On May 08 2011 10:05 Drunken Master wrote: Good. I dont know how you people can be a fan of him, with all the bad manners he displays.
His game play. You don't have to like the dude to like how he plays the game. Watch sports much?
Prolly this, I think that Christino Ronaldo is the biggest douchebag and crybaby there is in Football right now, but boy can he play good football/soccer. Same with Idra, guy his attitude is bad in my opinion, but I will not question the notion that he is a very very good Zerg player.
Exactly my point. That dude is sick at soccer. I didn't even know he was a douche until you said it but I did know he was an amazing soccer player.
Did you all think IdrA really wants Cruncher dead, and he is actually that mad when he loses?
Please. Talking shit to opponents is and should be tolerated, especially on the internet. I know almost every forum have some sort of rule about flaming, but in reality nobody cares.
Don't tell me you haven't flamed anyone for something they did that you didn't like. Cruncher cheated, it was so blatantly obvious, and TL just banned the best player in NA from the most popular NA SC2 forum.
Most of you have seen this, but it's so relevant I have to post the link:
Sure, telling people to spam Chill about the bans was a low blow, but who gives a crap about Chill's feelings anyway. I'm on this forum because of IdrA (among others) to learn and enjoy SC2, not to be afraid of prude moderators who think they can decide what should and shouldn't be allowed on the internet.
On May 08 2011 09:55 Caul wrote: Whether or not Idra deserved the ban has become less important to me, than ,Team Liquid and the moderators imposing a new set of standards on the community. We saw it with the discussion with EG's annoucement and Tyler's comments on the same and we are seeing it again here.
Success or Power corrupts, at some point Team Liquid staff and management need to evaluate what the greater success is doing to the "community" belief and attitude. If Team Liquid is only for "the old guard" or those that "toe the line", then I think that Team Liquid needs to address what the goals for the site are.
At the same time, EG should ask themselves some hard questions about it means to be on EG. Or is Idra the designated "bad boy" of the team and its his job to stir up controversy. Essentiallyis it just an act or stunt for publicity? I wonder what role Incontrol has been designated? But I digress...
Personnely, Idra's act is getting old and tired and is offering nothing new. IMHO he needs to evolve if he wants to continue to be a valued voice in the community and esports in general. As an example, his one dimensional discussion of game balance last week on State of the game.
I will watch his games, but read his posts, no, Watch his stream yes - but with the audio off.
As a member of the "old guard". I find your post utterly offensive. As someone who has been on TL for 7 years I have seen it change over the years. The leniency people get in posting now is far far higher than it used to be. TL is much more lenient and has become a far more open community overall since the launch of SC2. Do not talk about things you don't understand.
We have a list of rules that everyone should have read upon joining TL. What Idra did is against those rules. People may view his ban as harsh, but his status as a progamer and the contributions that have been given to the community because of this is the only reason he hasn't been perma banned. He has a long standing reputation of being bad mannered, trollish, disrespectful, etc... to both his opponents in games, the moderation staff on TL. For him to then continue the behaviour that has gotten him punished in the past then only encourage the harassment of a mod (who has contributed more to this website than almost every user, and a fair amount of progamers) I would tell you all to sit down and think before you post.
Ban was justified, and anyone saying it was unjustified is ignorant and should open their eyes. Idra is no saint, hes a complete asshat and has only gotten off as lightly as he has because of his skill at sc2. Everyone should be grateful his stream wasn't pulled from TL.
I can't say that I don't like him as a player, but all his bullshit has got to stop at some point. Whether it's just some publicity stunt, or he actually has the attitude of a spoiled, arrogant 8-year old, it's annoying. He abuses the hell out of all of the leeway that he gets. At this point, I'd love to see someone say that the next ban is permanent.
On May 08 2011 10:12 Baeff wrote: Hang on a minute here...
Did you all think IdrA really wants Cruncher dead, and he is actually that mad when he loses?
Please. Talking shit to opponents is and should be tolerated, especially on the internet. I know almost every forum have some sort of rule about flaming, but in reality nobody cares.
Don't tell me you haven't flamed anyone for something they did that you didn't like. Cruncher cheated, it was so blatantly obvious, and TL just banned the best player in NA from the most popular NA SC2 forum.
Sure, telling people to spam Chill about the bans was a low blow, but who gives a crap about Chill's feelings anyway. I'm on this forum because of IdrA (among others) to learn and enjoy SC2, not to be afraid of prude moderators who think they can decide what should and shouldn't be allowed on the internet.
I'm sorry but your post count isn't high enough for the TL staff to think you matter. Also, you went against them in any shape or form so......see you in disney land?
But neither can IdrA be proven to intend to harrass Chill with that statement. No evidence.
Sick how my mind works, huh?
yes he can, he posted it on his twitter dude
nice attempt at being clever, but idra was wrong regardless of whether he wants to admit it or not
How is that proof when you have to make assumptions and interpretations? Nothing was explicit.
if you want to be a genuine skeptic about everything then nothing is proven but logical tautologies
but that isn't very practical is it? you should read up on the principle of charity to avoid such impracticalities
there is a clear difference though in the two situations seeing as how in one, the accused actually confessed to the crime
I didnt see him confessing to trying to harass chill. The only way to prove cruncher cheated would be if he had screens of him with idras stream unmuted while he was playing idra...which isnt going to happen. So you have to make assumptions based on the evidence like what was done with idra's tweet.
seems simply vindictive. Idra is Idra and just a part of SC2, while childish it does bring in the viewers and he is a very good player.
Other players do BM, and post immature things. I think idra does get noticed a bit more unfairly. Aka the second he rages it's on the front page of reddit and everyone wants to see the screenshots.
I hope this shows him the error of his ways. From my own personal opinion he seems far to elitist. His attitude towards this community and esports is a negative shadow that shouldn't be supported. He's good for a chuckle when he rages that is about it.
On May 08 2011 10:08 tofucake wrote: The 90 day was a result of a discussion among IdrA and various TL staff members.
It is still funny that people assume they know Idra's intent for his twitter post. There is nothing wrong with telling people to msg a moderator if they are upset with the decision. It is actually the most logical thing to do. He did not say, SPAM CHILL ALL DAY. What people did were results of their own actions.
So, is TL saying you are not supposed to express your opinion about something that goes on inside the site? If we disagree, are we not supposed to post about it or msg a mod? =/
Also, I fully understand TL can do whatever they want, but the site is supposed to be an unbiased place for people to express opinions (from what I've read from mods in the past). I wouldn't have said my above statement if this was not how the site had been presented to me in the past.
It's funny how nobody is calmly assessing this. I am neutral by the way, the Gracken comes from my home-state, so yea Grack on. Idra has a volatile history of being generally dis-respectful to people, even when other people give him many chances due to his talent and contributions. However, to be taken seriously as a sport, Starcraft sponsors and sites need to have repercussions.
Sites descend into mindless anarchy when there is no moderation. Teamliquid is the one stellar example where anarchy is reigned in and I feel I can contribute as a poster. Everywhere else is a gore-fest with b-tard memes and that stupid face plastered in front of my screen. Why in the blazing hell would I take that seriously?
Idra knows perfectly well, and I'll say this with confidence, he knows fully well how rabid his fans are, hence when he "subtly" dropped that comment, he knew what was going to happen. You can't defend Idra for doing that, it was immature, and it dis-credits the E-sports name.
About Cruncher. If he did cheat, it is surely unfortunate. If anyone has screenshots, then send it to the TL mods. I would clearly like the evidence. If there is no evidence, there can be no judgement as you all so desire.
EPT
