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I have the Microsoft Optical Mouse atm with a social studies folder as a mousepad(lol). I like it alot actually, no problems with it, i am just wondering if I should upgrade my mouse and mouse pad. Would it be worth to spend $60 for the goliathus and deaethadder or should i just keep my own right now since i think its still good?
![[image loading]](http://wellcom.co.il/catalog/images/Microsoft/MOM.jpg)
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Not sure about that specific mouse, but I've used the logitech laser mice for a long time and I can tell you it is most definitely worth the upgrade.
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United States4053 Posts
You probably should look for a better mouse if you think it'll help you.
I'm also still using one of those legacy microsoft optical thingies with the cool red light on the bottom 
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really i dont get the difference between a gaming mouse and regular mouse besides looking better, and DPI doesnt really matter i think because u can just change mouse sensitivity on sc2 settings, it just seems that every1 has those "gaming" mice, idk if its really worth it
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I have a deathadder, love it, but no, you don't need one. The wmo is actually a really good mouse from what I hear.
Upgrade from the binder, but you definitely don't need a gaming mousepad, just pick up a supermat for 10 bucks... it's performance is legit, lots of quake pros use it or used to and they're probably the best aimers in the world.
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The weight/feel tends to be better, at least with the logitech mouse that I use. I've owned the microsoft one and it just doesn't track as well either, although maybe the newer ones do, I don't know. Also the logitech has the ability to change dpi with the click of a button immediately, however I don't use this feature ever, so it's not a determining factor for me.
Mostly it's just that the mouse is something that is so critical to starcraft 2, and even just day to day work, that spending 20 or 30 extra dollars even if it's marginally better is going to be a good investment in my opinion.
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Just as babolatt said, the actual feel of using the mouse is what's most important. If you feel like the microsoft optical fits your needs, there's no reason to switch.
If you feel bad about everyone having gamer mice, just remember that many professional quake and counter-strike players actually prefer the mouse you're currently using because of its shape and low weight. That mouse is in no way bad for gaming, and everyone who bought "gamer mice" are either total suckers for spending that much on a mouse, or felt that the mouse was better for their own grip.
Now, there are differences between the Microsoft Optical and the typical gamer mouse beyond their shape and size, such as the maximum control speed you can move the mouse without having to deal with negative acceleration, but in an RTS game like SC2, negative acceleration won't affect you much at all.
The most important thing about a mouse really is the ergonomics.
That being said, I own a Razer Imperator, and yes, I'm a complete sucker for flashing lights. 
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I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities.
If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful.
Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels.
So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI.
All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it!
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keyboard = more important than mouse
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Yes on both, but make sure you go with the older version, not the 3500 dpi deathadder. The higher dpi actually makes the mouse at fast movements bug out terribly
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On November 29 2010 16:48 Char711 wrote:I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities. If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful. Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels. So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI. All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it!
Total nonsense. High DPI provides equal (and dubious) benefits between every resolution. High resolution just lets you see the effects.
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have a G9 logitech. Best $70 dollars ive spent on my compy extremely comfortable and solid feeling. i would say go to a best buy and see if they have a few sitting out you can play around with. i also do alot of work in Adobe and the "better" laser is extremely noticeable over the stock dell ones my school uses. rarely skips pixels or jumps(need a waccom tho..come on santa!)
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Got that combination and I love it :p (deathadder + goliathus ), so do several other players I know
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I own a goliathus and its wearing out rapidly. It actually has bird crap residue on it (I don't really know how it happened but I came home one day and there was a bird crap on it, so don't leave your windows open kids). I thought about replacing it this week, I thought long and hard about it and thought about how much I liked the feel of it and realized that if I was to buy a new mouse pad it would probably be the new version of the same pad. I'm pretty sure mine is a control version?
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Been using a Deathadder for a while and I have no complaints. All the feedback I've read says if you want to use a Razer mouse, Deathadder is the way to go.
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I really need to stop having 4 TL threads open at once ...
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I've got a deathadder, and I can say it's just a feel thing. I used an intellimouse optical for over a decade before switching to this one. It just feels better/different but really didn't improve anything, except for my aim in FPS ever so slightly.
TBH you should buy a real mousepad.
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I've tried my cousin's Deathadder and I have to say, I like it more than my Steelseries Ikari
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You already have one of the best mice on the market - what resolution are you playing at?
