*Sigh* Blizzard doesn't want to create the tournaments, they want to develop their games and give the community necessary tools and means to create their own tournaments. Why would they spend money doing something the community/KeSPA does for free? Even though KeSPA makes money as a government body of e-sport in Korea it will be far from profitable world wide, especially for a game developing company. Remember that KeSPA is an e-sport association, they don't produce broadcasts. And they are not only a dictator of rules and ranks, they also shuffles money into the e-sport industry and makes sure every team can compete on the same level, economy wise.
Have a look at ICCup as a ladder, it works because there are a lot of volunteers in the communiy. They check replays for abuse and cheats, etc. thus Blizzard have to create a tool in Bnet 2.0 for moderating cheat/bad manner reports. Teamliquid is another great example, they create tournaments, or at least affiliates themselves with the tournament creators. They give the community write-ups, betting and what not to create excitement for the community. I don't see any reason why blizzard would focus their time on anything like this.
It remains to be seen whether or not Game Masters (volunteers) will be part of the new Bnet 2.0 and if they will play any role in Starcraft other than the removal of inappropriate names etc. Last but not least, I don't see any reason why KeSPA wouldn't be able to continue with what they are doing, nothing about the no-LAN issue affects KeSPA. Don't you think they have internet to connect with Bnet 2.0?
On July 27 2009 14:24 keV. wrote: I could care less about KeSPA or "Korean pros." SC2 will be big enough that I don't think we will always have to be looking -just- at Koreans to get quality entertainment and great games.
as much as blizzard is responsible for the greatness of starcraft as a game, kespa needs to get a LOT of credit for making starcraft the most prestigious e-sport ever, anywhere. in fact, they deserve a lot of credit for even making the genre of e-sport. even after 10+ years starcraft reigns near-supreme, even with its outdated graphics/multiplayer system. kespa made this; created a market where there was once none, convinced GIRLS to like starcraft, and made game-nerds into rockstars.
i'm not kespa is a great organization. i am saying that i can sympathize with them
On July 27 2009 17:23 Tef wrote: *Sigh* Blizzard doesn't want to create the tournaments, they want to develop their games and give the community necessary tools and means to create their own tournaments. Why would they spend money doing something the community/KeSPA does for free? Even though KeSPA makes money as a government body of e-sport in Korea it will be far from profitable world wide, especially for a game developing company. Remember that KeSPA is an e-sport association, they don't produce broadcasts. And they are not only a dictator of rules and ranks, they also shuffles money into the e-sport industry and makes sure every team can compete on the same level, economy wise.
Have a look at ICCup as a ladder, it works because there are a lot of volunteers in the communiy. They check replays for abuse and cheats, etc. thus Blizzard have to create a tool in Bnet 2.0 for moderating cheat/bad manner reports. Teamliquid is another great example, they create tournaments, or at least affiliates themselves with the tournament creators. They give the community write-ups, betting and what not to create excitement for the community. I don't see any reason why blizzard would focus their time on anything like this.
It remains to be seen whether or not Game Masters (volunteers) will be part of the new Bnet 2.0 and if they will play any role in Starcraft other than the removal of inappropriate names etc. Last but not least, I don't see any reason why KeSPA wouldn't be able to continue with what they are doing, nothing about the no-LAN issue affects KeSPA. Don't you think they have internet to connect with Bnet 2.0?
Just my 2 cents.
blizzard wants control of everything Kespa is doing cuz they can get consistent revenue doing so through royalties. It wouldn't be much different from the 15 a month they make x 10 million + from Wow
Kespa needs to get their heads out of their asses and stop swinging around their authority bat like a spoiled brat.
yes, E-Sports is what it is today because of Kespa, Kespa created the infrastructure which facilitates the development of e-sports ever since the dawn of time, but come-on, look at what kespa did in the past few months, how the f*ck can u possibly defend such a corrupt, idiotic organisation?
what did they do recently to help promote e-sports? Stop teams from participating in a network which broadcast pro-games internationally in english because they had no say in who Blizzard decides to invite to THEIR events? Randomly disqualifies players from tournaments because they accidentally typed A in chat? enforcing retarded rules without using common-sense at all and monopolizes the entire E-sports industries and runs it like tyrant?
