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Sigh so tired of you holding your hand over LSB Foolishness, if I was right about him imma hate in the postgame  . But allright, I'll bite:
@LSB you instantly claimed roleblock upon seeing day post. Later Jackal claimed as well. Thats a full KP bringing us up to 4 KP. My first question is how do you explain:
a) 4 kp mafia in a game of this size
b) Mafia choosing to roleblock a green claim instead of killing you, considering I probably raised enough suspecion against you to not get medic protection (at least that was my goal, was hoping for a vigi)
c) Mafia sacrificing a full 2 KP so far on powers. Seems retarded not to abuse 4 kp.
Second question:
You spend alot of time defending others, but not alot of time scumhunting (I ignore your posts on me for now). Who are your actual suspects and why?
Answers can be PM'ed.
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On March 03 2011 06:55 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2011 06:50 Jackal58 wrote:On March 03 2011 06:43 deconduo wrote:
Just a few things:
Cubed does have a good point that people seem to be missing. Why ignore the possibility of Jackal being the one with the fake roleclaim. Chaoser doesn't even mention it and bum simply says 'Now, I can't say much on jackal'
Regardless of what the situation is with them is, the fact that this was ignored in the analysis is the important point.
Those PMs do paint a somewhat different picture of seraph. If seraph was trying to bus annul why didn't he do so in the thread?
It's because LSB is at the front end of several peoples scum list. The only reason I can think of. I fully expected to be thoroughly grilled by posting my RB. Again the point is not whether or not you are more suspicious than LSB, but that chaos and bum completely ignored the possibility of it.
I don't have any suspicions on jackal. I have suspicions on LSB. I've written about him previously. I am 80% convinced he is mafia. I'm going to push for his lynch. That being said, what foolishness said really vibes well with me. We can look at this situation again in day if we want to, it'll always be here. But that's not the case with the inactives.
##unvote LSB
##vote Jbright
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On March 03 2011 06:39 Foolishness wrote:
That first PM convo was from the first day, when he was actually here and trying to post. According to my sources, he's been very inactive in PM land recently.
I think we as teamliquid mafia players should all make a thread called "Lynching for information is stupid" in which we all post in it and say "lynching for information is stupid" and post examples from games that show "lynching for information is stupid".
I hope I got my point across there -_-
Are we solely lynching for information? Did barundar not just show his analysis of LSB and did I not give enough that disregards all information we would get out of the lynch? No. We are merely stating that in addition to an agreed concern of LSB's alignment shared by a lot of people, Bob Barker pops up and shows us all this neat stuff about people in this game and more. Maybe this is just an abstract warning, but no one is voting for LSB because "Oh I think he's town but I want to see anyway."
Look guys, with the votes so spread out right now, a townie is sure to die. Some clever last minute mafia posting can easily lead to one or two people switching their votes onto a townspeople. At the very least we should pile onto two players would we think are the most suspicious (Seraph and Jbright in my opinion).
I personally really liked your LD analysis, I'm not sure why you stopped. As for seraph and JBright, I don't know, and I don't care at the moment. If they are scum, they are weak and their defenses can be blown over with a sneeze. I think it's the oppostie direction. LSB is much easier to flesh out as mafia earlier rather then those two. I'm not going to grace them with a defense if they can't do it properly themselves. If the rest of the town thinks they are scum, then good we lynch one, I'm focusing on conclusions I've made on LSB for now.
LSB has clearly shown that he is active enough to respond to posts against him. Thus he will definitely be 100% active tomorrow to answer posts against him. What about Seraph and JBright? Are they going to be active tomorrow to respond to our posts? Who knows.
I know! This town will get on them. LSB will make some roundabout list about how some unrelated person deserves to get a bomb placed on them but not get vig'd and but maybe get protected. You should focus on one though. If you are going to argue for seraph and JBright, pick one and have everyone switch to that if mafia votes at the end concern you that greatly.
We need to deal with our inactive scum suspects now. Yes, now. Not tomorrow or later. I don't care how much you think LSB is mafia, lynching him now is not in the best town's interest (I say this even though I am suspicious of him as well). How many mafia games have been played where town lynched all the active players who were "suspicious" and then lost because they couldn't figure out the inactive mafia players? Quite a lot, it happens almost every game the mafia win.
Heartedly disagree. LSB is not just suspicious he has linked himself to every facet of this game you could want to find mafia in the middle of. LSB isn't a whim, I dont vote for whims. JBright and serpah seem like whims.
I am not convinced LSB is mafia. Others have the same attitude I do. You want to convince me? Spend the rest of today, tonight, and tomorrow posting stuff against him. I guarantee you he's going to be here to respond (if he's not, that just makes it all the easier to convince the rest of us). Tomorrow I highly doubt we are going to have any new information on JBright or Seraph. Which is why we need to lynch one of them now and not later.
