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Wow, amazing. Can't see myself utlizing it, but maybe I can slowly incorporate it into my muscle memory.
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Ok, I misunderstood the targeting method. Would be much easier to have it as C along with creep spread.
Let's pray this never falls into Terran hands.
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On May 11 2013 10:02 Kaitlin wrote:
Thread worthy ???
More than 99,9% of the threads on TL.
I actually learnt a really usefull tip, and I think I'm not the only one (binding C to 2 differents things is a crazy idea but it works :D)
Edit : Could it works with warp-in too ? The space bar yes, the shared control I think you need to choose and unit (zealot probably  )
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Not sure how long you've been doing this for, but... we beat this to death on the Fleet Keys/TheCore forums (very recently). I actually brought this to light about a week ago, as a workaround for the mouse wheel nerfing and a way to optimize Injects in my hotkey layouts. I already have this implemented, but I'm not sure if JaK decided on it yet for TheCore. There are many great uses for this; we just didn't feel it was necessary to start a thread on it. The info here was written off-the-cuff mind you, but it covers most of what you'd be looking to add to this thread.
On May 01 2013 23:21 eneyeseekay wrote:Details regarding the new change to be added to all versions of Fleet keys for the big overhaul. Rapidfire FeatureI did extensive testing last night with this feature and here's what I've determined, summed up by race, in a unit-by-unit list:[list] PROTOSS+ Show Spoiler +- Warpgates. When used with the rapidfire feature, they adhere to the same limitations that other races experience when using a keyboard's repeat rate for queuing/morphing. Warping in units in the mid and late game can be done very quickly depending on the amount of Warpgates you own. The big limitation is that if you plan on warping in different types of units using the rapidfire feature, there will be a short delay between queuing different units, so it's not not usable in every Warp-in situation and hard to actually abuse in any meaningful way. Warping in one unit off of many gates is sped up dramatically though, so that's pretty cool!
I feel that this is actually fair. This levels the playing field for late game Protoss players who chose gateway-heavy compositions, and reduces needless repetition tied to a mechanic that is supposed to facilitate the concept of "instant reinforcement". It allows you to operate in some ways similar to that of Zerg production because of the benefits of repeat rate and repeat delays, but again, is limited to different producing multiple unit types because of repeat delay.
- Nexus. Chronoboosting a lot of things at once becomes much quicker, but if you're keeping up with your macro, there's no immediate benefit gained from the rapidfire feature. A great way to dump Chrono energy. Watch out for Chornoboosting the same structure though, as you'll just waste energy that way.
- High Templar. Feedback. This spell really shines with the rapidfire feature. You can cast it quick, but relatively uncontrollably (much like ITs). Follows the same rules as Snipe though, in that you need a lot of HT's to make super-effective use of the rapidfire feature. Psi Storm remains a surgical spell in that you can't afford to waste them, so it remains mostly unaffected by the rapidfire feature. Morphing Archons remains the same, as its an ability that already reaps the benefits of your keyboard's repeat rate.
- Phoenix. Graviton Beam. You can have some fun with this without breaking anything in the game. You can spam the spell, and lift up many things. Watch out with this, as you won't be able to shoot anything if all of your Phoenixes are busy lifting unless you've got some other air-attacking support handy.
- Oracle. Doesn't benefit from the rapidfire feature much or at all. Nothing to really note here.
- Sentry. This unit doesn't really benefit too much from the rapidfire feature. Forcefields. You want to be surgical with them and spamming the spell is a good way to waste energy and lose the game. Hallucination. This is about the only good application of rapid fire for this unit, so that's good, as Sentries are already extremely powerful. Guardian Shield isn't relevant at all in this case.
- Orbital Commands. MULES can be rapidly called down, but you need a lot of energy and orbitals to really make great use of this. Still, it's cute if you want to dump energy when falling behind on macro, but won't affect a player who has solid macro. Calling down depots won't benefit much from the rapidfire feature. Scans can be spammed, but there's no reason to ever spam Scans due to wasteful casting past the first Scan, so that remains the same.
- Ghosts. When they are in excess numbers (at least 15-20, with near-full energy), the infamous Snipe exploit claws its way out of nerfing hell a bit. An unlikely situation, but still, a small possibility that isn't exactly realistic within the realm of standard play. EMP doesn't really benefit much from this (although the option is there to spam it), nor does Nuke.
- Raven. Seeker Missile. In large numbers, they can benefit greatly from the rapidfire feature, provided that you actually need to send mass amounts of Seeker Missiles at the enemy. The potential to waste energy is still very much present, and aiming is tough, so that's fair. Autoturrets can be deployed faster, but they behave like structures, so you must be careful in your casting or you'll hit a lot of placement conflicts and only some will actually deploy. There's some skill involved there, with potential gain, so I like that. PDD's can be deployed faster, but treat them like Forcefields in that you don't want to spam them too much or at all.
