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On September 06 2011 02:36 hyshes wrote:Show nested quote +On September 06 2011 02:29 Rachnar wrote:
With a budget like that, you can anything you want ... for the engineering stuff, your not running the work itself on your computer ? if not an i5 will be enough, otherwise, an i7 will be needed This budget of €3500 needs to cover everything (desktop - monitors - laptop). For major Finite element method calculations i have other means at disposal. But now and then i would like to do some of the little calculations myself.
With the i5-2500k, overclocking is basically extra performance for free, theres no reason not to do it. For the desktop something like this would be good. Leaves you with plenty spare for the laptop.
Total build cost: €1,722.44 + €17.50 shipping
Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €173.55
Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA €16.64
Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ) €46.19
ASRock P67 Extreme4 (B3), Sockel 1155, ATX €127.49
2 x Club 3D Radeon 6950 2048MB, AMD Radeon HD 6950, PCI-Express €215.24
XFX PRO650W Core Edition Full Wired Power Supply €66.90
3 x BenQ G2420HD €141.78
8GB-Kit GEIL Value PC3-10667 DDR3-1333 CL9 €35.63
MS Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit SB-Version Englisch €83.32
Scythe Mugen 3, für alle Sockel geeignet €34.95
FRACTAL DESIGN Gehäuse DEFINE XL Black Pearl €123.41
Crucial M4 128GB SSD 6,4cm (2,5") €158.54
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thanks for the advice SkyR
that's less than i thought i think ill buy sooner than i thought then. How long would you think it would take for ncix to ship to Victoria, BC?
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You forgot Blu-Ray (to get instead of the DVD drive). A burner is about 71€:
http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=30521&agid=856
He also needs a TV capture card.
And I don't see the need for Crossfire HD 6950s unless he wants to display the game on all three monitors. A single HD 6950 should be fine with a Z68 motherboard for additional video outputs as long as the other screens aren't showing anything too strenuous (to handle three monitors plus one TV).
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On September 06 2011 02:56 MrEko wrote:
thanks for the advice SkyR
that's less than i thought i think ill buy sooner than i thought then. How long would you think it would take for ncix to ship to Victoria, BC?
NCIX warehouses are located in Richmond and Markham. If every item is in stock than it's going to be no more than a week. If everything is available at the Richmond warehouse, you may even get your entire order in two days.
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I made some more revisions and I'm probably going to buy it tonight when I get home from work. It'll still be Monday in CA so any NewEgg promotions that end today I'll still get.
Mobo: ASRock P67 Extreme4
CPU: i5 2500K
GPU: MSI GTX 560 Ti OC
Memory: G.Skill 8GB DDR3 1333
PSU: Corsair TX650 V2
HDD: Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB
SDD: Crucial M4 128GB SATA III
Optical Drive: OEM DVS Burner
Heat Sink and Fan: Cooler Master Hyper 212+
Case: Cooler Master Storm Scout
OS: Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit
Will the i7 2600K really help for streaming enough to warrant the $95 difference?
Is the 650W PSU overkill when I think I only need ~500W?
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650w is definitely more than you need, but make sure you look at available connectors, too. Depending on the price difference, sometimes it's worth it to pay a bit more to be able to connect stuff easily and manage cables.
2600k vs 2500k might matter for HD streaming, but if you're doing 720p or below, 2500k is easily enough.
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Thanks a lot already. a few questions.
On September 06 2011 02:41 deconduo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 06 2011 02:36 hyshes wrote:On September 06 2011 02:29 Rachnar wrote:
With a budget like that, you can anything you want ... for the engineering stuff, your not running the work itself on your computer ? if not an i5 will be enough, otherwise, an i7 will be needed This budget of €3500 needs to cover everything (desktop - monitors - laptop). For major Finite element method calculations i have other means at disposal. But now and then i would like to do some of the little calculations myself. With the i5-2500k, overclocking is basically extra performance for free, theres no reason not to do it. For the desktop something like this would be good. Leaves you with plenty spare for the laptop. Total build cost: €1,722.44 + €17.50 shipping Intel Core i5-2500K Box, LGA1155 €173.55 Samsung SH-222AB bare schwarz SATA €16.64 Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ) €46.19 ASRock P67 Extreme4 (B3), Sockel 1155, ATX €127.49 2 x Club 3D Radeon 6950 2048MB, AMD Radeon HD 6950, PCI-Express €215.24 XFX PRO650W Core Edition Full Wired Power Supply €66.90 3 x BenQ G2420HD €141.78 8GB-Kit GEIL Value PC3-10667 DDR3-1333 CL9 €35.63 MS Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit SB-Version Englisch €83.32 Scythe Mugen 3, für alle Sockel geeignet €34.95 FRACTAL DESIGN Gehäuse DEFINE XL Black Pearl €123.41 Crucial M4 128GB SSD 6,4cm (2,5") €158.54
Is overclocking not generating more noise?
