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On April 18 2009 12:45 PH wrote:
Hmm...Hunter-seeker missile was hilarious...it's like a sieged tank shot you need to micro.
The game looks...odd. Nothing like BW anymore...the way it plays, the pacing...I'm hoping it was just because those were bad players.
It took years before the macro plays evolved in starcraft, both players needs perfect understanding of the game for it to work. Since sc2 changes quite often, and due to none having so much experience forcing everyone to learn from the start it is impossible for anyone to develop such macro play for sc2.
Also I am sure that they picked a game with many battles all throughout the game to make it less boring to watch for those who do not have deep understanding of the game (All of us really, I am 100% sure we would see more complaints if this was actually a macro battle), games with tight action for this long are really rare so it probably do not represent their most skilled replay.
On April 18 2009 14:11 latent wrote:
Also, do you people really not realize this whole match was scripted? I mean... do you actually think this was a legitimate game? It's a battle report. It's meant to showcase specific units and build orders, not to demonstrate an actual game in progress. How has almost every single person in this thread missed that?
If it was scripted it would have played out way differently, they would have used more diverse armies to showcase the game better etc, especially the first battle report.
However unless they have some ladder or prizes for the best testers I doubt that they give it their all. They should have something like a tester ladder with a mini tournament between the players highest on it each week and the winner gets some extra cash.
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On April 18 2009 15:06 geno wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2009 14:30 A3iL3r0n wrote:
God I want to see someone flawlessly Boxer clone 7 or 8 hunter-seeker missiles into an oncoming army's front line... *fap fap fap*
Fuck, let's get some progamers on BR and have Tasteless shoutcast it if possible *more fap fap* Don't think you need to be boxer to do that. Smartcasting is in the current build isnt it?
*stops fapping* 
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yea i just found that was gonna post it , ty
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On April 17 2009 03:45 Latham wrote:
The only thing that really irked me about this game is that the zerg was sitting on 2 bases the whole game.
Yeah, I think the zerg could had taken a 3rd base a lot earlier.
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Did anyone mention that the build orders were horrible? If terran was planning to bunker rush he should have made his barracks at the second choke with a depot. Then he could have expanded easier as well and prevented the roaches to get in and stuff.
Also the zerg took forever to make a 3rd, I dunno maybe a 3rd isn't as important in ZvT anymore but wtf he still probably could have slipped one in during the entire midgame where he had map control and harassed. Also when he slipped in the 2 or 3? banelings with a couple lings he totally wasted them trying to go inbetween the barracks and then again going around the long way and running into reapers and then wasting them on a reaper. Should have just went for the SCV to begin with.
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Watched it twice yesterday, the graphics - textures, terrain design, random items are absolutely amazing. I get such a nice feeling of the map as if I'm watching a sci-fi movie like Starship Troopers with Terrans fighting Zerg in true color 
From what I've got the balance is quite similar to the BW, but still different because of much more unit choice for terran (bio especially).
Zerg didn't go for lurks at all, I guess he lacked resources because he was so slow with expansion, it got delayed and he couldn't even get another one up later. Terran macroed decently, whereas zerg couldn't keep up.
Nighthawk's Seeker missiles are quite cool especially visually - an eyecandy. And the animation (icon) of NH is hilarious
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If it was scripted it would have played out way differently, they would have used more diverse armies to showcase the game better etc, especially the first battle report.
However unless they have some ladder or prizes for the best testers I doubt that they give it their all. They should have something like a tester ladder with a mini tournament between the players highest on it each week and the winner gets some extra cash.
You don't understand what an "alpha" phase is and what actually "testing" a game entails at this point. They're developing a computer game which requires a large amount of high-level programming code. Their efforts right now are on actually developing the code base for the map maker, AI, interface, etc. They're also developing artwork and sound for all the units. Consider an FPS at an equivalent point in development. One thing programmers will have testers do is during an online match run everyone to the corner of every map and simultaneously start shooting their weapons up into the air.
To quoth wikipedia: "The first phase of testing, developers generally test the software using white box techniques. Additional validation is then performed using black box or grey box techniques, by another dedicated testing team, sometimes concurrently. Moving to black box testing inside the organization is known as alpha release." The point is the testers are supposed to make sure everything is running properly. It's during the beta phase and beyond (yes beyond...this is Blizzard after all) where they start working on the nuances of game balance.
What I'm trying to say is they're not ready to show off all the tech trees and units because they're not finished coding them. This is also why holding 'tester tournaments' would be silly. All testing is done under close supervision of internal programmers and software engineers as it is. The testers don't have the freedom to "play for fun".
