EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XXXIV - Page 21
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
On January 05 2013 00:19 Mocsta wrote: I am 100% sure he is town, but hes just too useless. My vote is sticking on him. If he's your 100% town read, why are you voting for him? I thought the point of the game was to vote out scum? Even if he is useless in the scumhunt, his vote is still a big asset to us. Also, who knows whether he can step up his game in the coming days? You're saying that you aren't convinced that anyone else is scum, so why not vote for a no-lynch instead of voting him off? The difference between voting for TeMiL and voting for a no-lynch right now is that if we keep TeMiL around, we still have a vote, and we can stave off a possible lylo later by one day. Is that advantage that irrelevant to throw away? I don't think so. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9387 Posts
My vote is changing; but its not to one of the usual suspects. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9387 Posts
On January 05 2013 08:00 cDgCorazon wrote: The difference between voting for TeMiL and voting for a no-lynch right now is that if we keep TeMiL around, we still have a vote, and we can stave off a possible lylo later by one day. Is that advantage that irrelevant to throw away? I don't think so. Fair point. I am changing my vote for 3 reasons. (1) I was worried about TeMiL getting modkilled anyway (2) My top scum read interacted in what I deemed a meaningful way overnight (3) Coach feedback as well.. I am stuck though for the following reasons. (1) There was a significant lack of discussion last night so I am not confident there are enough *hawkers* online to do a bandwagon (2) I dont want to build association cases, but I have a read on 2 players, and they happened to interact overnight subtley. My prime target is not a suspect, whereas the association who i would rather not target, is a suspect for others. I do not know which has a higher chance of people agreeing with me. & (3) Spag.. hes really making life hard for me. If I wasnt so set on my top scum read, I would love to push Spag regardless (like TeMiL).. his contributions are full of white-knighting, full of contradictions, full of copy/paste jobs. I know he wants to be the medic to my marine [not a soft claim.. its a joke to spag from newbie 33], but his behaviour is pinging my scum radar A Lot.. Essentially to me his actions have a town explanation, but how he goes about it, is to me, quite scummy. | ||
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StriX
Australia42 Posts
I just have one simple question. Don't you think it's interesting OmniEulogy bandwagons twice? (first on zarepath then on myself) I'll attempt to find some proof because didn't really suspect him until now. | ||
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OmniEulogy
Canada6590 Posts
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StriX
Australia42 Posts
Not happening in this case but I felt it a bit with zarepath originally. It's very tactical to 'voteblock'. That is vote someone before they vote you and then claim they are trying to OMGUS you. | ||
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OmniEulogy
Canada6590 Posts
On January 05 2013 08:14 StriX wrote: sorry time is of the essence so I can't really post the long analysis you guys keep hyping me for. I just have one simple question. Don't you think it's interesting OmniEulogy bandwagons twice? (first on zarepath then on myself) I'll attempt to find some proof because didn't really suspect him until now. doesn't sound like an OMGUS? "I didn't suspect anything and haven't had any proof to support that he's scum but now that he's made a case on me and voted for me TIME TO HUNT" for the first time this game I might add. I guess its good that something finally pushed you to contribute. It's unfortunate that it's you being up for a lynch. I welcome your case on me by the way. I am town, so the sooner you make your case the sooner I can tear it apart. You can spin what you meant by "it was a ploy" all you want now. It's become a matter of opinion and as I believe you to be scum, your opinion on what you yourself wrote doesn't change the fact that you stopped pressuring him. | ||
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StriX
Australia42 Posts
hardgamehardlife. ##Vote jampidampi | ||
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StriX
Australia42 Posts
at risk of adding more fuel to the fire. Will you vote for jampidampi if I die VT? I would have been suspicious if you bandwagon'd anyone. | ||
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Sylencia
Australia1057 Posts
On January 05 2013 03:42 Spaghetticus wrote: As above, but @Sylencia You're being just responsive enough to fly under the radar. I can't see much that you've contributed pertaining to the outcome of this game, you've responded when prompted which suggests that while you are wanting to appear active, you aren't actually doing any of the background research that leads to OC or cases. This is scummy. As I said to Strix, show me some original content you have contributed, or even better, present some you've been holding back. Wait, I've been trying to present cases for my votes, and that's going under the radar? | ||