Is i5 enough? i saw laptops with i5 processors.. i tought desktops were better?
Is 8Gb ram enough? same thing..
On September 06 2011 02:58 Myrmidon wrote:You forgot Blu-Ray (to get instead of the DVD drive). A burner is about 71€: http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=30521&agid=856He also needs a TV capture card. And I don't see the need for Crossfire HD 6950s unless he wants to display the game on all three monitors. A single HD 6950 should be fine with a Z68 motherboard for additional video outputs as long as the other screens aren't showing anything too strenuous (to handle three monitors plus one TV).
No 1 monitor is enough. the second and third are for work/poker.
Why ssd as second disk and not first?
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On September 06 2011 03:18 hyshes wrote:
Thanks a lot already. a few questions.
Is overclocking not generating more noise?
Not necessarily. Aftermarket heatsinks are much better in terms of noise levels than the provided Intel heatsink. You can achieve ~4.5Ghz with very little effort and almost no increase in temperature / noise.
Is i5 enough? i saw laptops with i5 processors.. i tought desktops were better?
Yes. Mobile i5 are dual cores with hyperthreading. Desktop i5 is a quad core. Games do not utilize more than four cores (and actually very few even use four cores).
Is 8Gb ram enough? same thing..
Yes.
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On September 06 2011 03:14 JingleHell wrote:
650w is definitely more than you need, but make sure you look at available connectors, too. Depending on the price difference, sometimes it's worth it to pay a bit more to be able to connect stuff easily and manage cables.
2600k vs 2500k might matter for HD streaming, but if you're doing 720p or below, 2500k is easily enough.
I compared the XFX Core Edition 550W to the TX650 V2 and they're pretty similar. The TX650 has another PCIe connector, more peripheral connectors, and one less SATA connector, none of which I think will end up making a difference with my build.
So, is it worth the $9 difference to get the TX650 V2 for another 100W? Or will the difference in power just raise my utility bills?
skyR said the i7 2600K will matter for HD streaming a few pages back, so I should consider it then. I guess the real question is whether or not the $95 difference is worth it given I really don't stream a lot. I had thought of streaming BF3 when its out and such, but I don't know. :\
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The 550w should be fine. As for streaming BF3, I could see the 2600k helping, since that's probably going to be CPU intense, particularly if you want to stream HD. As for whether the price difference is worth it for something occasional? That's up to you.