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I've used this combo of deathadder and goliathus (currently use it until my Xai ships)
It's very very nice. The DA is easy to clean if you start having issues, but it took over two years for me to start seeing a decrease in performance due to dirtiness. It tracks nicely on the goliathus, but the softness of the map can get scratched up very easily (like if you run a fingernail across it, that line will be there forever).
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I love my DeathAdder. Had to turn the dpi down to 1800 tho. 3600 seemed to be too touchy for me. Also turned the polling down to 500ms.
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Depends on what you need.
Been using this combo (1800DPI deathadder tho) for about 2 months now - heavier than the MX (somewhat, you can adjust), different shape (that's obvious, just try them at the shop if you can, I think it might be better for a claw grip, tho I use varying grips), supports firmware/driver polling adjustment (the USB clock rate), tracks at higher speeds (if you're hardcore enough to reach those speeds you probably wouldn't be asking around though, we're talking 2m/s + here)... Ok just check this and this(here's the deathadder review) out and decide for yourself whether you need the new mouse - the WMO is solid. As for the pad - you should be able to get it cheap and IMO it's worth it. Just don't scratch it/whatever as people have pointed out
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I use this exact setup and have no complaints.
I was previously using the MS Explorer 3.0.
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I don't care too much about the all of the mumbo jumbo numbers that come attatched with the deathadder, but it's the most fucking comfortable mouse I've ever used, something that is very important when playing long RTS sessions.
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I have a DeathAdder and it's pretty darn solid. It probably wasn't the best choice for me, since I exclusively use a fingertip grip - it's a little large for that. I run it on full DPI and full refresh, since I use a ridiculous amount of sensitivity.
Don't bother getting a "Gaming mousepad" because they really aren't much different than a good 10 dollar one you can get at Staples or something. I bought an XL size hard mousepad at office depot and its been pretty awesome so far.
Next mouse will either be a SteelSeries (apparently they are smaller) or Razer's small mobility mouse.
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lmfao i dont even i know, i just found this mouse out of nowhere and i just plugged it in to my laptop and i use it on 45-50% mouse sensitivity for sc2 and i really like it, i guess im gonna keep my trustworthy microsoft optical
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On November 29 2010 18:53 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 16:48 Char711 wrote:I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities. If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful. Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels. So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI. All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it! Total nonsense. High DPI provides equal (and dubious) benefits between every resolution. High resolution just lets you see the effects.
Based on both the statement implying there is a benefit on the fourth page of the review Lwerewolf posted (second page of this thread and from one of the most testing-intensive and knowledgable sites you'll find for this) and the very information-filled post by Black Gun at the bottom of the page of this thread, I'll have to disagree with you.
The benefits are far from dubious and there is clearly a difference in benefit between resolutions. I think you're vastly underestimating the effects of resolution changes.
If you have some sources that prove me wrong, I'd love to see them. I'm really interested in this stuff because I like getting all of the little things right!
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On November 30 2010 10:28 Char711 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 18:53 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 29 2010 16:48 Char711 wrote:I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities. If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful. Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels. So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI. All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it! Total nonsense. High DPI provides equal (and dubious) benefits between every resolution. High resolution just lets you see the effects. Based on both the statement implying there is a benefit on the fourth page of the review Lwerewolf posted (second page of this thread and from one of the most testing-intensive and knowledgable sites you'll find for this) and the very information-filled post by Black Gun at the bottom of the page of this thread, I'll have to disagree with you. The benefits are far from dubious and there is clearly a difference in benefit between resolutions. I think you're vastly underestimating the effects of resolution changes. If you have some sources that prove me wrong, I'd love to see them. I'm really interested in this stuff because I like getting all of the little things right!
dude, I come from that site and the mousescore is a joke. Nobody there takes it seriously and they don't do it anymore. I suggest you ask on that forum or any number of hardcore hardware forums, I don't feel like educating you. I guarantee they will tell you the same thing.