- Battlecruisers. Yamato Cannon can be spammed to pretty good effect, so it's applicable and useful in a situation where you're looking to dump a ton of Yamato rounds into an opponent's army. Not a highly likely situation to be in, and only really appears when the game has gone on for far too long anyway. There's a lot of potential for overkill when using Yamato Cannon with the rapidfire feature.
- Queens. Transfuse. You can rapidly cast this spell, but not too much faster than a competent human could because it has a significant amount of delay. There is also a tendency to over-Transfuse on units that aren't at risk of dying (but are still slightly damaged), so it's more of a judgement call that can go good, or can go pretty bad due to wasted energy. Spawn Larva works with this, but the uses aren't very applicable unless you did what I did and bound the rapidfire key to Spawn Larva's key (the S key in Fleet Keys Alloy, which is central to the layout). It lets me cut out the mouse clicks while performing the Backspace Inject method, which is a pretty big deal depending on who you ask. A neat little improvement, but extreeemely specific both in terms of implementation and usage. Creep tumors. Now this is where the rapidfire feature shines with Zerg. If you ever get to the point where you are spreading Creep with multiple tumors (5 or more I'd say), or need to dump a Queen's energy quickly by placing Creep Tumors, then you're in luck, because you can eliminate the need to click to propagate the Creep Tumors, and the process is sped up by a considerable amount. Not a broken feature, but potentially very beneficial. Just watch where you aim your cursor as you cast, because you can cast close to your tumors and that should make you feel sad.
- Infestor. Infested Terrans can be spawned at rapid speeds. It's more of a double-edged sword when used with the rapidfire key rather than an exploit. You can spend your energy quick, but the expenditure is extremely hard to regulate when using them in conjunction with Fungal Growth. So you can waste your energy very quickly, but somewhat...uncontrollably. Works really well when using Infested Terrans as a harass method, as you dump the energy quick. Fungal Growth interacts poorly with rapidire, as energy is precious, and you don't want to waste your Fungals. Neural Parasite isn't really viable in most situations where you'd want to make Infestors, and wouldn't benefit the use of rapidfire much or at all. Only good use may be vs mass Archons, Carriers, Battlecruisers, Thors and other massed Infestors I suppose?
- Viper. Abduct. You can cast it quickly, but you have much less control over what you Abduct, and Abduct has a high energy cost anyway so it's not really game-breaking and can end bad for the Zerg spamming it. Blinding Cloud doesn't benefit from rapidfire, much like how spammed Forcefields don't. Consume benefits greatly from the rapidfire feature if you have large amount of Vipers. It makes queuing the ability up much quicker when you have about 6 to 8 or more Vipers (the most you probably would want in a normal game).
- Corruptor. These guys are able to spam Corruption to great effect, so that's pretty damn cool. You waste cooldown and not energy so there's some amount of forgiveness there, but you still have to be careful with where you're actually casting the spell, as you can cast multiple Corrupts on single targets and that's wasteful. The rapidfire feature takes some tedium out of Corrupting single targets in exchange for some chaotic rapid targeting. With careful aiming, the rapidfire feature allows a player to use this underused and often-times lackluster ability to greater effect. Overall, I really like it. It does the unit some justice and promotes the use of its ability.
- Snipe can be used in a similar but much more limited way as pre-nerf Snipe did. The potential to spam it still exists, but... It's not similar enough to pre-nerf Snipe to create issues.
- The rapidfire feature can help out in certain situations where you slip on your macro with your Nexus or Orbital Commands. A great way to dump that energy FAST.
- Enhances the speed of Creep Spreading by a considerable amount if you have 5 or more tumors on the go. Also is a great way to dump your Creep Queen's energy if she has a lot banked, as rapidly queuing Creep Tumors can be done much quicker.
- Lets you sacrifice accuracy and precision with many spells for a casting rate increase. Works like a trap in some ways, it works nicely in others. It depends on who is using the spells, and is kept mostly in check by the spell's balanced features like non-stacking and cooldown rules.
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Wow, and this is no by no means against the rules right? The scroll wheel method for infested terrans was banned here and there what I remember.
Sick, this will really streamline creep with those pesky uneven crep tumors
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On May 11 2013 15:47 Facultyadjutant wrote:
Wow, and this is no by no means against the rules right? The scroll wheel method for infested terrans was banned here and there what I remember.
Sick, this will really streamline creep with those pesky uneven crep tumors
It's all done with sc2 key binds so its perfectly fine.
I definitely like it for corruption as well.