PICK ONE PLEASE.
If LSB is mafia, he'll slip up the more and more you guys pressure him (yeah you probably think he's slipped up 50 times already, but I'm not convinced). JBright and Seraph aren't going to slip up because they aren't going to ever post except to vote last minute.
Do what's best for the town.
btw did you guys know there is a player in this game by the name of "LastArgument"? Did you guys know that he's probably mafia? Just a friendly reminder.
WHY BRING HIM UP NOW. You already are complaining about candidates being switched on and off, just make a nice case on one of them, tell everyone that's you're strongest inclination. Even if it's wrong it's much better then FoSing all these useless inactives that inevitably give mafia an out.
I feel like you are trying very hard to take this off a single person, almost revving the chainsaw! RRRRRRRRRRRRRRWRWWWWWWWWWWRR!
If LSB is town, foolishness is most definitely town in my eyes. I will submit my vote to him, vouch for protection on him every night and PM his inactive enemies with questions and discussions til they give up and ask RoL to let them surrender.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
To Barundar:
My first impression of LSB through day one was that he is town. However I am not sure anymore. I directly said in my last post "I am suspicious of him", I'm not defending him or his actions. It's a matter of doing what's in the best interest of the town, and that would be killing JBright or Seraph. I don't think anyone in this game has said that they think both of these two are town, or are not okay killing one or the other. Ser Aspi brings up some excellent points but I think the case against Seraph is strong (obviously I'm biased though). Decide for yourself who you think is more convincing.
But by all means please keep pressuring LSB, just make sure you don't go overboard with it.
To Gmarshal:
Mafia XXXV LSB the veteran was lynched day one mostly for information. He was mildly suspicious, annul pushed him hard and people decided to go along with it to see if it would say anything about annul or the others that pushed him in the beginning. It was only the first day but it was a huge loss to the town (even if they did kill annul the next day). Definitely some of the older players here can provide other examples as well.
Lynching for information is a terrible idea 95% of the time (I suppose we could conjure up some rare examples where it'd be useful). It's bad because it's not in the best interest for the town. As I said in my previous post two of the major things the town should be doing right now is:
1) Not spreading out the votes.
2) Killing a suspicious inactive.
The first one is obvious because at this point in the game a last minute vote switch can screw over the town hard (even if it's obvious who did it). For example in Incognito's double mafia game, the mafia family I was the head of all piled on one player in the last 5 minutes of voting. Even though it was obvious that we were all mafia, we did it because it guaranteed us a victory a day later. (Note this is not what actually happened because 2 people in my family went mia and got modkilled, but if it had worked we had a for sure win. In the end it was a tie game between my family and the town).
The second point is situational for this game because all our good leads are on relatively inactive players (Seraph, JBright, and yesterday LD). The only other lead we got is the obvious LSB (and maybe Barundar if you want to go that route). Since we're at almost half the amount of people we started with, we need to start pressuring inactives and killing them (assuming we have good evidence, which we do) while saving the more active people for later. Otherwise the inactive mafia will run away with a victory because by the time all the actives are dead nobody will know who to kill. This sort of happened in Mafia XXXV.
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@bumarlarge
The way I'm thinking about it is like this. Jbright and LSB, which one would be an easier call for a vigi? We lynch Jbright and leave LSB for a vigi to hit.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
To bumatlarge:
I think they are both good targets. And I did pick one, look at who I voted for and posted an analysis of yesterday. I said in a previous post I stopped the case on LD because I thought he made some good pro-town posts. He's not off the hook, but there are other better people to lynch right now (I'd lynch LSB right now over LD).
I was reminding people about LastArgument, not saying we should vote for him. If you skim through his posts, you'll notice he doesn't really seem to care about the town very much. That's pretty suspicious if you ask me. I'm saying keep him in mind for the later days. In my second mafia game, RoL was mafia and I didn't even know because I completely forgot he was in the game because he made ~3 posts over the course of 5 days. When I died in that game, Ver said "RebirthOfLegend is mafia" and I said "...who's that? He isn't in this game...?" Don't forget about him.
I'm glad you think LSB is mafia, and I will delightfully listen to your arguments all day and night. It's about doing what's in the best interest for the town, even if that means not killing your top suspect.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
And I'll be gone until day's end unfortunately, gotta work late.
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Yeah I'm also going to go to bed soon, and I'm most inclined in voting for Jbright. Any lurker would be equally good in my eyes.
But I agree with Foolishness, mostly. I don't think that lynching one of the two will automatically confirm the other though, I'm just going with what people have been posting in the thread so far about them.
I feel rather left out actually, since I've only been PMing GM, I feel I'm only part of half the game.
