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[Stream] IdrA - Page 102
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Asday
United Kingdom388 Posts
User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Pokedude1013
116 Posts
On May 07 2011 04:56 Guvna wrote: . People only watch Idra because of all of his drama anyways. Spot the scrub | ||
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Mailing
United States3087 Posts
On May 07 2011 04:56 Guvna wrote: i believe someone else took the pic of Cruncher's stream. Having watched his stream many times, i know he just tries to snipe Idra to make him rage, but doesn't leave the stream on. Who knows if he did it this time or not (probably people who were watching Cruncher's stream know for sure), but from what i've seen in the past he's never done it, i dont know why he'd start now. I find this hilarious, and hope him and others do it more often. People only watch Idra because of all of his drama anyways. They watch him because he is the best zerg that speaks english, and the community is mostly zerg players. | ||
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Sqq
Norway2023 Posts
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unoriginalname
England380 Posts
On May 07 2011 04:56 Guvna wrote: People only watch Idra because of all of his drama anyways. People watch him since he's a good player, people are defending him because he's a good player, people are upset about the delays to the streaming because he's a good player. | ||
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Fallingtoss
United States14 Posts
--- nm he was banned because of his post to thread about his justinTV stream -- (i think) | ||
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tainted muffin
United States158 Posts
On May 07 2011 04:59 Mailing wrote: They watch him because he is the best zerg that speaks english, and the community is mostly zerg players. Zerg is the least played race so most of the community can't be zerg. | ||
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BloodNinja
United States2791 Posts
On May 07 2011 05:02 unoriginalname wrote: people are upset about the delays to the streaming because he's a good player. The issue with this is that TL has no control over Idra streaming or not. Idra choosing to not stream was done by Idra himself. For refference, when Idra was temp banned for 30 days not so long ago, he continued to stream during the ban. | ||
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haffy
United Kingdom430 Posts
On May 07 2011 05:14 tainted muffin wrote: Zerg is the least played race so most of the community can't be zerg. Yes I agree. Also the worlds population is about 50% women 50% men. Therefore 50% of the posters must be women. | ||
tree.hugger
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
Are there enough people in this thread to look at this rationally? Let's find out, shall we? On May 07 2011 03:57 Essentia wrote: Wait so Cruncher posted a screenshot of him having Idra's stream opened while he was playing and yet ppl say that's not enough evidence? Where's the logic in that? There's clearly a good majority of you who have no idea what you're talking about. For example, this person has clearly not actually looked at the screenshot in question, nor read CrunCher's explanation for his actions. Let's go over this piece by piece. - IdrA's stream is MUTED in the CrunCher screenshot Plenty of people have said that CrunCher could easily have turned up the volume to the stream at some other point. This is true. However, he also could've mixed himself a martini during the countdown. Any speculation on what CrunCher could have done is the product of bias. Pure and simple. The only concrete evidence we have that CrunCher was looking at IdrA's stream shows him doing so completely legally. - CrunCher explained the reason he had IdrA's stream open was that he was attempting to 'snipe' IdrA. This means something highly specific in this case. It means that CrunCher was attempting to enter the queue for finding games at the exact moment that IdrA did, thereby increasing the chances that they would play each other. There is nothing wrong with this. This is perfectly logical and plausible. Any speculation on other reasons why CrunCher may have been watching IdrA's stream are the product of bias. - CrunCher's play is not standard, but it's not completely odd either. Plenty of protoss wall-in with two gateways. Plenty of protoss add more than one cannon, especially if they do not have good scouting information. CrunCher knew that he had done early damage to IdrA by delaying his hatchery for so long. IdrA has become well known recently for all-inning against protoss. Against CrunCher, and against CrunCher's opening, it is extremely reasonable for CrunCher to have played the way he did to be safe. - IdrA doesn't have good enough perspective to make this call. We know IdrA doesn't like CrunCher. We know he said he thought CrunCher would stream look before he ever had the slightest shred of evidence to any effect. Throughout the game, he made a self-destructive decision and then ascribed all of CrunCher's actions