So yes, this is a scripted match.
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What I'm trying to say is they're not ready to show off all the tech trees and units because they're not finished coding them.
They've been constantly showing off units and tech trees for the past two years, completed or not. You clearly haven't been paying any attention.
The testers don't have the freedom to "play for fun".
And you know this.. how? It doesn't follow from the things you said.
So yes, this is a scripted match.
Nice non-sequitur. And I love how you state that like it's obvious..
To me it looks very much like a non-scripted match, where the players use only those units they are comfortable/familiar with, not forcing the game just to show off a particular unit or strat (practically no high-tech units were used in the game) and where they try their best to win. What would have had to be different to convince you it was a non-scripted match?
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Whoa looks so good I CANT WAIT TO PLAY
One of the only main things I hated while watching that was that the hunter seeker missile still killed the zerg units when they burrowed.
When he burrowed I was like OMG CLUTCH! It's like a fast thinking kind of move that should have paid off for him
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On April 18 2009 16:31 [X]Ken_D wrote:Show nested quote +On April 17 2009 03:45 Latham wrote:
The only thing that really irked me about this game is that the zerg was sitting on 2 bases the whole game. Yeah, I think the zerg could had taken a 3rd base a lot earlier.
Right because with the queen's larva ability you're completely sure that you need to be up a base on the terran when we don't know the metagame for sc2 yet right?
I really don't think we're in a position to talk about a player's choices in macro strategy like that purely from a sc1 perspective when the game is completely different from brood war.
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What I'm trying to say is they're not ready to show off all the tech trees and units because they're not finished coding them
Ive played the game 3 times, twice during both blizzcons and once during WWI. two of those times had full tech trees fully available to show off and display and play out competitively with other competitors at the event. On top of this they actually showed a spur of the moment match between the Progamers Yello and Sonkie at Blizzcon live for everyone to watch....... This argument doesn't really work...
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Was the lame gas-mechanic in the game now?
I didnt see any red refineries.. I hope they removed that.
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wow I just realized the roach was buffed up to 100hp (instead of 80). That's a lot! Maybe it also costs more, which would explain why the zerg always has such a small army (besides his terrible macro). 100hp is quite a lot for a unit that regenerates so quickly, and it also tells us that the seeker missile does 100+ damage. We can also guess the D8 charges do something like that too (there was only one mine and tons of stuff blew up, but the roaches were probably a bit damages).
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On April 18 2009 18:04 axion wrote:
Was the lame gas-mechanic in the game now?
I didnt see any red refineries.. I hope they removed that.
they removed that some time ago, iirc
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On April 18 2009 17:56 -orb- wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2009 16:31 [X]Ken_D wrote:On April 17 2009 03:45 Latham wrote:
The only thing that really irked me about this game is that the zerg was sitting on 2 bases the whole game. Yeah, I think the zerg could had taken a 3rd base a lot earlier. Right because with the queen's larva ability you're completely sure that you need to be up a base on the terran when we don't know the metagame for sc2 yet right? I really don't think we're in a position to talk about a player's choices in macro strategy like that purely from a sc1 perspective when the game is completely different from brood war.
The macro part of the game is almost the same
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On April 18 2009 18:54 Hammy wrote:
wow I just realized the roach was buffed up to 100hp (instead of 80). That's a lot! Maybe it also costs more, which would explain why the zerg always has such a small army (besides his terrible macro). 100hp is quite a lot for a unit that regenerates so quickly, and it also tells us that the seeker missile does 100+ damage. We can also guess the D8 charges do something like that too (there was only one mine and tons of stuff blew up, but the roaches were probably a bit damages).
There were 4 mines actually. 3 placed in very quick succession almost on top of eachother and 1 mine a little lower. 10:20 mark ->
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On April 18 2009 19:28 zeox wrote:Show nested quote +On April 18 2009 18:04 axion wrote:
Was the lame gas-mechanic in the game now?
I didnt see any red refineries.. I hope they removed that.
they removed that some time ago, iirc
Yes, it has been removed. However, they did keep the double 2500 gas geysers for each base in case the player wanted to double his gathering rate for fast tech strategies.
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Good job catching that, I only saw one while watching. Do you know how long the mines took to explode? It'll take me ages to stream it again :s
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On April 18 2009 22:51 Hammy wrote:
Good job catching that, I only saw one while watching. Do you know how long the mines took to explode? It'll take me ages to stream it again :s
Looks like 2,5/3 seconds.
Edit: closer to 3 seconds than 2,5. Also seems like the mines dont destroy eachother like spider mines often do.
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EPT
