EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XXVIII - Page 25
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DarthPunk
Australia10854 Posts
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DarthPunk
Australia10854 Posts
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
I understand your suspicions but I'm just a town newbie with a lot of bad posts. I'll try my best to step up and post cases. If you don't mind, I'm going to build a case on debears before addressing your attacks because I feel I might screwing up myself more if I spend too much time defending your cases against me. But I can shortly explain my backflip on Kush. At the beginning of the game, I was not confident at all to nail a scum on day 1. I have even been called for it but, as a newbie, I didn't think I could have a correct read on someone (be it town or scum) and was really afraid of a mislynch. So, at that time, when Darth found Kush scumslip, I was not ready to believe it was so easy to find a scum. That's why I bought kush's explanations for his scumslip. After that I went out and slept and when I came back to the thread I found all the crazy posts from kush and also SDM case. I realized at this point that the slip was indeed a scum slip. Also I realized that not being confident is bad for town so I boost up my confidence. I called the scumteam kush/debears/corrosion and also was more and more sure of kush being red. | ||
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corrosion
Norway29 Posts
doing earlier. Before saying more about the post, I'll specify that this happened after Kush's scumslip and after his explanation. When the slip was pointed out, I thought that the "townie statement" could just be implying that he had a town read on Darth. I think someone later implied that it was a contradiction because he had earlier accused Darth of being scum, but I don't find any prior statement from Kush that actually says that Darth is scum (maybe others did read something between the lines). I've read that mafia don't usually make blatant slips, so I was hesitant. Kush mentioning his streak earlier also seemed blatant. It's not really good town strategy to simulate your play from your last scum game, but with Kush I thought it might be his way of applying game theory to stay consistent no matter what role he is. Then I saw his explanation, and it didn't fit the defense I would have expected if my earlier assumption had been correct. At this point I thought that it was a good chance that Kush was scum. I did not find the use of the word "townie" natural. I guess the main reason that I didn't totally stick with that read, was this post from Darth: On September 28 2012 21:23 DarthPunk wrote: Wow. Really? That was not an explanation at all. It was a slip, and now everyone believes his weak as shit explanation. Anyway this is obviously going nowhere. And it is becoming a distraction at this point. ##Unvote ##FoS: Kush I felt like this was a strange reaction, and a somewhat bad explanation. I especially thought that the point about "everybody believes his weak as shit explanation" seemed strange because it seemed to me that only a few people had said that, and since those people might as well have been mafia I thought the reasoning for unvoting was weak. Then he goes on to FoS Alsn. This flipflopping made me uncertain of his motives, so I decided to try to make my "case" on him. The case itself has been discussed already. I'll address a few things: + Show Spoiler + "Maybe this was all intentional. Suppose he suddenly remembered that game. He might not have wanted people to look at those games earlier, but now he realized that if he posted them he would be able to establish a town read on himself." I was going to write maybe instead of suppose, but just then I remembered that indecisiveness isn't good for town. I see now that I went overboard with that paragraph, and should probably have dropped it altogether. + Show Spoiler + If Kush hadn't made that slip, I think the derailing argument would have looked strong. Now it doesn't look so strong, because we've actually gotten new information. I'm not saying that I'm sure the scum slip is an actual slip, but if it is and it results in a succesful lynch, I think town got very lucky. Scum usually wouldn't slip in such an obvious manner. When I say town would be lucky, I meant that we would be lucky that Kush made such a huge slip. It seems now that Darth did a very good job at exploiting Kush's tendencies, so it's hardly luck alone that led to a successful lynch. While writing the post, I was starting to get tired. It was getting late and it had been a long day. Instead of finishing analyzing Darth's filter, I decided to stop. I did feel the pressure to post something after my comment to Remedy, and I thought: "Fuck it. Newbies were encouraged to post, so I'll just post what I have and see what feedback I get." Voting: + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 21:59 corrosion wrote: Let me just state the reasons that my vote is on Kush right now: 1) I think his explanation of the slip was poor. If he had given a good explanation, I might have believed him. 2) I've been thinking about who would benefit if the result is a no-lynch. I'm thinking mafia is likely to benefit the most from a no-lynch. Right now, I think that there's more than a 25 % chance that Kush is scum. Therefore, I'm voting for him. I'm not sure if any of these points