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OmniEulogy
Canada6590 Posts
On January 05 2013 08:52 StriX wrote: @OmniEulogy at risk of adding more fuel to the fire. Will you vote for jampidampi if I die VT? I would have been suspicious if you bandwagon'd anyone. I'm not sure honestly. I think I'd look at him again for sure, but the N1 kill and how D2 goes would influence my vote far more than who started the lynch in this case. especially as we have 3 choices currently. | ||
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
TeMiL (3): Spaghetticus, Mocsta, zarepath StriX (2): jampidampi, OmniEulogy jampidampi (3): Sylencia, cDgCorazon, StriX Not voting (1): TeMiL Currently, TeMiL is set to be lynched! ~1 hour until deadline. Just as a reminder, day 1 deadline will be at 01:00 GMT (+00:00), because of the performed YOLO. Vote plz. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9387 Posts
Omni, my vote is going to you. I only have 50min left before I have to go, and I will not be available for the lynch deadline. Because I can't be here, I am not going to make a huge case, I am going to point out what I think are anomalies in your play. If town agrees, they can share their vote with me. If you dispute them successfully, my vote will be the only one that remains, and you will not be lynched. I hope that makes up for my lack of presence. Apologies, I was not even meant to online at this time in the first place. Omni has approximately 30 posts. I have chosen to pass through 9 key posts. Maybe some in general read null. But if you take all the 9 posts as a sum of contributions.. the result is zilch. Its all fluff revolving around policy, and copy/paste <insert participant post>. This screams of scum play to me, and if you are not voting Omni, you better have a damn good reason not to. I am just going to do a quick analysis of your significant filter posts. + Show Spoiler + On January 03 2013 10:37 OmniEulogy wrote: Whoa didn't expect it to start tonight. I'm extremely tired guys and I was about to go to sleep till I saw the PM. I'll catch up tomorrow when I wake up x.x Quickly though - for those of you who played with me last game my views stay the same for Policy lynches. We shouldn't lynch the lurkers D1 just because they aren't active, we need to actively scum hunt and push our top scum reads. I WILL lynch liars though. Townies don't need to lie in this game. That's all I've got to say about that  I'm looking forward to this getting going!(1) Policy talk from all is typically meaningless fluff at the start. You say you will actively scum hunt.. but what have you contributed actively? A vote on zarepath.. because he votes no-lynch early game. that is not active scum hunting. That is prejudice. I can vote 100 people between now and deadline. its the vote at deadline that matters. First sign you need to step up your game.. the question is whether town or scum motivation. To me, I take this 50/50. So null read. + Show Spoiler + On January 04 2013 03:18 OmniEulogy wrote: So a bit late but I'm (GMT-5:00) Eastern Time. I went to bed much earlier than normal though as I'd been up for almost 48 hours. First things first. Spag has already said he's changing his style from his last game because it got him lynched D1. He's also right that I bandwagoned last game instead of sticking on Cora who was my strongest scum read D1 and ended up getting him lynched. I'm going to try and avoid that kind of play this game. Spag your questions and calling them laziness doesn't really fly considering how you played last game however I don't really see it as being scummy. Your posts seem good so far and I agree we should try to pressure lurkers but just like XXXIII I don't think we should lynch a lurker D1 unless there is absolutely no other option. That being said ##FoS: Zerepath The no-lynch is a scummy trait. As this is one of your first games on TL I'm not reading too far into it but it is not a townie mind set at all. You make a good reason for having a no-lynch but again... that is NOT a townie mindset. It's a reason for scum to slip through us and kill somebody N1 while knowing they only have to play it safe and just have to vote no-lynch or join the only wagon. Very hard to find scum like that. @Mocsta I think Spag seems slightly more suspicious based on his change of play styles but we all knew he would be doing it so I'm trying not to judge him based on that. What I find more incriminating on him so far is that he says he is lazy when he was very active and making larger posts D1 with no mention (I believe) of being lazy. I think your play looks almost identical to your town play last game Mocsta so I'll give you a weak town read for the moment. The only difference is that Aqua is not here this game so you had to vote yourself, I believe this is also not a move scum would make so early into the game so you've cleared yourself of my suspicion unless you make some posts that make me seriously ask myself WTF. @Sylencia the chances of lynching scum D1 are indeed very low and I believe that is what Spag was saying. The fact that we almost had one last game should be forgotten because if we DO lynch Scum D1 it means they screwed up and the amount of information we would get would be MASSIVE. example: if we lynched Cora D1 last game we would have had FC lined up and ready for D2. 