to his earlier theory. IdrA cannot have made that accusation rationally. He even predicts two gate stalker when instead CrunCher sends out two zealots. IdrA had no perspective. - TL Mods acted to protect CrunCher/punish IdrA for what he said on stream/ruin it for "The Community" When this issue was first raised, several staff immediately suspected CrunCher of cheating and suggested that his stream be taken down. As Chill has posted, he sent a pm asking CrunCher for his side of the story. Once CrunCher posted his explanation and pointed out the muted stream in the screenshot, it was determined that his explanation was plausible, and that in the absence of any real proof, no action could fairly be taken against CrunCher. IdrA, meanwhile, was banned for posting an immature and disgusting insult. That's literally all there is to it. Anyone who says that IdrA has been treated unfairly on TL is so unbelievably wrong it's silly. If IdrA were anything but the best foreign BW player, he would've been banned permanently years ago. IdrA is perfectly able to keep streaming if he wants to. He's stopped streaming because he's throwing a temper tantrum and wants attention. TL doesn't need IdrA, but apparently he needs TL. To recap: - No evidence against CrunCher. - Only biased conjecture. TL has a responsibility to be fair to all of its members. This isn't a popularity contest, this is a contest of who can produce proof of what they say. And IdrA and his fanboys have no proof. Reasonable doubt exists. I really can't understand why this is so hard to figure out. | ||
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Swineflew
United States61 Posts
On May 07 2011 05:14 tainted muffin wrote: Zerg is the least played race so most of the community can't be zerg. It might just be me, but I've seen a huge increase in zerg since the first ladder season. I personally switched from random to zerg, so maybe that makes me a bandwagoner(sp?) but I like the way the game plays as zerg, even if it makes me want to rip my hair out because I'm terrible as zerg. Edit: I'm personally against stream sniping. It seems like a slippery slope to me. You can use outside sources to manipulate the game, but since it's a "victimless crime" it's not a big deal. Let's say that Player A is super gosu can't be beat, and he hates player B. What if player A stream snipes Player B all the time, and beats him just to make him lose ladder points/make him rage. Does that really seem fair? | ||
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numLoCK
Canada1416 Posts
 Idra is definitely a great player I just wish he could avoid acting out and getting himself banned so often. The fact that he won't stream because of this little incident is sad | ||
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Drteeth
Great Britain415 Posts
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Jotoco
Brazil1342 Posts
On May 07 2011 05:22 tree.hugger wrote: entire fanbase No it's not. Is it so hard to understand that there are several tens of thousands of Idra's fans that: 1 - Didn't post; 2 - Posted several times and didn't even get a warning (like myself). So, it must not be his entire fanbase. And you're not the first mod to come up with this. This is insulting people for no good reason. If Mods want to hold such high concept of moral and manner and whatever, they should uphold it first. If this was the first mod to do it, I would simply ignore it, but you're probably the fourth or fifth, including the messages in the TL.BOT logs in the ban thread...... | ||
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Tracedragon
United States948 Posts
1) This post, especially the line "Cruncher said himself that he has streamcheated before", comes to mind: On May 06 2011 23:09 Crezth wrote: Well, Cruncher said himself that he has streamcheated before, so there's precedent, and then there's this: I think, if Cruncher did streamcheat, it was very impolite. It's too bad people take advantage of IdrA's short fuse to tease him, and now he's taking it out on the people who watch his stream. A lot could be gained if everyone just manned up. [...] 2) On May 07 2011 02:43 Jibba wrote: http://www.justin.tv/eg_idra/b/285221418 Around 30~ minutes in. I just watched it and it's really not bad at all. People are overreacting purely on IdrA's comments rather than what actually went on. Cruncher's wall is weird, but it's basically a double gateway forge wall for Tal'darim with a Cyc further back, which is what some P FE's with vs Zerg. How the Gateway timing can be considered "fishy" is beyond me, since Cruncher delayed IdrA's hatchery and knows IdrA needs early damage to catch up. Given it was Cruncher, he was probably pooling gas for a Stargate, rather than blinding countering a Roach/Ling all in. IdrA says, "two Gateways before.. (Cybernetics Core) he's definitely watching." Now go watch Forge FE games from other top Protoss on Tal'darim. In just two minutes I've found VODs of White_ra and others doing the same thing (albeit with a better wall.) Then again, a very, very, very good Protoss expert did tell me it's suspicious. :x We really would need a replay or Cruncher's