are original. I'm having trouble keeping up with the thread, because I tend to get hanged up in details. I've already explained my first point. The second point was poorly worded. Here's my thought process: I was thinking about the majority lynch, since I hadn't watched any games with this mechanism before. My thinking was that there was a reasonable chance that Kush was mafia so even if I had reason to vote on another person that I found even scummier, the wagon on that person could lead to a no-lynch. I was also unsure how the missing vote from Lesrah would factor into this. If someone needs 7 of 11 active votes to get lynched, the chance of a no-lynch would be rather big. I guess I could have asked about this, but I was unsure how that question would be interpreted. The reason I state that I think mafia would benefit from a no-lynch and my mention of 25 %, was that I was thinking that it would be a lot worse for mafia to lose a power role(a possible outcome) than for town to lose a vanilla. Kush hadn't made any attempt at claiming a blue role. 25 % is the percentage of mafia in this setup if I read correctly. This doesn't take into account my own alignment, but I figured that my earlier theory of power roles would compensate for that. I'm estimating that I was actually around 50 % certain that Kush was scum at this point in time. Here are some references of early posts regarding postin: + Show Spoiler + On September 28 2012 07:41 Stutters695 wrote: Agreed but, regrettably, there isn't really anything else to talk about this early. To second his point about townies being active, don't get intimidated if you aren't really sure how to make a case and stop posting. Long cases aren't the only way to catch scum so if you feel overwhelmed sick around and ask questions. Demand answers for things you find wrong. Even if it doesn't directly catch a scum it provides insight into both you and the person you question. Silence allows the scum to hide very easily without having to do anything. Here, Sonic and Stutters advice newbies to post. On September 28 2012 11:34 debears wrote: @Darthpunk Do you have links to all your previous games? I see validity in your points. However, I need to see how you've played before. You are coming off really strong really early. and @Kush Tunneling does not mean only looking at the people under pressure. It means that we should only post cases with substance at that point. Someone going off tangent on some stupid duck hunt with no reason and distracting the attention of the town is bad at that point. If you do feel suspicious of someone but don't have a good case, just keep it on word and save it for when evidence does come out. Here, Debears advices against posting cases that are weak ("at that point" refers to the second half of D1). So maybe I didn't pay enough attention on Debears' advice, and just thought about Stutter's post. Interestingly, this is the same post that Debears made that I overlooked when making my "previous game history" argument against Darth. Whew. I'm gonna take a little break. Psssht (Tychus quote) | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
On September 29 2012 01:55 debears wrote: @Djoref Please pm marv for help. The coaches are great I know this point not new and debears has already addressed it but I would like to point out the way he addressed it. First this slip might not be as evident as Kush's one but it is one nevertheless. The same way kush knew Darth was town, debears also know I'm town is because he is mafia ! For the people suspecting me, please consider this post written by a town Djodref ^^ Debears didn't write "Get some help from the coaches !", he wrote me to get help from the town coach because he knows I am town. Now please have a look on how he answered me when Omniscient asked him about it + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 03:28 debears wrote: @Omniscient No. I am trying to help a newbie get into the swing of things. Last game, there was a large portion of lurkers, and it destroyed the game atmosphere. If he gets help and posts more quality, we have a much better read on him. He denies it right away and gives a town motivation for his post. But then he starts talking about lurkers. I think lurkers and newbies are two different things and he was trying to divert everybody with this line. After that I give my guess on a kush/debears/corrosion scumteam and call him a scum by association in the light of Z-BosoN case against him. Here is his answer to my post. By the way, I asked him at this time what was his read on me but I should have ask directly "how do you know I am town?" + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 15:21 debears wrote: @djo What parts of his case specifically do you believe? His main case against me is contradiction. Look at my case against thrawn in the last game. What was the main point of that argument? Inconsistency. Its an easy point for scum to point out. There are two possibilities for kushvin my eyes 1) a mafiab tryingbto pity his way out off a lynch 2) a townie acting likeva total noob with accusations against him. Which has less assumptions? Number 1. My problen with the scum by associstion is the case that i was defendung kush earky on. That us false i was trying ti communicate ti darth that his reasoning wad based off such a strong s assumption early in the game. In fact, I'd say that z-bosons case against me is the same. He looks at the