2/3 scum gone in 2 days. While I hope something like this happens we need to scum hunt to get it done. @Zarepath I'd like to know your thoughts behind how I explained a no-lynch to hurt town and what you think of Mocsta's aggressive behavior so far in the game in leading discussions. (2) This post is complete fluff. You have a prejudice justification for FoS (zarepath).. the rest is some fluff about policy and other players. Do you remember easy things for scum to do are talking about policy and voting for policy reasons. Yes I voted for a lurker (TeMiL) but my justification was not "he is a lurker" I gave rationale... Omni is simply "your stance differs to mine, here is a "FoS"... sounds like someone who doesnt care who his vote goes to... wait a sec, thats a mafia motivation. Your post is pinging my radar Omni, you have been upgraded to FoS + Show Spoiler + On January 04 2013 12:32 OmniEulogy wrote: Talkative bunch. Alright... Vote: Zarepath you left us with a nice case on syl, I don't agree with most of it but it was a decent case and he responded to it very well. However you left right after ruining the chance of any immediate conversation that might have stemmed from it. Your position on a no-lynch is a factor in my vote as well, it just isn't a town mindset. Also claiming that a no-lynch vote is not even at play any more is a bad attempt to bury something that is very much a factor in how D1 plays out. Again not a town mindset. You attack Sylencia largely on ideas that promote strong town behavior like his willingness to lynch lurkers in certain situations but otherwise always going for his scum reads. Almost everything you said about him applies to yourself in terms of posting, in which he is ahead in terms of quality and quantity. ##FoS: Strix lack of everything from you so far. You are a close second to Zare. @Everybody What do you think about the case made against Syl? How do you feel about Mocsta leading discussion and his vote on Cora? How do you feel Cora responded to the vote. How has he given himself any credibility as town afterwards. (Cora please feel free to answer this one as well) And lastly in answer to asking if making a contributions list if town vs scum it could be either. We had Shz in NMM XXXIII attempt a similar thing as VT and I've watched mafia players pretend to contribute by doing the same thing in other games. The point to be made aware of is that Mocsta has also lead discussions and is not ONLY making those posts. (3) Your vote starts off as a disagreement of zarepath case to Sylencia. You then change gears and bring the justification back to policy. Sounds to me, your deadset on a bullshit reason to lynch this guy. i.e. policy dispute... The question is, are you that prejudice against LAL policy, you would pursue that as your top scum read... OR... do you vote for the policy because of your prejudice, which allows you to vote with conviction.. an important trait as mafia. I find it further curious that you make a vote, and then post a FoS.. Lets say you believe it, you know from Newbie 33 lessons learned, not to make association cases. I think this is a nice attempt to follow/start a bandwagon on StriX, and give your self a lurker bait out with StriX.. in reality at that point in time it could have been Strix, TeMiL, jampidampi; I think you randomly chose StriX. Lastly, why do you care if Cora has given himself town credibility. Typically it is scum who value their image to town. If I look at the 3 paragraphs separately I have 50/50 reads. But the sum of their parts (i.e. the flow overall) to me is scum motivation, not town. You are still pinging my scum radar Omni. + Show Spoiler + On January 04 2013 14:09 OmniEulogy wrote: At this point I'd consider voting for Strix followed by Jampi and then TeMiL in that order. I know Temil said something about work hours but I'd really like to see his thoughts on current matters before even considering to vote for him. Strix does vaguely give off that "Threesr" feeling but not even half as bad as the real thing. He's my #2 at the moment. I think we can cut down on the possibilities a bit more before anybody really needs to throw out a vote if they don't think they have a read at all. (4) Interesting, you follow up your FoS, by calling out StriX, but take no action? You then put forward 2 other lurkers. How is this active scum hunting? All you do is propose a name, but is that not an easy thing anyone can contribute? Omni again needs to step up his game. If i read this post independently it is a null read. Combined with points (1), (2),(3) I can see scum motivation. + Show Spoiler + On January 04 2013 14:26 OmniEulogy wrote: @Syl nope it's not directed to you. @Zare fair enough I know it happens. I also agree that the mafia would rather have us lynch ourselves and get an even larger advantage. It happens in most games D1 but they also tend to be the ones who say a no-lynch is fine with them early on. Ignoring that aspect of why I voted for you though because as you say its hypothetical and you did make a case on somebody else I'm going to keep my vote on you for the time being. (5) Again, more theory-craft work. What targets are you actively pressuring, and how are you aiding the scum hunt. At his point, 5 key posts and claiming you wanted to actively scum hunt..what have you contributed OmniEulogy.
