EPTHowever, and this is kind of important, sportsmanship is emphasized in this game by Riot. However, by your logic and Riots logic, the unfairest asshole gets always what he wants, while you bow down and pick a role you don't like as much. And that is unfair. It starts to become fair, if í can actually call the asshole out by reporting him for being an asshole, linking the chatlog to my report, then this gets fair. Before, it is just unjustified insulting the fair players to not be stubborn.
[Patch 3.02: Fake Quinn] General Discussion - Page 155
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Broetchenholer
Germany1887 Posts
However, and this is kind of important, sportsmanship is emphasized in this game by Riot. However, by your logic and Riots logic, the unfairest asshole gets always what he wants, while you bow down and pick a role you don't like as much. And that is unfair. It starts to become fair, if í can actually call the asshole out by reporting him for being an asshole, linking the chatlog to my report, then this gets fair. Before, it is just unjustified insulting the fair players to not be stubborn. | ||
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Crownlol
United States3726 Posts
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ihasaKAROT
Netherlands4730 Posts
Aslong as you dont act like a total moron you should be able to play what u want | ||
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sylverfyre
United States8298 Posts
On February 27 2013 23:41 Sbrubbles wrote: Or, if you pick first and the other guy has already presented himself as uncooperative (MID OR FEED), you can just pick mid first and keep a positive atitude if he also picks mid, while trying your best to make something good out of the situation (2v1). This way, you make sure that, if it ever goes to the tribunal (it has a chance to), it'll be pretty clear he's being the dick and not you. You could, but you're still kinda being a dick about it. What's stopping you from playing your second best role? You probably are more likely to win if he really IS shit at every other role, and you're on your second-best. Now, I TOTALLY agree that the pre-game chatlog should be in a tribunal report. I'm divided on pregame report buttons, though. | ||
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Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On February 27 2013 23:49 sylverfyre wrote: You could, but you're still kinda being a dick about it. What's stopping you from playing your second best role? You probably are more likely to win if he really IS shit at every other role, and you're on your second-best. Thing is, what if you're also crap at every other role, potentially worse than him? What if he lied and he's pretty damn good at all the roles? You have no way of being sure what combination of roles will maximize your winning chances. A lot of times (even in ranked!) people play a different role than their "best role" simply because they want to (fun). Of course, I'm taking about a hypothetical situation in which both you and him don't want to concede. My opinion is that the only solution is to be a dick (in that you picked the role he wanted), but have a positive attitude about it. You don't need to mouth off the guy, rage, threaten to report and be overall negative. If you want mid and he wants mid (and you picked first while he picked it afterwards), just play it out and make the best of a bad situation. For me this is kinda moot because I always play support, but I can totally understand that there are people who won't concede during champion select. | ||
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Fildun
Netherlands4122 Posts
But then I think that person should just say that he is only good at mid, and probably people will let him mid (or those people themselves are just assholes too, in which case they should be reported too) For clarity: Imo MID OR FEED isn't that bad, but the rage that follows when somebody also says mid is really bad. | ||
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Tal
United Kingdom1014 Posts
If I'm first pick I will generally not choose support, as I feel I have the duty to try and snowball the game our way, but apart from that I just try and talk to people and go with the flow. Doing anything else makes it more likely you'll lose. This only applies to ranked of course - in normals I just instalock whomever I feel like playing. | ||
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
Yeah, those types of games are the ones that always end really poorly. The ones that have you just shaking your head from champ select all the way till the surrender vote finally passes. Just do yourself a favor and dodge. | ||
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ArchAngelSC
England706 Posts
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Blyf
Denmark408 Posts
On February 27 2013 18:17 jcc wrote: Actually Cash Ashe is very good and thus far I've had a 100% win rate with it in every game, me being upper diamond 2 low diamond 1 currently. I also fielded it at a LAN. Ashe is assumed by the general community to have a weak laning phase. But the more I play her the more I feel that is false. Pair her win sona or zyra and you have a very strong lane with a devastating level 6. Every game I have gone WEWEWRWEWQEQQQ etc, doran's first, shove real hard level 1-3, abusing your LVL 1 dominance, and with that early shove shop fast at 800 gold. This doesn't put you behind lane trade wise because they either are still in lane or are backing too cuz you shoved fast. Q is unneeded due to double cc ults for optimum gank support. The average bonus gold I get is 900-1200 by 18-20 minutes without a TF on my team, it's about 1200-1600 with a TF. If you manage