So I'm gonna go wash up and think about who I want to vote between Jb, Seraph, or LastArgument. I'd most like the lurkers to be mod-killed actually, but I got this urge to sheep Foolishness whenever he posts (no joke).
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And by "one of the two" I mean Jb or Seraph.
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##Vote JBright
Lynching for information is a terrible idea 95% of the time (I suppose we could conjure up some rare examples where it'd be useful). It's bad because it's not in the best interest for the town. As I said in my previous post two of the major things the town should be doing right now is:
1) Not spreading out the votes.
2) Killing a suspicious inactive.
This makes sense to me.
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#Vote Seraph
The case against seraph is a lot stronger than against Jbright.
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Why do people bold votes in this thread? Can't you just say "This is who Im voting for" and do it in the thread? Im so confused -_-
There is no reason not to be on LSB/JB/Ser. I recommend you do that now so we make prepare for how the lynch will go down and eople can make dying post or identify vote switching clearly.
Also, cube, you agree with foolishness and vote JB when he votes seraph i no understand. cubescumdin.
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On February 10 2011 15:40 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Voting rules: 1. Voting is done (in a separate thread, located * NOT MADE YET*). When you vote, you must ALSO post in the main thread saying your vote. This is to keep the game in the game, while also making vote tally's more manageable. Do not PM me your vote.
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Ok I'll vote for JBright as well.
I went with Foolishness' idea and thought hard about the two: Seraph and JBright.
There are more reasons to pick Jbright though:
1. His inactivity (I found like 12 posts of his, as opposed to 29 of Seraph, I don't know if I counted right but that's half the posts either way), I know this doesn't mean much but it's a start.
2. Coag's reasoning: He brought him up early, then others have been brought up. It's pretty clear that this mafia team is not defending their members, since Annul's lynch went pretty easy, but derailing lynches is a must if they want to survive. I'm inclined to think this can also be a clue.
3. I have looked at Foolishness' analysis of Seraph and I'm not convinced. It's basically a posting habits analysis, and albeit pretty conclusive, it doesn't necessarily mean he is red. Yes, he's behaving oddly, but not scummier than JB.
That being said though, even if Jbright flips green, I think it's a good idea to get rid of Seraph tomorrow (meaning, not lose track of him after nightfall). I went back a good number of pages and didn't find any relevant clues that the two are tied together, so I don't think that they are very much connected by anything other than WIFOM. Or, if a vet wants to shoot someone, I think he would make a better target than LSB. My two cents.
##vote JBright
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WHOOEE BOYS, TIME FER A LYNCHUN
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On March 03 2011 08:39 Barundar wrote:
#Vote Seraph
The case against seraph is a lot stronger than against Jbright.
How so?
I'm not mocking, I'm genuinely asking, because I've been over the past 10 pages or so and I think JB is much scummier.
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I agree with the above, though I'd rather lynch someone completely different.
The votes are pitifully strewn about, and I fully expect a lot of wagon hopping in the next couple of hours.
We need to form an active-person-voting bloc. I was imagining this in my car.
Myself,
Foolishness,
LSB,
Deconduo,
Barundar,
Cubedin,
LunarDestiny,
Jackal,
Bum,
Ser Aspi,
Chaoser
^I am not happy with any of these lynches, although I would consider LSB because of his anti-town player d2+, even considering his "pro-town" play d1, even if he has cognitive bias in relation to how terrible it was due to him eventually being on a scum wagon.
What about ohN? Guy has been seriously lurking.
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On March 03 2011 08:41 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On February 10 2011 15:40 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Voting rules: 1. Voting is done (in a separate thread, located * NOT MADE YET*). When you vote, you must ALSO post in the main thread saying your vote. This is to keep the game in the game, while also making vote tally's more manageable. Do not PM me your vote.
Oh dear... :X
##Vote LSB
lol...
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Also, they have 3 KP
it says "THE godfather represents 1kp", also there will be 6 in a game this size.
So, we should have 4 at .5, and 1 at 1, meaning 3kp
3 deaths, either a vig isn't claiming, or someone is lying
Eventually, if a vig doesn't come forward, we need to lynch between Jackal and LSB. Maybe even if a vig comes forward, if we determine they are scum collectively as a town.
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On March 03 2011 08:44 CubEdIn wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2011 08:39 Barundar wrote:
#Vote Seraph
The case against seraph is a lot stronger than against Jbright. How so? I'm not mocking, I'm genuinely asking, because I've been over the past 10 pages or so and I think JB is much scummier.
I feel like the Jbright analysis is based more on "scumslips" than actual behavioral analysis. Quite contrary to the conclusions drawn by Ser Aspi, I don't see Jbright answering as a pressured scum. His silly reasons and distance from the game tells me bored townie rather than scum.
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EPT