VOD to help. 3) On May 07 2011 04:35 greendestiny wrote: Jesus, dude, this isn't a murder trial. But if it were, what you're saying would be akin to a lawyer saying: "Look, my client didn't commit this murder. After all, there are no pictures of him holding the knife and stabbing the victim." That's would be such a weak argument. Don't you agree? Strictly speaking, your post contains what is called argumentum ad ignorantiam - "the fallacy that a proposition is true simply on the basis that it has not been proved false or that it is false simply because it has not been proved true." http://philosophy.lander.edu/logic/ignorance.html [...] So when Idra says and during his game vs Cruncher, you can say 'Hmm, Idra so far knew exactly the thought process of his opponents and when Cruncher just blindly countered his build, there was something fishy and he called him out on it". [...] And in general I agree with the sentiments of this post: On May 06 2011 20:46 Cuddle wrote: I use a knife in the kitchen fairly regularly, nothing strange about it. But if my cheating wife gets mysteriously stabbed to death and I get caught standing over the body, knife in hand, I'm gonna get arrested. Whether or not I get sentenced depends on the evidence and how many well paid lawyers i can afford. I'm not saying the evidence is overwhelming here, I'm just saying...9 times out of 10 the husband with the motive did it, even if the knife he was holding wasn't the murder weapon. So far, Cruncher's only response to this has been: On May 06 2011 07:10 CrunCher wrote: lol. idra fanboys so uspet i sniped idra. watch my stream next time  cant accept a loss about the 'cheating': sniping=waiting till he searches to search http://puu.sh/1Tpw as you can see the sound is muted and the guy ss'd my stream(live) idra all-ins half the games in ipl, and i didnt see him expand. and you make 2 gateways so you block off faster, mostly after nexus first (and i dropped my 2nd gate before he dropped his roach warren). and 2 cannons when you nexus first is cheating? (watch gsl/ipl/nasl, ex- anypro makes 3 cannons and zealot/sentry/stalker before tech) Are there any VODs from Cruncher's PoV of the Cruncher vs IdrA game that show his own thought process and why he played so weirdly? Or does Cruncher have some other defense in regards to how he didn't cheat? | ||
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BloodNinja
United States2791 Posts
I dont have time but your #1 is very flawed. That was a allegation thrown out by a random user with nothing to back it up. He has provided zero evidence of this statement being true. In addition I would recommend you read Tree.Hugger's post two above you. It provides some good analysis right there. | ||
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{ToT}ColmA
Japan3260 Posts
i actually enjoyed the bit i saw yesterday (evening for me) where he commented his play and also the opponents, sad that he wont do it in the near future on a sidenote, people should relax | ||
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TheRhox
Canada868 Posts
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hicks91
United Kingdom50 Posts
Just dropping you a line idra (if you read this) that your stream has really helped me up my game, watching you play (and now with you telling the logic behind your moves) i've gone from gold to the cusp of diamond so thanks idra! | ||
BroOd
Austin10833 Posts
On May 07 2011 05:30 Jotoco wrote: No it's not. Is it so hard to understand that there are several tens of thousands of Idra's fans that: 1 - Didn't post; 2 - Posted several times and didn't even get a warning (like myself). So, it must not be his entire fanbase. And you're not the first mod to come up with this. This is insulting people for no good reason. If Mods want to hold such high concept of moral and manner and whatever, they should uphold it first. If this was the first mod to do it, I would simply ignore it, but you're probably the fourth or fifth, including the messages in the TL.BOT logs in the ban thread...... That's a fair distinction to make. With the overwhelming response in this situation, it's easy to forget that there are plenty of reasonable, responsible idra fans who don't like or care about the antics and simply watch him because he's a very good player. I, myself, have found myself frustrated with "idra fans" when I should just be frustrated with the individual users who've chosen to turn this situation into a shitstorm. (it should be noted that tree's use of "entire" in that instance was probably hyperbolic) I'm going to speak for myself here when I say that banning isn't fun (usually). There's no thrill or adrenaline rush or orgasm. Most of the time, it's just an increasingly detached sigh of disappointment. I'd much prefer to not have any reason to ever ban anyone. Unfortunately, that's not a feasible reality. What you should take from this is that we're not tyrants, or power-hungry or crazed with ban-madness. We're just normal people trying to uphold the standards of something that took a long time and a lot of hard work to build. | ||
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