a kill or two you're astronomically ahead of the enemy adc. People doubt cash Ashe but I've beaten folks like maplestreet and others in lane and just farmed hard and had a whole item up on the enemy adc even though they had more kills or towers, early E max and early avarice is broke as fuck on Ashe. Also in regards to her trading ability, the most they'd have up on you during that avarice buy I'd a longsword or boots, which are both minimal. With sona or zyra cash Ashe is amazingly broken, and is only susceptible to heavy all in lanes, which then become free lanes when you both hit 6 and get free kills with jungler on command whenever you desire cuz all in lanes have to overextend to maintain lane control. To do this you also have to understand ashes power curves and how to appropriately abuse her range and auto W counter initiate harass. Thanks for adding some insight (/value) to the discussion. A most welcome change from all the people so eager to share their ignorance on something they have probably zero experience with. | ||
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ishboh
United States954 Posts
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TheKefka
Croatia11752 Posts
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Zhiroo
Kosovo2724 Posts
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kainzero
United States5211 Posts
and it's nice when you can say "i'm going annie, i don't care which lane i'm in" and your annie/rengar bot lane stomps and everyone's laughing in skype chat and happy times are had. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
 On February 27 2013 19:43 Serelitz wrote: Seriously though, the nerfs for pretty much all OP champs atm that are on PBE don't seem harsh enough. I main jungle Vi and I don't think 8 AD will do enough, same with xin/kayle q etc. Nerfs need to be harsher imo. Uh? I didn't doublecheck but if they're taking 8 AD from her base that's actually pretty huge, especially at early levels where she's strong. Takes 8 damage from every auto, 9.4 from every E... And she also loses a third of her W damage when she maxes it last. You can say "well, 2% ain't much" but you can also compare 4% to 6%. It's not like they have to gut the champs, really, just put them back in line. I like the W base change at early levels only because it doesn't hurt her ability to build tanky and still deal damage later on, while making her early aggression/duelling a lot weaker, along with some base AD. On February 28 2013 01:23 kainzero wrote: this is the reason why i've only started playing with friends. i'm so tired of arguing about which role to play. I have pretty bad memories of playing as 5 because I would literally be the only one to play more than 2 roles and the only jungler, of the others 2 would play mid and something else and 1 would only play mid, and only Morgana. I used to main Morg at the time and was unable to play her (she started getting popular for some reason, independantly from her competitive status, so every one would buy her as one of their first champs) while having to deal with the ramblings of the guy being terrible with her and doing bad every game, while basically insulting me (in intent) whenever I'd try to share my experience or help him. As the others seemed to view it as inappropriate of me to talk about the guys' plays when he gets destroyed and vents (yeah, better let him suck and keep raging on vocal), I just told how I felt to the most reasonable of the 4 and stopped playing with them as 5s. | ||
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
I do run into a lot of people who lie about their "2000 elo smurf" to get a position, when they're clearly not that level. They usually aren't super horrific though. | ||
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jcc
United States472 Posts
On February 27 2013 16:38 iCanada wrote: Nasus on the other hand makes a 6 item AD worthless. Wither make them move so slow, do no damages. Just manage to get your team to stall till 40 minute mark you win erry game. Be a 5k HP 200/200 resistances freak who makes their AD useless and has a Q that does like +800 damage. In addition, gets AoE 5% per second Hp burn (which also gives him increased AD) on his ult. Nasus R so strong in League of Warmogs, even if you just sticking to one tank for one second you prolly going to hit the max AD bonus from his R, if you running at their AD you probably going to get like +500 AD with everyone trying to peel you. You can win 45 minute games where other team like 10-15k gold ahead. How you going to stop a Taric, Thresh, Alistar, Lulu, Lux, Nautilus, Blitz, Sona, Leona or Zyra from just poking your balls off / just hard engaging on you? You can't use arrow every trade... Its not like you can expect your jungler to pressure bottom that hard either because bottom ridiculously hard to gank always 2+ wards down there unless one just expire. I don't buy it, think you just get totally crushed by any competent bot lane if you rush Avarice while having no trading ability. Only Support I could see not just totally zoning you is like Soraka, but no one plays Soraka anymore. Ok, you're making alot of incorrect assumptions here and seem to not be very comfortable with Ashe's playstyle in general. You ask how to deal with hard initiating supports in lane, and i'm guessing that this leaks into later on in the game into "How do you deal with hard initiating jungler ganks? Or hard initating bruisers in team fights?" - None of this matters to Cash Ashe because it is IRRELEVANT to what items you get. That initial 800 gold into avarice changes none of those dynamics, if anything it makes them easier to deal with because you can peak faster and kill those bruisers faster before they hit dangerous peaks. Now, i also described the scenario on WHAT TO DO to appropriately get away with this build in a way that the enemy adc, nothing short of super blue golems lvl 2 all in, can do to stop. I'll set my conditions on when i MOST OFTEN pick Cash Ashe and the scenarios she excels in for GUARENTEED advantages. 