mafia side only, which to me is a indicator of mafia. I can't make a case dur to drinking and being on my phone. My read in you is that you are sheeping onto cases. I don't like it because i did the same. Why do you think i would refer you to a coach? What are the townie and mafia motivations behind it. @z-boson The same question stated the line above refers to you He doesn't want to give a clear answer on his read about me. What does it mean that I'm sheeping onto cases ? I think it was too dangerous for him to pronounce himself about my alignment due to his previous slip. I asked him why he directed me to marv and answer by a question because he cannot afford to be transparent on this subject. I would like to add one more thing but it's non-related to the scumslip. [QUOTE]On September 29 2012 13:47 debears wrote: @darthpunk Currently, you should know one of my suspects based on a heated discussion btw him and me. The other i am waiting for a few more posts to give him a fair opportunity. The second one is a wildcard. Tomorrow i will build a casebfor him when I'm at my computer and in a better ba situation to make a suitable case In this post, he promises a case which has never come. I don't think it's big but it adds up. Also he is basically OMGUSing Z-BosoN while defending himself from his case. Conclusion I'm also for a debears lynch for tomorrow | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
Here is a post where our great mafia player Kush defends debears from to case of Z-BosoN + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 05:46 kushm4sta wrote: Hi z bozon. Inconsistencies do not make someone scum. Also it's quite funny how you are so certain this early in the game. To summarize this awesome post: your case is not strong. you are overconfident in your scumread. This one speaks for itself. I believe Kush was still trying to play seriously at this time and tried to defend his scummate. But here are also these two horrible posts On September 29 2012 07:44 kushm4sta wrote: debears I saved you bro...scumteam 4 lyfe He did this one no so much after voting for himself so I guess he was in full troll mode at this point. He was still attacking Z-BosoN on his "stupid" case. I think he purely gamethrew by seeing two scums nailed so fast in this game. On September 29 2012 12:14 kushm4sta wrote: debears hf you are dying next. And this one just before admitting he was scum. Given kush character, I could imagine him giving his scum partner like this. I'll be sad if it turns out to be true they are just to much elements pointing into this direction. | ||
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Alsn
Sweden995 Posts
So with that out of the way, expect a big post from me sometime during the evening. | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
His case against Darth was poor but newbies have a lot of pressure to build original cases to establish their townieness. So I can see town motivation for it. He also admitted that the case could have been weak. Also he defended himself in an honest and clear way. So I understand now why people attacking him can be seen as suspicious. So far I know that debears and me have been on him. I think now that debears was hoping to push a mislynch on corrosion. unFoS: corrosion | ||
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corrosion
Norway29 Posts
I also think Remedy made good points: + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 23:15 RemedySC wrote: I'm sorry, but I don't believe these are reasons a town would choose to make a vote. So the scum slip itself doesn't give you good reason to vote for him, but his poor defense does? A mafia making a scum slip could have the best explanation in the world. That doesn't exonerate them. So your second reason isn't even something that Kush has done. Wouldn't you also say that mafia would benefit from a mis-lynch more than from a no-lynch? Could you elaborate more on the bolded part, because you give no explanation as to how a mafia would benefit more from a no-lynch. You would think a town would want to be more than 25% sure the person they are voting for is scum. You don't even have any cases made against kush. No questions asked. Very vague reasons given... This looks like good scum-hunting to me. Well done. It's kinda strange that nobody followed this up better, though. SDM asked for a clarification on something I wrote. That's ok. I think the other responses I've gotten are more unclear and not to the point. I'll try to look into what intentions could be behind those posts. | ||
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Omniscient4983
United States32 Posts
On September 30 2012 23:46 Djodref wrote: Debears didn't write "Get some help from the coaches !", he wrote me to get help from the town coach because he knows I am town. Now please have a look on how he answered me when Omniscient asked him about it + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 03:28 debears wrote: @Omniscient No. I am trying to help a newbie get into the swing of things. Last game, there was a large portion of lurkers, and it destroyed the game atmosphere. If he gets help and posts more quality, we have a much better read on him. He denies it right away and gives a town motivation for his post. But then he starts talking about lurkers. I think lurkers and newbies are two different things and he was trying to divert everybody with this line. Thank you for pointing this out. When I asked him about it at first, I didn't think much of it. But now that I look at his response, it seems to inherently dodge the question; no mention of why Marv specifically. Also, don't write stuff like this: On September 30 2012 23:46 Djodref wrote: For the people suspecting me, please consider this post written by a town Djodref ^^ By flaunting yourself as town, you make yourself look suspicious. And for those that have scumreads on you, that can only provide a point for them. | ||