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On September 05 2011 23:11 skyR wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On September 05 2011 15:55 galtdunn wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Let me preface this by saying that I am a total noob at computers, I have no idea what some of these terms even mean (ex. overclocking), so that's why a lot of answers are "I don't know." Basically, I want a new desktop capable of running SC2 and DotA 2 (when it comes out) at medium-high settings without lagging. It also needs to be able to play blu-rays/movies, do all the normal school related stuff (Microsoft Office), and burn discs, etc. Before this post I had been consulting with my father and a friend, my friend is good with computers, while my dad has a lot of experience also. My dad has maintained that building a computer is not worth the effort because if something goes wrong I won't know how to fix it, etc; whilst my friend has been urging me the entire time to get a built one because I can get more for my money and he can help me with it. So my Dad and I had picked out this Acer Predator, but my computer savy friend told me this is not a good computer for the money it costs and that the Graphics Card is terrible (and I've done a bit of searching, it's nvidia's entry-level graphics card). So I come to you, TL Tech Forum, with a request for advice and tech knowledge. 1) Is maintaining a self-build computer easy (will I need to worry about repairs/upkeep)? I don't want to buy all the parts and then something goes wrong and I have no idea what to do. 2) Is the Acer Predator not a good computer for what I want? and 3) Assuming for some reason that buying the Acer is the worst decision of my life I haven't made yet, I'm going to provide the TL guidelines for building my own computer so I have the option to do that. So anyways, please help me out! I'm going to post in accordance to what I want in hopes that I get good suggestions, and hopefully some of you can help me out with the other part of my post too. Thanks in advance! + Show Spoiler +If you request a build, please answer these questions. We will spend as much effort on your build as you spend on your answers to these questions! I urge people to abstain from providing builds unless all the questions are answered. What is your budget?$1000 max, less is better  What is your resolution?I'll be buying a monitor seperate, so whatever my new monitor is. What are you using it for?Starcraft 2, DotA 2, watching movies, school stuff. What is your upgrade cycle?I don't know. When do you plan on building it?Sooner is better, prefferably within 1-2 months. Do you plan on overclocking?I don't know. Do you need an Operating System?Yes, it will need to run Windows 7. Do you plan to add a second GPU for SLI or Crossfire?I don't think so (I want a non-integrated graphics card, but I don't need 2, which is what I think this is asking). Where are you buying your parts from?Wherever is cheaper, I live in Southern CA so I have access to Fry's and any American based online seller (Newegg, etc). Oh and last question, I also will be needing a new monitor, I want between 19-23" and less than $200. I had picked out this Asus, is it okay? Thanks so much! :D The Acer Predator is as you said. It has a low-end graphics card not meant for gaming and a crappy power supply, you would probably be able to play on low at best at 1080p. You said you also need to run blu-ray but it doesn't even have a BD drive... There is the same amount of maintenance between a pre-built computer such as the Acer Predator and a self-built configuration. It's just cleaning out the dust once in a while with compressed air. People are under the wrong impression if they think more is involved in maintaining a self-built configuration... that's only true if you are overclocking (and even than it's arguable) or doing a custom liquid cooling solution. But with both, there is a chance of hardware failure. If you're not confident in your ability to google or have friends help you than maybe you're better off going with a prebuilt that's just send in and have them repair it. Here's a configuration for $773 ($673 if you can get Windows for free or at a discounted rate through other means such as university / work) that's capable of running current and upcoming games on reasonably high settings at 1080p and has a Blu-ray drive. Core i5 2400 @ $190 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115074XFX Radeon HD6850 @ $160 ($130 after mail in rebate) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150551Asrock H61M-VS @ $55 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157241Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB @ $60 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152185GSkill 2x4GB 1333MHz @ $44 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231422Coolermaster HAF 912 $ 60 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119233Corsair CX430 V2 @ $45 ($35 after mail in rebate) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139026Blu-Ray Drive @ $59 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106325+ Show Spoiler +Windows 7 Home Premium x64 @ $100 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116986
So the graphics card that comes with the Acer Predator won't be able to run good graphics on a good resolution. Got it.
My main concern I guess is if something goes wrong with my computer, and I can't send it in to get it fixed because it's not under warranty. Do people gave this problem a lot?
Also, how am I suppose to know which part work with other parts? That list skyR gave me for example, I have no idea if those parts are compatible with each other. Is there a way to verify that? Also, how do I know if I'm missing a piece or not? Should I just trust anyone who posts in this thread?
And thanks skyR for helping me, much appreciated
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Every part comes with a warranty of some sort. For example, the Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB harddrive, Intel Core i5 2400 processor, and Corsair CX430 V2 power supply all come with a three year warranty while the XFX Radeon HD6850 graphics card comes with a lifetime warranty upon registration (register on their website with your serial number within 30 days of purchase) and the GSkill memory comes with a lifetime warranty. If something breaks than you just contact the manufacturer of the part and send it in for it to be repaired or to get a new one.
Warranties of individual components are much better than the one year warranty you receive from a prebuilt computer. The post-sale support of the manufacturers are also much better than what you would receive at Best Buy or Acer. You would just have to troubleshoot the problem yourself with the help of google.
There's not much to component compatibility these days. All modern graphics cards you're looking at on Newegg are PCI-E x16 which work in all modern motherboards for the modern processors (since they all come with PCI-E x16). PCI-E 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, 2.1, 3.0, etc are all backwards and forward compatible.