We need the the infrastructure that Kespa created, but we DON'T need the retarded and immature management behind the current incarnation of Kespa, there has to be a change in management and Blizzard is going to make that happen in SC2.
i'm not sure whether if this claims of Kespa not letting them broadcasts SC2 matches because they are being retarded again is true, any proof for this? because if it is, boy... its going to be a matter of time behind an angry nerd pulls off a crazy shooting/bombing shit in Kespa's HQ.
IMO, OGN and MBC would've had success with OSL/MSL/Proleague without the creation of KeSPA. I don't believe that the contributions of the KeSPA members outside of the broadcasting companies were so valuable that StarCraft would've died in Korea without them. Sure KeSPA has had an overall positive impact on StarCraft in Korea, but it wasn't a life-or-death thing.
On July 27 2009 16:13 Jonoman92 wrote: T.T KeSPA... They've become way too powerful considering they don't serve much of a purpose. I mean the pro teams shoudl be like F U KeSPA and make a new organizational league that is just cooperative within themselves. I realize it must be more complicated than that but it seems KeSPA is undeserving of the power they've come to wield.
Haha, KeSPA is the progaming teams. KeSPA consists of one member from each of the teams' companies. But then the sponsors of a team don't always do what the team wants to do. It's a very weird move, at least in my American opinion, that the sponsors of the teams would also run the governing entity. They purposely and openly govern KeSPA in a way that's best for their companies and not what's best for eSports.
I think it kind of sucks how Blizzard just jump back in and say... well SC is popular and we have SC2 coming out now so lets take it back... I know they are not actually doing that but I get that impression a little bit from some of the actions they have made (i.e. chucking money at GOM and saying to Kespa you are not going to choose who goes to BlizzCon this year we will, through GOM).
IMHO it's understandable that KESPA is pissed. They know that when SC2 comes out they will no longer be the major player like they are now (noone likes to be told to go sit on the bench after being 'the' starting player all along. I really hope the big cheeses at KESPA work out a suitable strategy to liaise with Blizzard. I really can see KESPA becoming either an associate of Blizzard and working with them to promote SC2 in Korea. Blizzard is going to need people there who have experience/knowledge and can speak Korean (lol) anyways so why doesn't KESPA step up and evolve into a new style organisation. If they don't they will be steamrolled by Blizzard and die for sure.
It's up to you KESPA... convince Blizzard you are worth keeping around.
It is funny how you are all bashing Kespa whereas it is the only reason why Bw is still alive today. Without the pros + all the new maps and drama i doubt bw would be a competitive game.
Don't forget that Blizzard goal is to make money by selling games ( think 3-parts starcraft 2 = 3x more money ) whereas Kespa makes money by providing awesome tournaments to the audience.
That's absolutly different. Remember how Blizz didn't care about bw until they started the development of Sc2. Who made Lan latency ? Who made the ladders ? Who made the tournaments ? The communauty ( And Kespa belongs to the communauty ) not Blizzard.
I also guess that Blizzard would have prefered that bw died around 2004 because this game isn't really profitable anymore and they had to delay its sequel because it seems quite hard to make a game as good and they will make us( the community) pay for it because i think that there are some guys at the head of Activision/Blizz who think that the 2004 <-> 2009 period of bw wasn't EV+ enough. So they just want to make a lot of money from Kespa and they have the right to. But will it be good for the community ? I'm not sure.
The relation between Blizzard and bw makes think that "the problem with a nearly indestructible product is that shoppers rarely need to replace"
Now we are about to get the sequel they will try to get a maximum of money even if it means stomping parts of the community like Kespa or private ladders, making 2 expansions, diverse fees and no Lan.
But that's cool we have a bunch of kids yelling "Fuck Kespa". Thank God.