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debears
United States2516 Posts
Read my posts. The second case I had planned was against SDM. However, SDM's posts have been well thought out with good reasoning. It would be useless and stupid to post a case based only on meta from last game. @Darth Seeing as the main part of the case against me is my "soft defend of kush" (actually telling you to chill out on it), I would like to explain my reasoning for telling you so d1. I asked for your previous games to examine your meta. A few things stuck out on me. On September 28 2012 11:41 DarthPunk wrote: My previous games. NMM XXII Godfather NMM XXIV Cop TL Mafia LVII Roleblocker NMM XXII - Godfather Here you gave an early FOS against Mordanis as godfather From that point on, you tunnel him pretty hard (you threw out some other accusations but nothing big) Here you send a vote for Mordanis, the first vote on him. I found it similar to the pattern with kush at the time. NMM LVII - Roleblocker In this game, you jump on Mattchew early. Pretty much all your posts revolve around him You weren't anywhere near voting him first, but your early tunnel of him was alarming. This one wasn't as similar, but still made me a little wary to trust you. However, 2 things made me think you could also be town. In your two mafia games, you hardly used red text. (I think once per game both games only on one word). In your game as cop, you used the red text a bit more than you did as mafia. One post had a bit of red around pg 4 of your filter. Also, your post quality in this game was an improvement over your other games as mafia. Thus, I was confused for most of day 1 about you. I wasn't willing to condemn kush based on how you attacked him. However, once kush imploded, it became apparent to me that he was, at the very least, a lost cause, at most scum. | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On September 30 2012 22:05 DarthPunk wrote: OK. So here are my top scum reads in order. Debears. His flip-flopping around the kush lynch FoS'ing kush then soft defending him and trying to downplay the lynch after that are cause for concern. I am almost sure that he is scum. And he should be the next lynch candidate. Please reference the excellent case on him made by Z - Boson. Djodref. More flip flopping around the kush lynch. He was far far FAR to ready to believe kushes weak as anythign explanation for his slip. Something which all the candidates on my list have in common. The thing that really gets me though are the following. I accepted kush's explanations because it was unbelievable for me to nail a scum by a scumslip this early in the game. If you look at my filter, you can see that I was believing that we were going to mislynch on day 1. So I had a confirmation bias (I wanted kush to be town so I was ready to buy anything) and wanted to avoid a mislynch. Very bad play from my part... Twice asking for a read on himself. This is something that I have the impulse to do as scum. (i don;t do it, but I would love to) If you are not being talked about you have no idea if what you are doing is working well. I.E. If you are behaving scummy or not. Probably not anything. But something that struck me as odd. I only asked debears about a read on myself. It was related to his scumslip. I wanted him to push him into slipping more by forcing him to say that I was town without any good explanations. That's why I asked him a clear read on myself, which he didn't give by the way. The second time he admits having a null read on me. Anyway I should have been more confident and asked him how he knew I was town Trying to take credit twice from the kush lynch. Despite being wishy-washy at best and soft defending him at worst. As I have said earlier. Town cred is exactly what you want from a bus. And here is an already scummy player, who has not really scum hunted been incredibly wishy-washy etc. wanting town cred from a lynch he not only did not push but opposed and soft defended. I've realized so far that my play is bad. But I want town to win and I want to have a part in this. So I'm proud of the little help I could give. It's true that I'm not the root cause for kush's slip but I think I provoked it somehow. Also I know it's better to establish my alignment by posting original cases. I failed at it for the moment but I'm going to improve. So my motivation is just to show people what makes me town. At least I try to be transparent in my actions. If you look at my backflip just after, I knew it would look weird but a lot of stuff happened in the thread while I was afk. So I quoted myself for it to be visible for everyone. And his vote post was a 180 degree backflip if I have ever seen one. Also there is a progression in his posting from kush may be town. To kush may be red to kush IS red. With no addition to the case or explanation. He [b]knows kush is going to flip red. Before the flip. And his previous posts were not even