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On December 01 2010 06:22 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2010 10:28 Char711 wrote:On November 29 2010 18:53 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 29 2010 16:48 Char711 wrote:I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities. If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful. Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels. So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI. All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it! Total nonsense. High DPI provides equal (and dubious) benefits between every resolution. High resolution just lets you see the effects. Based on both the statement implying there is a benefit on the fourth page of the review Lwerewolf posted (second page of this thread and from one of the most testing-intensive and knowledgable sites you'll find for this) and the very information-filled post by Black Gun at the bottom of the page of this thread, I'll have to disagree with you. The benefits are far from dubious and there is clearly a difference in benefit between resolutions. I think you're vastly underestimating the effects of resolution changes. If you have some sources that prove me wrong, I'd love to see them. I'm really interested in this stuff because I like getting all of the little things right! dude, I come from that site and the mousescore is a joke. Nobody there takes it seriously and they don't do it anymore. I suggest you ask on that forum or any number of hardcore hardware forums, I don't feel like educating you. I guarantee they will tell you the same thing.
I'm sorry you "don't feel like educating": I thought that's what threads like this were for.
Still, I have yet to see a truly good thread on TL saying that same thing, which makes me suspicious: TL people are very good about their testing and research, in general.
Is the mouse score only a joke now or was it always a joke (as the ones we're looking at are older)? The tests seem fairly solid when you look at them, if only in terms of technical limits.
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On December 01 2010 11:26 Char711 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 06:22 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 30 2010 10:28 Char711 wrote:On November 29 2010 18:53 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 29 2010 16:48 Char711 wrote:I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities. If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful. Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels. So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI. All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it! Total nonsense. High DPI provides equal (and dubious) benefits between every resolution. High resolution just lets you see the effects. Based on both the statement implying there is a benefit on the fourth page of the review Lwerewolf posted (second page of this thread and from one of the most testing-intensive and knowledgable sites you'll find for this) and the very information-filled post by Black Gun at the bottom of the page of this thread, I'll have to disagree with you. The benefits are far from dubious and there is clearly a difference in benefit between resolutions. I think you're vastly underestimating the effects of resolution changes. If you have some sources that prove me wrong, I'd love to see them. I'm really interested in this stuff because I like getting all of the little things right! dude, I come from that site and the mousescore is a joke. Nobody there takes it seriously and they don't do it anymore. I suggest you ask on that forum or any number of hardcore hardware forums, I don't feel like educating you. I guarantee they will tell you the same thing. I'm sorry you "don't feel like educating": I thought that's what threads like this were for.
Well, I'm sorry to put the burden of fulfilling this thread's destiny on someone else.
Still, I have yet to see a truly good thread on TL saying that same thing, which makes me suspicious: TL people are very good about their testing and research, in general.
Is the mouse score only a joke now or was it always a joke (as the ones we're looking at are older)? The tests seem fairly solid when you look at them, if only in terms of technical limits.
They're fine technically, they're just meaningless. There's simply no respect for the significance of those numbers any more.
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On December 01 2010 19:03 UniversalSnip wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 11:26 Char711 wrote:On December 01 2010 06:22 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 30 2010 10:28 Char711 wrote:On November 29 2010 18:53 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 29 2010 16:48 Char711 wrote:I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities. If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful. Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels. So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI. All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it! Total nonsense. High DPI provides equal (and dubious) benefits between every resolution. High resolution just lets you see the effects. Based on both the statement implying there is a benefit on the fourth page of the review Lwerewolf posted (second page of this thread and from one of the most testing-intensive and knowledgable sites you'll find for this) and the very information-filled post by Black Gun at the bottom of the page of this thread, I'll have to disagree with you. The benefits are far from dubious and there is clearly a difference in benefit between resolutions. I think you're vastly underestimating the effects of resolution changes. If you have some sources that prove me wrong, I'd love to see them. I'm really interested in this stuff because I like getting all of the little things right! dude, I come from that site and the mousescore is a joke. Nobody there takes it seriously and they don't do it anymore. I suggest you ask on that forum or any number of hardcore hardware forums, I don't feel like educating you. I guarantee they will tell you the same thing. I'm sorry you "don't feel like educating": I thought that's what threads like this were for. Well, I'm sorry to put the burden of fulfilling this thread's destiny on someone else. Show nested quote +Still, I have yet to see a truly good thread on TL saying that same thing, which makes me suspicious: TL people are very good about their testing and research, in general.
Is the mouse score only a joke now or was it always a joke (as the ones we're looking at are older)? The tests seem fairly solid when you look at them, if only in terms of technical limits. They're fine technically, they're just meaningless. There's simply no respect for the significance of those numbers any more.
So . . . you're saying that they actually are valid and that people just don't understand that. I fail to see how that contradicts anything I said.
