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David Kim's Thoughts on Balance Update #8 - Page 6

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 HotS
Post a Reply
Prev 1 4 5 6 7 8 Next All
Sreka
Profile Joined May 2011
France114 Posts
December 07 2012 19:08 GMT
#101
Hydralisk are really bad so people dont use it. Buff air unit to force player to make them and suffer. lol

More seriously, the hydra is too gaz heavy considering you need 2 upgrades to just bring them in range of the target.

20 hp buff or gaz cost lowered to 35 seems a good way to start (more might be necessary).
blade55555
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States17423 Posts
December 07 2012 19:12 GMT
#102
On December 08 2012 04:08 Sreka wrote:
Hydralisk are really bad so people dont use it. Buff air unit to force player to make them and suffer. lol

More seriously, the hydra is too gaz heavy considering you need 2 upgrades to just bring them in range of the target.

20 hp buff or gaz cost lowered to 35 seems a good way to start (more might be necessary).


Ah hydra's aren't to bad when you have viper support. At least vs mech or protoss. I do think hydra's need a small buff though to AA though or maybe a little extra HP either or would make me happy.
When I think of something else, something will go here
hansonslee
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States2027 Posts
December 07 2012 19:16 GMT
#103
Everything looks good, but the Raven's Seeker Missile acts more like a Yamato Cannon. When will they work on the poor BCs soon?
Seed's # 1 fan!!! #ForVengeance
Sreka
Profile Joined May 2011
France114 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-07 19:28:31
December 07 2012 19:26 GMT
#104
Hydra are glass cannon enough. You need either more hydras to increase army's total HP or more HP per hydra. I would rather go with the lowered gaz cost, since the current cost prevent you from building anything but lings with your hydras. And lings are bad in hots like a bit too bad imo.
Also hydra/viper is available only in lategame (way too much gaz involved). And to be honest I dont see hydra / viper dealing with any of the late game composition of T or P.

The more I play, the more I feel the mid game air is better countered by nydus & queen play rather then hydras.
Alex1Sun
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
494 Posts
December 07 2012 19:29 GMT
#105
Sounds great! I feel really satisfied
This is not Warcraft in space!
RampancyTW
Profile Joined August 2010
United States577 Posts
December 07 2012 21:12 GMT
#106
On December 07 2012 20:15 Rabiator wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 07 2012 04:05 mythandier wrote:

Ultralisk

Burrow charge was cut because we believe it’s better for the Ultralisk to be an all-around powerful ground threat, than a teleporting anti armored unit.

You can still "Blink" your Ultralisks ... just use Vipers for it to get up a cliff or into a bunch of bio. Since the Vipers will have full energy that wont be too difficult to do in larger numbers and with just a few Vipers. I cant wait for someone to "ignore" the large main army at the front of the base and just drag these baddies into the main base to wreak havoc. Maybe then Blizzard will wake up and see how terrible their spells are.

Show nested quote +
On December 07 2012 16:28 ledarsi wrote:
On December 07 2012 13:36 Zombo Joe wrote:
Its a mediocre patch.

Any other developer getting this much flak would have done better.


I agree. But their history has been so bad that this is, relatively speaking, great news. If they continue in this direction they may really do a good job in the long run.

Nah ... they only listen to the community when it is convenient for them and they dont think about consequenses or general strategy at all. Only their specific racial strategies (and the "data" from the ladder which fixes itself to 50/50 ratio all the time) are important to them and that is bad.
Wait... are you talking about the first part like it's a bad thing? Because that sounds awesome. And it's such a huge resource/supply/energy investment that it would have to be done intelligently, as well. This is a GOOD thing, not a bad thing.

Everything they've added increases the skill cap tremendously, adds more active player decisions, and increases "soft counter" interactions while decreasing "hard counter" interactions. What the heck are you unsatisfied about with this patch?
CrazyRah
Profile Joined December 2012
Sweden8 Posts
December 07 2012 22:55 GMT
#107
I really can't wait to see just what these changes bring to the table. Numbers are always one thing but how the players deal with the changes and adapt to them will be the real deal for me. Not going to doom or praise the patch until things have settled with the patch
It could always be worse
Akilleus
Profile Joined November 2010
Sweden82 Posts
December 07 2012 22:59 GMT
#108
I love this patch! Finally we get som guts from Blizzard! Can't wait for the result of this patch and then more big changes to help diverse gameplay and compositions! THANK YOU BLIZZARD!
PXEnTei
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
United States209 Posts
December 07 2012 23:14 GMT
#109
I really like the armory change. terran is the only race with 3 upgrade sets kinda. i need bio, mech and air upgrades.
Zerg has 2.5 with double ground attack, then air upgrades, and toss just has ground and air, with sheilds, but sheilds are special
"Sue me, dickhead!" -Thor
happyness
Profile Joined June 2010
United States2400 Posts
December 07 2012 23:42 GMT
#110
On December 08 2012 04:16 hansonslee wrote:
Everything looks good, but the Raven's Seeker Missile acts more like a Yamato Cannon. When will they work on the poor BCs soon?


With the tempest and viper and new HSM, BC's have no place in HotS
Harbinger631
Profile Joined September 2010
United States376 Posts
December 07 2012 23:45 GMT
#111
Hydralisk cost 1 supply. There, I said it.
Decendos
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany1341 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-07 23:46:32
December 07 2012 23:45 GMT
#112
BC are very viable now after going mech. insta 3/3 battlecruiser vs 2/0 air or whatever your opponent will have is very strong now. but yeah you will have to build other stuff with them to fight tempest, HSM and viper. but building some BC might be very strong now after meching because you will always have an upgrade advantage which is huge for BC.