close to this sure. In fact. He was inclined to believe kush's weak excuses. He said maybe and might. Also read SDM's case on him. Third is Alsn. Soft defending Debears. Desperately trying to stop the kush lynch as hard as he could. Employer of WIFOM. Honestly Just look at Z- Boson's case against him. Town reads I have a probable town read on Z-Boson, and SDM. In no particular order. Z - Boson is playing to his town meta from everything I have seen so far. And SDM has been very helpful and has contributed a lot. It is only day one so take this with several grains of salt. But I thought I would put it out there in case I die. Anyway. Feel free to ask me questions etc. I have stopped grinding solo q for the day. So now I am much more motivated for mafia lol. I'll be glad to answer any questions from anyone  | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
Thank you for the advice ! I think my wording was poorly chosen. SDM, DarthPunk and maybe some other guys are now suspicious of me so I wanted these guys to look at this particular post while considering the possibility than I was town rather than the possibility that I was scum. In fact, this is what I did by checking the filter of corrosion. I read his twice with the two following assumptions :
His filter makes more sense with the second option, especially when I look at his latest posts. So I have a mild town-read on him. SDM and Darth are for me almost confirmed townies so I feel bad to have them both suspecting me. @debears Regarding my case on you, could you make some comments about your scumslip rather than the part where I was wrong ? Also why do you think kush made these stupid posts about you ? Why was he defending you ? | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On September 30 2012 20:29 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: After last night's post I've decide the lurker I found most suspicious is suspicious enough to call out. So far I've seen zero scum hunting from Djo. The best attempts I see are these two: + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 13:17 Djodref wrote: Hey, guys ! I would like to bring up something that struck me in the post of corrosion about Darth. I didn't like this post in general because it didn't match my interpretations of the early events between Kush and Darth but I understand that our views can differ. But looking back at corrosion filter, he's trying to find scummy motivation for Darth to give his links to his previous game. Check the bolded part in the spoiler. + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 04:29 corrosion wrote: I'm just going to address the "fight" between Darth and Kush. I'm going to focus on Darth for now. Looking more closely into Kush's contribution is something I think should be done well ahead of lynch time. I'm actually going to start by telling about some thoughts I had after reading my role PM. I was trying to figure out what players town should be focusing on. I had obsed NMMXXVII, and came to the conclusion that it might be reasonable to go after any player except Kush. I figured that Kush was going to make a lot of posts anyway, so I was thinking that we could get a good analysis of him without any early pressure. One of the first things Darth did was to antagonize Kush: + Show Spoiler + On September 28 2012 08:34 DarthPunk wrote: No it's not. It is simply a mechanism to get the discussion going and allows scum to seem to participate and to potentially mislynch an inactive townie. Any more talk of policy will get you FoS'd. I'm thinking that this could easily be an attempt to start a fight that would result in derailing the thread. Kush responded the way I expected him to, and these two posters exchanged arguments back and forth. In the middle of this, Darth made a remark against lurkers, but quickly changed his focus back on Kush. I don't see why he should make this comment at this time, since it wasn't going to get looked at while there was a fight going on. Shortly afterwards, Kush makes his supposed scum slip. Darth jumps on it, and shortly afterwards he posts about his previous mafia games. I've watched the game where he played cop, and seen that he and Shady argued a lot on D1. So I was thinking that this seems to be Darth's town meta. But I also asked myself why he did post about his previous games at this point in time. Maybe this was all intentional. Suppose he suddenly remembered that game. He might not have wanted people to look at those games earlier, but now he realized that if he posted them he would be able to establish a town read on himself. I'm not sure if this is a strong case against Darth at the moment. I would like some input from the more experienced players here. If Kush hadn't made that slip, I think the derailing argument would have looked strong. Now it doesn't look so strong, because we've actually gotten new information. I'm not saying that I'm sure the scum slip is an actual slip, but if it is and it results in a succesful lynch, I think town got very lucky. Scum usually wouldn't slip in such an obvious manner. His cases against Debears and Alsn are something that might reveal useful information, but I've not studied them closely yet. I still think that Kush seems more suspicious when everything is taken into consideration but with all the focus that has been on him, I'm sure someone else can post a decent case on him before we need to consider our first lynch. But Darth