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razer mouses are more fps specific. i use a diamondback 3g and love it, but i've had it since it came out and i'm just so used to it.
a good mousepad actually can make your mouse seem way better (you have a quality mouse really)
FYI****** if you buy a nice mousepad, DO NOT EVER set a hot plate or mug on it like my dumb ass. i bought a big ass ocZ pad and it's now warped in the middle cause i was setting hot tea and the occasional food plate on it. it's to the point where only a corner of it is playable and i have it angled so my mouse is on that corner now =(
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definately mousepad, It helps so much. i have to say im addicted to my mouse pad haha
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On December 02 2010 09:41 Char711 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 19:03 UniversalSnip wrote:On December 01 2010 11:26 Char711 wrote:On December 01 2010 06:22 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 30 2010 10:28 Char711 wrote:On November 29 2010 18:53 UniversalSnip wrote:On November 29 2010 16:48 Char711 wrote:I think something crucial has been missed when we're talking about mouse choice: the games being played. Those older FPS games run at lower resolutions and, therefore, don't require high DPI. That and FPS players naturally use incredibly low sensitivities. If you're running SC2 at a moderately high resolution, a higher DPI is important. Not the 5,000 or ridiculous amount that some mice advertise, but some (for example, the 1,800 on the MX518 is good; I haven't heard of many people going much higher than 2,500 or so with SC2, but I also haven't seen too many people say what their settings are) is helpful. Now, you might say, like D3ath3nat0r, that you can adjust the sensitivity in the settings. No. You can't. Why? Because, for a 1:1 ratio of mouse movement to movement on screen (assuming you've turned mouse acceleration off), you need a Windows mouse sensitivity of 6/11. Since the SC2 sensitivity is partly linked to it, without getting into the math behind it, it should be set to 51-54% (the "setting" isn't actually notched up any until you hit multiples of 5) for what most people call "optimal settings." The DPI on your mouse is what picks up the rest of the slack (as it is essentially saying how many pixels per inch that your mouse will traverse). You can up the SC2 sensitivity, but you'll get slight loss of accuracy in the form of skipping pixels. So, that said, I'd recommend at least a slightly more modern mouse. Yes, some people are totally fine with those old ones and there is nothing wrong with using them: the most important thing is, obviously, comfort/personal preference. With what I've seen through my research, though, the increasingly high resolutions of the modern day (that you will have unless you play on the lowest setting) are usually complemented by a higher DPI. All of that said, I'm going from my MX518 that I've used for around 4 years to a DeathAdder. It's widely held to be one of the best mice (right up there with the MX518 and "RTS favorites" like the Salmosa). I'd say go for it! Total nonsense. High DPI provides equal (and dubious) benefits between every resolution. High resolution just lets you see the effects. Based on both the statement implying there is a benefit on the fourth page of the review Lwerewolf posted (second page of this thread and from one of the most testing-intensive and knowledgable sites you'll find for this) and the very information-filled post by Black Gun at the bottom of the page of this thread, I'll have to disagree with you. The benefits are far from dubious and there is clearly a difference in benefit between resolutions. I think you're vastly underestimating the effects of resolution changes. If you have some sources that prove me wrong, I'd love to see them. I'm really interested in this stuff because I like getting all of the little things right! dude, I come from that site and the mousescore is a joke. Nobody there takes it seriously and they don't do it anymore. I suggest you ask on that forum or any number of hardcore hardware forums, I don't feel like educating you. I guarantee they will tell you the same thing. I'm sorry you "don't feel like educating": I thought that's what threads like this were for. Well, I'm sorry to put the burden of fulfilling this thread's destiny on someone else. Still, I have yet to see a truly good thread on TL saying that same thing, which makes me suspicious: TL people are very good about their testing and research, in general.
Is the mouse score only a joke now or was it always a joke (as the ones we're looking at are older)? The tests seem fairly solid when you look at them, if only in terms of technical limits. They're fine technically, they're just meaningless. There's simply no respect for the significance of those numbers any more. So . . . you're saying that they actually are valid and that people just don't understand that. I fail to see how that contradicts anything I said.
meaningless, the quality of having no value or significance. These measurements tell you NOTHING useful about the mouse, especially the arbitrary rating scale.
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steelseries xai > deathadder
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Deathadder is a great mouse, but if you want a cloth mousepad I think the steelseries Qck range are a better option than the goliathus. There's even starcraft themed ones out now 
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I use your very mouse, its a really really good mouse. Dont let kids bullshit you that it doesnt track well. It has perfect tracking good and good control.
