was nothing Axslav could do since he'd just warped in units to the main battle.
Interesting.. I didn't think you could use it in PvP because your opponent should be able to defend with warp ins, but I could see things getting ugly if the the defending protoss is mid-recharge.

I don't think it would be as effective vs a Zerg as the other two faces because of the general spread of overlords providing vision and the speed of zerg units. Thats not to say that it won't do damage and possibly win you tyhe game.
Actually it doesn't matter if they see it coming 99% of the time. Because you are being aggressive with your equally sized army, if he spots it and recalls his army it gives you free reign on the map. Think back to PvT - if you recall all your army home then your army is terribly out of position when the rest of the Terran army comes running into your natural. Same applies here. The strongest thing about this is that you're not sacrificing strength from your core army to make this work whereas in TvP the terran is, but that strength is also its weakness as it means you have nothing left if everything fails. Also, keep in mind that with Zerg their reinforcements are often coming from many bases and hence you generally deal with smaller groups at a time - and zealots eat lings :3

If you watch the (terrible) game against ray, you'll see that my warpins separated his roach army at one point which allows my core army to clear up his half army ezpz. And that lead to me being able to do lots of damage to his 4th.

On June 06 2011 23:38 TigerKarl wrote:
so because of the lack of stim i really find the terran drop otions much stronger, but Protoss will still benefit from using Warp Prisms and drops.
Yea no doubt medivac drops are great and much easier to execute (don't need as crisp timing on the warp ins etc). But I would argue that this is just as scary when executed right.
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
GreEny K
Profile Joined February 2008
Germany7312 Posts
June 06 2011 14:46 GMT
#6
Well written and makes buckets of sense. As simple and logical as this is, I don't really warp in units at my battles or harass while I battle his main army. I should probably utilize this more.
Why would you ever choose failure, when success is an option.
r3tsa
Profile Joined April 2011
Poland94 Posts
June 06 2011 14:48 GMT
#7
I was considering the similar idea, but i don't think i have the mechanics to pull it off yet
No pain, no gain.
Volka
Profile Joined December 2010
Argentina408 Posts
June 06 2011 14:51 GMT
#8
You know what, I used to do this against Terran, and it worked really good. Now that you metioned it, I'm gonna try it again Thx!
http://www.starsite.com.ar
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
June 06 2011 14:51 GMT
#9
On June 06 2011 23:46 GreEny K wrote:
Well written and makes buckets of sense. As simple and logical as this is, I don't really warp in units at my battles or harass while I battle his main army. I should probably utilize this more.

Why not? Because its HARD if you are supporting your army then getting the prism in the right place is REALLY annoying, if you are harassing then timing it so that you are being active with your army AND having the cooldown reach zero when your prism sets up is insanely hard to get right
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
Kuro Shinigami
Profile Joined June 2011
United Kingdom9 Posts
June 06 2011 14:57 GMT
#10
If the two main armies annihilate each other, and you still have the resources to warp in at the back of their bases i think this is making the assumption that you are already ahead in the game thus you could win anyway by simply fighting the main battle.
I'm not better than everyone, they're just worse than me.
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-06 15:04:41
June 06 2011 15:01 GMT
#11
On June 06 2011 23:57 Kuro Shinigami wrote:
If the two main armies annihilate each other, and you still have the resources to warp in at the back of their bases i think this is making the assumption that you are already ahead in the game thus you could win anyway by simply fighting the main battle.

Perhaps I assumed too much, but let me justify that statement a bit more. I find that in a lot of my pvz's that the Zerg will try to kill all my shit with banelings and at the end of the exchange we end up with no army each. The zerg then tries to remax on lings/roaches to exploit the lack of gas units and hence take the game. My reinforcements will be at home, not doing anything, and I'll be sitting there trying to churn out more colossus/VR/templar/archons - or whatever my gas heavy unit of choice is. This is designed to stop such occurrences by being active with those first round of 'expendable' units.

Let us remind ourselves though, that the units we are warping in with the prism would not normally be in the army. They would be warped in to the closest based and used for reinforcements. Your opponent would be building reinforcements too, so you end up even again. What this does is places that first round of reinforcements in his main (or in your army) so that they are actually serving a purpose rather than walking across the map.

Again, I stress how difficult it is to get the timing right on the warp prism so that you are attacking while warping in your first round of 'reinforcements' into his main.
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 06 2011 15:06 GMT
#12
On June 07 2011 00:01 Plexa wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 06 2011 23:57 Kuro Shinigami wrote:
If the two main armies annihilate each other, and you still have the resources to warp in at the back of their bases i think this is making the assumption that you are already ahead in the game thus you could win anyway by simply fighting the main battle.

Perhaps I assumed too much, but let me justify that statement a bit more. I find that in a lot of my pvz's that the Zerg will try to kill all my shit with banelings and at the end of the exchange we end up with no army each. The zerg then tries to remax on lings/roaches to exploit the lack of gas units and hence take the game. This is designed to stop such occurrences.