1) - You are blue side. Not because of golems, but because it allows you to abuse your lvl 1 crit / W by harassing the blue. 2) - First request Sona support, and if you cant get sona get Zyra, and worst case scenario get janna. Why? Sona allows you to start dorans safely, provides the strongest lvl 1 in bot lane in conjunction with your crit / w, and allows you to TOGETHER rush to their blue, "60" second ward their banana bush, then green ward their blue. You can force their jungler to a) Back cuz he gets low from your harass b) the enemy bot lane to get REAL low from defending your harass, c) steal blue cuz hes trying to smiteless and you hit it over wall, or d) he has to smite and mid has to waste time in conjunction with their bot to stall your harass. 3) That you know how to appropriately control lane flow and after the lvl 1 stuff you come to lane (ideally ahead in hp), SHOVE IT HARD, and non stop shove until you hit about 800 -1200 gold, immediately back, buy avarice and maybe longsword or a few pots. you can get away with this cuz you harassed the fuck out of the jungler and KNOW he cant punish for 3-4 minutes. And almost no enemy bot lane can deal with that kind of shove with a dorans start ashe + sona or zyra in the first 3 levels unless they want to risk an all in where the likelihood of your jungler being there is MUCH higher than theirs. 4) On return of buying your avarice, you again shove fast 2-3 waves, then shop and you can equalize what items they bought. They started dorans too and bought vamp? Ok, you bought dorans, avarice, shoved, shopped, buy longsword. THE TRADE VALUE IS EQUAL in atk damage, he only has the 10% lifesteal, which means nothing to you cuz you have sona and want SELECTIVE burst trades with W, + Sona Q and autos. Not extended trades or allins. 5) Ashe and Sona both have HUGE range, learn to kite, learn to harass CORRECTLY, learn to disengage. 6) Supports like taric are actually VERY easy to deal with. He's sort of a joke support after a certain elo, very easy to push out of lane if the enemy adc has long range and the enemy support is ranged. Also leona / blitz supports are predictable. Blitz support is also very squishy. Dont get grabbed, and if he runs up to you to punch you fucking just attack him, he is squishy, he will either die, back, or the trade will be equal deaths. Which favors you cuz you have a CONSTANT larger income. 7) Ashe isn't the best "herp derp" pick this adc whenever you want. Much like Vayne, Kog, I put Ashe in the hyper carry category. She has no ingrained escape, so if you are 4th pick and they ALREADY have J4, Leona, Ahri, etc then you chose your fate. That is a scenario you'd want a safer adc like ezreal, trist, sivir, etc. BUT, if you pick ashe against a good comp, OR you get so much money so fast and your team KNOWS how to play with an ashe (cuz its very different than playin with a graves or ezreal), you can still easily win and still be ahead. Typical build order btw would be: Dorans --> first 800 fast buy avarice --> longsword ---> BF or pickaxe (depending on how soon you gotta back) ---> vamp --> Beserks ---> Shiv ---> BotRK or LW, etc etc. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
On February 28 2013 01:56 jcc wrote: You spoke of Sivir as a safe AD, because of spellshield + her passive that helps with kiting too I guess, despite her low range and lack of dash. Can I ask what are your thoughts about her? She's probably my favourite AD Carry but I feel she is outshone in every one of her aspects (sieging, pushing, kiting... jack of all trades, master of none, except in terms of pre-6 burst), she's hard to pick early because of how long-range carries can abuse hers, and she relies on heavily snowballing early because as time passes Graves becomes better in burst, Cait in sieging/pushing, Ashe in kiting, and several in raw damage and poking (and even both). | ||
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Zhiroo
Kosovo2724 Posts
On February 28 2013 01:23 kainzero wrote: this is the reason why i've only started playing with friends. i'm so tired of arguing about which role to play. and it's nice when you can say "i'm going annie, i don't care which lane i'm in" and your annie/rengar bot lane stomps and everyone's laughing in skype chat and happy times are had. Ain't so easy when none of your friends want to play support either.  | ||
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JonGalt
Pootie too good!4331 Posts
On February 27 2013 19:53 Chrispy wrote: Brazilian Support Kayle gets killed at level 2 "huehuehuehue" + Show Spoiler + There, the jokes dead we can all go home. But but but... I wanna play too! Support Kayle gets killed by Limp Bizkit. "Wow, I didn't expect Fred Durst." On February 28 2013 00:56 TheKefka wrote: man,reading GD some times makes me wanna take a nap You clearly weren't seeing the Kayle support jokes. On topic, I really like the idea of Cash Ashe and I feel like she could be really good in the League of Divers (I am talking about competitive and using Cash or standard). I know she doesn't have an escape, but she can kite for days. Use ult as counter-engage and just Q/W for days. Would this work, or would Hec/Vi/J4/Xin still just get in your face. I know it's hard to stop Hec and Vi, but you can still flash ult into q away. I also feel like Trist with W and R should see more in competitive with all the divers. | ||
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