Buy some teflon skates and decent cloth pad and you are set.
Also, to the people who act like they know why higher dpi= better at higher resolutions need to set down and listen to this.
lets use starcraft as an example cause its input is done on 2d my 400 dpi mouse @ 1:1 ratio @ 1024x768= 2.56 inches horizontal 1.92 inches vertical. A perfectly normal fucking value.
And that's pixel perfect.Starcraft 2 is not a game that requires pixel perfect control
now fps's are more complicated than that, but honestly more dpi does mean more accurate "technically" but its also REDUNDANT accuracy. It is also alot fucking faster in many cases and requires lower in game sensitivities to reach the same real world movement.
Lets take quake 3s mouse calculation
ill use my sensitivity
(in game sense)x .022(in game degrees per input)x DPI= N
360 / N = (real world sense in inches)
mine equals 10.22 inches for a 360
now remember aim is decided by degrees not pixels
tired of math and shit.
Point is more DPI is redundant and low sensitivity is nothing bad.
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Currently $39.99 at NCIX, go go go!
pretty good price imo, I got it for $34.99 back in late August.
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I love my deathadder. I use it on a CM storm cloth pad and I couldn't be happier with it.
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I suggest a Math Folder. Much better than Social Studies imo. But seriously, a better mousepad would be nice. A $10 one from staples is better than a folder I think. The mouse is fine and the same one that I use.
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It's pretty simple; if you are comfortable with your mouse and have good control and maintain the APM you want, you shouldn't switch mice. I would agree with switching mousepads though, and personally I recommend a hard pad (I use the Rocketfish double-sided pad). There is a big difference between playing on a professional mousepad and a school textbook; much bigger than the actual mouse.
I use a DeathAdder, and I do like it, but it's not any better or worse than other mice on the market. You have to get a mouse that feels right in your hand.
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I was actually thinking about upgrading to the WMO from my deathadder since i kinda stopped playing FPS games and it really isn't shaped the best for RTS games. I ended up getting the G9X instead of the WMO since the g9x was on sale but I wouldn't change to the Death Adder unless you can find the 3g version (1800dpi, not the 3.5g 3500dpi version) for cheap. That or get an abyssus or salmosa.
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On November 29 2010 13:54 D3ath3nat0r wrote:
really i dont get the difference between a gaming mouse and regular mouse besides looking better, and DPI doesnt really matter i think because u can just change mouse sensitivity on sc2 settings, it just seems that every1 has those "gaming" mice, idk if its really worth it
DPI is very important for playing on high res monitors.
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Im using Abyssus but i dont really care about dpi and all the fancy lights... i picked the mouse based on the shape because it fits my hand and allowes me to play with no pain
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Dominican Republic913 Posts
u should get the deathadder i dont know about the mousepad, i have the mouse
its super GOOD
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Deathadder is a great mouse
I own these so far:
Deathadder
Lachesis (actually I sold this)
Sidewinder x5
MX510
Logitech G5
I'd say the best feel for me is still the Deathadder and at the price range, it's great.
As for mouse pads, the Razer DESTRUCTOR is the choice for me. Check it out, SOOOOOOO quick and also very precise. It also comes with a carrying case.
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On November 29 2010 13:54 D3ath3nat0r wrote:
really i dont get the difference between a gaming mouse and regular mouse besides looking better, and DPI doesnt really matter i think because u can just change mouse sensitivity on sc2 settings, it just seems that every1 has those "gaming" mice, idk if its really worth it
If your mouse has 500 dpi and you set the in-game sense to max, the mouse will be horridly inaccurate and will be jumping pixels like a motherfucker.
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Get the Goliathus. I have one and am super happy with it. Deathadder though...looks kinda weird. I have a salmosa, I'd say that's better for rts in general.
On November 29 2010 18:22 iPlaY.NettleS wrote:
keyboard = more important than mouse
Don't agree at all. I can play on a crappy keyboard but the mouse has to be decent.
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I actually upgraded from the exact mouse you currently have to your choice of mouse and mousepad. The reason I did was the feel of the mouse. I'd had the MS Optical for many many years and my fingers are quite long, so the Deathadder suits me a bit better. The mousepad, honestly isn't as big of a deal as they advertise and say. Going back, I probably wouldn't have spent the money on it.
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EPT