was just answering a request from debears ! + Show Spoiler + On September 28 2012 11:39 debears wrote: As I said, I want a quick look at you first. Second, there isn't much more to add to what you said about it. It does give off the impression of extra information. I think corrosion was trying to cast scummy shadow on Darth to shift the focus on Kush. I did so by omitting/deforming some parts of the thread history. Also, he fits my definition of a semi-lurker trying to blend in. So, corrosion, until I got your explanations about this point, I got my eyes on you. ##FoS: corrosion Here he brings up a point that had been brought up by Darth already, basically adding nothing on your own. I realized that afterwards but I was looking into the corrosion's filter so I missed Darth point about it. That's why I'm now totally believing corrosion defense about it. We have made the same kind of mistake... + Show Spoiler + On September 29 2012 16:19 Djodref wrote: Also I don't understand you stances on my alignment. After your first case on me, I thought you were suspicious of me. Later on, you recommend me to pm marv for help. You certainly know that marv is the town coach. So did you just let go your suspicions and consider me as town newbie ? Your town motivation would be to help a fellow citizen but in this case why do you think I'm town ? Your mafia motivation would be budding me and show pro-town behavior (unfortunately while slipping). And I would like you to answer my questions clearly in the future and not throwing me a question back. Again, this is a completely ripping off an earlier argument by Boson, adding nothing new. Aside from those two attempts, he's keeping his post count relatively high while not posting anything of value. So yeah, I've encouraged newbies to post, but this is exactly what I call posting for the sake of posting. Adding nothing new and just getting along, and that's scummy. Further... This is not the first time you're trying to give yourself townie points for asking a question to Kush. Last time it was more thinly veiled but it still caught my attention: Asking Kush the question doesn't give you townie points. The thing with a scum slip is that it's obviously something which happens unintentionally, so if you were both scum it obviously wasn't planned anyway (or at least highly unlikely to have been). To be fair he did at least engage in the discussion, which can be seen as scum hunting, but not until Darth had aggresively called out Kush. What follows is this: It's one of the only thing I'm happy with my play until now except from my last case on debears. I wished it could give me town credit rather than looking suspicious But I totally get your pointCasting doubts on Darth's suspicion, downplaying it as a flame war. Even if Darth would be able to flame Kush as scum (he probably would), it's not the focus here, there are actually good arguments supporting the accusations. Actually I was really shocked by his absolute certitude about kush. As I already said, I wasn't confident at all early game and I couldn't not imagine a townie to be so sure of himself. I made the parallel with his play and flaming as roleblocker in his last game because of the confidence he showed also during the flaming. Here he is keeping his options open, which is a convenient strategy in a pressured situation. Then actually buying into Kush's silly explanation: Finally jumping the wagon with weak reasoning (later claiming my post helped pursaude him): When I woke up and looked at the thread it was then clear that kush was mafia. I did a poor job at explaining myself at the time but it's true that your post convinced me of the reality of the slip. I thank you for that I realize this can be the result of him being a total newbie, but his posts are really unconvincing and worthy of suspicion. It pains me a little but this is exactly the result of me being a total newbie. I know I'm using this excuse way to much so I'll be posting cases from now on. Please let me improve ^^ ##FOS: Djodref | ||
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debears
United States2516 Posts
If you would actually read through my posts, most of your questions are answered. There are 3 parts that are inherently wrong because you aren't reading my posts. Instead, you feel like accusing me about points that I have already addressed. Wrong 1) The second case thing Wrong 2) Why the pm marv post. "1) If you looked at my posts after my “PM marv for help” post, I believe corrosion instantly assumed that I confirmed him town. That is not true at all. Notice A) Djo is a noob and B) I said COACHES. The word townie was never said in the sentence. You guys are putting words in my mouth. Also, note how in one of Djo’s prior posts, he says he was going to go look at guides. I don’t understand why you guys are so eager to jump on someone trying to help a newbie. Yet again, townie motivation: If Djo is town, it will greatly help us if he gets help. Even if he isn't, it will raise the quality of this NEWBIE game and help us all improve if he gets help." 3) "He doesn't want to give a clear answer on his read about me. What does it mean that I'm sheeping onto cases ? I think it was too dangerous for him to pronounce himself about my alignment due to his previous slip. I asked him why he directed me to marv and answer by a question because he cannot afford to be transparent on this subject." I gave a clear answer on you On