DDR3 memory is DDR3 memory. Clock speed doesn't matter.
Case is case. A cardboard box would work. Power supply is power supply, all the cables will be there. If there isn't enough, you'll just need an adapter. A quality ~400w unit is more than enough to power such a configuration (a core i5 2400 uses around 55w and a 6850 uses around 100w, both under load). Not all power supplies are of equal quality and some are extremely bad so it might be hard for a novice to determine this... though it's not hard just by looking at the pricing.
Processor goes into one socket and one socket only (not talking about AMD, you don't want AMD currently anyways since their processors just suck in comparison to those of Intels). If it says LGA1155, the motherboard must be LGA1155.
The components that make up a computer is the motherboard, memory, processor, graphics card, harddrive, and power supply. Everything else (including the case and dvd-drive) is optional. The motherboard has integrated sound and ethernet (if you want wireless, you'll need to buy something else) so you don't have to worry about that stuff.
It's not a good idea to trust anyone who posts in online communities. It's best to use your own judgement and do some research yourself, I would advise staying away from tomshardware since it's website is awful and it's community isn't that great either. You don't have any reason to trust me either so take everything I say with a grain of salt (= You can dig through my post history if you really want, many people have been satisfied with the configurations I've provided.
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Ok if you buy a computer from a big company they come with a 1 year warranty unless you pay more money for an extended warranty.
When you buy stuff from the manufacturer they usually come with longer warranties. like 2 or 3 years and some have lifetime warranties.
If something breaks all you have to do is run some test and figure out what is wrong. you can use google or even ask here. there are a ton of resources online that will help you figure it out.
then you contact the manufacturer of the product. for example, if you find out that your processor is broken (like your i5 2400) intel has a 3 year warranty and you can contact them and they will have u ship it and then they will fix it or give u a new one(most likely).
EDIT: skyr beat me to it t_T
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skyR, why do you recommend the i7 2600K over the i5 2500K for HD streaming? Is it the larger L3 cache that helps or is it the hyper threading? Actually, I don't even know what hyper threading is.
Why don't you like Tom's Hardware? Just personal opinion?
Why the Seasonic S12II over the XFX 550?
Sorry for the millions of questions. :X
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Hey, wanna build a pc for my clanmate
What is your budget? 600-1000 euro, the lower the better
What is your resolution?
1920x1080
What are you using it for?
sc2, d3 when it comes out and some other things, maybe streaming
What is your upgrade cycle? 2 years
When do you plan on building it? as soon as possible
Do you plan on overclocking? yes
Do you need an Operating System? yes
Do you plan to add a second GPU for SLI or Crossfire? no
Where are you buying your parts from? germany
thanks in advance
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On September 06 2011 05:44 LazyMacro wrote:
skyR, why do you recommend the i7 2600K over the i5 2500K for HD streaming? Is it the larger L3 cache that helps or is it the hyper threading? Actually, I don't even know what hyper threading is.
Why don't you like Tom's Hardware? Just personal opinion?
Why the Seasonic S12II over the XFX 550?
Sorry for the millions of questions. :X
Tomshardware is bad. Design of website is terrible, I don't even want to know how it looks without adblock. Forums are hard to read without maximizing because of the sidebars that provide no relevant information to me. Hard to keep up to date with forums because there are a hundred sub sections. Forums are terrible, no indication of user's post history or know if they're a manufacturer rep. Articles are poorly organized and lack technical depth. Tell me I'm wrong?
It's the hyperthreading that helps with encoding. There was someone who posted a video of him streaming 1080p with a 2500k at a very low quality and only achieving 50 FPS at the start of the game. I don't remember who it was though.
Seasonic S12II is less expensive. The XFX Core Edition 550 is manufactured by Seasonic and is very similar to the S12II.
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Canada11349 Posts
+ Show Spoiler +
Just have to come back on to say I wound up buying the parts before all the deals changed rather than pricematching all over. So I've had my new pc for a couple weeks now and I have to say it works amazing! Plus all my fears over BW issues turned out to be unfounded as my monitor can add the black bars on the side so nothing is distorted. So fantastic playing SC2 without lag. Thank you, thank you!
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EPT