On July 27 2009 21:39 Liquid`NonY wrote: Haha, KeSPA is the progaming teams. KeSPA consists of one member from each of the teams' companies. But then the sponsors of a team don't always do what the team wants to do. It's a very weird move, at least in my American opinion, that the sponsors of the teams would also run the governing entity. They purposely and openly govern KeSPA in a way that's best for their companies and not what's best for eSports.
It's a very east asian way to do business. Then there's a scandal and someone has to kill themselves.
i'm just going to say that kespa/ogn/mbc do a hell of a lot better organizing and broadcasting SC than any of the organizations broadcasting and organizing 'blizzard sanctioned' WoW tournaments. It's dumb if kespa isn't broadcasting these SC2 matches as part of a power struggle with Blizzard (kespa WILL lose when SC2 comes out), but i'm not exactly sure I want Blizzard taking over or getting their hand in things.
On July 27 2009 23:55 entrails wrote: i'm just going to say that kespa/ogn/mbc do a hell of a lot better organizing and broadcasting SC than any of the organizations broadcasting and organizing 'blizzard sanctioned' WoW tournaments. It's dumb if kespa isn't broadcasting these SC2 matches as part of a power struggle with Blizzard (kespa WILL lose when SC2 comes out), but i'm not exactly sure I want Blizzard taking over or getting their hand in things.
I don't like Blizzard's decision of taking out lan play in SC2 , not anyone can afford to have internet all the time to play the game with someone other then the computer . Korean SC scene has a big part in why starcraft is such a popular game in the first place . The Korean proteams their tournaments PL MSL OSL are very well organized and just by watching them people get in to the starcraft a lot . Many people watch a lot of pro starcraft , but don't play the game or play it casual . But if blizzard wants to make a decision to take control of everything in SC 2 they should do a better job with organizing and broadcasting of SC 2 tournaments better then Kespa in SC 1 otherwise people would still end up following starcraft scene if SC2 is poorly orginized .
Since Kespa didn't give a reason for not allowing video of the matches, I try to interpret this from their position.
Starcraft 2 is an incomplete game. If a bug or glitch were to happen it would appear as if they had done harm to the game's image (from Kespa's position). No one in Korea has played the game extensively so they do not know how stable it is.
Kespa (as I see it) wants to give a good and professional image to Blizzard to let them know they are capable of running the scene. The best case scenario would be that they make a lot of fans happy and give the game more exposure. The worst case would be looking bad in front of Blizzard.
Edit: What I mean to say is that Kespa is just being cautious.
PC gaming is just over the hill. Few years ago developers were still concerned with making the best map editors possible, being as user friendly as possible and basically making a great game packed with features. Now in the name of "controlling the product" it's the other way around.
Few years ago we bought a game. Now we buy a game along with the one and only company-approved way to enjoy it. We're not buying SC2. We're buying Bnet 2.0, the playground, and the SC2 box letting you play SC2 is just a side-benefit. This is sleazy marketing and I don't care what the eternal defenders of the idiocies of capitalism (such as planned obsolescence) are going to come up with here.
Speaking of planned obsolescence, that's exactly what is happening to gaming. Yes, a product that lasts 10 years and generates so much hype out of the company's control is obviously bad! (for the company, not the consumer) So let's introduce controls and make sure that never happens again. Yay for mediocrity!
Do not forget, as a gamer, that your interest (getting a great game with as little artificial barriers as possible to ensure a strong ever expanding community) and the developer's ($ which implies maximum possible control of your software to charge extra for w/e features and terminate it when you please) are now radically opposed.
I say fuck Blizzard. For all its supposed faults, KeSPA got the job done. Blizzard can make great games. But oversee (since their authorizations through bnet 2.0 will have the final say on anything) the whole esports scene and keep it as healthy as possible? I highly doubt they have the slightest clue wtf they're doing there. And if the esport orgs boycott Blizzard, I have a feeling Blizz will be looking pretty fucking stupid. So I don't think the politics are as one-sided as some would have it here. KeSPA has its cards to play.
EPT
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