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I understand this method, but I think it's not really effective.
You don't spread each tumor far away enough from the other, so your creep spreads in a not-large-enough area in my opinion. You understand?
With your method its:
----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------o-o-o-o-o-------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
but it should be:
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
----------------------------------------------------------------
You don't use the creep that one tumor spreads effective enough.
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So as long as the hotkey used isn't scroll wheel, using this trick is not cheating? This is essentially the same thing, why wouldn't it also be banned? I feel like this is just another version of the scroll wheel trick that will be banned once players begin to use it.
Edit: I know it doesn't use external programs like the scroll wheel, but I don't think that prevents tournaments from banning it. It looks like it could be a good addition to the game if it's not banned.
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I think it'll probably be banned/patched soon, as you're using 1 key to accomplish 2 keypresses (aka macro-like).
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you guys are genius really.´Should add the video to op since i understood how fast it is by watching the video :O
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what so holding a key down so it repeats and then placing stuff from that is not how people have always done it?
Am i missing something?
how else do you think zergs in bronze hit 200 apm regularly on average if it was not for holding keys down to make units?
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lol I'm already doing this since 2011.
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On May 11 2013 16:13 enemy2010 wrote:
I understand this method, but I think it's not really effective.
You don't spread each tumor far away enough from the other, so your creep spreads in a not-large-enough area in my opinion. You understand?
With your method its:
----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------o-o-o-o-o-------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
but it should be:
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
----------------------------------------------------------------
You don't use the creep that one tumor spreads effective enough.
On May 11 2013 09:42 hearters wrote:
2. Multiple creep tumours and want to spread out: wave from outside the creep in a zigzag inwards to the creep. Result is furthest creep tumours in spread out directions.
^will result into
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
----------------------------------------------------------------
and the larger the wavelength of the zigzag, the more spread out are the creep tumors
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Binding it on C also works awesome for mass chronoboosting by the way xD
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On May 11 2013 16:13 enemy2010 wrote:
I understand this method, but I think it's not really effective.
You don't spread each tumor far away enough from the other, so your creep spreads in a not-large-enough area in my opinion. You understand?
With your method its:
----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------o-o-o-o-o-------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
but it should be:
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
----------------------------------------------------------------
You don't use the creep that one tumor spreads effective enough.
This depends on the waving 'technique'.
if you start out with this:
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
and you wave quickly in a line at the edge of your creep, you'll get this:
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
it's the technique of waving ^_^
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On May 11 2013 21:54 hearters wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2013 16:13 enemy2010 wrote:
I understand this method, but I think it's not really effective.
You don't spread each tumor far away enough from the other, so your creep spreads in a not-large-enough area in my opinion. You understand?
With your method its:
----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------o-o-o-o-o-------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------
but it should be:
----------------------------------------------------------------
----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------
----------------------------------------------------------------
You don't use the creep that one tumor spreads effective enough. This depends on the waving 'technique'. if you start out with this: ---------------------------------------------------------------- ----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------ ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- and you wave quickly in a line at the edge of your creep, you'll get this: ---------------------------------------------------------------- ----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------ ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------- ----------o--------------o---------------o------------o------ it's the technique of waving ^_^
But in my case my button repeat rate (or whatever its called) is too fast, so my tumors dont leave a big enough space in between them.
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it's not about the button repeat rate. it's about waving at the edge of the creep. if you wave at the edge of the creep, they will all go spread out. it's hard to explain, but try it.
i just posted a replay in OP in which i use this method to spread creep. interestingly, if not for the creep spread, i might have lost this game. for me, the best part is not only that it makes creep spread FAST, it makes creep spread FUN! ^_^
http://drop.sc/333434
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Wanted to let you guys know that I also uploaded a video on this. Scarlett already told me some time ago about the trick, included two of the posters in here in the shoutouts as I've seen the thread before I recorded it. Really interesting read up, nice to see how indepth you guys researched this trick!
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I'm definetely rebinding my alternate key to this to be able to use this method. Looks sick!!! Thanks for sharing it!
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On May 11 2013 17:49 Persh wrote:
I think it'll probably be banned/patched soon, as you're using 1 key to accomplish 2 keypresses (aka macro-like).
The entire point of the hotkey that Blizzard put in was to do this. Why would it a) be illegal, or b) be patched out ?
edit: Not to mention, the right-click a unit to attack is a prime example of using one key to accomplish 2 keypresses (attack and target).
On May 11 2013 21:01 Nimix wrote:
Binding it on C also works awesome for mass chronoboosting by the way xD
Seems to me, you could waste energy by chronoboosting the same thing more than once, using this and the other versions of this exact method discussed over the last couple years.
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EPT