Once again, all the easy things for scum to do. I think out of all the players, you are the one that has persisted with policy talk the most. Spag has mentioned his LAL attitude; but has not been as aggressive in implementing it as you have. In essence, a fluff post (once again). + Show Spoiler + On January 04 2013 14:37 OmniEulogy wrote: I'm not ignoring your contribution at all. Sylencia's defense was enough for me to keep him off my scum list for now that's all. You can make a case like that and it doesn't really put you into the spotlight at all. If we all voted for him and he flipped town THEN it would. But you yourself didn't even vote for him. How is not even voting for somebody and just calling everything they have done scummy dangerous for you in any way? It's a good way to start conversation on a target, and you got him to answer but it's not putting yourself out there in any way. (6) Ahh justification for calling out 3 lurkers.. It starts conversation.. I ask how.. All you do is say, Hi you are lurking.. There is no questions to them. There is no vote on them. There is in essence... NO CONTRIBUTION. Your posts are at this stage consistently Fluff. Please tell me I am tunneling here because its getting painful to read these posts, I have to rack my brain to think why a townie would post all this garbage? You may have a half-decent post count, but we have to extend the quality bar for you to a new scale that contains negative values... This is the point I went to bed. With all your "contributions - if i may" I had you as my top scum read (due to actively trying to participate, but not actually participating. I was going to put the pressure on you Night 1, but after your overnight posts, I have upgraded you as a higher priority than TeMiL. + Show Spoiler + On January 05 2013 04:33 OmniEulogy wrote: ##Unvote: Zarepath given the three/four pages I need to catch up in and what I have read so far I don't believe my vote should still rest on Zare for this lynch. I think he has now contributed more than several others and it would be worse for town to lose him at this moment. I think TeMiL is just really bad town so I wont be voting for him either. I'll have a longer post written up shortly. Also spag I only read your last post as writing this and I have no idea what you are talking about. I think you have this made up illusion that I have something against you because of NMM XXXIII. Get over it. You are trying to get people to think that we can't agree on anything and that our opinions will always be different. As I know I am town, I can only see it as a move to try to divide townies and get us to lose faith in each other, please stop or I'll assume its scum motivated instead of you dwelling too much on the past. (7) Interesting. The justification is quite weak to remove the vote.. He has contributed? big whoop, this is a piss poor attempt to move onto another target. You are admitting here your actual vote justification was weak, or even just sheeping. Again, how does that help town win? You never post your write-up either... I am on the thread 3-4hrs later, and its not there, what we get is a summary. Your comments to Spag are interesting as well. Overly defensive. What struck me as odd is "As I know I am town, I can only see it as a move to try and divide townies..... please stop or I'll assume scum motivation" Very odd phrasing in general. Too many town references, is just plain over compensating.. obviously being scum.. You then try to re-enforce your town, by assuming he could be playing a scum game.. I also think in general you are over-reacting to Spags filter.. its no where near as relevant as you are making it out to be. Screams of trying to make contributions again... without actually contributing. This post is not helping your cause.. still the top scum read. + Show Spoiler + On January 05 2013 05:46 OmniEulogy wrote: Alright, I'm not sure if I can get the whole thing out in under an hour so I'm going to make a summary for you Jampi so we can talk about it a bit while I continue to write up the bigger one. I'll start with the people I don't think we should vote for in this lynch. I believe Mocsta and Spag should be free of suspicion for this lynch entirely. TeMiL and StriX I believe we should wait until D2 TeMiL I think is just bad town and I don't think a vote on him is the BEST we could do. StriX says he makes long analytical posts. I'm waiting to see one. He hasn't delivered in 48 hours and I am most likely going to put my vote on him. I believe Syl is in the middle ground and responded to the case made against him really well. I have a very slight town read on Jampi. I most likely will not be voting on him unless something drastically changes. Cora hasn't called himself scum twice yet so thats a plus  he's actually been playing in my mind what a town cora would be.Please ask any questions I'm doing a larger write up right now. (8) The summary post. Classic scum trait. Easy to do, and looks like contribution. Is there any new thought in there? If you read it.. there is no original content in the post. Its simply a rehash of thoughts throughout the thread. Why are you trying to pass this off as a meaningful contribution? Curiously you throw in Jampi as a slight town read.. you have had minimal interactions with this person, and he is the prime target for several others in the thread.. and in genearl his post count is lacking... I would love a detailed explanation on this one. Are there town motivations for this post? In theory, it sounds helpful.. my problem is, its ultimately fluff, there is no new contributions, which appears to be a constant OmniEulogy theme. All of this SCREAMS scum to me. + Show Spoiler + [QUOTE]On January 05 2013 07:06 OmniEulogy wrote: My case on StriX. Why he is my top scum read. Syl gave him a very nice resume as Mocsta called it and made me look forward to what he would bring to the table to help us with his insight. However I have not seen any of it in nearly 48 hours. Perhaps a town StriX would make large posts and push strong scum reads however that is not what we have seen at all. He plays a newbie card early on and on top of that votes for TeMiL and feels that after making that his only useful(?) post he should not be grouped together with him as a lurker. + Show Spoiler + StriX Australia. January 04 2013 14:40. Posts 31 PM Profile Report Quote # filter @OmniEulogy by the way - if you reread I was the first to call out zarepath on his no-lynch so it's amusing to me that you use it as an argument then call me out for contributing nothing. @cDGCorazon I shouldn't be grouped with TeMil. He follows up when asked why he doesn't pursue Zare with this + Show Spoiler + On January 04 2013 15:27 StriX wrote: Seems to defeat the purpose - Much easier to wait for a mistake then tell someone your watching them and expect one. Not to mention you could create one self fulfilling prophecy style. He also admits that Mocsta has fed him the names for his top scum reads at that point in time. No real searching involved. We then have his take on Zare's case vs Syl and how to support/promote town play + Show Spoiler + [QUOTE]On January 04 2013 21:19 StriX wrote: oops forgot this bit On January 03 2013 22:47 StriX wrote: (2) [Mocsta] thus, how do you propose to support town play? At this point transparent observations are my strength. Aggression for me is fun and all but very often seems to lead to situations we have with Sylencia v Zarepath. He wants to lurk as town and offer no helpful information himself and use information other people gather to give his opinions. On top of this he then criticizes it when it is exactly what Syl had to do to answer Zare's case. It makes no sense considering it is exactly what he wants to watch happen. (have people question each other for information so he can make cases) The only problem with what happened was that a bandwagon did not form on a possibly innocent Syl and thus as scum he had nowhere to hitch his vote to. He also backtracks on Zare just based on the fact that he no longer things the no-lynch would be scummy without a good reason. Stating "it was a ploy" and that is all. At this point in time StriX has moved to my top scum read and therefore I am voting for him. ##Vote: StriX (9) The vote on StriX. Starts off copy/pasting my comments. Goes back into policy lynch talking.. Seriosly Omni... future games you roll as town, you need to let it go man.... Justification regarding StriX->zarepath is weak, but passable as a town motivation. Then finishes off with more policy talk. I assumed he realised the justification for the vote was weak, so decided to spruce it up with some policy justification. Weak overall, and lacking conviction.. Wait a sec, didnt my guide on scum hunting, suggest we don't call out early town reads, because mafia can easily do it because they arent lying... whereas, its hard for mafia to build a detailed case, because naturally they have to lie (to vote a townie)... hmmmm its coming to gether. SCREAMING SCUM! Omni has approximately 30 posts. I have chosen to pass through 9 key posts. Maybe some in general read null. But if you take all the 9 posts as a sum of contributions.. the result is zilch. Its all fluff revolving around policy, and copy/paste <insert participant post>. This screams of scum play to me, and if you are not voting Omni, you better have a damn good reason not to. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9387 Posts
##Unvote:TeMiL ##Vote: OmniEulogy Sorry mod. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9387 Posts
On January 05 2013 08:52 StriX wrote: @OmniEulogy at risk of adding more fuel to the fire. Will you vote for jampidampi if I die VT? I would have been suspicious if you bandwagon'd anyone. He cant.. read this post..+ Show Spoiler + On January 05 2013 05:46 OmniEulogy wrote: ... I have a very slight town read on Jampi. I most likely will not be voting on him unless something drastically changes. . he thinks Jampi is (slight)town read LOL | ||
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Corazon
United States3230 Posts
I'm not saying you are wrong (I need to read it over again, it's so long that it is making my head hurt), but why this timing? | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
##Vote: OmniEulogy | ||
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Spaghetticus
Australia451 Posts
##vote:Strix | ||
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Sylencia
Australia1057 Posts
On January 05 2013 09:12 cDgCorazon wrote: Moc, why are you giving this to us an hour before the vote? Why not give this out after the lynch D1, instead of creating more confusion right around the deadline? I'm not saying you are wrong (I need to read it over again, it's so long that it is making my head hurt), but why this timing? To add on to this, since I suspected this move would be pulled, doesn't this go against what you said/agreed with? On January 04 2013 22:54 Mocsta wrote: Lastly, if you do build a case against anyone.. please take Sylencia advice, and try to post at least 4 hrs (preferably 8hrs) before lynch deadline. People should have an opportunity to defend themselves. You've posted a big case, it's compelling on first read since I only skim read it first, but you're really not giving too much time for Omni to defend against all these points. | ||
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