On December 08 2012 08:45 Harbinger631 wrote:
Hydralisk cost 1 supply. There, I said it.


wont happen although it would be the best thing ever ^^
willoc
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada1530 Posts
December 08 2012 00:22 GMT
#113
On December 07 2012 04:25 Virid wrote:
Why did Blizzard do something like "Let's add a huge number of new threats for players to produce, and add their counters as well" for both Protoss and Terran, but not Zerg?

In other words, they used a very heavy hand with Terran and Protoss, but nearly every explanation for changes to Zerg ends with "we're not sure this is enough, let's wait and see."

It's going to be a rough couple of weeks for Zerg players in the beta.


Did you miss the hydralisk buff DK mentioned specifically for countering air units?
Be bold and mighty forces will come to your aid!
ledarsi
Profile Joined September 2010
United States475 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-08 02:25:30
December 08 2012 02:24 GMT
#114
Hydra to 1 supply. Been saying it since the WoL beta.

Also Roaches back to 1 supply. Although roaches would need to stat adjustments to match- the hydralisk is pretty much good to go as a 1 supply unit right now. Maybe reduce damage from 12 to 10, as in BW.
"First decide who you would be, then do what you must do."
ktimekiller
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States690 Posts
December 08 2012 02:34 GMT
#115
I wish they would stop fiddling with the Swarm Host. Simply a less interesting variation of Lurker
ledarsi
Profile Joined September 2010
United States475 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-08 02:46:13
December 08 2012 02:46 GMT
#116
And the Swarm Host and Siege Tank should become 2 supply units so there can be more of them on the board.

And I would not be averse to giving the Swarm Host a normal-range burrowed attack of its own in addition to spawning locusts.
"First decide who you would be, then do what you must do."
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
December 08 2012 02:55 GMT
#117
With vipers in the game, if you make hydralisks 1 supply, protoss will never beat a roach/hydra/viper army... ever. As it is, it often comes in pretty close between the two with proper positioning.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
ledarsi
Profile Joined September 2010
United States475 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-08 04:15:59
December 08 2012 04:12 GMT
#118
On December 08 2012 11:55 Whitewing wrote:
With vipers in the game, if you make hydralisks 1 supply, protoss will never beat a roach/hydra/viper army... ever. As it is, it often comes in pretty close between the two with proper positioning.


Buff psi storm size? And stalker HP? Or, instead of stalker HP buff, make Immortals 2 supply, a bit cheaper, and decrease their attack damage and greatly decrease their bonus against armored. 200 HP plus 100 hard shield makes them legitimately "Immortals" in numbers.

I also think you greatly underestimate the Colossus.
"First decide who you would be, then do what you must do."
Rabiator
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany3948 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-08 07:46:44
December 08 2012 07:21 GMT
#119
On December 08 2012 06:12 RampancyTW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 07 2012 20:15 Rabiator wrote:
On December 07 2012 04:05 mythandier wrote:

Ultralisk

Burrow charge was cut because we believe it’s better for the Ultralisk to be an all-around powerful ground threat, than a teleporting anti armored unit.

You can still "Blink" your Ultralisks ... just use Vipers for it to get up a cliff or into a bunch of bio. Since the Vipers will have full energy that wont be too difficult to do in larger numbers and with just a few Vipers. I cant wait for someone to "ignore" the large main army at the front of the base and just drag these baddies into the main base to wreak havoc. Maybe then Blizzard will wake up and see how terrible their spells are.

On December 07 2012 16:28 ledarsi wrote:
On December 07 2012 13:36 Zombo Joe wrote:
Its a mediocre patch.

Any other developer getting this much flak would have done better.


I agree. But their history has been so bad that this is, relatively speaking, great news. If they continue in this direction they may really do a good job in the long run.

Nah ... they only listen to the community when it is convenient for them and they dont think about consequenses or general strategy at all. Only their specific racial strategies (and the "data" from the ladder which fixes itself to 50/50 ratio all the time) are important to them and that is bad.
Wait... are you talking about the first part like it's a bad thing? Because that sounds awesome. And it's such a huge resource/supply/energy investment that it would have to be done intelligently, as well. This is a GOOD thing, not a bad thing.

Everything they've added increases the skill cap tremendously, adds more active player decisions, and increases "soft counter" interactions while decreasing "hard counter" interactions. What the heck are you unsatisfied about with this patch?

Being able to drag your own Ultralisks into the enemys main base or something similar is TERRIBLE, because it really destroys any positional play whatsoever AND it adds even more mobility to a race which does not need it! And this is only the use of the spell on a friendly target and not the "I grab your big and expensive units from the back and there is nothing you can do against it because the spell is instant and Blizzard just buffed the hit points of the Viper anyways to make it better".

Don't you guys realize that POWER needs to be balanced and that this kind of "fun and exciting" shit is simply too good to be in the game?

EDIT: Just looking at the new KeSPA map BIFROST makes me see tons of vulnerable spots where this kind of circumventing of a front can be abused. Too much mobility really limits positional play and there isnt enough of that in the game already.

EDIT 2: The game was won by abusing one of the most broken spells in the game: Forcefield ... and yet Blizzard refuses to learn and adds more abuseable spells to the game ... to every race except Terran, so I guess its balanced, right?
If you cant say what you're meaning, you can never mean what you're saying.
RampancyTW
Profile Joined August 2010
United States577 Posts
December 08 2012 07:44 GMT
#120
You've provided zero proof that it would be imbalanced. All you've proven so far as that it has the potential to look awesome. You have yet to demonstrate that it would be too powerful for its limited, situational application and heavy gas/supply/energy investment, beyond your simple assertion that it would be.
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