Let us remind ourselves though, that the units we are warping in with the prism would not normally be in the army. They would be warped in to the closest based and used for reinforcements. Your opponent would be building reinforcements too, so you end up even again. What this does is places that first round of reinforcements in his main (or in your army) so that they are actually serving a purpose rather than walking across the map.

Again, I stress how difficult it is to get the timing right on the warp prism so that you are attacking while warping in your first round of 'reinforcements' into his main.


I totally agree with this. Especially on 3 bases+ vs Zerg, I seem to find myself sitting on tons of minerals and no gas much of the time. Reproduction of my army is always gas dependent (contrasting vs Terran when chargelots are almost always good). It sounds odd, but 1000 minerals on a warp prism and bunch of zealots is actually a very low cost in mid-late game vs Zerg when it's gas I need.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Ignorant prodigy
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States385 Posts
June 06 2011 15:11 GMT
#13
Here’s a thought…build two warp prisms and load one with a sentry or two. ‘Harass’ an expansion first with the sentrys, but have it do hallucination so your army appears to be much larger.. your opponent should defend with a good chunk of his army if not all.. which lets you position your army between his main and his expansion..
Then once in position you do the real warp in at his main with the second prism.. he will be forced to engage your main army to try and stop the attack.. but you’ll essentially be blocking his advancement. Then if your first warp prism is still alive you can simply warp in more at his expansion.
http://www.twitch.tv/ignorantprodigy playing masters random with no hotkeys......big pimpin'
Binabik
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany686 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-06 15:19:54
June 06 2011 15:15 GMT
#14
PvZ:
I wouldn't recommend doing this stuff with Zealots and a Warp Prisma, because 1 Spine Crawler + 1 Queen will kill it. And on most maps good Zergs tend to get even 2 Spine Crawlers + 1 Spore, because DTs are that strong.
PvT:
As long as he doesn't have a Planetary

edit2:
Storm Drops are great in both MatchUps though, because the Templar get energy while they're in the Prisma and a storm kills workers really quick.
It also protects your High Templar from being Sniped/EMPd
Rybaia
Profile Joined May 2011
Italy213 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-06 15:22:53
June 06 2011 15:20 GMT
#15
I'm actually practicing alot with warp prism and I find the very good expecially on maps like Shakuras (your picture looks like the my usual minimap lol) and Shatterd Temple.
But I've never tryed to warp units at the warp prism during a big engagement. I usually poke at the front and then when I see that the T or Z moves his army to defend I warp in to harass the mineral lines of the main and the 3rd and then I retreat.
If he tries to save the workers I can still poke again at the front and do damage or cut off the reinforcements that are going to the 3rd expo.
Thank you Plexa for the read.

+ Show Spoiler +
Sorry for my bad english I hope you guys understand my post =/
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36161 Posts
June 06 2011 15:25 GMT
#16
On June 07 2011 00:20 Rybaia wrote:

+ Show Spoiler +
Sorry for my bad english I hope you guys understand my post =/


Your english is excellent ^^
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
TheFrankOne
Profile Joined December 2010
United States667 Posts
June 06 2011 15:32 GMT
#17
I love this post!

I would like to add that there is an ideal time to get a warp prism in my experience. Right when the robo bay is coming online, get the obs and then chrono out a warp prism, one warp prism has far more utility than one immortal and saves you enough gas for a cheap upgrade, half of an expensive one like thermal lance, or a sentry. I do it in all three matchups but have been lacking a strategy that allows me to utilize it extremely well.
shammythefox
Profile Joined May 2010
United Kingdom286 Posts
June 06 2011 15:33 GMT
#18
This is the kind of experimentation protoss players really need to start engaging with. Stuff like this is already apparent at high levels but the knowledge hasn't filtered down i feel. If you watch macro protoss' such as artosis play you'll often seen double warp prism dt harrasment.

The situation described has its benefits as outlined, but i feel the real power of this strategy lies not as an all in but as a harrasment technique, on 4base usually rather than 3. Consider for a moment you engaged the exact same move, but rather than trading armies, you move in, start doing the templar/collosus/void ray dance with whatever tech you have, get warped in in his main, and just forcefield to back off. This type of damage can be done without the losses.
junemermaid
Profile Joined September 2006
United States981 Posts
June 06 2011 15:35 GMT
#19
one of my favorite things is watching zealots punch zerg units. this tactic allows for that to happen.

i would add that loading up a sentry with the warp prism so that you can perpetually forcefield a ramp if the opportunity allows for it. it's better than warping in sentries because of the energy allowance, and one less sentry shouldn't detract from the frontal attack.
the UMP says YER OUT
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
June 06 2011 15:38 GMT
#20
On June 07 2011 00:15 Binabik wrote:
PvZ:
I wouldn't recommend doing this stuff with Zealots and a Warp Prisma, because 1 Spine Crawler + 1 Queen will kill it. And on most maps good Zergs tend to get even 2 Spine Crawlers + 1 Spore, because DTs are that strong.
3 Zealots yes. 10+ 2-2 Zealots, not a chance
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