September 30 2012 00:06 debears wrote: [/list][/list]null right now. Just was working on Boson. Will look into you more though  Sheeping means you jump on cases without making your own reasons. I have been pretty straightforward on answering these questions. Alright, now for an interesting point that you brought up. "He denies it right away and gives a town motivation for his post. But then he starts talking about lurkers. I think lurkers and newbies are two different things and he was trying to divert everybody with this line." Ask Remedy about this. On September 28 2012 06:40 RemedySC wrote: Hey, About me This is my second newbie game. In the first game I had a good read on Kush, but I didn't post enough, or have the amount of content needed in a post to get him lynched. This time though, if I have a good read that some one is scum, they are going down. Lurker Policy Well, like in the previous game, I think that a pure lurker lynch policy will end up hurting town and benefiting mafia as the game progresses. If we have no reasonable scum lead by the end of the day, then I think town hasn't been trying hard enough. So think fucking positive, we will find them! Last game, he lurked and got the axe for it. He says he had a case but couldn't get the content he needed. Hapa said only thrawn got help from him last game. So, if guys like remedy had gotten help last game, what could the difference have been? The same applies for this game. Anyone who is a nooby should get help. It increases the quality of the game and allows everyone to have an actual read on you. | ||
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Alsn
Sweden995 Posts
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
Well I would disagree about sheeping. Nobody so far has pointed out the defense you got from kush and the posts where he implies that you are his scumbuddy. So why do you think kush was defending you ? @everyone Before going to bed, I would like to state that my guess for the scumteam is now debears/alsn. I think Z-BosoN has the right of it. I'm asking for a vig shot on debears ! Also Remedy is too much of a lurker. I don't think we are going to encounter lylo or mylo situations in this game but I hope that we can get something of him before this... | ||
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Omniscient4983
United States32 Posts
On October 01 2012 01:29 Djodref wrote: In fact, this is what I did by checking the filter of corrosion. I read his twice with the two following assumptions :
His filter makes more sense with the second option, especially when I look at his latest posts. So I have a mild town-read on him. @Djodref That's exactly my read on him atm. He certainly seems more newbie-town than scum right now. This is why I was questioned your suspicions of him. Glad to see we can agree on this read. | ||
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Omniscient4983
United States32 Posts
On October 01 2012 02:09 Djodref wrote: Also Remedy is too much of a lurker. I don't think we are going to encounter lylo or mylo situations in this game but I hope that we can get something of him before this... This was a reason I made a post about him. Granted, the post itself wasn't on the best foundation and plagued by some misinterpretations, but it was an effort to get his input on things. You can see that he posted a large post after me, and that's it. I respect his defense, and I'm curious to hear what he thinks about the Debears situation, or the other cases made earlier on night 1. | ||
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Sonic Death Monkey
Sweden991 Posts
On my first read through of the thread, I found Alsn being generally suspicious of everything (overall a town trait) and he had been fucking up with regards to some of the information (perhaps not what I'd expect of Alsn given what I've seen of him before, but I don't find it too weird). Alsn was pretty much a null read to me. Anyway, I went back to look at Alsn's filter. In his first post, which happens around 11 hours after the start of the game, he makes a long ass post about his thoughts on Kush. This in itself might be suspicious to some people, but having played with Kush in XXVI and XXVII he was probably the one player I was thinking the most about who to handle pre-game so I don't find it too weird. In his next post, one hour later, he has read up on the thread and recognizes that Kush has been playing like he Alsn had been afraid he would. He FOS Kush but says he's not convinced. Anyway, when I said I wasn't convinced of the case, I had messed up the timeline of events. I thought Alsn's posts indirectly defending Kush happened not long before Kush completely blew up. If that was the case, I would've found it weird for Kush to blow up soon after his scum buddy showed him support. It seems now that Kush blew up at a later stage when Alsn wasn't around the thread, so that nullifies the argument I thought I had against the case. I felt it was best to put it out there because if I happen to get killed off I don't want to leave with the impression I had some well thought out objection to the Alsn case. I still need to finish reading Alsn's filter and look at the case again, but I won't have time to do it until tomorrow. | ||
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. But a big national holiday is coming this week end so I should be able to participate to the thread and finish to read all the guides.
